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ADAM S3A- fatiguing to anyone?
Old 29th January 2007
  #1
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ADAM S3A- fatiguing to anyone?

just had an extensive listen to these, along with the 2.5 and the surprisingly good A7.
my only gripe with the s3A was the amount of top-end which i fear could be tiring after a while. trimming down the >6k helped a bit. any users find this to be the case? thanks,
david lawrence
Old 29th January 2007
  #2
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reid's Avatar
 

if anything, I've found my S3as to be the least fatiguing monitors I've used.

could your experience be down to....

a poorly treated room?

too long (and tiring) a mix / listening session?

material with too hyped a top end?

The s3as are pretty unforgiving, and might well just be revealing the deficiencies in your source material.
Old 29th January 2007
  #3
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RKrizman's Avatar
 

Check that you're not getting any comb-filtering reflections off the console or control surface. Set a mirror on the console and move the speakers until you can't see the tweeters from the mix position.

-R
Old 29th January 2007
  #4
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matucha's Avatar
no fatigue here
Old 29th January 2007
  #5
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Zwinter's Avatar
 

Mercenary has a pair of these in its studio, the Methods and Applications Laboratory. I have never found them to be fatiguing, even after a couple hours. You want fatiguing get a pair of NS-10's and a Mackie amp.
Old 30th January 2007
  #6
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I personally don't find my S3-A's to be fatiguing but another engineer that uses my studio pretty frequently did comment he felt that tired his ears out pretty quickly.

That said pretty much anything JBL makes can tear my ears up FAST.

different folks....
Old 30th January 2007
  #7
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Mark Warren's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by reid View Post
if anything, I've found my S3as to be the least fatiguing monitors I've used.

could your experience be down to....

a poorly treated room?

too long (and tiring) a mix / listening session?

material with too hyped a top end?

The s3as are pretty unforgiving, and might well just be revealing the deficiencies in your source material.
Agree 100% with this, the s3a's are probably one of the least fatiguing monitors I've experienced, and this is shared by others having worked at our place.
Old 30th January 2007
  #8
84K
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84K's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Warren View Post
Agree 100% with this, the s3a's are probably one of the least fatiguing monitors I've experienced, and this is shared by others having worked at our place.
I agree
Old 30th January 2007
  #9
mds
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I work on S3As all the time and don't find them fatiguing. In fact, I can work on them for a long time before losing it...I think ADAMs have a tendency to sound bright at first listen because they represent so much of the high end content. Bright things sound bright, but they don't add any discernible brightness to the signal. I find it easier to get high end EQ done correctly since I can actually hear it...same goes for the A7s...

Mike
Old 30th January 2007
  #10
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Marlowe's Avatar
 

Same here, I've never had any problem.
Old 30th January 2007
  #11
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Ruudman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Warren View Post
Agree 100% with this, the s3a's are probably one of the least fatiguing monitors I've experienced, and this is shared by others having worked at our place.
Agreed


ruudman
Old 30th January 2007
  #12
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I recently did a week of 14 -18 hrs a day trying to finish a particular band that shall remain unmentioened. Ears never fried. My brain did but not the ears. I monitor at 72- 88dbs. Gen 1030 series and the like do me hard in less than 2 hours.
Old 30th January 2007
  #13
It's a common mistake to blaim a driver for fatigue when it can be caused by poor crossover components. Replace the coils with air-foil inductors, the sand resistors with Mills wire wounds and the caps with InfiniCaps, MIT's etc.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades
Old 30th January 2007
  #14
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drew's Avatar
Depends on the source. When I demoed them last year for over a week I found they were fatiguing with modern rock mixes as the source. If you'll be working on that type of material and need to have finished product that is similar to what's out there in that genre, I feel you'll have to push the mixes til they are in fact fatiguing.
Old 30th January 2007
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by drew View Post
Depends on the source. When I demoed them last year for over a week I found they were fatiguing with modern rock mixes as the source. If you'll be working on that type of material and need to have finished product that is similar to what's out there in that genre, I feel you'll have to push the mixes til they are in fact fatiguing.
Modern rock mixes are fatiguing on everything. I find they sound best when either the de-emphisis is on or the tweeters are shut off.

Funny, I don't recall rock mixes in the past to ever sound as bad as they do today.

What gives? The gear, or operator error?

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades
Old 30th January 2007
  #16
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drew's Avatar
Trends are trends I guess. Hopefully it'll pass. I'm sure John Philip Sousa thought the ragtime/jazz cats were crazy and butchering music, just as Miles would think GWAR is an abomination. Point being, just because you don't get it, doesn't mean it isn't valid.
Old 30th January 2007
  #17
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I have my S3a tweeters turned down about 1.2 dB.

They're just too bright (fast) for me otherwise, but...

People hear differently, that is to say the brain translation/perception is different. If I leave the S3's flat, the tweeters take too much of my brains attention, and I can't perceive what's going on in what I call the "mud zone" (150Hz. - 500Hz.). But someone else may be perfectly fine with them flat.

I know that some would say that a studio monitor shouldn't "have" to be adjustable and I would tend to agree, except in the case of Adams. Slight adjustments to these cause them to "reveal" the sound in very different ways. The way I have mine set right now is for work, more like a custom tool - It may not be very good for listening to CD's etc., but it makes me concentrate on what's important when mixing.
Old 30th January 2007
  #18
I bought ADAM's (S4AC's) because I found everything else out there sounded too sharp to my ears..

I have been a fan of ribbon tweeters since the S30's by Genelec...

So I dont find them fatiguing....
Old 30th January 2007
  #19
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Most current releases song like crap on S3As. Intermodulation distortion etc.. are so obvious it's hard to deal with. Modern mastering practices are brutal when monitored on a good system.
Yeah if I goose a bunch of midrange on a rock mix it will result in fatigue. The Adams aren't adding any, just letting you hear it.

BTW. With the lack of dynamics in today's music I get fatigued even listening to my crappy Delco system in my Chevy.
Old 30th January 2007
  #20
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HIGHENDONLY's Avatar
 

Yea i been listening to alot of older stuff threw the s3a's when i have a lil bit of writers block and need some inspiration. Some new stuff sounds great on the s3a but alot of it sounds like complete crap. Play some eric clapton, phil collins or whatever great oldies you have they will sound great.
Old 30th January 2007
  #21
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HIGHENDONLY's Avatar
 

Yea i think that is another thing....Take a damn break lol. I try take 10-15min breaks after every several hrs
Old 30th January 2007
  #22
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ive been spending a lot of time around the ADAMs... the s2.5s are harder to handle on the high end than the s3as, IMO.... i suppose its due to the s3a's ability to compensate on the low end... the A7s are more well rounded, the highs sound a little richer and sparklier (which i like) than competitors like the BM5as, however the BM5as round off better on the low end making them sound slightly more even (even though they are lacking the clarity of the ribbon)

i think you just gotta get used to whatever you can get used to, whatever suits your mixing ability best. im in love with the s3as, probably my favorite out of the entire ADAM S, A, and P series monitors....

...and just about anything is going to get hard to handle after extended hours of mixing. some can be friendlier than others, but it also depends on the project. if you are engineering talent, it can get hard to handle very fast. if you are engineering your own project, your tolerance can last for hours on end with no break.... i know this one first hand. its half mental.
Old 30th January 2007
  #23
Trp
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Not fatiguing at all!

Love my S3As.
Old 30th January 2007
  #24
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djui5's Avatar
 

S3A's are the best monitors ever...
Old 30th January 2007
  #25
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No fatigue for me That is why I like these speakers. Maybe the mixer who is fatigued is listening for to long at a high volume level.
Old 30th January 2007
  #26
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HIGHENDONLY's Avatar
 

Yea the s3a is my fav out of the adam s series. But i must say i have recently borrowed a set of the p22a and was pretty blown away with the quality of these speaekers at half the cost of the adams. Anyone listen to the p22a and were impressed as well?
Old 31st January 2007
  #27
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u b k's Avatar
 

my experience is that fatigue comes not so much from volume or freq response but from phase issues. poorly recorded tracks, too much eq, bad eq, fubar room reflections in the mixspace... these things tire me out fast.

atc's are the brightest speakers ever, pmc's too, but they don't fatigue because their phase coherence is ludicrous.


gregoire
del
ubk
.
Old 31st January 2007
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
my experience is that fatigue comes not so much from volume or freq response but from phase issues. poorly recorded tracks, too much eq, bad eq, fubar room reflections in the mixspace...
.
I totally agree with that, I was thinking about my S3a's the other day, and relized that they really force me to take a look at what I'm doing to the highs. If I'm eqing to much, it shows very quickly, and does become fatiguing.
Old 31st January 2007
  #29
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Donny's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k View Post
my experience is that fatigue comes not so much from volume or freq response but from phase issues. poorly recorded tracks, too much eq, bad eq, fubar room reflections in the mixspace... these things tire me out fast.

atc's are the brightest speakers ever, pmc's too, but they don't fatigue because their phase coherence is ludicrous.


gregoire
del
ubk
.
Agreed. The S3-A's are very revealing in the high frequencies. In fact it was a bit daunting when listening back to some stuff i had done many years ago on a pair of different monitors. Wrong EQ choices!!! Since getting the ADAM's my mixes translate better and sound much more balanced...And fatiguing they certainly are not
Old 1st February 2007
  #30
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Allright, as everybody LOOOOOVES their S3As sooo much, I´ll be the one to bash them

No, honestly, I think they really are less fatiguing than many other speakers out there. I´ve been recording and mixing a lot on S3A since 2001 (I guess that was even before they were available in the U.S.), also for the last 12 months I have been working with a pair of ARTist plus a Sub8 as well.

Still, I have a hard time to work with "only" a set of ADAM speakers, because I feel the high end sometimes does not translate well to the rest of the world. Also, i particularly don´t like the bottom end on the S3A, I think that is their weakest spot - too much 180-200 Hz, too less 40-70 Hz. I have worked on them in different studios that have S3As, so it´s not just the room, it is the speaker as well.

Still, i feel they are great for mixing, sort of the "evolution of the NS-10", but I strongly recommend a subwoofer for the S3As.

My experience.

Toby
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