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Behringer DeepMind 12
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18781
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Hum. well non of that has worked. Ive not tried "dont use a hub" yet as all my USB are hard wired through a powered USB 3 hum. I physically dont have long enough cables to reach the PC, OR any spare ports on the PC. There all in use.

Bones sees the DM just fine as a device - when the DM is on its an option in both send and receive - when its off its not. That proves that the DM is actually connected to the PC just fine. Its the editor that just doesnt see it.
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18782
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OK - sorted. My silly error (arnt they always silly).

I didnt realise the input/output devices in settings were "scrollable" or that it wouldnt automatically pick up the Deep Mind. I have my Moto Micro express midi patchbay connected and its ports were showing at the top. Once I realised they scrollled (WHY no down arrow ??) the DM was sitting at the bottom.

Follow on Q.

Whats the best way to backup banks to PC, or load banks from PC ? can I do that in the editor or is Bomes SendSX the best way? if so I need to work out how to use that.
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulmapp8306 View Post
Whats the best way to backup banks to PC, or load banks from PC ? can I do that in the editor or is Bomes SendSX the best way? if so I need to work out how to use that.
I expect people will vociferously disagree (again), but I think the best way to back up banks is to use Bome's Send SX, simply because there's no easy way to get that wrong, whereas, the app can easily be used to trash the bank you wanted to back up.

I've attached a zip with 8 separate dump request files, one per bank.... They're for my DM6, but I doubt if that matters.

In text form (which you can paste into Bome's instead of using a sysex file), they look like this:

// PROGRAM DUMP REQUEST 
//
F0
00 20 32 // Behringer Manufacturers ID
20 // DeepMind 6 Model ID
00 // 0d Device ID ( 0-15 ) 
09 // Bank Dump Request
00 // 0b Bank Number (0-7 => A-H)
00 // first Program Number (0-127)
7F // last Program Number (0-127)
F7


- the device ID is different for the 12/12D (see the manual, towards the end), but that's probably not an issue. The bank number is different, for each bank. 0 represents A, and so on.
Attached Files
File Type: zip BANK DUMP REQUESTs.zip (1.1 KB, 0 views)
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18784
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulmapp8306 View Post
or load banks from PC ? can I do that in the editor or is Bomes SendSX the best way? if so I need to work out how to use that.
Bome's is best suited for sending a bank or patch back to the same location. Moving a bank to another bank (different letter) is tricky, because each patch in a dump has the bank letter and slot number stored in it, but you can use this to change a bank from one bank letter to another, among other things:

http://www.riccardosantato.net/idee-...2d-sysex-files

The only problem I found is that the banks need to be stored in a folder with a short path

- e.g, put them in

C:\DM12

rather than in

C:\Users\Ghenghis Cohen\My Documents\Synths\Synth modules\Behringer\Behringer DeepMind 12\sysex\banks I paid for that aren't in the bank I want them to be in\loopop

- longer paths confuse it
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18785
Lives for gear
 

Hum. Not having any luck with the sysex librarians (though I really dont know what Im doing with them lol).

I have a 3rd party bank that mirrors the original Junos factory sounds that Im using to test.

Using the editor - I can drag and drop the bank into the preset managers left hand column - I can then transfer them to DM by copying them to the right (seems logical). They seem to play fine on the DM.

Now - with the librarians.......

I can save the banks dump from DM on all 3 Im trying (Midi OX, C6 and Bomes Send SX). They seem to have worked fine, as I can use them to over-write that original Juno bank to revert to the factory state (yes I know I can do that direct from the DM).

HOWEVER, sending the banks (any of them including the Junos) is not working. I can set the DM as both in and out in them no problem. I can load the sysex messages, and when I press send - tit SEEMS to be sending something...somewhere however Im getting no "receiving" message on the DM itself and no patches change.

As an aside, I did a FW update fine (to 1.1.2 - which is some months old so no idea how long the synth has been boxed on a shelf lol). Again done from the editor and went smoothly.
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18786
Lives for gear
 

OK - getting there.

The banks were blank even though they had data in them. No wonder DM didnt receive any sysex.

I can now load in via Bomes SendSX. I cant read though (which is why they were blank). Im getting data into the midi chain - but its not valid when loading again.

Ill have to look at that however as the only time Im going to do that is to backup user date - I can probably do that via the editor I guess which does work both ways.
Old 12th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18787
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulmapp8306 View Post

I can now load in via Bomes SendSX. I cant read though (which is why they were blank). Im getting data into the midi chain - but its not valid when loading again.
Maybe you do need to edit the device ID, in the dump request, to match the DM12D.

