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Important lesson on working with sound when it is still alive
Old 14th May 2006
  #61
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
The guitar is moot. It's what's on the other side of the guitar that's important. Strings and electronic pick ups are besides the point. They don't make the music. And no, this is not semantics.
To that I agree. Music transcends the medium - whether it be analog or digital, a violin or an oil drum.
Old 14th May 2006
  #62
*edit***** you guys are fast... labs-- the finger monkey

cute

does it bite?


LMFAOROTF
haha tats amazing ha ha ha ah
can't type anymore ha
Old 14th May 2006
  #63
Gear Addict
 
(DC)'s Avatar
 

The wonders of weed.

It's a bit out there, but I get what you're saying. All you had to say was: Get the sound right on the front end.

But I guess it's a lot deeper (and cooler) when you connect it to how sound is alive.
Old 14th May 2006
  #64
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henryrobinett's Avatar
Well pickups do matter, to a point. To the point of getting a sound. But for me they don't matter in the least. I pick up a guitar it always sounds like me. Always. Sure, there are variations of that sound, in eq, bridge pickup, neck and in-between. It alters the way I play it. Context. But the only thing that matters to me is the hands. It's my problem. But I'm much more a musician than I am an engineer.

I came to this late. I don't see the relevance between analog and digital in the debate. That's not what I'm talking about.

Change my recording strategy? I don't know. Maybe in paying closer attention to trying to capture the sound as it's happening rather than hoping to reamp and alter/shape the sound later?

Music is art. Carpentry is not. Neither is plumbing. Art is creativity of something from nothing or something - a consideration of aestheticness.

Music is much more than a language of emotions. It is a language and it therefore contains emotions. Emotion is the most readily available, most obvious selling point of music. But it's also thought, shapes, colors and sounds we connect and associate experiences with. It's fascinating.

But the book analogy is a good one. The book uses language which lives within us. We, as audience, can duplicate it and can relate enough to experience and associate those experiences so it becomes alive with us. We make it "alive", though the words on the page are not.
Old 15th May 2006
  #65
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[QUOTE=henryrobinett Music is art. Carpentry is not. [/QUOTE]

in the end its just MUSIC. and most of it is defenately lightyears away from being ART imho. if the human factor brings in all the art aspects, then everything humans are doing is art. so if we agree on that one we can really fast forget about the whole art idea. in most cases it just used for pseudo intellectual bull****.

its all about the FUN !

tomorrow everything will be different again
Old 15th May 2006
  #66
FX smörgåsbord user
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jules
__________________
Jules

"Tofu Masaman is a major fave of mine. What's yours?" - Charles Dye
Jules, we'll keep that just between us engineers.... right?
Old 15th May 2006
  #67
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heh You know. I didn't say it was high art, but art. There's a misunderstanding of the term art. I'm not saying you have it, but it's a common misunderstanding.

But for me, yes, music tends to be ART, with a capital A. Though most music being produced and widely distributed is art with smalll letters, IMHO. F art let's dance.

Art is self expression through a medium of letters, music, painting, sculpture, plastic, etc, that represents an idea or ideas having to do with the senses and aesthetics.

Plumbing is a craft, a creation of function and utilitarian needs. It's not art. Art can enter into craft. Craft can enter into art.

Art is fun, but it doesn't have to be. Music does not have to be fun. I have fun playing it most times. Sometimes I do not. I have fun recording it. Often I do not. I have fun mixing it. Often I do not. I have fun writing it. Most times I do not. Sometimes I have fun listening too it. Many times it's work. I have fun rehearsing it. Many times I do not.

Dance music is probably mostly craft. That's my opinion. Much commercial music is probably mainly craft. Opinion too.
Old 15th May 2006
  #68
500 series nutjob
 
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for me as a musician, a guitarist, music is a curse, a horrific curse.
it has been a torment for me as long as i can recall.
this curse dictates that for me, music is art and nothing less.
entertainment often falls short of art!
a modern travesty.
Old 15th May 2006
  #69
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octatonic's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett
Music is art. Carpentry is not. Neither is plumbing. Art is creativity of something from nothing or something - a consideration of aestheticness.
I disagree.
One can go further than that.

The art of craft vs the craft of art.

The aqueducts are a technical marvel- and there is artistry there- at least to these eyes.
Commercial pop/rock, to my ears sounds pedestrian for the most part, especially compared to what I consdider 'great musical art'.
There is also a craftiness to art- compare Sargent to some horrible modern concept art and you can see the craft of art there in the former, whilst the latter is purely theoretical.
The art in architecture? What about the craft of it?

Again, to quote fripp- "The genius is artless"

JR
Old 15th May 2006
  #70
Gear Head
 
VelvetGoatmine's Avatar
 

Let's bring this thread back on track, shall we?

Let's discuss the things that really matter.
Attached Thumbnails
Important lesson on working with sound when it is still alive-fingermonkeysold.jpg  
Old 15th May 2006
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvoc3000
When I mix I make sound zombies because first the music is live and then I record it to digital and kill it and then i mix it and make analog and it comes to life and kills people.
AAAAAHHHHHHH!

That's really funny, man.
Old 15th May 2006
  #72
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by richmondjames
I disagree.
One can go further than that.

