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Toft ATB vs Trident 8T : audio samples Condenser Microphones
Old 14th February 2008
  #1
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Thread Starter
Toft ATB vs Trident 8T : audio samples

Since this two boards are getting discussed a lot lately, I thought that posting some audio files would have been a good thing

As usual this is a non scientific test, even if I did my best to be precise!

The chain was: Rode NT5-->Console mic pre-->Motu 24I/O straight into cubase. No peak editing, no processing at all, I tried to record the takes so they were already balanced and "ready" to export.

At first I recorded the guitar at one feet from the point where the neck meets the body. Then I engaged the high shelf at 12K giving a boost of 6db on both consoles and re-recorded the tracks. Then I moved backward and recorded the last two samples at about three feet from the mic.

As for the snare, the mic was placed at about two feet over it aimed to the center. Regarding the voice, I had the singer at about one feet from the mic with a popper stopper on it to prevent annoying air blasts.

I think that's all... enjoy!

PS. I'm currently performing some tests on the eq's, I'll post the results soon.
Attached Files
Old 14th February 2008
  #2
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Thread Starter
....and the other files...
Attached Files
Old 14th February 2008
  #3
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Thread Starter
I almost forgot to say that when I recorded the acoustic guitar with the high shelf engaged, a band was having a reharsal in the tracking room (I was in the control room with the guitar) and you will hear some noise in the background.

If I can I'll repost those clips tomorrow!
Old 14th February 2008
  #4
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Thread Starter
wow... one thousands threads about the ATB and none of you has anything to say about how it compares to the 8t ?
Old 15th February 2008
  #5
Gear maniac
 
Shabo's Avatar
 

thanks for the post, I'm definitely curious.. I'm also surprised no one has chimed in yet! I'm betwwen dsp services now so i'm using dial up but i'll listen to the clips as soon as the painfully slow finish..
Old 15th February 2008
  #6
Thanks for posting these!

From a quick audition of the acoustic guitar sample, I'd say that console A has more presence and definition. I'll listen to all of them through my Genies when I get home from work.

Cheers,

-B-
Old 15th February 2008
  #7
Gear interested
 

As just said, i want to renew my thanks to you Luca for doing his best for taking the time to bring truth (sound) to our ears and to anyone minding about the "Buy" of the last months.

I did get the consoles right trough reading your advices and so this means you did describe them well also anly with words. I at the moment have no one of the consoles.

Maybe i soon will get one.

Old 15th February 2008
  #8
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Jon Harter's Avatar
 

I preferred Console A. You could hear the biggest difference on the first guitar files.
The mid range sounded a lot better to me on A. Also, B had a weird low end "cheapness," to me.

But of course, everyone will have their own opinion.

Thanks for the shootout. I'm super interested in one of these two consoles. I'm looking forward to the results.
Old 15th February 2008
  #9
Gear Head
 

I like B
I'll guess that one is the Toft.
Old 15th February 2008
  #10
I prefer A...

Console B sounds like something smiley curve is going on...


However, I like both and I'd like to hear both 'in context...'


Thank you for the test...


T....

Last edited by everyday; 25th February 2008 at 09:54 PM.. Reason: mis spell
Old 15th February 2008
  #11
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I thought b was meatier. i prefered it.
Old 15th February 2008
  #12
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NoEgo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlesaustin View Post
I thought b was meatier. i prefered it.
I thought B was more broad band (meatier) . but I think either can be made to sound like the other with what's on board. I don't think either lacks. Since I hear what is going on in B on mine, I own a Toft I will say B, and not to mention I am listening to PC speakers right now, not in my studio so it mau be all screwed up........yeah
Old 15th February 2008
  #13
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Thread Starter
Cool, now it's getting interesting!

One thing's for sure, they sound really different on acoustic guitar. The sound was very position depending and I didn't spend much time searching for the sweet stop. In addition the strings were old and dull and the sound might radically change with new ones and a different placement.

I'll see what I can do to provide some more valid samples.
Old 15th February 2008
  #14
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Dirty Halo's Avatar
 

Lightbulb Funny... so close.

For ALL the controversy, the comments seem to show a general feeling that they are both good and close...

Who would have thought from THOUSANDS of emotional por/con posts on these two boards, which seem too close to even reliably tell the difference

-a
Old 15th February 2008
  #15
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lionheart's Avatar
Like some others have already said, i think "B" sounded a little warmer and fatter sounding.. i preferred B on this sound tests.. :-)

I could'nt actually hear that much difference on the vocal takes??!!

Nice work on putting out the samples dude:-)

Old 15th February 2008
  #16
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Thread Starter
Ok, here we go with another test.

I took a stereo sample, sent it to both consoles, eq'd the tracks and recorded them back into cubase.

Before you make any judgements please consider a few things:

1) There's no way to match the eq on right and left channels (no stereo mode available)

2) Even if both consoles have a nominal maximum boost/cut of 15 dB my ear suggests me that the two ranges are slightly different (actually console B seems to have 1-1.5 db more)

3) I didn't eq the track to make it sound better, but just to show the inherent behaviour that I think comes out clearly.

