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Kii Three-Have you heard them?
Old 4th June 2017
  #931
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggy Neve Slut View Post
Ha so true.. 188 pages of about Amphions!
Yes Wiggy, the awfully boring 188 pages thread on gearslutz !



R.
Old 5th June 2017
  #932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolf Ebitsch View Post
Yes Wiggy, the awfully boring 188 pages thread on gearslutz !



R.
hehe, and it stills goes on and on, like sabbath´s heaven and hell
Old 7th June 2017
  #933
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Still absolutely loving them. Still mostly in low latency mode (composing/tracking).
Old 8th June 2017
  #934
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edham View Post
Still absolutely loving them. Still mostly in low latency mode (composing/tracking).
Same here and switching to the higher latency for mixing and mastering. The best tool in my studio.
Old 9th June 2017
  #935
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Just did some catching up on this thread.

I've been on them for what, 5-6 months now and this geezer nailed it;

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpr View Post
I can say for certain that this speaker represents the future. How could it not when the natural clarity is absolutely off the charts ridiculous?

The Amphions [...] create an incredibly usable portrayal of the music. By 'useable' I mean they give me exactly what I need in order to determine what changes, if any, should be made. If you are like me and loathe spinning your wheels on issues that will have zero real world impact, then the Amphions will let you work fast and efficient, only showing you issues that WILL have real world consequences.

The Kii's in contrast present a ton of awe inspiring upper mid range detail (without inherent harshness), which as impressive as it sounds, was getting me a little hung up in mastering. It wasn't until hours later in my car, and on my laptop speakers at home that I realized I wasted time on a few things that were of no real world consequence. Issues that the amphions would of guided me around without fail.

Over time I will adapt to the Kii's detail and learn not to fall for microcosmic annoyances which the world will pay no attention to. That's a given.

The thing that really keeps blowing me away about the Kii's however is how even the bass guitar comes across. [...] It comes thru as one single column of tone and I didn't realize that the amphions, even on the EXACT same curve as the Kii's, aren't delivering it as naturally until i switched to the Kii's. Same volume of the SAME frequencies, yet the bass remains an obvious pillar of sound that stays the same the the entire performance, note by note

[...]

I have a feeling tho that the Kii FOURs or FIVEs are going to make this a different story...
The part about being hung up on absolutely minute details is SO absolutely correct. I've put myself through the mill with a lot of masters on the Kiis; The PMC IB2S did as the Amphions do for mpr. I understand 100%. So they've slowed me down to some extent, but I'm learning how to interpret them.

But the thing is, judging purely by client feedback, those details DO make a difference in the real world. Even if it's 1-2%; it's important. Tiny things all add up, and the responses have, very generally speaking, gone from 'sounds great!' to 'WOW!!!'.

The way they reveal ANY kind of distortion (all kinds, including phase) still blows me away. Interpreting those upper mids/highs is still a real trick to master though, but I'm getting there faster and faster.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating, and I'm very, very happy indeed. I'm building my new studio soon (hold ups due to other bloody people) and I'll be teaming them with my pair of Rythmik subs. I can't wait.
Old 14th June 2017
  #936
mpr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stamand View Post
Any news Mark???
Hi guys! I finally got a breather to gather my thoughts. A month later and I'm keeping the Kii's, along with the Amphions. Im kind of embarrassed to admit this, not just for the financial consideration, but because: do I really need two very high end monitors to do my best work?

Apparently for me, yes. Even though the Amphions remain my goto for translation confidence (by creating a GIANT bullseye), it is the consistency and natural realism of the Kii midrange that remains untouchable after almost 100 masters now.

Having access to that midrange detail in addition to real world honesty from the Amphions has definitely improved my work. I sometimes wonder if I will shed the Amphions in the future, but right now Im still on the Amphions 70% of the time because the confidence factor they deliver is off the charts.

Again, the reason I can switch seamlessly between the two without confusing my ears is because they are both Trinnov'd together (mostly below 400hz). And both are on the same translation curve (previously mentioned).

