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Is SoundCloud Relevant Or Not? Plugin Bundles
Old 11th June 2018
  #31
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
There's no mystery here man, there's plugins for several browsers, freestanding apps, and soundcloud2mp3 websites that'll do it for you. Just try it you'll see how it works.

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/d...cfbignci?hl=en
I clicked on the first one, and it's got this little blue "Report Abuse" Button.

Are they kidding?

If you're uploading to Soundcloud, it's assumed that you own the copyrighted material. If you're using an app like this one, then you don't. And you're clearly violating Google's Terms of Service, and probably Gearslutz's as well, and stealing music. Yet this app is on Google's very own server, so it's all happening with Google's blessing. Google seems be giving it a pass by calling the copyrighted material "sounds" and explaining that by doing this you're somehow doing the rightful owners of these underexposed "sounds" a favor.

We're all feeling sorry for ourselves because the record business has gone to hell due to file sharing. Yet here we all are talking about this like it's all fine and dandy. It may be the New Normal, but fine and dandy it is not.
Old 11th June 2018
  #32
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
I clicked on the first one, and it's got this little blue "Report Abuse" Button.

Are they kidding?

If you're uploading to Soundcloud, it's assumed that you own the copyrighted material. If you're using an app like this one, then you don't. And you're clearly violating Google's Terms of Service, and probably Gearslutz's as well, and stealing music. Yet this app is on Google's very own server, so it's all happening with Google's blessing. Google seems be giving it a pass by calling the copyrighted material "sounds" and explaining that by doing this you're somehow doing the rightful owners of these underexposed "sounds" a favor.

We're all feeling sorry for ourselves because the record business has gone to hell due to file sharing. Yet here we all are talking about this like it's all fine and dandy. It may be the New Normal, but fine and dandy it is not.
I'm not talking about "what should be" but "what is."

There's no possible way to share music with people in a non-downloadable manner. Proceed accordingly in how you conduct your music sharing business.
Old 11th June 2018
  #33
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
I'm not talking about "what should be" but "what is."
Yes, I get it. As I said, it's the New Normal.

Part of what I don't get, though, is the inconsistency. If you were to post on GS saying, "I use cracked plugins and here's how I get them," both your post and you would be history in a heartbeat. Yet you can post "I help myself to other people's music and here's a handy app so you can, too," and it's so acceptable that even a GS mod joins in on the discussion. But it's the exact same thing.
Old 11th June 2018
  #34
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Yes, I get it. As I said, it's the New Normal.

Part of what I don't get, though, is the inconsistency. If you were to post on GS saying, "I use cracked plugins and here's how I get them," both your post and you would be history in a heartbeat. Yet you can post "I help myself to other people's music and here's a handy app so you can, too," and it's so acceptable that even a GS mod joins in on the discussion. But it's the exact same thing.
I don't see where anyone's said that. This was an alert to you and any readers on awareness and self protection.

If you've sent clients or A&Rs or whoever non-downloadable links, chances are they have a hard copy. If you post your tracks live for the public, chances are fans have a hard copy.

A lot of people only put up clips as a way around this.

The rippers are legal because the internet is flooded with non-copyright material that you're legally allowed to rip. Just like guns aren't getting banned even though they're often used for the wrong things, neither are these rippers.
Old 13th June 2018
  #35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Yes, I get it. As I said, it's the New Normal.

Part of what I don't get, though, is the inconsistency. If you were to post on GS saying, "I use cracked plugins and here's how I get them," both your post and you would be history in a heartbeat. Yet you can post "I help myself to other people's music and here's a handy app so you can, too," and it's so acceptable that even a GS mod joins in on the discussion. But it's the exact same thing.
It’s more like discussing the tech behind peer to peer networking - which of course can be used illegally or legally.

I mean - we all can point our phone at a speaker and record the sound. Are we not allowed to discuss microphones now? After all - that’s the enabling tech. And some would argue it’s not really lower quality than a Soundcloud stream.

It’s a personal judgement call but I don’t see this in the same league as discussing cracked plugins.

By all means report the thread and I’ll let there be a 2nd opinion.
Old 13th June 2018
  #36
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
It’s more like discussing the tech behind peer to peer networking - which of course can be used illegally or legally.

I mean - we all can point our phone at a speaker and record the sound. Are we not allowed to discuss microphones now? After all - that’s the enabling tech. And some would argue it’s not really lower quality than a Soundcloud stream.

It’s a personal judgement call but I don’t see this in the same league as discussing cracked plugins.

