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High Frequency Hearing Loss
Old 7th December 2017
  #1
Deleted efd8500
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High Frequency Hearing Loss

Here's a cheery subject

So who's lost their high frequency hearing ? or even worse has tinnitus ?

A friend of mine who also plays electronic music visited his doctor recently with a hearing issue, she asked him if he was exposed to any loud or high pitched sounds which he replied that he played synths with headphones for hours on end, she rolled her eyes and said "Another one of them"
Old 7th December 2017
  #2
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GregkoNYC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orchestrion View Post
Here's a cheery subject

So who's lost their high frequency hearing ? or even worse has tinnitus ?

A friend of mine who also plays electronic music visited his doctor recently with a hearing issue, she asked him if he was exposed to any loud or high pitched sounds which he replied that he played synths with headphones for hours on end, she rolled her eyes and said "Another one of them"
No tinitus yet, but my hearing maxes out at 14Khz and rolls off significantly at 12Khz.

The good news is that I think that it's made marriage easier

Greg
Old 7th December 2017
  #3
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gentleclockdivid's Avatar
 

I have both .
Tinnitus kicks in late at night , when going to sleep ..
It starts with a high pitched soundd ...gradually fading away ..takes about a minute for it to fade away .
If it doesn't , I tend to look / hear for patterns in the tone .
Tinnitus, couldn't live without it .

HIgh frequency loss , mostly in the left ear ...
Right ear , sine @15 kHz is still audible , used to be 20Khz in my teens
Old 7th December 2017
  #4
Deleted efd8500
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HaHa

Already some great answers

I totally understand you both, I have a slight pressure (like pulsing in my head) which I know is tinnitus as well as some high frequency loss

I couldn't live without it either and her indoors is quite often a distant groan that I nod my head at blissfully unaware
Old 7th December 2017
  #5
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norfolk martin's Avatar
 

At 58, including a misspent youth involving 4x12's and Marshalls , some tinnitus, and a cut off around 12 K.

It would seem that this would be fatal to my mixing ability, but I get not complaints of excessive high end. Somehow you learn to compensate, even though there are a few instrument frequencies in the mix that I cant hear.
Old 7th December 2017
  #6
Deleted cec0d5b
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregkoNYC View Post
No tinitus yet, but my hearing maxes out at 14Khz and rolls off significantly at 12Khz.
This is totally not scientific because near the top of the range there's a crazy amount of aliasing and compression artefacts so it's hard to make out the fundamental, however with this rough test and a pair of Sennheiser HD-25-1 II headphones I was able to hear 20Hz - 18.6KHz:



If I could be bothered I'd set up some test tones in Audition and play them properly, but my ears now feel they've already had a beating after that test!

I'm very surprised at this result though. For a good many years I played in bands and stood right next to the drummer's cymbals(!). I did always wear ear-plugs though (when no-one else did), and now I'm glad I did!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregkoNYC View Post
The good news is that I think that it's made marriage easier
Old 7th December 2017
  #7
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TornadoTed's Avatar
I try to look after my hearing the best I can. I always wear ear muffs while micing drum kits, operating machinery, even mowing the lawn! But, realistically I know I have give my ears a bashing over the last 27 years since I first played bass in front of an 8 x 10", especially when I was younger, bit of an occupational hazard.

On the bright side, we as humans are very adaptable, I have worked with a Grammy winning producer who hasn't been able to hear above 10kHz in one ear since he was in his teens. Another very successful producer I worked with has a constant 'waterfall' in his ears from a few decades of monitoring at ear shattering levels and still churns our great sounding records.

Last edited by TornadoTed; 8th December 2017 at 08:14 AM..
Old 8th December 2017
  #8
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Originally Posted by markodarko View Post
This is totally not scientific because near the top of the range there's a crazy amount of aliasing and compression artefacts so it's hard to make out the fundamental, however with this rough test and a pair of Sennheiser HD-25-1 II headphones I was able to hear 20Hz - 18.6KHz:

