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Peavey 5150 multiple tone tests, which do you prefer ?
Old 30th November 2008
  #1
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SLy_drums's Avatar
 

Peavey 5150 multiple tone tests, which do you prefer ?

What do you think of those tones ?

Here is the first one.

Here is the second one.

Here is the third one.

It's the beginning of the song "Drifter" by In Flames but the tuning is higher. Drums were programmed quick.

I think they sound good, I had a different approach each time. I applied a bit of EQ on each at "mix" time, but it was done quick so I guess it's not perfect.
Tell me which you prefer.
Old 30th November 2008
  #2
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I did a different EQ on the second one, here it is
Old 30th November 2008
  #3
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Exclamation

1 vote here for DrfiterV30tubegros.wav & DrifterINFLAMES_test.wav
but i like more the tubegros
Old 3rd December 2008
  #4
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Thanks, and for those who are interested, this is the totally raw V30 tone (juste HP @ 60 Hz and LP @ 12,5k)
Old 3rd December 2008
  #5
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Nice! How did you record it? Mics their position, pres, eqs and comps if any.
Old 4th December 2008
  #6
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Thanks !

For that raw V30 sample, we used the following :

Gibson Les Paul with EMG 81 active pickups => Maxon OD-820 => Peavey 5150 on "lead channel" => Bogner Uberkab 4x12" (V30 miced) => SM57 => API pre => Lavry AD10 converter.

Anyway the key to this sound is the mic position, it's still not perfect in this sample, you can hear the low mids are a bit muddy, but nothing not fixable. Mr Andy Sneap excels in this domain
The perfiect position for the 57 is where you have the tightest sound, clarity in the low mids, and air. I found the best positon is the edge of the dustcap : move the mic 2 millimeters on the left if you want a brighter sound, move the mic 2 millimeters on the right if you want a darker sound. Record and listen, do it again. The good mic position is when You notice that your low mids are clearer and it does not sound boxy anymore.
The "raw" sample it totally raw, just HP @ 60 Hz and LP @ 12,5 khz, and that's it, no EQ nor compression.
I know that Mr Sneap regularely uses a Waves C4 multiband compressor to tighten the low mids a bit only in the 140-240 Hz area, and a touch of EQ but for sure he gets amazing raw tones !!
I also have a Vintech X81 pre that I have to try, should sound creamier with less transient agression.

EQwise when mixing I try to avoid more than 3 db cuts, else it becomes to sound dead. The key is to get the perfect raw tone, and for metal active pickups do the job very well. That and a tubescreamer pedal and you get the modern creamy tone.
Critical areas are
- the low mids (from 140 to 400 Hz), I sometimes have to cut one or two db there to make room for the bass, it depends on the bass tone too, you have to match it with the low mids of the guitars to get the "glue". I found that the better the 57 is placed the more you can keep your low mids without muddying the entire mix.
- the fizz (4,5 to 6 khz), I always cut one or two db there to get rid of it.
Other than that, I sometimes cut some 500-800 Hz to make room for the drums but I avoid it when I can. It can easily sound thin then.
I generally like to boost some frequencies when mixing, for example 90 Hz (cab resonance), 1600 Hz ("good" mids), 8,8 khz (mediator)... A good analog EQ works amazingly there.

My next test will be using the "rythm" channel on the 5150, which sounds bigger and less agressive (think Mesa boogie-ish tone).
Old 6th December 2008
  #7
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Nastyn8's Avatar
 

I Like 2 the best
Old 6th December 2008
  #8
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nomis666's Avatar
 

Thanks for the great samples and the explanation of your eq tactics, VERY useful.

My questions for you:

Is there any kind of double tracking or delayed copies used in the final samples

My vote goes to the first sample!
Old 8th December 2008
  #9
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Thanks for the detailed description. thumbsup

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLy_drums View Post
I also have a Vintech X81 pre that I have to try, should sound creamier with less transient agression.
Please post the results! heh

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLy_drums View Post
The key is to get the perfect raw tone, and for metal active pickups do the job very well.
Exactly! If the sound is not there when you record it, there's no EQ nor compression tweaking that will transform it into "THE major guitar SOUND".

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLy_drums View Post
My next test will be using the "rythm" channel on the 5150, which sounds bigger and less agressive (think Mesa boogie-ish tone).
They call it "Rythm" for something heh! Seriously now... the rythm channel will sound much more dynamic and, as you said, bigger... and bigger is better!
The lead channel seems better at first (maybe because it is more compressed by nature therefore sounding apparently "louder" which has the psychoacostic effect "louder is better" in your head) but I came to the conclusion that not so much distortion is needed to make an heavy guitar sound...

Thanks again and keep posting examples like these!
Old 14th December 2008
  #10
Gear Maniac
 

Nice. I like somewhere between the 1 and 2 samples. I think the mix might sound better if you bring the drums in a bit on the pans. Get them away from the guitars. I've got a 5150 in the arsenal as well.
Old 23rd January 2009
  #11
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I'm going to have new 5150 clips on sunday, recorded through Vintech X81 pre and SM57.
Old 26th January 2009
  #12
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Hey guys, here are the promised tones.

I've been doing some guitar tests yesterday.
Chain was : ESP Eclipse with EMG pickups => Maxon OD-820 => Bogner Uberkab
The cab was miced with a 57 in front of the upper right V30 speaker. Mic pre was a Vintech X81 into Lavry AD10 converter, I had the 50 Hz low cut engaged on the Vintech.
I programmed the drums for the song "Food For The Gods" by In Flames, and we recorded the first riffs. Tuning is not perfect but I think the tone is cool !
The tones are EQed and panned 90% on each side, double tracked.

We did one test using the lead channel :
Sly_5150_ESPEc_lead_EQ
And another with the rythm channel (different settings on the Maxon though) :
Sly_5150_ESPEc_rythm_EQ

I had to EQ the low mids with ApEQ quite a lot (300-800 Hz area), I think the tubes I'm using in the power amp are a bit too midrangey (JJ 6L6 tubes), I can post the raw tracks if you want. I'd like to have your opinion on this. Or maybe a bias issue ?
Old 26th January 2009
  #13
tdr
Gear Head
 

I think I prefer the rythm channel, less bite but more punch. They are real close to me though, would think that either one would work in a mix. Good tone overall, fuels my 6505 gas a little further....don't think there is too much midrange.
Old 26th January 2009
  #14
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Thanks !

Those are EQed version, I have to post some raw samples so that you hear the muddy low mids.
Download them again, I just changed the EQ a bit a minute ago and I think it's better !! thumbsup
Old 27th January 2009
  #15
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I tried a different EQ, I tried to cut less and keep more of the raw take, here are the results :

Lead channel :
Sly_5150_ESPEc_lead_lessEQ

Rythm channel :
Sly_5150_ESPEc_rythm_lessEQ

I prefer the sound of the rythm channel like this, it seems to be a bit tighter and it's easier to keep the low mids.
As for the lead channel, I prefer my first version (first post).

I guess a part of the problem is that I'm using the C3 multiband compressor to tame the low mids but it seems to sound a bit lame. Anyone having a good C3 setting or recommanding a good cheap mulitband comp ?
I'm using ApEQ too, which is not the best EQ plugin, it could sound better with a better EQ.
Old 29th January 2009
  #16
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And another one, same guitar, same samp, rythm channel but mids on 3 instead of 2,5 this time :
Only For The Weak

(sorry for the loudness)
Old 30th January 2009
  #17
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And the raw take
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