The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Question for mixers who worked a lot on SSLs Consoles
Old 3rd May 2015
  #1
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

Question for mixers who worked on SSLs

I am wondering if these days there is a point in buying SSL outboard analog eq's considering there are so many clinical plugs out there with linear phase, band solo and what not, while the colorful, sweet and actually limited eq's are in fact harder to emulate ...

What are your thoughts? would an analog SSL eq be your choice for outboard, all considered?

Last edited by Rea; 3rd May 2015 at 07:52 AM.. Reason: Coherency...;)
Old 3rd May 2015
  #2
Gear Head
 
therecordlabel's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rea View Post
From what i gather, before plugins and DAWs, the SSL EQ's were considered THE clinical carving tools, that were not necessarily famous for their beautiful sonics, but rather for their utilitarian advantage, while outboard EQ's or console eq's like Neve/API/Trident etc. were considered a more "interesting" and pleasant eq, but less flexible.

I am wondering if these days there is a point in investing in SSL analog eq's since there are so many clinical plugs out there with linear phase and what not, while the colorful, sweet and limited eq's are actually harder to emulate ...

What are your thoughts? would an analog SSL eq be your choice today all considered?
Hey,
It's true that the plugin versions available to emulate SSL (Duende, Waves, MH, Slate) are getting extremely good, and are just as useful for surgical stuff IMO. But hardware has a way of imparting weight that I love - don't forget many people also boost with SSL EQs, they're not just for cutting! The main issue is what hardware to use outside of a desk - the 500 stuff doesn't have the filter if I recall, and I love the filter on SSL. For versatile hardware EQ we just ordered a pair of Kush Elektra 500s - will report back :-)
P
Old 3rd May 2015
  #3
Hi Rea,

We tried to match a few SSL plugin EQs against a range of EQ settings on our SSL 4000 desk to see which got close. The Waves SSL clones got very close but you can't boost like you can on the desk. Also, depending what SSL outboard you're looking at, you get more of a weighty, three dimensional thing going on if you run a mix through a few SSL outboard channels. I also have 8 channels of outboard SSL EQs with line amps that I bought years ago and running stems from an ITB mix through those instantly added weight and seemed to help pull the mix together and help things sit. I'm not sure one or two outboard EQs on an otherwise ITB mix would make much difference vs plugins (unless you're talking a decent stereo EQ on your mix) so I think whether it's 'worth it' is really down to how many outboard EQs you'd be looking to add. Plugins do get quite close to the SSL on an individual channel basis, but it doesn't sound the same as a whole mix going through an SSL desk or 75% outboard in my opinion.
Old 3rd May 2015
  #4
Clip Examples

I've also been wondering the same thing. I got the Softube Console 1 which is great and want to take the plunge on some hardware but it's a big investment for subtle returns.

I did this quick unscientific test with clips from the Zen Clipalator. I hope this is cool to post Warren?

There are the clipalator's drums with the E Series and with the Stereo G.
I took the bypass files and ran them through the Console 1 with a similar curve.

There's no doubt of all the drum clips on the Clipalator that I prefer the SSL. So here are some bounces so you can see how close the Softube is....

I know we are only dealing with dreaded MP3s but what do you think?
Attached Files

SSL 4.mp3 (923.8 KB, 1690 views)

SSL 3.mp3 (923.8 KB, 1625 views)

SSL 2.mp3 (923.8 KB, 1639 views)

SSL 1.mp3 (923.8 KB, 1645 views)

Old 3rd May 2015
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I already have 16 outboard SSL eq's and Dyn's but thinking out loud whether this size of investment was not made smarter had i left the surgical aspect to the Plugs and invested in colorful stuff in the analog domain and not the the way around...
Old 3rd May 2015
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rea View Post
I already have 16 outboard SSL eq's and Dyn's but thinking out loud whether this size of investment was not made smarter had i left the surgical aspect to the Plugs and invested in colorful stuff in the analog domain and not the the way around...
Yeah I've seen all your SSL related posts. I merely posted the clips to see whether folks would hear a noticeable difference between software and hardware. Whether the investment is a smart one depends on how much money we have and how much we can earn, which these days is unfortunately an issue.

I have a bunch of classic, coloured and vintage stuff but need at least 16 channels of decent surgical stuff. Many of the pros I've seen in recent times use plugs but I'm sick of screens and I think the hardware punches harder.
Old 3rd May 2015
  #7
We'll I'm not sure it's that straight forwards. We've got over £400k worth of analog desks & outboard, but we still use plugins too. It's worth it if it improves either your workflow, sound or inspiration levels! I guess it also depends greatly on what your budget allows and how vital making the money back from your investment is. I think maybe just add the 'colour' EQs ontop?? This is gearslutz after all Also, we use the desk EQ & dynamics all the time and it's a vital part of the sound. No doubt other EQs & compressors can be a bit more 'wow' but they work better on top of a great SSL bed. Sounds like you already have the makings of an awesome system, so no just keep adding on top of you like what you hear
Old 5th May 2015
  #8
Gear Guru
 
jwh1192's Avatar
if you have not tried the SSL Duende plugins it is worth the effort ..
Old 5th May 2015
  #9
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I do have the Duende. Compared them to my HW SSLs. The HW is more defined and has, what seems like , "better band separation", weight, size and depth for a lack of a better word.