This means that what I hear change when switching are mostly the phase and dynamic responses, that while both affect the frequency response, it feels dynamic (music dependent) and not static as if without Trinnov. I find this very useful during the flow of a master, and my confidence continues to build throughout the session which is key.

Turn off the Trinnov for both speakers and Amphions win hands down. 'Win' in terms of natural translation outside my room, and not how good it sounds in the room. The Kii's sound impressive regardless so unless your room is perfect, DRC is essential for professional work IMO.

Which brings me to the only real fail of the Kii's: With all that DSP inside of them, there is no professional way (yet) to dial in a proper room response for critical mastering.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bassbinoctuplets View Post
Any difference running them analog vs digital?
Yes! Even though the builtin ADC is clearly very good, I go into the Kii's digitally as I can hear a subtle veil removed while using AES input. And I could swear the dynamics sound more lively as well, but that is likely dependent on how many bits you are feeding it. (every 6dB down = 1 bit of info)

Quote:
Originally Posted by housegezeichnet View Post
anyone using kii three with trinnov?
Yes, 100% of the time and from 20hz to 20khz. I have a feeling that the Kii's have enough internal DSP to do what the Trinnov (or Acourate) does but is currently missing the software interface for intricate room calibration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macc View Post
But the thing is, judging purely by client feedback, those details DO make a difference in the real world. Even if it's 1-2%; it's important. Tiny things all add up, and the responses have, very generally speaking, gone from 'sounds great!' to 'WOW!!!'.

The way they reveal ANY kind of distortion (all kinds, including phase) still blows me away. Interpreting those upper mids/highs is still a real trick to master though, but I'm getting there faster and faster.
I am right there with you macc! My work is also improving as I learn how to read the upper mids of the Kii's efficiently. The Amphion upper mids are more musical (to me) and thus easier to flow with, but the Kii's offer pure realism up top and this detail can be smartly harnessed without breaking your flow.

macc, don't you also use Trinnov full range? If so, do you use a target curve as well?

Last edited by mpr; 14th June 2017 at 04:17 AM..
Old 15th June 2017
  #937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpr View Post
I am right there with you macc! My work is also improving as I learn how to read the upper mids of the Kii's efficiently. The Amphion upper mids are more musical (to me) and thus easier to flow with, but the Kii's offer pure realism up top and this detail can be smartly harnessed without breaking your flow.
Yeah, I'm getting there with that. A big part of that (or tied in with it) is the absolutely ruthless revealing of distortion. I spent ages in disbelief at how distorted a lot of stuff was when I first got them. It's really something.

Quote:
macc, don't you also use Trinnov full range? If so, do you use a target curve as well?
I use Acourate, and use an almost-flat curve. I 'grew up' in my engineering with electronic stuff, in clubs etc, so I have a slight sub bass lift at about 60Hz down. It used to be 1dB and I upped it to 1.5dB when I got the Kiis; they measure flat (and I MEASURE stuff to death), but they're so feckin clean that I felt I needed to compensate to avoid over-boosting.

FWIW I spent a good while talking to the Trinnov guys at AES recently and had a good look at the box etc. I couldn't help noticing that their correction gives some pre-ring - you could see it on the step response on their display unit. Acourate's pre-ring compensation does the trick really well - not a sniff of it. And it's a tenth of the price. I haven't tried Trinnov though so I can't comment beyond that. Basically I'm too small fry to afford it...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #938
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There is really no way to describe how much I love these speakers.
From bottom to top - its all "one thing". One picture that is incredibly coherent.
I've been through some of the best speakers out there - and I sit in front of the Kii's in total bliss.
It's not that they "sound good". They don't. they only sound good on great mixes and will show all the flaws in bad ones - but not in a way that pushes you hard in a particular direction. They are cool with whatever sonic vibe you prefer and will show you a completely balanced spectrum to let you know when you've reached your destination.

It's long after the honeymoon phase. We've moved onto the I can't live without you phase.
Last time that happened for me was 23 years ago - and my wife and I are still going strong.