4) The volumes could be not perfectly matched...

PS. On the low-mid cut test, I turned the gain knob fully counterclocwise on both boards while on the hi shelf test I boosted until I reached the 4th notch (I guess it's approximately 12 dB).

Enjoy
Old 15th February 2008
  #17
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I think I prefered B on guitar and vocals..
Old 15th February 2008
  #18
Gear Head
 

Think I'll stick to my opinion after listening to the EQ'd samples.

Slightly prefer B.

B was smoother to me on the high boost than A.

Was more difficult for me to discern a difference on the lo cut samples. Other than maybe a hair more "warmth" or as the others posted "meat" in the B sample.

I'll still guess B is the Toft due to the warmth. Had one for a few weeks and this is sort of the way I have percieved it - (but then again, I don't have a Trident to A/B it with)
Old 15th February 2008
  #19
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Thread Starter
These are the last files... then I'll let you guess which is which..

I performed another test with the same song cutting a more reasonable amount.
Attached Files

EQ Test 2 - console A - 9 dB at 400Hz.mp3 (1.32 MB, 8848 views)

EQ Test 2 - console B - 9 dB at 400Hz.mp3 (1.32 MB, 9864 views)

EQ Test 2 - No Eq.mp3 (5.76 MB, 10066 views)

Old 15th February 2008
  #20
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Thread Starter
undeeeeer my umbreeeeellla ellaaaa..........!!!!
Attached Files
Old 15th February 2008
  #21
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Thread Starter
ella ella ella ella EH EH EH EH

Attached Files
Old 15th February 2008
  #22
For those of us who wouldn't use the preamps, and maybe not use the EQ's....Could you do some A/B samples of a multichannel rough mix with 1) Both boards being set to the same general gain structure (no EQ) and 2) the boards being pushed to a hotter level than good gain structure would dictate? I'd like to see how just their summing compares in addition to how each one handles extreme demands on their headroom.
Old 15th February 2008
  #23
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Thread Starter
Very last thing....I leveled the peaks before exporting the files... but watch the volume anyways!
Old 15th February 2008
  #24
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Jackie Moon's Avatar
I find A cleaner and more precise than B wich I find a bit muddy. B has some kind of wierdness going, kind of like if you forgot some LF boost on the stereo bus. I like A the best !
Cool test.. thanks for taking the time.

Best

JB
Old 15th February 2008
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanEldred View Post
For those of us who wouldn't use the preamps, and maybe not use the EQ's....Could you do some A/B samples of a multichannel rough mix with 1) Both boards being set to the same general gain structure (no EQ) and 2) the boards being pushed to a hotter level than good gain structure would dictate? I'd like to see how just their summing compares in addition to how each one handles extreme demands on their headroom.
Yep..That's what I wanna hear also. The mix buss!...
Old 15th February 2008
  #26
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanEldred View Post
For those of us who wouldn't use the preamps, and maybe not use the EQ's....Could you do some A/B samples of a multichannel rough mix with 1) Both boards being set to the same general gain structure (no EQ) and 2) the boards being pushed to a hotter level than good gain structure would dictate? I'd like to see how just their summing compares in addition to how each one handles extreme demands on their headroom.
I could try but it's not that easy. The Rosetta's inputs freak out several dB's before than the 8T master output and I never tried if they can handle the Toft.

I've got a Pendulum PL2 at my disposal, I could use it to tame the signal before the AD with the limiter not engaged obviously. Is it a good idea ?
Old 15th February 2008
  #27
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Audio Hombre's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lionheart View Post
Like some others have already said, i think "B" sounded a little warmer and fatter sounding.. i preferred B on this sound tests.. :-)

I could'nt actually hear that much difference on the vocal takes??!!

Nice work on putting out the samples dude:-)

without reading too far into thread, i have to agree. there's just more overall meat to the console B sounds imho. Couldn't really tell on the snare but on the acoustic and vocal it was quite obvious.

thanks very much for the test. it's a lot of work and very appreciated.
Old 15th February 2008
  #28
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio Hombre View Post
without reading too far into thread, i have to agree. there's just more overall meat to the console B sounds imho. Couldn't really tell on the snare but on the acoustic and vocal it was quite obvious.

thanks very much for the test. it's a lot of work and very appreciated.
Actually I had fun performing the test and I was really curious myself to have them side by side to make a fair comparison... at this point... why not to share it ?
Old 15th February 2008
  #29
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Luca..thx for this. interesting stuff. I prefer the weight that B seems to add and my memory tells me that it's the Toft. Hope i'm wrong..heh
Nothing like a mistake to remind us to stay awake!
I guess these posts mean that you have sorted out your original problem with the Toft? Praise the Lord!!
Danny
Old 16th February 2008
  #30
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dasoundjunkie's Avatar
 

First of all thanx for the tests! Now I'd really like to know which is which?
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