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Behringer Mini model D? A good idea?
Old 2nd March 2017
  #1
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Behringer Mini model D? A good idea?

Myself and a few others have been discussing the theory of Behringer maybe doing their version of the Model D Mini-Moog, but as a desktop version, what ya think for around $500 or under price point. I have put the idea to Uli, and I got the impression he would consider it, depending upon the feeling amongst here. I certainly would buy a desktop version, especially if they can hit that price point, as the real Mini D way out of my price league.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #2
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Shadowkast's Avatar
That sounds disgusting.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #3
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Mini-D, Roland Boutique-style, and compatible with the k-25m/minikeys
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #4
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namnibor's Avatar
Just, no.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #5
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Focusing on sound quality or build as cheap as possible? I rather see they do that new cs80 with polyphonic aftertouch keyboard.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #6
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manalishi's Avatar
No. When you've seen how smart they were with the modulation options on the DM12, the last thing I would want from a Behringer mono is a plain D copy.

I want a full-fat modulate-anything-by-everything mono, Mr B.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #7
Whatever they do it has to be <insert vintage synth name> on steriods.

1:1's arent what Im looking for. I mean I love my Karp but would presets, mod wheel, on board fx and a sequencer have improved any vintage? Damn right
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #8
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Would be nice to see/hear what sort of plans Behringer have, wether its a straight 1:1 idea or maybe they add preset memory etc.
Old 2nd March 2017
  #9
Gear Nut
 

no. it's one thing to resurrect dead synths, but doing a mini that's back in production, which moog has worked very hard and with great respect and love to make again, feels wrong. tacky, tasteless, and predatory.

ulli would definitely lose me and i'd bet quite a few others as customers by doing this. there would be brand damage in a small market where reputations matter--and a huge part of the point of the behringer synth project is to elevate the brand from it's reputation for low-quality budget gear to pro level gear. i'd bet the deep mind has a very long way to go before it breaks even, even if it is a bestseller today.

it's a poor business strategy, too. there are tons of great dead synths to resurrect, for which there is more demand (ie, with no substitutes in the market): jupiter 8, cs-80, ob-xa, ob-x, voyetra 8, jupiter 4, memorymoog, and so on. start there, the fixed costs of developing an analog poly have already been sunk, now reap the benefits of that investment.

it's a bad, frankly terrible, idea in every respect.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #10
Gear Maniac
A Modern Minimoog on steroids. One that would make the Mini V, Se-1x and Voyager inferior. Tons of mod routing, insane fx, and modern studio/computer integration (USB with both MIDI and Audio, but still have analog outputs and DIN MIDI). Analog purists could moan all they want; I would totally buy it. I may be in the minority here, but I'd rather have a jack-of-all trades bass synth than the normal, "it's analog with some cool tricks", offerings.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neonrider View Post
no. it's one thing to resurrect dead synths, but doing a mini that's back in production, which moog has worked very hard and with great respect and love to make again, feels wrong. tacky, tasteless, and predatory.

ulli would definitely lose me and i'd bet quite a few others as customers by doing this. there would be brand damage in a small market where reputations matter--and a huge part of the point of the behringer synth project is to elevate the brand from it's reputation for low-quality budget gear to pro level gear. i'd bet the deep mind has a very long way to go before it breaks even, even if it is a bestseller today.

it's a poor business strategy, too. there are tons of great dead synths to resurrect, for which there is more demand (ie, with no substitutes in the market): jupiter 8, cs-80, ob-xa, ob-x, voyetra 8, jupiter 4, memorymoog, and so on. start there, the fixed costs of developing an analog poly have already been sunk, now reap the benefits of that investment.

it's a bad, frankly terrible, idea in every respect.
+1
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #12
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GeminIAm's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcearl View Post
Whatever they do it has to be <insert vintage synth name> on steriods.

