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Kendrick Lamar wins the Pulitzer for Music Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 22nd April 2018
  #241
Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post

Not to paraphrase Duke Ellington, if it's good, it's good, whether it comes from the US, Tuva, Bulgaria or with apologies to Herman Cain, Ubeki-beki-beki-beki-stan-stan....

.....


...but, Kendrick - you gotta hand it to him, he's hit at many levels: success at commercial/popular circles, socio-political relevance, positive criticicism/analysis from both the established and the vernacular. It's a rare nexus that few have. I don't know of a recent equal.
Your first one made me laugh a lot but you were tripping there sir.
''Murica'' is the empire leading culture....you know it, we all know it. Dont be an hypocrite. We know you know that.

That second one tho'....Hummmmmm

Dont be THAT guy please....we have enough of those in this thread.
Old 22nd April 2018
  #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Spearritt View Post
Are you sure about this? The endorsement of a committee, probably itself wondering how long it can remain relevant, is what was required? Maybe the committee is just trying to save its own skin.

I don't think anyone cares (or even knows!) about this endorsement, (apart from those in this thread ), do they?
I think I addressed this earlier.

I'm just guessing it was an attempt to bridge the gap between the incredible relevance of the Pulitzer's journalism awards and the generally total irrelevance of the classical academic 'art' music it generally tends to award. Not a good look...a very dissociated, pretentious, out of touch look, if that.

To me, just the attempt as such is a good thing, whether it chafes people's hide or not.

We're living in extraordinary times, kinda dystopian, uber nationalistic/draconian/fascistic/xenophobic, etc...sometimes extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures, to fit and address the need at hand.
Old 22nd April 2018
  #243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martel80 View Post
I think I understand what trsc is trying to say and I must say that I agree with his broad idea.

I also agree with GeneHall when he says that the good part is that it has finally been recognized.

The two things I dont agree with , or should I say, the ideas that gave me pause on those 2 ''other ideas'' that you both shared is that you, for example, trsc, point out Nas as a creator of a genre while Nasir Jones simply mastered that part of that art which is painting a real life canvas out of words in a rythmic pattern. Others have done that before but never as well has Nasir. Lets take a moment to remember Slick rick for example.
As for GeneHall, what I dont agree with your latest statement is that you seem to fail to hear that Lamar writing style is actually a very clear results of Nasir Jones work....just a totally normal follow up to his work as he his the reference.I am not saying this as a personnal opinion out of no where. If you're unsure about my statement, make some google research on whos your favorite rapper rapper. Another thing that make me cringe a lot is you stating people as ''accomplished learned academics of music''. I hope you are not talking about the 2 super famous clowns that came and asked why this is considered music as there is no notes on rap vocals and clearly still fail to see that not all music needs to be attached to the castafiore. Good thing is that it really made understood how much of a great decision I made when I decided to drop art school twice because they were tripping on the flowers on the rug and still couldnt have a single clue and couldnt explain that music is felt and not only an endless math test on technicality.
I think there's something to be learned from those ''accomplished'' statements. It just might not be what they intended to point out tho'.
As for GeneHall, what I dont agree with your latest statement is that you seem to fail to hear that Lamar writing style is actually a very clear results of Nasir Jones work....just a totally normal follow up to his work as he his the reference.
I'm not contesting the validity of this intejected point being made here.
Kendrick Lamar won a Pulitzer for music.
His influences and anything he has leaned on to arrive at his own unique version of the material judged to be worthy of a Pulitzer is a whole other conversation.
We all borrow, we all take lend of influential predecessors who have had an affect on us and helped forge what is unique about each of us.
Lamar is not a standout in this way, what does make him remarkable is his own unique presentation, a recipe that may or may not include the influences that helped shape his own artistic self.



Another thing that make me cringe a lot is you stating people as ''accomplished learned academics of music''. I hope you are not talking about the 2 super famous clowns that came and asked why this is considered music as there is no notes on rap vocals and clearly still fail to see that not all music needs to be attached to the castafiore.
I was not referring to any one person ( or two) in this regard, apologies if I somehow misled you. I was referring to everyone in this thread putting forth a perspective that in some way reflects their own version of an educated opinion. How they came about their education is irrelevant to me. I know extraordinary musicians and brilliant composers who have never stepped in a academic classroom but have talent and intuition academics can never be taught or learn from a book or in a classroom where conformity is as much a part of the lesson plan as is the notes on the page.
The most powerful attribute any writer can possess is life experience beyond comfort and convenience, IME. To me, if one's music is to influence culture or society, the artist must integrally insert themselves into that culture and society and have experiences not so unlike those that are a part of that culture and society.
For an academic to dismiss this, would be to negate some of the history of the worlds most endeared composers of ancient music.
I agree with you about rap vocals, 100%.

