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Rob Schnapf Ribbon Microphones
Old 29th June 2012
  #1051
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rob S's Avatar
Two different ways of doing it.
If i am mixing someone elses stuff and they have a stereo room
I will make a matrix by
L = L - R hard panned left
R = R - L hard panned right
C = L+ R mono up th middle.
You control the width by how much you pull down the center channel.
L and R are cancelling up the middle thru their phase relationship that you just induced.
Mono center controls the amt of spread or nausea,
Depending on your feelings about phase.
For me, 3db down in the center is the max i can handle
Before my eyes start crossing.
i find myself arriving at -2.7 alot.
But in the blend with the drumbs you geta good sense of space
Without mucking up the center.
And you have more room up the middle for kick snare vocal etc.
Its definitely to be used with taste.

If we are "generating" the source it will be a coles(figure8) 90* from source and a cardiode condenser
At source on same plane.
Condenser is your center mic.
Mult the coles and flip one out of phase and thats your L R.
Viola L R C.
Old 29th June 2012
  #1052
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
Before my eyes start crossing....
Old 30th June 2012
  #1053
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imacgreg's Avatar
hey rob,
I have had the same experience as you on the M/S for overheads thing. Can be messy and setup is tricky. Have had fun with a 47/121 room M/S thing though. Saw Ross Hogarth demo that at some tapeop thing.

Been doing a 121 "under head" approach for a couple years on and off and it's really something special.. It's all about learning the rejection nodes of the royers and aiming at what you don't want.

For rooms, I sorta stopped looking when I heard an SF12/24 on front of a kit in a good room. Mult the signal post-pre to a Chandler TG stereo limiter on medium crush and a pair of Level-Ors on level-mode. Lotta flavors between muted and full-on.

ian
Old 30th June 2012
  #1054
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rob S's Avatar
Oh yeah, Love the SF12 (hate losing that cable for it).
Really like em When in a bigger room than i got.
Ive been having good luck with the matrix for making small rooms sound bigger
Particularily after smashing it thru the pair of level-ors.
Get the right pumping and breathing action goiin.
Tuck it in there just right.....
Boom
Old 1st July 2012
  #1055
Rob thanks so much for explaining that I'm going to try it out right now!
Old 1st July 2012
  #1056
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
Mute all of them except for the 57's.
.

Ha!

.
Old 1st July 2012
  #1057
Gear Maniac
 

Just stumbled on this thread. I'm going to be reading all night.

Love your work on those Saves the Day and Elliott Smith records, Rob.
Old 2nd July 2012
  #1058
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rob S's Avatar
That should help you sleep
Old 2nd July 2012
  #1059
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Keith Moore's Avatar
 

Hey Rob,

Truly love the Eisley (In The Valley) record you worked on. Can you go into more detail as to your involvement with that one? Any pics from the sessions?
Old 3rd July 2012
  #1060
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rob S's Avatar
I worked real hard on that record.
The A+R guy was an absolute moron and their mgmt were useless.
I told the A+R guy i wil try to be nicer if you try to be smarter.
Needless to say, i didnt cross the finish line with that one.
What an idiot.
Jerry finn mixied it.
the commercial cd i have is distorted.
Apparently nobody cared enough to QC it.
Other than that it was a great time.
Old 3rd July 2012
  #1061
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Another slice of uncensored reality.....lol. This is one of the most valuable threads going, both for info and entertainment value. Thanks for keeping it so, Mr S!! Much respect.
Old 3rd July 2012
  #1062
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useme2305's Avatar
 

what's QCing again?
Old 3rd July 2012
  #1063
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skybluerental's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by useme2305 View Post
what's QCing again?
my guess is “Quality Control.”

see also Motown.
Old 3rd July 2012
  #1064
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Keith Moore's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
I worked real hard on that record.
The A+R guy was an absolute moron and their mgmt were useless.
I told the A+R guy i wil try to be nicer if you try to be smarter.
Needless to say, i didnt cross the finish line with that one.
What an idiot.
Jerry finn mixied it.
the commercial cd i have is distorted.
Apparently nobody cared enough to QC it.
Other than that it was a great time.
That is interesting to hear as when I put this record up on my studio monitors I did feel it was squashed a bit. I love the performance and melodies more than anything. The tones are still there. How much "performance" involvement do you put into your records?
Old 4th July 2012
  #1065
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rob S's Avatar
Well everything is performance based isnt it?
Im not sure what performance involvement means.
Im not involved in the performance in that im not performing.
although i played a ton of gtr on that record.
But i am involved in that i wanna believe it.
So from that point of view,very involved.
Not to state the obviouse but (i will) A great performance can be alot of different things.
It could be a vibe, an emotion, an execution of a part, style, attitude
Blah blah blah
So I dont necessarily care what "it" is but it has to be something.