1:1's arent what Im looking for. I mean I love my Karp but would presets, mod wheel, on board fx and a sequencer have improved any vintage? Damn right
An Oddy with full sized keys and midi for both pitch and modwheel would be good enough for me, fx would be a bonus. Presets would ruin it for me.
Old 2nd March 2017
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neonrider View Post
no. it's one thing to resurrect dead synths, but doing a mini that's back in production, which moog has worked very hard and with great respect and love to make again, feels wrong. tacky, tasteless, and predatory.

ulli would definitely lose me and i'd bet quite a few others as customers by doing this. there would be brand damage in a small market where reputations matter--and a huge part of the point of the behringer synth project is to elevate the brand from it's reputation for low-quality budget gear to pro level gear. i'd bet the deep mind has a very long way to go before it breaks even, even if it is a bestseller today.

it's a poor business strategy, too. there are tons of great dead synths to resurrect, for which there is more demand (ie, with no substitutes in the market): jupiter 8, cs-80, ob-xa, ob-x, voyetra 8, jupiter 4, memorymoog, and so on. start there, the fixed costs of developing an analog poly have already been sunk, now reap the benefits of that investment.

it's a bad, frankly terrible, idea in every respect.
We are not talking about 1:1 replica here.
Just a 3 VCO mono, with some ideas from DM12.
Moog doesn't have an exclusive right for such a synth structure.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #14
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goony's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
A nice mono analogue with those Midas chaps involved would be great especially desktop/rack version..
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #15
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Originally Posted by GeminIAm View Post
An Oddy with full sized keys and midi for both pitch and modwheel would be good enough for me, fx would be a bonus. Presets would ruin it for me.
Thats the thing about a preset function, you dont have to use it. I think I have three non preset synths and I seldom noodle on them. It doesnt take away from me liking them, but even synths with limited presets I like to fill with "future" sounds

Just now I use the Odyssey and ms 20 apps for this...but damn a modwheel and better midi would do more for it imo
Old 2nd March 2017
  #16
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fiddlestickz's Avatar
yes please..!!!!!!
Old 2nd March 2017
  #17
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fiddlestickz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by neonrider View Post
no. it's one thing to resurrect dead synths, but doing a mini that's back in production, which moog has worked very hard and with great respect and love to make again, feels wrong. tacky, tasteless, and predatory.

ulli would definitely lose me and i'd bet quite a few others as customers by doing this. there would be brand damage in a small market where reputations matter--and a huge part of the point of the behringer synth project is to elevate the brand from it's reputation for low-quality budget gear to pro level gear. i'd bet the deep mind has a very long way to go before it breaks even, even if it is a bestseller today.

it's a poor business strategy, too. there are tons of great dead synths to resurrect, for which there is more demand (ie, with no substitutes in the market): jupiter 8, cs-80, ob-xa, ob-x, voyetra 8, jupiter 4, memorymoog, and so on. start there, the fixed costs of developing an analog poly have already been sunk, now reap the benefits of that investment.

it's a bad, frankly terrible, idea in every respect.
oh please, can you lend me 5K to buy a re issue..?? those synths are still way way out of reach for most of us..

you people are weird, you get a chance to get things you've always wanted and then you say no because of some moral weirdness..

I for one would love a Model D that was cheaper than 5k and sounded just as good..
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz View Post
oh please, can you lend me 5K to buy a re issue..?? those synths are still way way out of reach for most of us..

you people are weird, you get a chance to get things you've always wanted and then you say no because of some moral weirdness..

I for one would love a Model D that was cheaper than 5k and sounded just as good..
Totally agree with you here.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcearl View Post
Thats the thing about a preset function, you dont have to use it. I think I have three non preset synths and I seldom noodle on them. It doesnt take away from me liking them, but even synths with limited presets I like to fill with "future" sounds

Just now I use the Odyssey and ms 20 apps for this...but damn a modwheel and better midi would do more for it imo
Lol with me it's almost the other way around! I love rompler presets but whilst I enjoy making patches on other synths I don't like trawling through them whilst composing, I tend to build what I need for a song. But then again as long as there's a front panel mode like on the dm12 everyone is happy lol.
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Old 2nd March 2017
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowkast View Post
That sounds disgusting.
There's very little morals and ethics to be had these days it seems.
It's sad that deplorable and predatory behavior gets OK'd as norm and status quo.