I was kindda thinking from another place in my question, i am not comparing the SSL Plug clones to the HW. thats not the point. I was tying to figure out whether, having limited budget, is it more advantageous to buy HW color eq's such as Neve/Api etc. or SSL which are a different animal and considered more of a surgical eq., at the age of linear phase plugs and the such, that are created directly for super precise surgical work without emulating artifacts.

Trying to find out where is the biggest advantage of analog. In the "colorful" stuff or the surgical stuff...

This may not have a one answer. but this is GS- its where silly questions are asked and answered...
Old 5th May 2015
  #10
Gear Guru
 
jwh1192's Avatar
i have 4 - 512 EQ's in a rack .. and anything i run through it imparts a nice finished sound - 4 channels of my system are routed through these 4 SSL eq's all the time .. sometimes not doing anything but turned on .. mine are not surgical though .. sorry for confusion .. john
Old 5th May 2015
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

512? what is 512? the only 512 i know is API mic pre...
Old 5th May 2015
  #12
Gear Guru
 
jwh1192's Avatar
the SSL 512 EQ is from a film console ..
Old 6th May 2015
  #13
Lives for gear
 

The answer is, if possible, get both. I have a 500 series rack with SSL as well as more color/vibey modules. They complement each other. Doesn't need to be an either or situation.
Old 6th May 2015
  #14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rea View Post
I do have the Duende. Compared them to my HW SSLs. The HW is more defined and has, what seems like , "better band separation", weight, size and depth for a lack of a better word.

I was kindda thinking from another place in my question, i am not comparing the SSL Plug clones to the HW. thats not the point. I was tying to figure out whether, having limited budget, is it more advantageous to buy HW color eq's such as Neve/Api etc. or SSL which are a different animal and considered more of a surgical eq., at the age of linear phase plugs and the such, that are created directly for super precise surgical work without emulating artifacts.

Trying to find out where is the biggest advantage of analog. In the "colorful" stuff or the surgical stuff...

This may not have a one answer. but this is GS- its where silly questions are asked and answered...
I think you might find that what you refer to as 'colour' EQs (or any high end outboard for that matter) will sound noticeably 'better' than plugins, or at least do something that plugins really can't match, compared to 'regular' outboard EQs, but stacked up on multiple tracks, through a decent desk or summing amp, even those regular EQs like SSL desk EQs are going to help give your mix better power and separation than just using plugins.

At least, I think they certainly help .... A lot.

When we got our SSL desk our mixes instantly sounded better.

That said, Andrew Schepps now claims to mix entirely in the box and the Hozier album sounds pretty great so I guess the biggest difference is the ears and experience of the guy using what ever tools are available to them
Old 7th May 2015
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

I think Scheps is ITB for instant recall, and to be able to jump from mix to mix in a single mouse click without getting sick of the song he is working on- at least thats what he said-not for sonics. Granted, he gets great sound ITB that satisfies his clients as he is a great mixer, but im asking purely from a sonic pov...
Old 7th May 2015
  #16
I heard in a recent interview he claimed having done extensive shootouts, his ITB mixes 'killed' analogue in terms of sonics.

I can't say I've found the same thing, but I guess if he's found a way to nail it fair play.
Old 7th May 2015
  #17
Gear Head
Buy everything!
Old 7th May 2015
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Rea's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveAliveHQ View Post
I heard in a recent interview he claimed having done extensive shootouts, his ITB mixes 'killed' analogue in terms of sonics.

I can't say I've found the same thing, but I guess if he's found a way to nail it fair play.
Im not here to doubt Scheps. He has far more experience and credit then me, however, i can not get a better "sound" ITB, + the work flow of analog gear influences my way of working in a good way, so i factor that too...

But even in plain shootouts that i did between my analog gear and equivalent emulation plugs, the analog always wins, and same goes for summing. Its night and day IMO.

But again, im no Scheps... he may have found a way to make ITB processing sound better...

Where is that article you mentioned btw?
Old 7th May 2015
  #19
Deleted User
Guest
The scheps interviews i think are on youtube..

Nice set up Rea, just use what you have and add as you go along (make money), that's the way most people have done it in the past.
It's a life long journey - there's no rush..

Happy music making.

Old 7th May 2015
  #20
Old 7th May 2015
  #21
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveAliveHQ View Post
Excellent interview
Old 8th May 2015
  #22
Lives for gear
 
clip6's Avatar
 

You can't get endorsement deals mixing on vintage consoles and outboard.

I'll believe that when he sells his consoles.
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump