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Vaping - There's more to it
Old 3 weeks ago
  #271
Gear Guru
 
UnderTow's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sounds Great View Post
Well it works for me.

I have had no issues of any kind since I stopped burning the stuff over 5 years ago. And stuck with nothing but fresh bud.

And munching on the occasionally (certified store bought) edibles.
If you are only consuming stuff from reliable sources then you are probably fine. My comment was more general for people who might be in states or countries where cannabis is still illegal. In those situations the quality of the product might not be as safe...

Alistair
Old 3 weeks ago
  #272
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow View Post
If you are only consuming stuff from reliable sources then you are probably fine. My comment was more general for people who might be in states or countries where cannabis is still illegal. In those situations the quality of the product might not be as safe...

Alistair
Yes, well I've only been back in California less than a year and half.

I never did the edibles before that though.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #273
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow View Post
For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong.

There can be plenty of toxic pesticides, herbicides and fungicides in fresh bud.
That's why it's probably a good thing it's being decriminalized and regulated. To dismiss "fresh bud" across the board is an oversimplification to be kind. Certainly worth erring on the side of caution though.

(Edit: and then I read your next reply. d'oh!)

Or you can simply decide all this isn't worth it and not do it - gasp
Old 3 weeks ago
  #274
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bill5 View Post

Or you can simply decide all this isn't worth it and not do it - gasp
Why stop there? Might as well have mommy wrap us all up, you can't be too safe.




On the other hand, I wonder how many people have died eating tainted lettuce.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #275
Lives for gear
Spoken like a 12 yr old. So like rock on dude I'm so totally!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #276
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12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sounds Great View Post
Why stop there? Might as well have mommy wrap us all up, you can't be too safe.




On the other hand, I wonder how many people have died eating tainted lettuce.
That mommy needs to invest in some bubble wrap with bigger bubbles.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #277
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
That mommy needs to invest in some bubble wrap with bigger bubbles.
Here you go.

Old 2 weeks ago
  #278
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New CDC Report Out Today Makes it Even Less Likely that Store-Bought Nicotine E-Cigarettes are Playing Any Role in the Outbreak


Quote:
The key findings of the report are as follows:

1. 92% of the patients for whom product use was ascertained admitted to using THC vapes (only 3 out of 53 - 6% - did not).

2. Of the THC products tested, 89% contained vitamin E acetate oil.

3. No abnormalities were found in any of the nicotine e-liquids tested.

4. The report concludes that “unregulated THC-containing cartridges play an important role in this outbreak.”
Old 2 weeks ago
  #279
Gear Guru
 

So it's less likely because of the report being out?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #280
Lives for gear
 

Err, no he's obviously talking about the findings in the report, some of which I've quoted underneath the link.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #281
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12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sounds Great View Post
Here you go.

The thing is, he could still vape. So how safe is it really?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #282
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TheBrightSide's Avatar
Interesting video about the news reporting of one person who was hospitalised from vaping.


Old 2 weeks ago
  #283
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanRand View Post
Err, no he's obviously talking about the findings in the report, some of which I've quoted underneath the link.
I know. I was being facetious.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #284
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Swurveman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow View Post
From the article you link:

"Officials have not determined what sickened the middle-aged adult, whether the product was contaminated or whether they may have added something to the liquid in the device after buying it, said Dr. Ann Thomas with the Oregon Health Authority."

Most importantly: ALL of this is based on self-reporting. If people buy something illegal from the street, they might not be willing to admit that and might blame legal products instead.

Also, in this particular case, the guy had kidney damage and then suddenly died from a brain haemorrhage less than an hour after he had been walking around. Who knows what happened. This is NOT your typical lung disease (from vaping or other).

There are more than 9 million adults in the US that vape regularly according to CDC data. Some of those will die acutely from unrelated diseases or traumas. All it takes is one case where people link the unrelated death to vaping and the data gets confused.

Who knows what that guy vaped. Even if it came from a legitimate shop, the shop owner might be buying stuff off the black market to cut costs. The content could be anything and the product could have also been adulterated either by the shop or the user.

Anyway, I'm in the EU, manufacturing of vape products is regulated and controlled. Apparently in the US it is the wild west when it comes to vaping products so I guess for the US it is best to be cautious.