It's little wonder why the state of the world is where it's at these days...
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
There's very little morals and ethics to be had these days it seems.
It's sad that deplorable and predatory behavior gets OK'd as norm and status quo.

It's little wonder why the state of the world is where it's at these days...
how do you explain all that software that copies every legacy synth and drum machine ever made, and there is the euro rack plague of clones of every single filter and vca known to man..oh and then there is the Crowminius and multiple clones of the enigmatic 303..hello Avalon and XOX boxes bass botts etc etc..
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz View Post
how do you explain all that software that copies every legacy synth and drum machine ever made, and there is the euro rack plague of clones of every single filter and vca known to man..oh and then there is the Crowminius and multiple clones of the enigmatic 303..hello Avalon and XOX boxes bass botts etc etc..
I could explain it all, really, I could, but I don't want to expend the energy to do so, at least give the effort required to explain it cogently, intelligently, to properly describe all the machinations that goes hand in hand to create the cesspool that it is ATM.

Nevertheless, from just a simplistic POV, it's very easy to recognize scuminess when self evident...

You can either step in it, or walk around it...frankly it's a choice.
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
I could explain it all, really, I could, but I don't want to expend the energy to do so, at least give the effort required to explain it cogently, intelligently, to properly describe all the machinations that goes hand in hand to create the cesspool that it is ATM.

Nevertheless, from just a simplistic POV, it's very easy to recognize scuminess when self evident...

You can either step in it, or walk around it...frankly it's a choice.
Don't suppose you own or use any clones in your studio eh..?? it's all first originals serial number 1 and you write the code for your own DAW and build computer from scratch too..?
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz View Post
Don't suppose you own or use any clones in your studio eh..?? it's all first originals serial number 1 and you write the code for your own DAW and build computer from scratch too..?
I already got an infraction for merely pointing out past histories of Behringer.

Please don't goad me into that path again...

Let's just leave it there, shall we.

If you care so much, you can search through my post history - I've explained in detail the differences in co-opting IP that's in public domain, vs blatant ripoff of contemporaneous technologies and marketing. If you can't understand the difference or nuance, well, that's more a reflection of your ignorance or blind eye, rather than the issues of ethics at large...
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #25
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I wonder how everyone would feel about an 808 clone that sounded 95% of the original, I'm sure there would be lines around the block to purchase one of those..
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #26
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Jamie munro's Avatar
 

This thread is making me itch or I'm not sure, perhaps both
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz View Post
I wonder how everyone would feel about an 808 clone that sounded 95% of the original, I'm sure there would be lines around the block to purchase one of those..
Not much interest frankly...it's overtly saturated beyond reason.

...but that's not the crux of what's important to discussion at hand. It's the forgiving or looking the other way of countless sins and despicable behavior/actions, that somehow is absolved merely by the materialistic dangling of the proverbial carrot?

It's beneath dignity in many respects...again, it's a choice whether to defend it, or to point it out.
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
Not much interest frankly...it's overtly saturated beyond reason.

...but that's not the crux of what's important to discussion at hand. It's the forgiving or looking the other way of countless sins and despicable behavior/actions, that somehow is absolved merely by the materialistic dangling of the proverbial carrot?

It's beneath dignity in many respects...again, it's a choice whether to defend it, or to point it out.
Acidlab have cloned the 606, 808 and 303...where's the cries of indignation there..?
Yokto
Nava
The Avalon
XOX boxes
countless VST's that have a interface almost identical the original..

how come you don't cry foul at those..?
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz View Post
Acidlab have cloned the 606, 808 and 303...where's the cries of indignation there..?
Yokto
Nava
The Avalon
XOX boxes
countless VST's that have a interface almost identical the original..

how come you don't cry foul at those..?
How do you know I don't?

And in all honesty, you're OK with their past?

I guess we have different standards...
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Old 3rd March 2017
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
in co-opting IP that's in public domain, vs blatant ripoff of contemporaneous technologies and marketing
don't pretend big B is unique in this endeavor in our modern capitalistic globalism. we're talking silly synths for (fat) (white) (men), not stuff that really matters to the world on the whole.
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