By all means report the thread and I’ll let there be a 2nd opinion.
Not to dump anyone in it but sampling of Youtube as was talked about earlier is illegal. Everything on Youtube is "fixed" and hence copyrighted technically speaking. Brent is not wrong.
Old 13th June 2018
  #37
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by creegstor View Post
Not to dump anyone in it but sampling of Youtube as was talked about earlier is illegal. Everything on Youtube is "fixed" and hence copyrighted technically speaking. Brent is not wrong.
There are many copyright free libraries of sounds and songs on Youtube, their target precisely being various media creators. They've set up a whole "copyright free" distribution platform full of songs and sounds. They're also all over the net if you google "royalty free sounds" or "copyright free effects" or other similar searches.

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

etc

etc

These are the only terms, you're free to use "in videos and other content you create" wherever however for money:

Your use of this music library (including the music files in this library) is subject to the YouTube Terms of Service. Music from this library is intended solely for use by you in videos and other content that you create. You may use music files from this library in videos that you monetize on YouTube.
By downloading music from this library, you agree that you will not:
Make available, distribute or perform the music files from this library separately from videos and other content into which you have incorporated these music files (e.g., standalone distribution of these files is not permitted).
Use music files from this library in an illegal manner or in connection with any illegal content.
Additionally, some music files from this library may be subject to additional requirements as set forth in the library (e.g., attribution requirements). You agree to comply with such requirements when you use music from this library.

Last edited by newguy1; 13th June 2018 at 05:29 PM..
Old 13th June 2018
  #38
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
There are many copyright free libraries of sounds and songs on Youtube, their target precisely being various media creators. They've set up a whole "copyright free" distribution platform full of songs and sounds. They're also all over the net if you google "royalty free sounds" or "copyright free effects" or other similar searches.

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

etc

etc

These are the only terms, you're free to use "in videos and other content you create" wherever however for money:

Your use of this music library (including the music files in this library) is subject to the YouTube Terms of Service. Music from this library is intended solely for use by you in videos and other content that you create. You may use music files from this library in videos that you monetize on YouTube.
By downloading music from this library, you agree that you will not:
Make available, distribute or perform the music files from this library separately from videos and other content into which you have incorporated these music files (e.g., standalone distribution of these files is not permitted).
Use music files from this library in an illegal manner or in connection with any illegal content.
Additionally, some music files from this library may be subject to additional requirements as set forth in the library (e.g., attribution requirements). You agree to comply with such requirements when you use music from this library.
The problem here is these "Royalty Free" people (which are a tiny tiny tiny tiny minority of what's on YT) are telling you to do something that is not allowed under the terms of service...

Quote:
https://www.youtube.com/static?gl=CA&template=terms

4. General Use of the Service—Permissions and Restrictions
YouTube hereby grants you permission to access and use the Service as set forth in these Terms of Service, provided that:

You agree not to distribute in any medium any part of the Service or the Content without YouTube's prior written authorization, unless YouTube makes available the means for such distribution through functionality offered by the Service (such as the Embeddable Player).
You agree not to alter or modify any part of the Service.
You agree not to access Content through any technology or means other than the video playback pages of the Service itself, the Embeddable Player, or other explicitly authorized means YouTube may designate.


5. Your Use of Content
In addition to the general restrictions above, the following restrictions and conditions apply specifically to your use of Content.

The Content on the Service, and the trademarks, service marks and logos ("Marks") on the Service, are owned by or licensed to YouTube, subject to copyright and other intellectual property rights under the law.
Content is provided to you AS IS. You may access Content for your information and personal use solely as intended through the provided functionality of the Service and as permitted under these Terms of Service. You shall not download any Content unless you see a “download” or similar link displayed by YouTube on the Service for that Content.

I mean I really don't care. I was just saying Brent was not at all wrong in what he said.
Old 13th June 2018
  #39
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by creegstor View Post
The problem here is these "Royalty Free" people (which are a tiny tiny tiny tiny minority of what's on YT) are telling you to do something that is not allowed under the terms of service...
No its legit through Youtube. They have a whole Copyright Free division now. Record labels are even setting up No Copyright releases.

Its to inspire more creative content on Youtube while making money off the ads that run before the videos, and potentially kickstart awareness of songs by allowing people to use them in videos for free which could help something go viral and get sync'd to bigger things or take off on Spotify.

Watch the first video I linked, they've even compiled much of the Copyright Free material under a "Creator Studio" tab when you log in, the video shows exactly where. With its own set of terms (which is what I quoted.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by creegstor View Post
I mean I really don't care. I was just saying Brent was not at all wrong in what he said.
Its a bit of case of shoot the messenger. This was to warn Brent that anything he sends out can and probably will get ripped by clients or A&Rs or whoever. "Non-downloadable" doesn't mean people can't download.
Old 13th June 2018
  #40
Quote:
Originally Posted by creegstor View Post
Not to dump anyone in it but sampling of Youtube as was talked about earlier is illegal. Everything on Youtube is "fixed" and hence copyrighted technically speaking. Brent is not wrong.
I’m not saying that. I was referring to the bit of “even a mod joining in” part. I’m not advocating piracy, I’m just discussing Soundcloud. The soundflower audio routing software isn’t illegal or immoral in itself.