I think we can all edit and put things on the grid.
There isnt anything much special about that.
Old 4th July 2012
  #1066
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
It could be a vibe, an emotion, an execution of a part, style, attitude
Blah blah blah
So I dont necessarily care what "it" is but it has to be something.
That's deliciously to the point and I'm afraid I will have to borrow that for a sig.........thank you very much indeed. Now if only more people thought that exact thought more often when making records......if only......
Old 4th July 2012
  #1067
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useme2305's Avatar
 

rob, love your work...especially the gbv recordings.

what's your opinion on diy gear? have you built anything for yourself or had something built for you that you used on any of your records?

also api vs neve?
Old 4th July 2012
  #1068
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rob S's Avatar
DIY is cool
Old 4th July 2012
  #1069
hey rob, how's the console sounding?
how are you using the combination of busses?
cheers!
jeremy
Old 4th July 2012
  #1070
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rob S's Avatar
Yeah speaking of DIY. That console is pretty crazy.
I have come to realize, John musgrave who created it,
Basically made another console inside of the 428B.
Both sonically and in function.
The downside is, i didnt have the money or time to get it rescreened
So at first its a bit of an enigma to work on,
As the level of functionality and flexibility has been greatly increased and
unlabeled.
Then there is the patchbay.....
And yes i use the the dual buss all the time.
It isthe mode of operation i choose to exist in.
It rules.
The mode is send the mix to both busses and then drive the hifi (990 jensen)
Into the neve buss.
Driving the neve into saturation seems to open it up
While maintainiing its nice neve bottom.
I dont use buss compression i use the transformer saturation.
And you just kinda play it for the sweet spot based on whatever
The music seems to dictate.
Old 4th July 2012
  #1071
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Keith Moore's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
Well everything is performance based isnt it?
Im not sure what performance involvement means.
Im not involved in the performance in that im not performing.
although i played a ton of gtr on that record.
But i am involved in that i wanna believe it.
So from that point of view,very involved.
Not to state the obviouse but (i will) A great performance can be alot of different things.
It could be a vibe, an emotion, an execution of a part, style, attitude
Blah blah blah
So I dont necessarily care what "it" is but it has to be something.

I think we can all edit and put things on the grid.
There isnt anything much special about that.
I meant more of suggestion of melody and changing what a player is playing kind of thing. I like to believe that the engineers I look up to are more then just professional knob twisters and that their simple presence in a studio brings inspiration to the artists & performers. This record has a very non sterile charm to it that seems to be from more than just proper gain staging and careful EQ curves.

And I agree 100% with the "special" factor. I often find myself arguing with singers to keep the less "perfect" lines as they have something about them that are moving and (dare I say?) "real".
Old 5th July 2012
  #1072
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rob S's Avatar
Yes
Old 21st July 2012
  #1073
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rob S's Avatar
Blackspade 3 ft in front of kick drum sounds cool.
Nice extra 3D boom.
Old 21st July 2012
  #1074
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drBill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob S View Post
Blackspade 3 ft in front of kick drum sounds cool.
Nice extra 3D boom.
17R Rob? Tried it on vox yet?
Old 22nd July 2012
  #1075
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rob S's Avatar
Havent tried the 17R on vocals yet but im gonna this week.
I sent it into circulation around the kingsize studios here.
Very positive reaction.
Old 24th July 2012
  #1076
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rob S's Avatar
The 17r sounded very good on the singer yesterday.
Not overly bright.
A good chesty quality.
Gave some desired beef to the singers voice.
Took eq nicely.
Round one goes to the 17r.
Old 27th July 2012
  #1077
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rob S's Avatar
This is a great mic.
I think it has the right amt of bottom.
The 17R is very nicely balanced in that department.
nice midrange.
Gives a nice chesty low mid fill in to the reedy singer.
And my favorite thing, its not to friggin modern bright.

Boom
Old 27th July 2012
  #1078
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
Thanks for the reports Rob. This mic is definitely on my radar, but first, I must recover from buying a vintage guitar..... lol
Old 27th July 2012
  #1079
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chet.d's Avatar
 

Good to hear.
I've been using it on almost anything since getting but back. But mostly vocals & fok.

Curious what kinda chains are after source for you.
I've found the top end / overall balance to be pleasing in a just right kinda way when paired with the right chain.
Old 28th July 2012
  #1080
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rob S's Avatar
The chain was api pre - pultec - LA3A

Awesomeness
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