I can hear 20hz to around 17.8k on that one.. although actually I can hear past that about 1k but it seems like the tone is descending instead of rising. Using HiFiman HE-400i planar magnetic headphones. I've used this test a few times in the past: Online Tone Generator - Free, Quick, No Sign Up Required. I usually hear up to around 17khz on that one.
Old 8th December 2017
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wagoo View Post
I can hear 20hz to around 17.8k on that one.. although actually I can hear past that about 1k but it seems like the tone is descending instead of rising.
Yes, that's what I hear too. If I concentrate I can still hear the fundemental tone at 18.6kHz or so, but after that the descending overtones overpower any chance of me hearing anything else - not that I think I could hear beyond that anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wagoo View Post
I've used this test a few times in the past: Online Tone Generator - Free, Quick, No Sign Up Required. I usually hear up to around 17khz on that one.
Cool. I may check it out once my hearing's recovered from the last test!
Old 8th December 2017
  #10
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What was interesting in that frequency test I did was, unlike my hearing being most sensitive at c. 3.3kHz (as I was expecting it to be), it is FAR more sensitive in the 6-10kHz range. Almost to the point of being painful compared to frequencies lower than that. Did anyone else experience that phenomenon?
Old 8th December 2017
  #11
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grasspike's Avatar
My high end hearing is shot and I have tinnitus from mixing and/or attending one too many metal shows back in the day

I'm much more careful with my hearing now
Old 8th December 2017
  #12
Oli
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Oli's Avatar
 

Most of my hearing loss has been from ear infections. I had unbalanced highs already in late teens. Really annoying for stereo playback. I used to be very careful with hearing protection, but the last three years I have had ongoing severe ear infections that have left me with tinnitus and much more severe hearing loss. I almost don't care any more.
Old 29th December 2017
  #13
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steveschizoid's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TornadoTed View Post
I try to look after my hearing the best I can. I always wear ear muffs while micing drum kits, operating machinery, even mowing the lawn! But, realistically I know I have give my ears a bashing over the last 27 years since I first played bass in front of an 8 x 10", especially when I was younger, bit of an occupational hazard.

On the bright side, we as humans are very adaptable, I have worked with a Grammy winning producer who hasn't been able to hear above 10kHz in one ear since he was in his teens. Another very successful producer I worked with has a constant 'waterfall' in his ears from a few decades of monitoring at ear shattering levels and still churns our great sounding records.
A few years ago I noticed Tchad Blake posting about this. He said something to the effect that due to a childhood which included unprotected visits to the shooting range, he has an "interesting curve" in his hearing response. I've never noticed a problem with his mixes.
Old 29th December 2017
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveschizoid View Post
A few years ago I noticed Tchad Blake posting about this. He said something to the effect that due to a childhood which included unprotected visits to the shooting range, he has an "interesting curve" in his hearing response. I've never noticed a problem with his mixes.
It was actually Tchad I was refering to, I thought I'd best not mention him by name but I guess if he has posted openly about it it's ok! You are right it hasn't stopped him churning out some amazing sounding records.
Old 29th December 2017
  #15
Old 4th January 2018
  #16
Very brave of Tchad to even utter such a thing as his livlihood depends upon it and so many less informed individuals/potential clients could take it too seriously instead of his actual work and run the other way. Though I suppose since he has proven himself far and beyond, it's a bit safer. Still...

I personally wouldn't care whether my mixer was deaf or not - I just care about what comes out the other end.

I have hearing loss and tinnitus at age 33 due to growing up and playing drums at 12 yrs with either no ear protection or blasting insanely loud levels through my phones to jam with. Then I marched in marching band on snare and in drum corps with no hearing protection. I was actually pretty good on ears up until a few years ago. I think mixing too loud and playing electric guitar for some years was the nail in the coffin. I also have had some dental cleanings done with an ultrasonic water cleaner tool that is awful. I think it has caused me some damage. They hit this molar on the right side of my jaw and it sends vibration right to the core of my left ear and I go deaf in some midrange frequency somehow. It's happened twice now, so no more of that. I have also stupidly been around firearm reporting with no protection. According to the article linked above, the short report of a firearm can potentially equal a week of 90dba occupational noise. Yikes.

They actually don't consider it hearing loss if it's a deviation of up to 10 decibels. I've got loss down at 250hz for some reason which is probably 15-20db, though I can hear a gnat fart at 1 and 2k. My issue is mostly with the left ear which is 20db down at 4k(mild hearing loss) and -10db down at 4k on the right ear. They come back together around 8k at -10 I think.

The most annoying thing is stereo, but then again, someone needs to bring back some good mono mixes, so maybe I'll concentrate on that.

Another annoying problem I have due to having two different curves of hearing is diplacusis. I perceive pitch in my left ear as slightly different than my right. That's kind of interesting to sweep a sine wave from left to right...

