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PSI Audio AVVA C20 (post your experience -review) Bass Traps
Old 18th November 2015
  #1
Gear Nut
 

PSI Audio AVAA C20 (post your experience -review)

Please post your experience if you had the chance and funds to buy this new product. I searched for user reviews but not much till now.

Last edited by 11bit; 19th November 2015 at 08:57 AM..
Old 19th November 2015
  #2
Gear Nut
 

Can a moderator correct the thread title from AVVA to AVAA? Thanks.
Old 19th November 2015
  #3
Gear Nut
 

I too would be eager to hear of any reports...
Old 19th January 2016
  #4
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I have two currently and two more will arrive on Saturday. I will post some data soon. Subjective findings were confirmed by objective measurement (fuzz measure).
Old 19th January 2016
  #5
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Oskari J.'s Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jyibe View Post
I have two currently and two more will arrive on Saturday. I will post some data soon. Subjective findings were confirmed by objective measurement (fuzz measure).
Waiting eagerly!
Old 20th January 2016
  #6
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Subscribed
Old 24th April 2016
  #7
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Hjelmevold's Avatar
I came across a very well-written test (in German) by mbakustik.de that includes measurements from different real-world scenarios:
Bassfalle PSI AVAA - mbakustik
http://www.mbakustik.de/wp-content/u.../AVAA-Test.pdf

To summarize, they were impressed by the AVAA, but there isn't so much to gain in the sweet spot of rooms that are already well-treated acoustically. The AVAA seemed to work best in open (not densely packed with equipment/furniture) rectangular rooms.
I also wish they had done some reverberation measurements, not just frequency response. Would have been nice to see some before-and-after waterfalls.

In other news, I thought I'd mention a very important detail that's written in the manual. I'll paraphrase:
Quote:
Apart from the two rear walls and floor that make up the corner the AVAA is in, make sure that no large reflective objects are within 1.5m from the AVAA, as these objects may cause "instability".
I'm guessing they're talking about inconsistent audible results due to interfering reflections, and not mechanical instability.

That's too bad. I was hoping to save some money for two AVAAs for my small apartment living room which is full of all sorts of furniture with practically no open space for bass traps, and certainly not 1.5m free space radius in the corners for the AVAAs to function properly.
Old 25th April 2016
  #8
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I think that's just the nature of the physics at play here, but it might be possible that it could be improved, since this is the first of its kind, I suppose.
Old 29th April 2016
  #9
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that 1.5 meters kinda kills it for me. The place I would most want to use these is in small rooms. Also the price kills it for any hobbyist. But I guess thats not the market.
Old 17th May 2016
  #10
faf
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A "little" experience from Bob Katz who has just released an article in Stereophile Magazine:

"Finally I can reveal the secret I've been keeping for months. Since the June issue of STEREOPHILE has come out: with my review of the AVAA active bass traps. It's remarkable technology that perform so well you think it breaks the laws of physics. There's nothing else on the planet that comes close to the performance of this patented technology. Sonically it has taken my room to a level of sonic accuracy that I never thought could be attained without some serious compromise, usually and overdamped room in the mid frequency and high-frequency decay time" - Bob Katz

More on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/bobkatz24bi...05?pnref=story
Old 17th May 2016
  #11
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Stereophile publishes a waterfall before and after the use of the avaa ?
Old 17th May 2016
  #12
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AVAA is still new to the market, not tons of info yet so hope it's OK to chime in with what I know (I am the USA dealer, I know).

If it means anything, we arranged all 3 of the USA magazine reviews for the PSI Audio AVAA and all 3 reviewers bought (purchased, not gifted) the demo units that were sent to them because they didn't want to unsolve the problems in their rooms that AVAA solved.

Bob Katz reviewed them for Stereophile Magazine (lets face it, a big market for these will be high end listening environments) and purchased 3 units.

Barry Rudolph reviewed them for MIX Magazine (upcoming issue) and purchased 2 units.

Andy Hong from TapeOp Magazine is reviewing them in an upcoming issue and purchased 2 units.

AVAA is definitely for well treated rooms that due to size and shape, still have issues in the bass region. It won't make a bad room great, it will cure that last issue that may still exist where re-building or tons of thick materials cannot be used to cure.

Maybe somebody on Gearslutz was at Fab Dupont's studio after the AES show this past October that can chime in on the demo we did. The first demo was with John Storyk who was amazing to watch, like an orchestra conductor having us move them around until the problem in their "B" room was solved. Within a few minutes the effect was kick drums going BOOOOOOMMMMMM to BOOM no matter where you stood in the room.

We then had a second small demo that more people attended afterward.

War
Old 17th May 2016
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warhead View Post
AVAA is still new to the market, not tons of info yet so hope it's OK to chime in with what I know (I am the USA dealer, I know).
The French demonstration has not impressioned more people. Avaa workes like the others products in the same domain. More you use, better is.
Old 17th May 2016
  #14
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warhead's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dinococcus View Post
Stereophile publishes a waterfall before and after the use of the avaa ?
I don't have a hard copy of this Stereophile review to know. I do know Andy Hong from TapeOp has waterfall plots showing the effect AVAA had on his room resonances, so I assume he would publish those in the magazine review when it comes out.