So that's how much I love these speakers. I just publicly said something sentimental about my wife in a musician/audio forum..........
Old 2 weeks ago
  #939
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After one year and half with Kii I must say I don't have any need to look elsewhere...Still the best speakers I have ever heard with the best translation ever.The best investment in my studio.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #940
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edham View Post
There is really no way to describe how much I love these speakers.
From bottom to top - its all "one thing". One picture that is incredibly coherent.
I've been through some of the best speakers out there - and I sit in front of the Kii's in total bliss.
It's not that they "sound good". They don't. they only sound good on great mixes and will show all the flaws in bad ones - but not in a way that pushes you hard in a particular direction. They are cool with whatever sonic vibe you prefer and will show you a completely balanced spectrum to let you know when you've reached your destination.

It's long after the honeymoon phase. We've moved onto the I can't live without you phase.
Last time that happened for me was 23 years ago - and my wife and I are still going strong.

So that's how much I love these speakers. I just publicly said something sentimental about my wife in a musician/audio forum..........
Old 2 weeks ago
  #941
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Old 2 weeks ago
  #942
Old 1 week ago
  #943
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Wiggy Neve Slut's Avatar
 

For London peeps there's a listening party at red bull studios next Tuesday.. Can't wait to hear them!

Wiggy
Old 1 week ago
  #944
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skriabin View Post
Any comparison yet between the Kii's and the Dutch & Dutch 8C's?
This is the Kii's and Dutch & Dutch 8Cs measured from the same point with the microphone in exactly the same position.
Keith
I have no idea why the forum software has inverted the image!
Attached Thumbnails
Kii Three-Have you heard them?-img_0896.jpg  

Last edited by puriteaudio; 1 week ago at 10:13 AM..
Old 1 week ago
  #945
Quote:
Originally Posted by puriteaudio View Post
I have no idea why the forum software has inverted the image!
Here it is right side up
Attached Thumbnails
Kii Three-Have you heard them?-kii.jpg  
Old 1 week ago
  #946
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I'm curious about applying curves. I'm still delighted with the natural flat response of the Kii's.

Bar Mark, is anyone else applying EQ (albeit aftermarket solution or via the internal contour controls), or are most keeping it as flat as possible?
Old 1 week ago
  #947
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b0se View Post
I'm curious about applying curves. I'm still delighted with the natural flat response of the Kii's.

Bar Mark, is anyone else applying EQ (albeit aftermarket solution or via the internal contour controls), or are most keeping it as flat as possible?
The Kii Three sound great flat listening to the music. For mixing, I've had to boost 1,5db in 3,5KHz because my mixes were sounding a little bright. I think it depend on your taste. My body was asking for a little brighter sound.

Last edited by MrChick; 1 week ago at 01:36 PM..
Old 1 week ago
  #948
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I totally respect the decision of the guys that use correction software/hardware with the Kii's, but still find it weird how they can be raved about after having changed the frequency (and phase?) response.
I know it's very normal to do it with large mains but these are top of the line near fields so it makes me wonder..
Old 3 days ago
  #949
rsv
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i have my kii control now that i have been waiting for a long time . now they are more amazing with the control . i was very impressed with internal eq of the kii very soft . now with the control you can make sound the kii like you want to . they are the best speakers in that price range right now . they sound like 20 k or 40 k speakers .
Old 3 days ago
  #950
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I got my pair without the Kii Control and have been toying with the idea of getting one too.
At present I run them from a PC -> USB -> Lynx Hilo -> AES -> Kii Three. I have other plans regarding Hilo, so the Control would come handy. I have one concern though:
Hilo has a rock solid USB interface (including drivers) which runs flawlessly no matter how busy my PC is. Any other USB DAC I have tried has given me less joy in terms of stability. Wondering how solid the Control is in this regard?
Old 3 days ago
  #951
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On mostly Mac and occasional Pc here, completely rock solid, Kii appears in 'audio midi' sounds come out.
Keith
Old 3 days ago
  #952
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbjp View Post
I totally respect the decision of the guys that use correction software/hardware with the Kii's, but still find it weird how they can be raved about after having changed the frequency (and phase?) response.
I know it's very normal to do it with large mains but these are top of the line near fields so it makes me wonder..
Horses for courses, depends what the ear is used to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleasantSounds View Post
I got my pair without the Kii Control and have been toying with the idea of getting one too.
At present I run them from a PC -> USB -> Lynx Hilo -> AES -> Kii Three. I have other plans regarding Hilo, so the Control would come handy. I have one concern though:
Hilo has a rock solid USB interface (including drivers) which runs flawlessly no matter how busy my PC is. Any other USB DAC I have tried has given me less joy in terms of stability. Wondering how solid the Control is in this regard?
100% solid on the Mac; not a single issue since owning them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsv View Post
i have my kii control now that i have been waiting for a long time . now they are more amazing with the control . i was very impressed with internal eq of the kii very soft . now with the control you can make sound the kii like you want to . they are the best speakers in that price range right now . they sound like 20 k or 40 k speakers .
Enjoy!
Old 3 days ago
  #953
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fwiw - my Kii's are set flat and I see no need to tweak them.
Its cool that you can but "flat" has never sounded so good .....
Old 3 days ago
  #954
Gear Head
 