Last edited by GeneHall; 22nd April 2018 at 10:47 PM.. Reason: typo's
Old 23rd April 2018
  #244
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Rap is art expressed through sound so yea, it's music. End of discussion imo. BUT, for me, 50% of a great hip hop piece is the instrumental tracks that go with the rap. It seems those artists are being ignored in this discussion. Thoughts?
Old 23rd April 2018
  #245
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhizomeman View Post
Rap is art expressed through sound so yea, it's music. End of discussion imo. BUT, for me, 50% of a great hip hop piece is the instrumental tracks that go with the rap. It seems those artists are being ignored in this discussion. Thoughts?
Talk to me sir.
Talk to me !
Old 23rd April 2018
  #246
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneHall View Post
As for GeneHall, what I dont agree with your latest statement is that you seem to fail to hear that Lamar writing style is actually a very clear results of Nasir Jones work....just a totally normal follow up to his work as he his the reference.
I'm not contesting the validity of this intejected point being made here.
Kendrick Lamar won a Pulitzer for music.
His influences and anything he has leaned on to arrive at his own unique version of the material judged to be worthy of a Pulitzer is a whole other conversation.
We all borrow, we all take lend of influential predecessors who have had an affect on us and helped forge what is unique about each of us.
Lamar is not a standout in this way, what does make him remarkable is his own unique presentation, a recipe that may or may not include the influences that helped shape his own artistic self.



Another thing that make me cringe a lot is you stating people as ''accomplished learned academics of music''. I hope you are not talking about the 2 super famous clowns that came and asked why this is considered music as there is no notes on rap vocals and clearly still fail to see that not all music needs to be attached to the castafiore.
I was not referring to any one person ( or two) in this regard, apologies if I somehow misled you. I was referring to everyone in this thread putting forth a perspective that in some way reflects their own version of an educated opinion. How they came about their education is irrelevant to me. I know extraordinary musicians and brilliant composers who have never stepped in a academic classroom but have talent and intuition academics can never be taught or learn from a book or in a classroom where conformity is as much a part of the lesson plan as is the notes on the page.
The most powerful attribute any writer can possess is life experience beyond comfort and convenience, IME. To me, if one's music is to influence culture or society, the artist must integrally insert themselves into that culture and society and have experiences not so unlike those that are a part of that culture and society.
For an academic to dismiss this, would be to negate some of the history of the worlds most endeared composers of ancient music.
I agree with you about rap vocals, 100%.
I apologize, seems like I completely misinterpreted and assumed a lot of opinions in your message. That Message in the other hand really clarify everything.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
I'm just guessing it was an attempt to bridge the gap between the incredible relevance of the Pulitzer's journalism awards and the generally total irrelevance of the classical academic 'art' music it generally tends to award. Not a good look...a very dissociated, pretentious, out of touch look, if that.

To me, just the attempt as such is a good thing, whether it chafes people's hide or not.

We're living in extraordinary times, kinda dystopian, uber nationalistic/draconian/fascistic/xenophobic, etc...sometimes extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures, to fit and address the need at hand.
I find it remarkable that there is even a need or desire to debate/defend the musical merit of any genre.
It's not something any true artist would ever do, imo.
With so much of the world already taking every opportunity it can to undermine the value of music to society and culture, here we have academic artist's pinged to culturally redundant ancient music looking down their noses at the most influential and current forms of music as being something lesser than their own perception will allow.
Classical arts has not made itself redundant or less influential, it's academic inner circle participants have- because they themselves know they have painted themselves into a pristine corner of isolation by maintaining immovable perspectives of not only what is music but also what is art.
I can imagine the same out of touch ilk of thinkers had similar responses to rock and roll, jazz, pop etc, because they above all under estimate the emotional significance of musical and art with all their thoughts and choosing to percievably blame society and culture for not recognising their training and education and ability , and it's just not like that.
I can imagine many hip hop listeners not preferring to listen to ancient music but I dare say those same hiphop listeners can appreciate ancient music for what it is.
For any supposed artist to dismiss any other form of music than their preferred as less than equal completely relinquishes their own credibility as an artist and showcases their flaws as humans to a much greater extent, and at a great cost to themselves above all and everyone else who has to endure their stuckedness as people. IMO.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #248
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneHall View Post
I can imagine many hip hop listeners not preferring to listen to ancient music but I dare say those same hiphop listeners can appreciate ancient music for what it is.
This is the key in all directions.