War
Old 18th May 2016
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warhead View Post
AVAA is definitely for well treated rooms that due to size and shape, still have issues in the bass region. It won't make a bad room great, it will cure that last issue that may still exist where re-building or tons of thick materials cannot be used to cure.
Interesting.. Lately a well known german acoustician (mb akustik) tested the AVAA together with some guys from PSI and they came to the exact opposite conclusion: CLICK (german)

The test is unfortunately in german, but maybe google translate can help..
Old 18th May 2016
  #16
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jlaws's Avatar
What's the gist of the article?
Old 18th May 2016
  #17
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thepoison606's Avatar
Their conclusion is:

- the AVAA is a further possibility for room treatment (additional to existing techniques)
- it achieves no wonders
- only very slight enhancements in treated rooms
- very interesting for untreated rooms
- great for people who change their location often (obviously)
- without knowledge of acoustics not easy to install
Old 19th May 2016
  #18
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jlaws's Avatar
Thanks for that! Some interesting conclusions, for sure...
Old 19th May 2016
  #19
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Hjelmevold's Avatar
thepoison606: Like I pointed out a few posts further up when I shared the same article, one weakness of that article is that MB Akustik only examine frequency response, without examining spectral decay. (At least that is what I could interpret from the article based on the German that I know)
Waterfall plots should be much more revealing than just frequency responses, in my opinion. Nevertheless, it's always nice to see people sharing real-world measurements.
Old 19th May 2016
  #20
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Overlooked your post, i'm sorry!

And of course you're right, decay time would be much more interesting..
Old 13th June 2016
  #21
Gear Head
 

Here's Bob's article in Stereophile:

PSI Audio AVAA C20 electronic bass trap | Stereophile.com
Old 13th June 2016
  #22
Gear Head
 

And here's Barry's review in MIX:

PSI Audio AVAA C20 | Mixonline
Old 13th June 2016
  #23
Gear Head
 

Here are waterfall plots taken in my room at mix position with two AVAA C20 units placed in opposite corners (front right, left rear).

The AVAAs are turned off and on, obviously.






And here's the frequency response (off/on overlaid on the same plot):



I don't know how many unicorns PSI Audio had to milk to fill up these little 29 lb boxes full of magic, but within 5 minutes of putting two of these loaners from Warren into the corners of my room, I was begging Warren to take my money so I wouldn't have to send them back!

Riffing off of what Warren already stated above, these suckers take the ...OOOOMMMMmmmmmmnnnnnnn out of your room, so that you can clearly hear the BOOM. But they also reduce "bass-suck," the loss of bass energy due to room-mode cancellations. (Room resonances can TAKE AWAY desired bass energy as much as they can add unwanted bass energy, as is evident in the waterfall plots above.)

Unless you already have a significant portion of your room's physical volume filled with bass trapping, I doubt you'll find a more efficient solution for reducing low-end resonances than the AVAA C20. With that said, the C20 isn't going to magically fix a crap-sounding room, so step one should be to install passive treatment first, before investing in the AVAA C20.
Old 13th June 2016
  #24
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thedommer View Post
that 1.5 meters kinda kills it for me. The place I would most want to use these is in small rooms. Also the price kills it for any hobbyist. But I guess thats not the market.
My trapezoidal control room is approx 18 ft long by 13 ft wide (with tall ceilings). One of my AVAA C20 units is buried in the corner of a room, less than 20 inches from a couch and 4 inches from the rear of an equipment rack. I tried my two AVAA C20 units in various spots throughout my room before settling on two opposite corners. Even though the rear unit is surrounded by furniture and gear, it still works wonders.

So I would take the 1.5 meter requirement as more of a "suggestion" than a hard requirement.
Old 13th June 2016
  #25
Gear Head
 

And I almost forgot to mention — although I posted only the plots I took from mix position, the two AVAA C20 units made a tremendous difference throughout the whole room.
Old 14th June 2016
  #26
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Old 14th June 2016
  #27
Gear Maniac
 

I heard the AVAA in an old pro studio control room and i could definitely hear a little improvement, but while i'm interested in this technology, I won't buy this yet. It's too young and expensive, for me anyway, and I'm pretty sure it will get cheaper and better. Yolo, though, so if you have the cash for it..
It is worth to note that there is another version of this absorber, a hybrid one. It's still in development.
AES E-Library » Experimental Assessment of Low-Frequency Electroacoustic Absorbers for Modal Equalization in Actual Listening Rooms
Old 14th June 2016
  #28
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by warhead View Post
...no matter where you stood in the room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by microsoftsucks View Post
And I almost forgot to mention — although I posted only the plots I took from mix position, the two AVAA C20 units made a tremendous difference throughout the whole room.
Sho nuff.

War
Old 23rd June 2016
  #29
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yesterday my friend and I experimented with two avaa units in a 40-50m2 room which already sounds very controlled and fine.
the difference was extremely subtle with sine wave sweeps played in the room.
(maybe the room needs certainly more units?!)
but with music it was a little less subtle. ;-) the difference was more enjoyable. specially in the upper bass region..

we both heard that the (upper) bass has been tighter/tidier. without the avaa units, we would reduce the bass (in mastering) 0.5-1db in some tunes which were already mastered. but with the avaa anything in this region sounded fine, that was a little annoying without them.
but i'm not sure if this small difference could justify the price of 4000-5000 dollars!

this i would say, is a typical price for a "recently" developed unit, new technology. but it does not necessarily correlate with its capabilities.
Old 28th July 2016
  #30
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by babmusician View Post
the difference was extremely subtle with sine wave sweeps played in the room.
(maybe the room needs certainly more units?!)
but with music it was a little less subtle. ;-) the difference was more enjoyable. specially in the upper bass region..
Near-steady-state sounds, like sine-wave sweeps, aren't going to help you find anomalies in the spectral decay of your room — which explains why the difference was more pronounced with music. Music has lots of transient information, and when certain frequencies continue to resonate in the room, they can mask details across all frequencies.
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