Can you guys explain how did the Kii Control has changed your workflow?

I guess there is no need for traditional monitor controller when you have the Kii Control and also no need for a dedicated D/A when working in stereo?

The Kii Control looks great but isn't it limited in situations where a 2nd pair of monitors needed or headphones amp, more analog input sources etc..?

I should have a demo pair in a few days and i'm not sure if it will be better to go with the Kii Control or with Grace Design M905 Digital.. the M905 can control the volume of the Kii Three (even when connected digitally - M905 AES OUT > Kii Three AES IN) and there will be no difference or degradation in audio quality Vs using Kii Control.

I didn't see the M905 mentioned here so i wonder if there is any advantage to the Kii Control except for the lower price and the presets which i'm not sure how often are used in normal use.
Old 3 days ago
  #955
rsv
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hello BoilingZone
like bose and puriteaudio say very 100% solid on the Mac . i got my kii control for 5 days now and i love it a lot . for mixing in the box is the best thing that you can get the kii control for your kii speakers no need for traditional monitor controller . i was using a grace 905 a year ago too with amphions one18 great unit too but i like the kii control better . for add external ouboart gears you have to use your interface and AES OUT to your Kii Three AES IN and use the headphones amp of your interface . you need the kii control to use your kii speakers in digital. bc if you use your grace 905 aes out to your kii speakers it work but you don't gonna have the volume control of your grace working going digital only analog that happen to before with my grace .
Old 3 days ago
  #956
Gear Head
 

@rsv, thanks for the info.
That was true about M905 until the last firmware update.

From Grace Design website: "New Firmware supports Digital Speaker control via AES and S/PDIF outputs"
That's great news for anyone who have DSP/Digital speakers (Barefoot, Kii THREE, Genelec etc)
Old 3 days ago
  #957
rsv
Here for the gear
 

wow BoilingZone i sold my grace and my amphion a year ago before that last firmware update .i miss my grace too i send a emai to the grace teen about that problem with my kii and they never email back too me a year ago .
pros of the kii control vs the grace is the great eq of the kii speakers that you can control everything with kii control and saved the presets
pros of the grace vs kii control is the mono bottom and the spl meters and a lot more conection for more speakers.

if don't want to spend more money in the kii control and if you gonna use your kii speakers flat . keep the grace 905
Old 2 days ago
  #958
Gear Addict
 

Thread Starter
Owner of kii...can you control the Eq setting via usb?
Old 2 days ago
  #959
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The kii 'control' connects to the kii speaker via their 'kiilink' connector, which is RJ45 , you choose which speaker is the master and then slave the other speaker to it, with the supplied Cat 6 cable.
Every parameter of the speaker is adjustablefrom the 'conTrol' even some which are not available via the rear of the speakers.
On the rear of the 'control there are some more connection options including USB.
https://www.puriteaudio.co.uk/single...rrives-at-last
Keith
Old 2 days ago
  #960
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Thread Starter
So...no software available to have acces to all of the feature?
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