By hip hop standards and aesthetics, classical music and rock are pure trash lol. Its all relative to your starting point vs "for what it is."

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneHall View Post
For any supposed artist to dismiss any other form of music than their preferred as less than equal completely relinquishes their own credibility as an artist and showcases their flaws as humans to a much greater extent, and at a great cost to themselves above all and everyone else who has to endure their stuckedness as people. IMO.
There's three worlds involved in any creation: 1. the world of the work itself 2. the world of the creator of the work, and 3. the world of the listener/experiencer of the work. All must be accounted for by any open minded intelligent person looking to expand their life experience and appreciation.

Those that reside soley in 3, and impose 3 absolutely onto everything, are operating at a more ignorant and inferior position of understanding the world, by all objective measures. No wonder this also tends to come coupled with self-defensiveness and obviously ignorant reasons to knock things.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
This is the key in all directions.



There's three worlds involved in any creation: 1. the world of the work itself 2. the world of the creator of the work, and 3. the world of the listener/experiencer of the work. All must be accounted for by any open minded intelligent person looking to expand their life experience and appreciation.

Those that reside soley in 3, and impose 3 absolutely onto everything, are operating at a more ignorant and inferior position of understanding the world, by all objective measures. No wonder this also tends to come coupled with self-defensiveness and obviously ignorant reasons to knock things.
Presented like this the behaviour reminds of Gurdjeff's Man number 4 concept.
Man no.4 just keeps having to do things over and over again and still never quite get it right, never to ascend to the next level or continue the expansion process towards an understanding of much more than their starting point, coupled with a heavy dose of The Convenience Theory
Old 23rd April 2018
  #250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhizomeman View Post
Rap is art expressed through sound so yea, it's music. End of discussion imo. BUT, for me, 50% of a great hip hop piece is the instrumental tracks that go with the rap. It seems those artists are being ignored in this discussion. Thoughts?
I can only speak for myself, but I can assuredly say easily more than 51%, probably much higher depending on the quality/inventiveness and innovation of the production.

Being the geek that I am, I love all things pre DAW hip hop production, where sampling and beat knowledge ruled, and it was basically an homage to 70s funk, 60s jazz, techno, rock, R&B, cinema/TV, essentially the whole open world and history of recorded music that is the raison d'être for crate digging.

The newer stuff is cool, but no where as interesting as compared to when anything went. It's like the palette shrunk from a virtually endless kaleidoscope of tonal colors to a Benjamin Moore paint color chart.

But that's just me I guess. That's one of the things I dig about Detroit techno - you get all the music and the beats, and production methods and doohickeys, without the vocal baggage...(I hope people got some sort of a sarcasm meter)
Old 23rd April 2018
  #251
f33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhizomeman View Post
Rap is art expressed through sound so yea, it's music. End of discussion imo. BUT, for me, 50% of a great hip hop piece is the instrumental tracks that go with the rap. It seems those artists are being ignored in this discussion. Thoughts?
80% to 100%
Old 23rd April 2018
  #252
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
I can only speak for myself, but I can assuredly say easily more than 51%, probably much higher depending on the quality/inventiveness and innovation of the production.

Being the geek that I am, I love all things pre DAW hip hop production, where sampling and beat knowledge ruled, and it was basically an homage to 70s funk, 60s jazz, techno, rock, R&B, cinema/TV, essentially the whole open world and history of recorded music that is the raison d'être for crate digging.

The newer stuff is cool, but no where as interesting as compared to when anything went. It's like the palette shrunk from a virtually endless kaleidoscope of tonal colors to a Benjamin Moore paint color chart.

But that's just me I guess. That's one of the things I dig about Detroit techno - you get all the music and the beats, and production methods and doohickeys, without the vocal baggage...(I hope people got some sort of a sarcasm meter)
That's because back in the day, guys knew they didn't have knowledge of music, but they wanted it. Also, most producers were DJs who grew an appreciation for what would move a chrowd, calm them down, then hype them up again. During this era, guys mae up for what they didn't have in musical knowledge by hiring musicians to give them the vibe of what they were sampling.

Also, like them or not, the industry had gate keepers that would keep some things out. Today every guy with an 808 sound set and a laptop thinks he's a producer. With no digging in crates, know studying music, no listening to old eras, just his friends/his click, and a bag of weed. So everyone is high and telling him it sounds good.