Alistair
All I was trying to do is state the FDA's recommendation. And that recommendation specifically states, "As such, we recommend that you should not use e-cigarette, or vaping, products that contain THC." The CDC has given their recommendation. It's up to the individual whether to heed it or not. I do think it is reckless for some guy on a message board to speculate about the deaths that led to the recommendation, but the Mods think it's OK. So, I won't discuss this further.

Last edited by Swurveman; 2 weeks ago at 07:49 PM.. Reason: FDA not FDC
Old 2 weeks ago
  #285
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clump's Avatar
 

Tex had it sussed long ago

Quote:
Tex Williams - Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette) 1947 - YouTube



Tex Williams - Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette) 1947 "Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette)" is a Western swing novelty song written by Merle Travis and...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #286
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swurveman View Post
All I was trying to do is state the FDC's recommendation.
Did you mean the FDA?

Which is actually a bogus watchdog organization, bought, paid, researched for and fully controlled by Big Pharma?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #287
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
I thought some cities had banned them outright? Indoors, outdoors, for sale etc?



I thought the whole “weight loss” aspect had been disproven long ago, other than the “get addicted to smoking instead of eating” approach.

Stress - obviously some find smoking calming.

Is any of that meant to offset the known effects of cancer, emphysema, heart attacks, etc?

It’s not “toxic additives” that cause these things - it’s smoke and tar! If anything, from a purely filtered point of view cigarettes are much better now - filters etc.

Selling single cigarettes rather than a pack of 20 is quite a good way to keep consumption down too!

People used to build with asbestos too..didn’t make it a good decision!

I know it’s currently trendy to think the pharmaceutical industry and government are lying to us all the time, but are we really doubting now that cigarettes are bad for you?

I tell you - as a non smoker (not a particularly militant one I should add!) if you’re an even moderate smoker, you stink....literally. Everyone around you smells you as you arrive....it can’t be hidden apparently! That’s one of the great things about the smoking ban inside (especially in studios!), you no longer go home smelling like a smoker!
LOL, and yet they want to legalize marijuana? When I tried that my mind turned into mush. I was a zombie.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noisewagon View Post
LOL, and yet they want to legalize marijuana? When I tried that my mind turned into mush. I was a zombie.
Well, legalisation means you can control the strength and supply and tax it. Prohibition doesn't work as we know! It works well for cities that do things that way (Amsterdam) and it seems to be working out ok in Cali too as far as I can tell?

Many other places simply decriminalise, which is fine from an end user point of view, but it's kind of hypocritical and a legal grey area, which isn't great for anyone.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Well, legalisation means you can control the strength and supply and tax it. Prohibition doesn't work as we know! It works well for cities that do things that way (Amsterdam) and it seems to be working out ok in Cali too as far as I can tell?

Many other places simply decriminalise, which is fine from an end user point of view, but it's kind of hypocritical and a legal grey area, which isn't great for anyone.
I'm agreeing with you. It just seems silly to legalize alcohol, tobacco and marijuana...and then ban vaping?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noisewagon View Post
I'm agreeing with you. It just seems silly to legalize alcohol, tobacco and marijuana...and then ban vaping?
Ah right sorry!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #291
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Ah right sorry!

Old 2 weeks ago
  #292
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robert82's Avatar
Latest research and conclusions:

https://www.sciencealert.com/there-s...related-deaths

They're saying THC is a marker in the death incidents, but also point out that it's probably the cutting agents in black market and DIY products that are most suspect.
Which perhaps should lead one to conclude it's not actually the THC, but how it's delivered.
Old 1 week ago
  #293
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12tone's Avatar
 

...just in.

A former SVP at Juul is suing the company for shipping 1 million contaminated pods
https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/30/...h-breja-flavor

So, it's not just the unregulated Chinese blackmarket cartridges that's capable of being contaminated. This is kinda big, like multi-$billion big, both from personal and class action liability suits to surely ensue; from both deceptive and leading/targeted advertising and now with this contamination thing.
Old 1 week ago
  #294
Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
...just in.

