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Neve 3114 & 3104 differences? Other Modular Audio Processors
Old 29th March 2016
  #1
Gear Addict
 

Neve 3114 & 3104 differences?

I'm hoping someone (Geoff Tanner?) could chime in regarding the differences between the Neve 3114 and 3104 broadcast modules?

I have a Neve 3115 which I like and have been looking for a 3114 as it is basically a 3115 but with additional EQ points.

However the Neve 3104 also seems to possess identical EQ points to the 3114.

I DIY'd a connector extension for my 3115 so I could fit it into a Heritage Audio Frame 8 '80 - Series' rack and it works fine.

Do the 3104's also share the same connector pinouts as the 3115/3114 modules?

Thanks
Old 29th March 2016
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Geoff_T's Avatar
 

Hi

And no... 30 series modules like the 3401, 2, 5 and 3104 along with a bunch of custom switching units, all used Smith's connectors that used round pins and only 16 on the line amps compared with 17 on the later 3415 modules that, like the 3114 and 5 used Varicon connectors with fork like contacts.

Smiths, along with Painton, dumped their audio product ranges and concentrated on more profitable military components so those connectors will be very rare.




Quote:
Originally Posted by rowmat View Post
I'm hoping someone (Geoff Tanner?) could chime in regarding the differences between the Neve 3114 and 3104 broadcast modules?

I have a Neve 3115 which I like and have been looking for a 3114 as it is basically a 3115 but with additional EQ points.

However the Neve 3104 also seems to possess identical EQ points to the 3114.

I DIY'd a connector extension for my 3115 so I could fit it into a Heritage Audio Frame 8 '80 - Series' rack and it works fine.

Do the 3104's also share the same connector pinouts as the 3115/3114 modules?

Thanks
Old 29th March 2016
  #3
Gear Addict
 

Many thanks Geoff.

So other than the connector and the different 4 button switch arrangement for EQ in/out, phase etc on the 3104, are the 3104 and 3114 similar sonically?

Would you say one is more desirable than the other?

Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff_T View Post
Hi

And no... 30 series modules like the 3401, 2, 5 and 3104 along with a bunch of custom switching units, all used Smith's connectors that used round pins and only 16 on the line amps compared with 17 on the later 3415 modules that, like the 3114 and 5 used Varicon connectors with fork like contacts.

Smiths, along with Painton, dumped their audio product ranges and concentrated on more profitable military components so those connectors will be very rare.

Old 29th March 2016
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Geoff_T's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rowmat View Post
Many thanks Geoff.

So other than the connector and the different 4 button switch arrangement for EQ in/out, phase etc on the 3104, are the 3104 and 3114 similar sonically?

Would you say one is more desirable than the other?

Thanks
Hi

It's stretching the brain cells to recall the diagrams after 40 years, but I think the differences include different transformers in the output stage along with minor differences in basic circuitry. I expect they will sound reasonably similar as the tertiary output transformer in the 3114 siblings was the basic LO1173 8dB step up in the 3104 with a 1:1 feedback winding added (quite a squeeze in that package size that Marinair managed and later St Ives, not so much... there was a thread on this years ago).

Desirability is a very personal thing but I would caution anyone against "Class A" modded 3104's modified by a non-tech individual at Brent Averills back when that relied on power boosting a BA338 pcb that not even Neve managed to do reliably (no heatsink doesn't help) and the option was dropped like a hot potato when the B438 came out. The units also had non-polarised capacitors when the entire circuits were designed to be polarised to half rail (12v).

Old 29th March 2016
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Geoff_T's Avatar
 

Hi

Interesting memory came back thinking about 3104's.... the B338, 306 and 340's inside those modules had teeny pins and no retention to the motherboards other than the friction of that tiny pin into its equally tiny socket.

Those 3104's were designed for BBC consoles and one such custom console was fitted in an Outside Broadcast van. On one of its first outings the techs had the nightmare of entire sections of the console not working and it was because the bumpy ride caused a lot of the daughter circuit boards to become unplugged from the motherboards. Every module had to be pulled out and checked.

So if you have a 3104 and look inside, it may have desperate bodges by Neve with laminate squares that had heatsink like clips underneath to clip on the BC441/461 transistors on the B338's and beryllium copper springs on top that pressed against the side covers to hold the amplifiers in their sockets.

That's why Neve introduced the later B406/438/440's with chunky pins and screws to retain them to the motherboards!

Old 29th March 2016
  #6
Gear Addict
 

Many thanks good to know Geoff!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff_T View Post
Hi

Interesting memory came back thinking about 3104's.... the B338, 306 and 340's inside those modules had teeny pins and no retention to the motherboards other than the friction of that tiny pin into its equally tiny socket.

Those 3104's were designed for BBC consoles and one such custom console was fitted in an Outside Broadcast van. On one of its first outings the techs had the nightmare of entire sections of the console not working and it was because the bumpy ride caused a lot of the daughter circuit boards to become unplugged from the motherboards. Every module had to be pulled out and checked.

So if you have a 3104 and look inside, it may have desperate bodges by Neve with laminate squares that had heatsink like clips underneath to clip on the BC441/461 transistors on the B338's and beryllium copper springs on top that pressed against the side covers to hold the amplifiers in their sockets.

That's why Neve introduced the later B406/438/440's with chunky pins and screws to retain them to the motherboards!

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