It used to be different when the sacrifice of paying to go into the studio kept some people from trying to make music. Though it seems like a good thing, that everyone has their own personal karaoke machine that can spit out an MP3, The outcome isn't always positive.

We can hate major labels and organized independents, but the quality used to be better when both were competing for position.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
and a bag of weed. So everyone is high and telling him it sounds good.
Yea, smoke that blunt AFTER you make some awesome music.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #254
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@IM WHO YOU THINK if people stayed away from drugs much better music would be made especially regarding Hip Hop.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhizomeman View Post
Rap is art expressed through sound so yea, it's music. End of discussion imo. BUT, for me, 50% of a great hip hop piece is the instrumental tracks that go with the rap. It seems those artists are being ignored in this discussion. Thoughts?
Yeah well over 50% is the overall feel of the whole thing for most people, IME. Which is largely the instrumental but also the sound/feel of the vocalist's tone and flow (words aside.)

I think this is true for most music though. Overall feel tends to trump all. "That song has a great sound/feel" is the reason most listen to what they like (IE the masses of non-musicians that make up the vast majority of music listeners). The words themselves tend to be what's least important (though still of great importance, obviously). Overall feel -> melody -> words in order of importance, for most songs.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #256
f33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
During this era, guys mae up for what they didn't have in musical knowledge by hiring musicians to give them the vibe of what they were sampling.
.
where did you read this or what example do you have of this?

and you dont think people back in the day smoked week and made beats? cmon now
Old 23rd April 2018
  #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
Also, like them or not, the industry had gate keepers that would keep some things out. Today every guy with an 808 sound set and a laptop thinks he's a producer. With no digging in crates, know studying music, no listening to old eras, just his friends/his click, and a bag of weed. So everyone is high and telling him it sounds good.
This is the most significant difference between past and present imo. The democratization of worldwide distribution obviously floods the market with trash, which was impossible to do pre-internet when an investment of millions and physical distribution was needed for anyone to get heard.

The imperialist days were frustrating for the millions of musicians who couldn't get heard, but for eveyone else none of the crap never made it past the desk of their local record store, so music listeners weren't tasked with sorting through piles of hay to find the needle like they are now. There was ZERO highly distributed amateur music. Which would be something of a relief these days.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #258
Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
This is the most significant difference between past and present imo. The democratization of worldwide distribution obviously floods the market with trash, which was impossible to do pre-internet when an investment of millions and physical distribution was needed for anyone to get heard.

The imperialist days were frustrating for the millions of musicians who couldn't get heard, but for eveyone else none of the crap never made it past the desk of their local record store, so music listeners weren't tasked with sorting through piles of hay to find the needle like they are now. There was ZERO highly distributed amateur music. Which would be something of a relief these days.
I have this picture of you strapped to a chair surrounded by 20 bums yelling at you "LISTEN TO MY MIXTAPE BRO, THE WORLD IS NOT READY FOR THIS'''
Old 23rd April 2018
  #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f33 View Post
where did you read this or what example do you have of this?

and you dont think people back in the day smoked week and made beats? cmon now
Why on Earth would you think I read it? I lived it. I don't really have a single example to offer you. I lived it. I started making records in HS. I'm old enough to remember when rapping wasn't popular and only a dedicated few were willing to save for drum machines/studio time, and buy records every week.

Sure people smoked weed then, but it wasn't like it is now. Today getting high is more important than what's taking place in the studio. It wasn't like that before..


The part with musicians happened mainly after sampling started drawing lawsuits.

Last edited by IM WHO YOU THINK; 23rd April 2018 at 11:28 PM..
Old 23rd April 2018
  #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martel80 View Post
I have this picture of you strapped to a chair surrounded by 20 bums yelling at you "LISTEN TO MY MIXTAPE BRO, THE WORLD IS NOT READY FOR THIS'''
Abridged to simply "Soundcloud" lol
Old 23rd April 2018
  #261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
This is the most significant difference between past and present imo. The democratization of worldwide distribution obviously floods the market with trash, which was impossible to do pre-internet when an investment of millions and physical distribution was needed for anyone to get heard.

The imperialist days were frustrating for the millions of musicians who couldn't get heard, but for eveyone else none of the crap never made it past the desk of their local record store, so music listeners weren't tasked with sorting through piles of hay to find the needle like they are now. There was ZERO highly distributed amateur music. Which would be something of a relief these days.
Yes, but we (or at least I can turn off the stuff I either don't like or think is worthy...I am my own gate keeper. Nobody forces me to like or listen to anything and I like the fact that I can discover and listen to an artist from South Africa who's work probably wouldn't get distributed if it had to pass through the hands of the traditional gatekeepers.