A former SVP at Juul is suing the company for shipping 1 million contaminated pods
https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/30/...h-breja-flavor

So, it's not just the unregulated Chinese blackmarket cartridges that's capable of being contaminated. This is kinda big, like multi-$billion big, both from personal and class action liability suits to surely ensue; from both deceptive and leading/targeted advertising and now with this contamination thing.
Contamination is not the same thing as inherently unsafe though. Cars get recalled all the time...doesn’t mean the principle is unsound (well of course they are potential killing machines, but it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t drive!).
Old 1 week ago
  #295
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
... it seems to be working out ok in Cali too as far as I can tell?.
Actually, in California it's working out like this: Legalization along with the newly flourishing medical/CBD thing suddenly made weed way more okay for not only new people dipping a toe in for the first time, but also older folks who may not have toked since college. For the first time, a bust wouldn't endanger their career and reputation, and many of them could afford to drop a hundred bucks at a dispensary now and then. But for lots of them, "now and then" has become every week. And the degree of taxation has started to really wear on a lot of people, giving rise to a new and flourishing black market. The same growers who sell legally out the front door are selling out the back door as well. And the players are big -- the Colombian and Mexican cartels, Armenian Power, folks like that. It's gonna be like the Five Families going to the mattresses around here, and soon.

So in the sense that these guys are about to start shooting each other, yeah, it's working out ok.
Old 1 week ago
  #296
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12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Actually, in California it's working out like this: Legalization along with the newly flourishing medical/CBD thing suddenly made weed way more okay for not only new people dipping a toe in for the first time, but also older folks who may not have toked since college. For the first time, a bust wouldn't endanger their career and reputation, and many of them could afford to drop a hundred bucks at a dispensary now and then. But for lots of them, "now and then" has become every week. And the degree of taxation has started to really wear on a lot of people, giving rise to a new and flourishing black market. The same growers who sell legally out the front door are selling out the back door as well. And the players are big -- the Colombian and Mexican cartels, Armenian Power, folks like that. It's gonna be like the Five Families going to the mattresses around here, and soon.

So in the sense that these guys are about to start shooting each other, yeah, it's working out ok.
It's working out great for the consumer. At legal shops, $30-35 for an 1/8th is a fair price. To be able to get it at one's leisure, out in the open, is a refreshing change from the rigmarole and routine in the past of hooking up with your dealer.
Old 1 week ago
  #297
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robert82's Avatar
Brent, are the "backdoor" sellers sourcing from the cartels (i.e. cross-border smuggled stuff), or are the cartels getting into the domestic growing market and, erm, selling to distributors "duty free"?
Old 1 week ago
  #298
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memristor's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
At legal shops, $30-35 for an 1/8th is a fair price.
I assume 1/8th means 3.5 g in the developed world?
I think thats quite expensive for what it is, really.
It seems more expensive then what you pay for here street price (its illegal here).
But legal CBD products are similarly expensive here.

Haha.
This stuff should not be worth more than 5,- per 100g when its legal if you think about it.

Incredible.
Old 1 week ago
  #299
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12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by memristor View Post
I assume 1/8th means 3.5 g in the developed world?
I think thats quite expensive for what it is, really.
It seems more expensive then what you pay for here street price (its illegal here).
But legal CBD products are similarly expensive here.

Haha.
This stuff should not be worth more than 5,- per 100g when its legal if you think about it.

Incredible.
I don't mind.

It was $60 for 3.5g for 40 years.

But you're right - it's literally a weed, an incredibly hearty and pervasive plant, and it's easy to grow. But to grow it well (for maximum potency, particular traits and flavors), to develop strains, etc; takes skill and talent, and knowledge.
Old 1 week ago
  #300
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by robert82 View Post
Brent, are the "backdoor" sellers sourcing from the cartels (i.e. cross-border smuggled stuff), or are the cartels getting into the domestic growing market and, erm, selling to distributors "duty free"?
Dunno for sure, but the word on the street is that some of the same huge domestic growers who sell to dispensaries legitimately are also selling to other, less-legitimate customers. Probably due to pressure. The kind of pressure that people who kill people like to apply.

And take a peek at this. Happened a couple days ago, about a half mile from my house. Is $100K the kind of money a local grocer could be expected to hand across the counter in an envelope? He's not pulling that down from the day job, I don't think.

ARMENIAN SHOOTOUT
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