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Sorry...Another 500 question
Old 25th January 2007
  #1
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Daedalus77's Avatar
Sorry...Another 500 question

Hello, all—

I apologize in advance for yet another thread on 500-form preamps.

A few months back I purchased a 500V rack to begin a 500-form collection. I began with two API 512cs. My budget now allows the purchase a second pair of units. I desire two channels that will suit well recording drums, but which are versatile-enough for electric and acoustic guitars.

Other preamps I own: 512c (2 -- mentioned above), GR-2NV, RNP (2).

We record primarily that pop/rock/country amalgam known (inadequately) as "Americana."

The 500 world is a rich and varied one, I know, and it's hard to go wrong. Any and all experiences and anecdotes would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,
David
Old 25th January 2007
  #2
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rowdy322's Avatar
 

A P1 comes to mind!
Old 25th January 2007
  #3
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A pair P-1 will be great for your over heads, as well as vocals and EG.


Nick
Old 25th January 2007
  #4
C/G
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C/G's Avatar
 

Why not another pair of the API's? I like my drums going through all of the same type of pres. Use your Great River for overs and four 512's for the drums. After another pair of 512c pres, then I'd venture into a pair of P1's or something different.
Old 25th January 2007
  #5
Colin,


do you like your drums all thru the same kind of pre's

so you get a " percieved reality" or put another way

so your kit doesn't sound tonally disjointed ?

or some other reason ?
Old 25th January 2007
  #6
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus77 View Post
Hello, all—

I apologize in advance for yet another thread on 500-form preamps.

A few months back I purchased a 500V rack to begin a 500-form collection. I began with two API 512cs. My budget now allows the purchase a second pair of units. I desire two channels that will suit well recording drums, but which are versatile-enough for electric and acoustic guitars.

Other preamps I own: 512c (2 -- mentioned above), GR-2NV, RNP (2).

We record primarily that pop/rock/country amalgam known (inadequately) as "Americana."

The 500 world is a rich and varied one, I know, and it's hard to go wrong. Any and all experiences and anecdotes would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,
David
My first thought was the A Designs P1, based on the other gear which you currently own.
Old 25th January 2007
  #7
David ,


sorry for diverting the thread a little .

As to your question I have a bae 312 and its great , similar to a 512c

but a slighlty different flavor that could be useful in one light.

On the other hand the Shadow Hills Gama are pretty cool with swicthable

x-formers for different sounds thats sort of versatile.
Old 25th January 2007
  #8
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thenoiseflower's Avatar
 

I'd get a few more 512's or 312's too. that or a pair of gammas.


I guess I REALLY gotta hear these P1's huh?
Old 25th January 2007
  #9
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C/G's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mahasandi View Post
Colin,


do you like your drums all thru the same kind of pre's

so you get a " percieved reality" or put another way

so your kit doesn't sound tonally disjointed ?

or some other reason ?

I like the kit to sound as one instrument so my reasoning would be to have consistency or continuity throughout the sound. There is simply something about the sound of kits recorded through consoles that I like so that is all I have for my reasoning.

I have 6 channels of UA 2108 I use for drums and it makes me smile. I will echo one of your above posts about the Shadow Hills mono Gama. I have a pair and want 2 more so I can almost cover a whole kit as well. I've been using them as overhead pres with the 2108 becasue when they are set to Nickel they have a similar vibe to the 2108 with a bit less crunch and a tad more airy sparkle. Set to steel they are good for a second snare and kick mic, but I like the overall kit going through the same type of pre.
Old 25th January 2007
  #10
Yeah,

Colin thats what i was getting at (consistent sound) ,
but you said it more clearly
For me this often sounds better, less like samples
more organic.

Thanks
Nick
Old 26th January 2007
  #11
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Daedalus77's Avatar
Thanks for all the responses thus far. Colin—I'm like you philosophically, I think. My initial thought was to go for two more 512s, or, more likely, get two BAE 312As, which are "essentially" the API sound, but, from what I've read, more "high-fi." Having that kind of consistency for the kit's pres seems like it would lend a certain coherence to the overall sound.

That said, the P-1 and the Shadow Hills seem like the best "overall" 500 pres (at least from all the hype one reads). But is anyone really using either for drums on a regular basis? My sense is they're used a lot for guitars and other applications. (Perhaps this is because most people who have them already own 4+ APIs...)
Old 26th January 2007
  #12
Here for the gear
 

I've got a lunch box and before I added my 3rd and 4th 512c, I did a lot of thinking about the need for many different flavors of outboard pres. Everybody seems to want their recordings to sound like the classics. They're obsessed with vintage gear and whether or not the metal in the wire that's in the new pres has the same impurities as the wire in the vintage pres. They seem to forget one huge huge difference in the way the old records were recorded. They were all done using just one kind of preamp! Yes, sometimes they changed studios in the middle of a record and the new studio had a different kind of desk, but that was usually done just for budget and scheduling reasons.

When did people start using outboard pres? Ten years ago? Wasn't Pet Sounds. Sgt. Pepper, Dark Side Of The Moon and Nevermind all done using just one or maybe 2 different kinds of pres? These recording equipment magazines and message boards have us all hot, bothered and horny for all these new must have flavors. I want some P-1s, and a couple of Elixirs so bad I can't hardly stand it. But maybe my recordings would be better served by getting some more 512s so I can cover the whole drum kit and track the whole band live using just one kind of pre?

And if you think about, back in the day, because of Aux sends and sending things out to compressors, reverbs and other stuff , tracks got sent through that one type of preamp more than once. It just seems to me that this would make a lot more difference in the sound of a record than how much nickel was in the wiring of the 1073 clone as opposed to the vintage 1073.

Am I only one that feels this way?
Old 26th January 2007
  #13
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I always figure if you going to 4 x512c, you might as well get a API 3214+.....cheaper and then you can load up the rack with other modules.....P-1, 560, 550. Having said that you can't go wrong with more 512c modules.

These are my drum pres
API 3124+
API Lunch Box with 2 x P-1, EM Blue, EM Red, 2 x 560
2 x LTD-1


Nic
Old 26th January 2007
  #14
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Daedalus77's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aearth View Post
I always figure if you going to 4 x512c, you might as well get a API 3214+.....cheaper and then you can load up the rack with other modules.....P-1, 560, 550. Having said that you can't go wrong with more 512c modules.

These are my drum pres
API 3124+
API Lunch Box with 2 x P-1, EM Blue, EM Red, 2 x 560
2 x LTD-1

Nic
Thanks, Nic. Yes, that makes sense, but I've got (presently) eight empty spaces in the 500VPR, so just getting more 512s seems to make more sense.

By the way, what do you use the P-1s and EMs for when using them on the kit?
Old 26th January 2007
  #15
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Hi
P-1's always on OH's
EM Blue or LTD-1 top and bottom snare
EM Red or LTD-1 kick
3124 on toms and room mics
560 for shaping if needed


Nic
Old 26th January 2007
  #16
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Daedalus77's Avatar
Can anyone comment on 512s versus BAE 312A for kick, toms, perhaps snare?

Also, anyone comment on the Purple Biz on the same sources?

Thanks again.
Old 26th January 2007
  #17
Old 26th January 2007
  #18
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RCM - Ronan's Avatar
One more vote for a couple P-1s.

I would not worry about using multiple mic pres on the drums. Using various mic pres on the drums is actually the norm these days (but not neccesary)
Old 26th January 2007
  #19
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h-man's Avatar
 

I just bought a lunchbox awhile back. I started off with a Buzz audio Elixir, and have also added a couple of P1's. They are both amazing sounding pres. I want to add another Buzz and some more P1's. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the 500 series. I really would like to have them all. I guess that is slutism at its finest. ha.
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