And yes, they put out "crap" too and still do, I have crates of them here...all genres are represented, we've been making crappy music since day one, it's just become a lot easier to record and distribute it over the last few years. Also, least we forget, the record label money paid for a lot of brown, white and green drugs too. On one hand we bemoan the fact that hip hop/rap producers don't search through records anymore and on the other hand we're bemoaning the fact that we don't have gatekeepers to pre-select for us.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #262
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Originally Posted by Samc View Post
Yes, but we (or at least I can turn off the stuff I either don't like or think is worthy...I am my own gate keeper. Nobody forces me to like or listen to anything and I like the fact that I can discover and listen to an artist from South Africa who's work probably wouldn't get distributed if it had to pass through the hands of the traditional gatekeepers.

And yes, they put out "crap" too and still do, I have crates of them here...all genres are represented, we've been making crappy music since day one, it's just become a lot easier to record and distribute it over the last few years. Also, least we forget, the record label money paid for a lot of brown, white and green drugs too. On one hand we bemoan the fact that hip hop/rap producers don't search through records anymore and on the other hand we're bemoaning the fact that we don't have gatekeepers to pre-select for us.
I'm not bemoaning anything, personally. Just noting a very significant point of distinguishment. But yes, there's always been so little good stuff that even with strict gatekeeping and high investment costs, much of the output was poor back in the day. There's a ridiculously massive difference in quantity now though, compared to pre-internet distro. Millions to hundreds. Crate digging Soundcloud in 2018 is nothing like crate digging vinyl in the 90s.

Markets always end up correcting themselves though as they naturally move towards equilibrium. . . what all this instant easy worldwide distribution has led to is an increase in the amount of tastemaker roles that are out there, IE the blogs and Spotify playlist selectors, along with internet and satellite radio station growth. They're something of the new record label A&R and radio DJ now, a 3rd tier of "selector" power has developed to account for the flood.
Old 23rd April 2018
  #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samc View Post
Yes, but we (or at least I can turn off the stuff I either don't like or think is worthy...I am my own gate keeper. Nobody forces me to like or listen to anything and I like the fact that I can discover and listen to an artist from South Africa who's work probably wouldn't get distributed if it had to pass through the hands of the traditional gatekeepers.

And yes, they put out "crap" too and still do, I have crates of them here...all genres are represented, we've been making crappy music since day one, it's just become a lot easier to record and distribute it over the last few years. Also, least we forget, the record label money paid for a lot of brown, white and green drugs too. On one hand we bemoan the fact that hip hop/rap producers don't search through records anymore and on the other hand we're bemoaning the fact that we don't have gatekeepers to pre-select for us.
So do you think the quality level now is as good as its ever been?
Old 23rd April 2018
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
I'm not bemoaning anything, personally. Just noting a very significant point of distinguishment. But yes, there's always been so little good stuff that even with strict gatekeeping and high investment costs, much of the output was poor back in the day. There's a ridiculously massive difference in quantity now though, compared to pre-internet distro. Millions to hundreds. Crate digging Soundcloud in 2018 is nothing like crate digging vinyl in the 90s.

Markets always end up correcting themselves though as they naturally move towards equilibrium. . . what all this instant easy worldwide distribution has led to is an increase in the amount of tastemaker roles that are out there, IE the blogs and Spotify playlist selectors, along with internet and satellite radio station growth. They're something of the new record label A&R and radio DJ now, a 3rd tier of "selector" power has developed to account for the flood.
It's actually not true that Markets always end up correcting themselves as they naturally move toward equalibrium. That's what's taught in basic Econ. But inherrent in that conclusion is the assumption that markets are allowed to move naturally.

In the real world, that doesn't always happen.
Old 24th April 2018
  #265
f33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
Why on Earth would you think I read it? I lived it. I don't really have a single example to offer you. I lived it. I started making records in HS. I'm old enough to remember when rapping wasn't popular and only a dedicated few were willing to save for drum machines/studio time, and buy records every week.

Sure people smoked weed then, but it wasn't like it is now. Today getting high is more important than what's taking place in the studio. It wasn't like that before..


The part with musicians happened mainly after sampling started drawing lawsuits.
you use a lot of anecdotal evidence, never been a fan of that.