The art of craft vs the craft of art.

The aqueducts are a technical marvel- and there is artistry there- at least to these eyes.
Commercial pop/rock, to my ears sounds pedestrian for the most part, especially compared to what I consdider 'great musical art'.
There is also a craftiness to art- compare Sargent to some horrible modern concept art and you can see the craft of art there in the former, whilst the latter is purely theoretical.
The art in architecture? What about the craft of it?

Again, to quote fripp- "The genius is artless"

JR
Hm. Where exactly is the disagreement? Or are you disagreeing to be disagreeable? I don't see the disagreement.

I'm not arguing to argue. I'm simply making points I think are valid.
Old 15th May 2006
  #73
FX smörgåsbord user
 
Charles Dye's Avatar
 

Cool. My two favorite circular conversations are incestuously commingling...

Analog v. Digital

Music as Art v. Product
Old 15th May 2006
  #74
Gear Maniac
 
Scratchy Pots's Avatar
 

anybody fancy a Pint?? .....
Old 15th May 2006
  #75
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
Don't drink. Sorry! But I'll have some mineral water.
Old 15th May 2006
  #76
500 series nutjob
 
pan60's Avatar
 

so tell us about the little monkeys.
Old 15th May 2006
  #77
Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett
Dance music is probably mostly craft. That's my opinion. Much commercial music is probably mainly craft. Opinion too.
ouch- I cringe by the denomination "Dance". heeuuuhh (shiver)
good electronic music/dance music (pretty wide-also covers funk for me, and experimental music, etc. etc.), doesn't reach mainstream often, so even if proficient in other areas a lot of producers/artists wouldn't know it existed. this is not a negativity, just a choice. and it was (is?) HUGE in europe ...mmm and electronic doesn't mean programmed by definition, just to set the record straight. furthermore a lot of the mainstream crap is just quantised cheapass copies of something subtle not really understood. IMVHO (sorry bout the rant, guess it's thé thread now for meaningless dribble so I contributed my part )


ah well

yeah those monkeys
do they bite?
Old 15th May 2006
  #78
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henryrobinett's Avatar
Sorry. I didn't mean to make you shiver. I consider any music created to make people dance as dance music, whether it's electronic or disco or rock'nroll hoochie-coo. That's not to say there's not the possibility of real vision or artistic merit. But when the intention is to make the masses shake their booty, or to make people respond physically rather than aesthetically, or thoughtfully, then yes, I consider it somewhat more craft than art.

BTW I like a lot of "dance" music.

And no, in my mind, the popularity of something has no bearing upon it's artistic qualifications.

When did this get in the "registered members area" only section?
Old 15th May 2006
  #79
FX smörgåsbord user
 
Charles Dye's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett
When did this get in the "registered members area" only section?
Jules musta felt that such high-minded discourse should be for special GS members only.



















KIDDING!!
Old 15th May 2006
  #80
Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett
Sorry. I didn't mean to make you shiver. I consider any music created to make people dance as dance music, whether it's electronic or disco or rock'nroll hoochie-coo. That's not to say there's not the possibility of real vision or artistic merit. But when the intention is to make the masses shake their booty, or to make people respond physically rather than aesthetically, or thoughtfully, then yes, I consider it somewhat more craft than art.

BTW I like a lot of "dance" music.

And no, in my mind, the popularity of something has no bearing upon it's artistic qualifications.

When did this get in the "registered members area" only section?
oh no apologies necessary thumbsup I shiver a lot hearing some talk about music
and to have all the endless discussions in one thread, eh I think mind and body are one.



(and so does my left foot heh)
Old 15th May 2006
  #81
Gear Maniac
 
Scratchy Pots's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett
Don't drink. Sorry! But I'll have some mineral water.
But it`s your round man!!!.......
Old 15th May 2006
  #82
ever wondered what the buttons on darth vaders suit do?
Old 15th May 2006
  #83
mr. Pots
how charming you look in your avatar
where did you get your hair cut?
Old 15th May 2006
  #84
Gear Maniac
 
Scratchy Pots's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptil
mr. Pots
how charming you look in your avatar
where did you get your haircut?
It`s a special little number cooked up by the wife!
lessons to be learned...never stay out drinking all night with ya pals....tutt
Old 15th May 2006
  #85
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptil
oh no apologies necessary thumbsup I shiver a lot hearing some talk about music
and to have all the endless discussions in one thread, eh I think mind and body are one.



(and so does my left foot heh)
Sorry again. I do go on!heh
Old 15th May 2006
  #86
Gear Maniac
 
echo unit's Avatar
 

When I listen to digital ITB mixes of recordings it makes me feel sick. Why?
Old 15th May 2006
  #87
You tried monkey skull?




sorry dude couldn't resist
Old 15th May 2006
  #88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scratchy Pots
It`s a special little number cooked up by the wife!
lessons to be learned...never stay out drinking all night with ya pals....tutt
orrh
Old 15th May 2006
  #89
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
You ate something that disagrees with you and IT'S time coincident with your ITB listening?
Old 16th May 2006
  #90
500 series nutjob
 
pan60's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Labs
They are your mixes?

Why are we getting off the topic of monkeys? dfegad dfegad dfegad dfegad

Gustav
yes monkeys!
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