I love mixing, recording and playing music so I refuse to stop, but I need to lower my levels and use protection. I am lucky with the amount of loss I am dealing with. If I manage to stop my loss from progressing(aside from age related) then by the time I am 60, my ears will just be normal again

There are also some pretty fantastic strides being made in the science fields in regards to hearing regeneration. They have found a way to regrow auditory hair cells in mice at MIT, if I recall. Then we enter a whole new mine field. If you mix just fine with hearing loss, would it mess you up and drive you crazy to hear perfectly again?

Don't stop doing what you love. Sure, I get very depressed about it and the ringing can drive me insane. The thought of yet another thing holding you back in such a long-shot of a dream job is an awful feeling. But whats worse to me than not being able to mix is not being able to listen to music I love again. I'd rather have my hearing and mix a little quieter than I want to.

Just know we are all in better company than we probably realize(there are more pro engineers than we know who have issues I am sure).
Old 30th March 2018
  #17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted efd8500 View Post
So who's lost their high frequency hearing ? or even worse has tinnitus ?
I tested my hearing around 2000 and could hear up to 18.6 kHz. Last week, I was down to 16.5 kHz. So 2000 Hz loss in twenty years. I think that's acceptable?
Old 31st March 2018
  #18
Deleted cec0d5b
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johannburkard View Post
I tested my hearing around 2000 and could hear up to 18.6 kHz. Last week, I was down to 16.5 kHz. So 2000 Hz loss in twenty years. I think that's acceptable?
I guess that depends on whether you were aged 5 or 45, twenty years ago.
Old 31st March 2018
  #19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted cec0d5b View Post
I guess that depends on whether you were aged 5 or 45, twenty years ago.
Man, I wish I could remember.
Old 19th August 2018
  #20
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isaacmacias's Avatar
After listening to the hearing test wagoo posted on my Sennheiser HD 380 Pro headphones, I could hear decently from about 23hz to 14-15khz. I could still hear up to about 16.5khz, but it was still somewhat harder to hear, and by 17khz it got very difficult to hear anything.

I didn't actually lose hearing late in life (which is pretty normal, I'd say, considering that I'm only 15 years old), but apparently I had jaundice when I was a baby and they didn't realize it until a tiny bit late and somehow it ended up taking the high frequencies away.

It doesn't really bother me most of the time, I just don't really hear lots of birds, crickets, and sometimes whiny animals, but the thing that really gets me is that I had really hoped to open up a studio one day, and occasionally and casually put out my own songs on the side, but I feel like I can't rely on myself since I can't even hear cymbals in most music. The low pitched hit of a cymbal would get drowned out by other instruments for the most part, and the high part I just can't really hear regardless. Luckily, as young as I am, I still might find that by the time I'm actually old enough and mature enough to set up a studio as a career, they might have better advancements in medical science where I can get the hairs in my ears regrown.

I do have hearing aids, but I can't use them on any setting with my headphones without incredibly loud feedback and it also makes things sound somewhat robotic, like it's being played through a radio.

I also have to say, thanks for making this post! I actually got on this particular board because I was thinking about making a similar post of my own, but either way, it's comforting to see people here with similar ailments and know that I'm not alone.
Old 19th August 2018
  #21
Deleted efd8500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isaacmacias View Post
After listening to the hearing test wagoo posted on my Sennheiser HD 380 Pro headphones, I could hear decently from about 23hz to 14-15khz. I could still hear up to about 16.5khz, but it was still somewhat harder to hear, and by 17khz it got very difficult to hear anything.

I didn't actually lose hearing late in life (which is pretty normal, I'd say, considering that I'm only 15 years old), but apparently I had jaundice when I was a baby and they didn't realize it until a tiny bit late and somehow it ended up taking the high frequencies away.

It doesn't really bother me most of the time, I just don't really hear lots of birds, crickets, and sometimes whiny animals, but the thing that really gets me is that I had really hoped to open up a studio one day, and occasionally and casually put out my own songs on the side, but I feel like I can't rely on myself since I can't even hear cymbals in most music. The low pitched hit of a cymbal would get drowned out by other instruments for the most part, and the high part I just can't really hear regardless. Luckily, as young as I am, I still might find that by the time I'm actually old enough and mature enough to set up a studio as a career, they might have better advancements in medical science where I can get the hairs in my ears regrown.

I do have hearing aids, but I can't use them on any setting with my headphones without incredibly loud feedback and it also makes things sound somewhat robotic, like it's being played through a radio.