'then and now' is too much of a generalization
Old 24th April 2018
  #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
It's actually not true that Markets always end up correcting themselves as they naturally move toward equalibrium. That's what's taught in basic Econ. But inherrent in that conclusion is the assumption that markets are allowed to move naturally.

In the real world, that doesn't always happen.
Yes of course, its a general rule, not a hard fact, if you want to nitpick a side point. .

The point was to note where a market correction of sorts is observably taking place right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
So do you think the quality level now is as good as its ever been?
I for one think music is in a very good place right now. There's a steady stream of music I really enjoy in multiple creative directions done at a very high level. I also find the radio quite listenable in general right now, esp compared to 6-15 years ago, its taken a strong turn for the better IMO.

I personally don't register anything I don't enjoy (no time for that, esp now with everyone's music being distributed everywhere), and what's left is quite amazing right now imo. I know the tastemakers I trust and mostly lean on them to save me the hassle of 10,000 new tracks/week, with a bit of digging around here and there on my own. I'm rarely at a loss of at least one "wow, that's really good" to something relatively new at any given time, often several.

Live music wise, I have every option I could ever want within 10 miles in LA. If I want classical, new or old, its there. Rock of all kinds, its there. Expertly performed cover bands of pretty much any huge band in history, its there. Hip hop of all kinds, there. Dance music of all kinds, there. Jazz of all sorts, there. Massive touring acts, there. The most underground scene acts of all kinds, there. With vibey crowds who are into it. I can relive all the different pasts of music at a high level, and the current is full of good stuff. Its a great time IMO.

Last edited by newguy1; 24th April 2018 at 12:55 AM..
Old 24th April 2018
  #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
...I for one think music is in a very good place right now...I also find the radio quite listenable in general right now, esp compared to 6-15 years ago, its taken a strong turn for the better IMO...Live music wise, I have every option I could ever want..Its a great time IMO.
Sorry if I am cherry picking from your statement, but I think if you are a musician or a small studio, its a terrible time. Nobody wants to pay for music anymore, the album format is near dead due to iTunes and like services, streaming radio pays the artists little to nothing, larger bands and classical orchestras are being being slowly starved by a thousand cuts in funding. MBAs and other 'sharps' run major orchestras and operas into the ground like they are equity-stripping venture capitalists. Professional recording engineers are nickeled and dimed by clients who think they can do better with their iPhones...maybe its better in the rap world, but I doubt it.
Old 24th April 2018
  #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
So do you think the quality level now is as good as its ever been?
"Quality" in this context is such a moving target because it's so subjective...but yeah, there is more stuff...so it stands to reason that there is more quality stuff and more not so quality stuff.
Old 24th April 2018
  #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newguy1 View Post
Yes of course, its a general rule, not a hard fact, if you want to nitpick a side point. .

The point was to note where a market correction of sorts is observably taking place right now.



I for one think music is in a very good place right now. There's a steady stream of music I really enjoy in multiple creative directions done at a very high level. I also find the radio quite listenable in general right now, esp compared to 6-15 years ago, its taken a strong turn for the better IMO.

I personally don't register anything I don't enjoy (no time for that, esp now with everyone's music being distributed everywhere), and what's left is quite amazing right now imo. I know the tastemakers I trust and mostly lean on them to save me the hassle of 10,000 new tracks/week, with a bit of digging around here and there on my own. I'm rarely at a loss of at least one "wow, that's really good" to something relatively new at any given time, often several.

Live music wise, I have every option I could ever want within 10 miles in LA. If I want classical, new or old, its there. Rock of all kinds, its there. Expertly performed cover bands of pretty much any huge band in history, its there. Hip hop of all kinds, there. Dance music of all kinds, there. Jazz of all sorts, there. Massive touring acts, there. The most underground scene acts of all kinds, there. With vibey crowds who are into it. I can relive all the different pasts of music at a high level, and the current is full of good stuff. Its a great time IMO.
I apologize. I'm a financial analyst by trade, financial markets raise my antenna. When I asked the question, I was specifically asking about hip hop. Of course there's no right or wrong answer, I just wanted to know your opinion on the current state.
Old 24th April 2018
  #270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f33 View Post
you use a lot of anecdotal evidence, never been a fan of that.

'then and now' is too much of a generalization
I can only know where I've been, and what I've seen. I'm OK with you having a completely different vantage point and opinion. I'm honestly not seeking to convince you. I did find it funny that your assumption was that I must have read it someplace. Lol.

I completely respect your right to disagree.
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