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gobos or hard walls around the kit?
Old 29th May 2015
  #1
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Faderix's Avatar
 

gobos or hard walls around the kit?

How often do you prefer absorbers and gobos compare to hard walls and ceilings close to the drumset? Do you choose depending on the energy you prefer to the close mics, depending of the size of the room, or if you just experience problems like comb filtering or leakage?
Old 29th May 2015
  #2
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mbvoxx's Avatar
I'm a big fan of gobos since they allow for flexibility.
Old 29th May 2015
  #3
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natpub's Avatar
depends on the sound wanted and what's best for the song...many places allow for fine tuning, adjusting surfaces and angles...one place I worked even allowed the ceiling to move up and down
Old 30th May 2015
  #4
Theoretically you'd want partially covered mid and HF absorption on anything less than 20ms round trip. So basically any wall (or ceiling) 10 feet or less from the source (particularly for the benefit of overheads or room mics). I'd still keep things controlled (not necessarily 'dead' which will take all the life out of the room) though if the space is larger.
Old 30th May 2015
  #5
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Jesus.

I'll answer your question. I think that drums that were recorded with hard, reflective surfaces next to them sound like ass. Therefore, I avoid that situation as much as humanly possible (which, as it turns out, is 100% of the time). There hasn't been a situation in my life where I've thought, "these drums would sound SICK if I put some plywood or cinder blocks a few feet away from them." It's not a "it depends" kind of thing and it's definitely not a "theoretically" kind of thing - it's simply the difference between what sounds good and what doesn't. Your mileage will not vary. Anytime you put hard, reflective surfaces next to YOUR drum kit in YOUR room it will ALWAYS sound like ass. If you can't hear it then please just trust that others will so don't do it. MmmKay?
Old 30th May 2015
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllBread View Post
Jesus.

it's definitely not a "theoretically" kind of thing - Anytime you put hard, reflective surfaces next to YOUR drum kit in YOUR room it will ALWAYS sound like ass. If you can't hear it then please just trust that others will so don't do it. MmmKay?
I said that because of the people who would say "but in real life it's different!!!". I've seen plenty of kits sat in the corner of a room, next to drywall or wood walls that were 3 feet away and they ultimately sounded great. Yes, if he wants to be safe there is nothing wrong with eliminating early reflections, and that's what I personally recommend (so we are in agreement). But sometimes art (and luck I suppose) can triumph science *flame suit on*.

Last edited by NathanEldred; 30th May 2015 at 05:12 AM..
Old 30th May 2015
  #7
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Diffusion can also be your friend. I have a diffusor behind the drums, and a cloud 12feet or so above. There's an angles wall a few feet to the left and a closer wall with something hanging on the right. I feel like that keeps the close mics and OH pretty nicely focused. Further out in the room there is less treatment, and that allows room mics to be more splashy.
Old 31st May 2015
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllBread View Post
Jesus.

I'll answer your question. I think that drums that were recorded with hard, reflective surfaces next to them sound like ass. Therefore, I avoid that situation as much as humanly possible (which, as it turns out, is 100% of the time). There hasn't been a situation in my life where I've thought, "these drums would sound SICK if I put some plywood or cinder blocks a few feet away from them." It's not a "it depends" kind of thing and it's definitely not a "theoretically" kind of thing - it's simply the difference between what sounds good and what doesn't. Your mileage will not vary. Anytime you put hard, reflective surfaces next to YOUR drum kit in YOUR room it will ALWAYS sound like ass. If you can't hear it then please just trust that others will so don't do it. MmmKay?


Yes.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
Diffusion can also be your friend. I have a diffusor behind the drums, and a cloud 12feet or so above. There's an angles wall a few feet to the left and a closer wall with something hanging on the right. I feel like that keeps the close mics and OH pretty nicely focused. Further out in the room there is less treatment, and that allows room mics to be more splashy.
How far behind the drummer's back is the diffusor? I've heard some acoustician-types say there's some kind of minimum-distance rule to follow when it comes to diffusion, and I'm particularly interested in this at the moment cuz the studio build I'm doing is looking to put stone wall diffusion behind where we think the kit is gonna most often go.



To the OP - I pretty much always track with gobos flanking the drum kit. Usually three in total: one each on either side, and one in the middle directly behind the player. I prefer tighter, deader OHs (mostly for stereo imaging purposes) and room mics with more ambience. Offers up a nice bit of variety. If I need more ambient OHs, I can simply raise them up higher.
Old 31st May 2015
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
How far behind the drummer's back is the diffusor? I've heard some acoustician-types say there's some kind of minimum-distance rule to follow when it comes to diffusion, and I'm particularly interested in this at the moment cuz the studio build I'm doing is looking to put stone wall diffusion behind where we think the kit is gonna most often go.
Its pretty much right behind the drums/drummer. I built it with a buddy, because shortly after moving in I could tell there was some odd stuff coming back at the mics from that. Before I built it, I'd put a packing blanket behind the drummer. There's also a cloud 11-13 feet up hanging from that angled ceiling.


Old 31st May 2015
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllBread View Post
Jesus.

I'll answer your question. I think that drums that were recorded with hard, reflective surfaces next to them sound like ass. Therefore, I avoid that situation as much as humanly possible (which, as it turns out, is 100% of the time). There hasn't been a situation in my life where I've thought, "these drums would sound SICK if I put some plywood or cinder blocks a few feet away from them." It's not a "it depends" kind of thing and it's definitely not a "theoretically" kind of thing - it's simply the difference between what sounds good and what doesn't. Your mileage will not vary. Anytime you put hard, reflective surfaces next to YOUR drum kit in YOUR room it will ALWAYS sound like ass. If you can't hear it then please just trust that others will so don't do it. MmmKay?
^ Yup.

But it is true that sometimes people want that closed in, silly-assed drum sound that comes with nearby hard surfaces. I have never agreed with that.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #11
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I think drums can sound great in a small, dead room for a dry and upfront 70s kind of sound.

I take "hard walls" to mean "built in and not modular", rather than "reflective and nasty" per se.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
Faderix's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllBread View Post
Jesus.

I'll answer your question. I think that drums that were recorded with hard, reflective surfaces next to them sound like ass. Therefore, I avoid that situation as much as humanly possible (which, as it turns out, is 100% of the time). There hasn't been a situation in my life where I've thought, "these drums would sound SICK if I put some plywood or cinder blocks a few feet away from them." It's not a "it depends" kind of thing and it's definitely not a "theoretically" kind of thing - it's simply the difference between what sounds good and what doesn't. Your mileage will not vary. Anytime you put hard, reflective surfaces next to YOUR drum kit in YOUR room it will ALWAYS sound like ass. If you can't hear it then please just trust that others will so don't do it. MmmKay?
What exactly is it you think sounds like ass? If everything is balanced, couldn't it be nice to just open up the energy some more? Isn't this the same reason why we often prefer hard floors to many instruments?
Old 2nd June 2015
  #13
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For me it's the cymbals that hurt the most.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #14
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Interesting thread! Would love to hear from recording engineers who have made pro records at top notch studios.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramism View Post
Interesting thread! Would love to hear from recording engineers who have made pro records at top notch studios.
I think you already have...
Old 2nd June 2015
  #16
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Ok would love to hear from MORE recording engineers who have made pro records at top notch studios.
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