But yes - people please don’t pirate audio!
Old 18th August 2018
  #41
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On the level of being relevant 'Yes' because when newer artist's send material regarding whether or not I want to work with them one of their main social media music accounts is Soundcloud. Alot of new artists still use it just as much as Dj's and Music Producer's. As much as Music creation is extremely saturated with a abundance of songs being produced Soundcloud is a great platform for showcasing music. However because of false 'Bot' programming allowing people to buy plays, replays, likes etc the truth becomes distorted when trying to understand the true reality of what the Majority enjoys.
Old 28th August 2018
  #42
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Rogue Ai's Avatar
Since the removal of groups no one comments on my stuff on Soundcould anymore... now I just use it to embed tracks elsewhere.
Old 28th August 2018
  #43
Gear Nut
I stopped focusing on Soundcloud this year as I went to renew my pro membership and discovered that not only had they raised the price by about 50%, they'd also removed the ability to schedule releases unless I sprang for pro unlimited at 3x the price of what I had been paying. I've been using Audiomack since, it seems a pretty good alternative, especially as it allows private links to entire playlists for sending albums to blogs etc, which Soundcloud could never manage. I still post new stuff to Soundcloud with my free account but have started putting my resources into Spotify promotion as at least that might pay something back.
Old 28th August 2018
  #44
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jdier's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
...I find it useful for giving easy-access links to people where they can listen but not download...
This is my answer also.
Old 29th August 2018
  #45
I miss the old Mp3.com, frankly.


With re Soundcloud's sound quality, yeah, it's low. But I suspect a lot of folks (like me) initially after the service's introduction assumed the best practice was to upload in the bitrate of their downloads, 128 kbps. But what many didn't realize is that SC goes ahead and reprocesses everything that comes to it. It doesn't just store it and stream it. And that means transcoding that 'multiplies' the lossy encoding damage. So even if you upload a near-pristine 320 kbps, it's going to sound bad in the standard download. The only good way to do it is to upload lossless and let them do their gritty 'magic' to it. [FWIW, I use the free tier and have never been tempted otherwise.]


With re to stealing off SC -- as noted, anything you can hear, you can copy.

But in the 20+ years I've been uploading and watching other people upload music to the web I have come to one conclusion, the overwhelming majority of those worried about getting their music stolen are largely worried about nothing.

The real trick for the overwhelming majority of musicians is getting someone to listen in the first place. Let us be real.

Back when Spotify was relatively new and before aggregators like Distrokid had made it so easy and inexpensive to get into the stores and streamers, and when most of Spotify's content was still conventional label releases, it was found that a full 20% of the content on Spotify had NEVER been streamed, not once, paid, free, whatever. Provoked by that, to me, astounding fact, I started a short-term project of using the Forgotify service to find and listen to this previously unheard content and write a series of reviews. I just took each record as it came from Forgotify, not rejecting any. Virtually all were label releases, many of them major label releases, some of them with obviously LARGE budgets and many musicians. I eventually tired of the project -- but I heard some quite interesting music -- and added more than a few things to my own Google Play Music paid subscription favorites.

Reviews of the 'forgotten fifth' -- the ~20% of Spotify content that has never been heard:

The Forgotify Files | Music Biz Outsider Report
Old 5th December 2018
  #46
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Any way of “ripping” the audio stream will result in the download being the same as the steamed option - possibly 128kbps?
I will try to dispel the myths. Downloaders can not work with bitrate. They just allow to get the audio directly from the server. I use Amazing Soundcloud Downloader – Soundcloud to MP3, I like the design of this site.
Old 8th January 2019
  #47
Just a heads up regarding playback quality...

I recently revisited (after some time) my old page at SoundClick (SoundClick - Music - Artists - Social) and was pleasantly surprised that not only had they cleaned up and modernized the look of the place -- they've upgraded the basic playback to 160 kbps. (Soundclick was founded in 1997, the same year the old, once-groundbreaking Mp3.com started, and predated Soundcloud by about a decade.)

160 kbps is not super-fi, but, a definite improvement over their old 128's. And they now accept lossless uploads (wav, flac) which means your original need only get data-compressed at the SoundClick end; paid downloads (I haven't explored the sales aspect beyond that) are the best quality of the track in question. Free downloads (artists can choose to make individual songs downloadable) go out as 160s for free artist accounts and best quality for paid artist accounts.
Old 13th March 2019
  #48
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldcassey View Post
<Deleted by Mod>
When people (such as me) don't tick the "downloadable" box in their SoundCloud postings and you use an app to download them anyway, that's called...

... Piracy.

Piracy is why there's no such thing as The Record Business anymore. Please don't do it. And GS, please don't encourage it.

Last edited by Synth Guru; 13th March 2019 at 06:10 PM.. Reason: Spam
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