I also have to say, thanks for making this post! I actually got on this particular board because I was thinking about making a similar post of my own, but either way, it's comforting to see people here with similar ailments and know that I'm not alone.
Glad to read you are mostly positive. Keep enjoying your music, you know what you like to hear and that's enough for most of us with some acceptance of hearing loss.
Medical advancements would be fantastic, but I will still enjoy the music whilst I wait for it to hopefully come my way
Old 19th August 2018
  #22
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isaacmacias's Avatar
Quote:
Glad to read you are mostly positive. Keep enjoying your music, you know what you like to hear and that's enough for most of us with some acceptance of hearing loss.
Medical advancements would be fantastic, but I will still enjoy the music whilst I wait for it to hopefully come my way
Oh of course, I can always be grateful that any issues I have are very minor and obscure.
Old 19th August 2018
  #23
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YourBestFriend's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by johannburkard View Post
I tested my hearing around 2000 and could hear up to 18.6 kHz. Last week, I was down to 16.5 kHz. So 2000 Hz loss in twenty years. I think that's acceptable?
18.6 for me too. I wonder if the tone is being cut off by or web browsers or something.

Online Tone Generator - generate pure tones of any frequency
Old 12th October 2018
  #24
LSP
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Just saw this thread. I've yet to do a proper test in studio...so I'll use my HD800 headphones at some point, but just playing the test tone on my tablet I'm done at approximately 12K, and I've been aware for quite sometime that my rignt ear is way more sensitive to mid frequencies. Saddening when I think about it. I'm 59 y.o, a drummer, toured for 14 years, also multiple years as front of house engineer.. and just now able to finish my full basement as a proper recording studio (control room/live room).

Even with my obvious high frequency loss I'm able to "hear" the air frequencies when applied, e,g., 12K and up. I haven't been recording and mixing for about 4 year now, so I really hope I can still deliver quality mixes.

Marc
Old 12th October 2018
  #25
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I have both....61 years old. My father is very deaf at 88 and I am afraid that I am headed down that path. I just did a tone sweep and I hear up to about 12K. My tinnitus is not awful...loud noises and singing really get it roaring.
Old 12th October 2018
  #26
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I'm 64: have high and some low frequency loss (low is not as bad). Could it be the banjo I play all these years? Grandma's genes on both sides? Some of it is probably just getting older.
I had an operation 3 years ago for oteosclerosis right ear - it helped the low frequencies
This summer my tinnitus got much worse - Don't know why. Had a hearing test - audiologist says my hearing is not quite bad enough to qualify for my insurance to pay for a hearing aid.... But she let me try one - it has a function to mask tinnitus.... but did not seem to work - the tinnitus was at a higher frequency than the masking. The hearing aid did brighten up her voice while I sat there listening, yet sounded like I was listening through cheap earphones... especially compared to my Sennheiser HD600 phones

Nevertheless, I continue to make music /record - and attempt to produce quality sound - I take more breaks because I have to -
I also have Ozone 8 software - which has a function to use reference tracks - and check the balance of one's mixes with those.

I still prefer recording my amp miked - to an amp sim... Maybe it's in my imagination?
Old 12th October 2018
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomPaul View Post
I have both....61 years old. My father is very deaf at 88 and I am afraid that I am headed down that path. I just did a tone sweep and I hear up to about 12K. My tinnitus is not awful...loud noises and singing really get it roaring.
Same here. 59 years old, some Tinnitus, a cut off around 12K, and a family history of hearing loss.

Sigh...........
Old 13th October 2018
  #28
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howseth's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolk martin View Post
Same here. 59 years old, some Tinnitus, a cut off around 12K, and a family history of hearing loss.

Sigh...........
Seems cut off at 12k is a common thread. My left ear cut off around 12k too - till this year.
Old 13th October 2018
  #29
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YouTube
Old 13th October 2018
  #30
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howseth's Avatar
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Originally Posted by Pepino456 View Post
Aumeo audio correction device for earphones. Never heard of it. Yes, I'm interested for sure. Sold on Amazon....(looks like a small startup company.)

I may order one - if I do - I will report back. Seems like a personalized EQ - between your headphones and the music - you adjust it through an app based on a self administered hearing test - need IOS or android phone /device. Frequency range claims- 50hz -20k - hearing test checks for sound 125hz-12.500 k you can save your profiles. - 3.5mm jack

On further thought: Shouldn't iZotope - or Sonar - make an app/module, etc to do this kind of thing...?

Last edited by howseth; 15th October 2018 at 01:21 AM..
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