It doesn't seem to matter for sending patches and banks, because any DM can load patches for any other, but it might be more fussy about dump requests.

You should be able to paste the text example i gave into the MIDI Out window of Bome, and edit it, or make the edit first, in notepad or similar - the comments should be okay to leave in.

One thing with Bome's is to clear your MIDI IN window, before sending the dump request, then save what you get back before doing anything else, otherwise you get extra bits of sysex tacked on, that aren't part of the dump.
Old 13th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18788
Here for the gear
 

Should I be worried ?

Did many calibrations, and most of them have fails for various voices of the DPW calibration. DPW is for pulse width according to the manual. A restart of the synth helps to solve this issue, but if I wait a bit the calibration fails again. And each time for different voices.

I did a factory reset, firmware is up to date, tried with and without the fan enabled...
Attached Thumbnails
Behringer DeepMind 12-130774602_10158730852752086_9186129530211005178_n.jpg   Behringer DeepMind 12-130900573_10158730852742086_2019404807589120318_n.jpg   Behringer DeepMind 12-130775947_10158730852847086_5293156665869552145_n.jpg  
Old 13th December 2020 | Show parent
  #18789
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulmapp8306 View Post
Go a DM12D this week - and not sure its a keeper.

The single main oscillator is more restrictive than I thought it would be. I know there are work arounds using 2 voice unison and pitch shifting, and while both work its not the same.

The control seq was one reason I chose the DM - and having bought a Squarp Pyramid this week as well - thats actually not as high a priority as it was when I was choosing the synth. Im also picking up a Pythion when there back in stock - which also has this kind of feature.

To top it off - I downloaded the editor today and it will not connect to the DM..... DM is connected to my PC. I hear the Bing when I connect, and DeepMind12 comes up as a device in Midi OX so its definitely there. NO idea why it just says "no connection".....

Without that patch management is going to be a nightmare - and loading "purchased" sound banks is also going to be a pain as Ill have to use sysex dumps (via Midi OX0 and I really dont know what im doing there.


DESPERATELY need some help getting this working please, or it will go back next week and Ill grab a DSi Rev 2 instead (FX are not as good, and no control seq BUT proper 2 osc section and it just works).
return it. If you're not in love with it, it will only start to irritate you later on.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #18790
Gear Addict
 
bftucker's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olafmol View Post
return it. If you're not in love with it, it will only start to irritate you later on.
Please return it. You deserve a DSI Rev 2. Thanks.

Old 4 weeks ago
  #18791
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How good is this synth for ambient?

What stereo stuff can it do? ... effects based I guess - I know this synth itself is simple.

Is there a lot of patches? Factory patches and for sale patches?

I am a pad slut.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #18792
Gear Addict
 
bftucker's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Dairy View Post
How good is this synth for ambient?

What stereo stuff can it do? ... effects based I guess - I know this synth itself is simple.

Is there a lot of patches? Factory patches and for sale patches?

I am a pad slut.
One example:

Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #18793
Gear Nut
 
KMN04's Avatar
 

Its good for ambient and there's quite a few factory and 3rd party ambient libraries available for it.
There's a few good showcases of its ambient chops by searching YouTube.

However for me the main limitation is not its oscillators but it mod matrix - it only has 8 slots which is too few IMO to make interesting evolving pads/ambient.

If the upgraded it to 16 mod slots I'd get it again (I used to have it but sold it).
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #18794
Lives for gear
I sold mine a while back and have regretted it since. I love making huge chords, stabs and pads in the roland cloud jx3p and juno but i feel like the deepmind allows for more manipulation of those sounds and adds a fresh twist.

Kept looking for a 12 voice desktop and finally landed a b stock last night. I really need to find a good resource that shows all the tricks to getting these sounds out of the mod matrix this time around. I simply didnt dive into the synth enough when i had it before and that was a mistake.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #18795
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Hi there,
One of the screws that is connecting the wood side panel to my desktop 12 is missing. Anyone know where to get spare screws and what kind of screws to ask for?
Thanks.
Old 1 week ago
  #18796
Lives for gear
Hi @ paulmapp8306 and all DM users,

Please use the Behringer app. It's really good as a librarian too.

Or even better use Knobkraft:
https://github.com/christofmuc/KnobKraft-orm

Download latest release:
https://github.com/christofmuc/KnobKraft-orm/releases

It's a generic Sysex librarian that integrates all HW synthesizers, is open source, and includes an adaptation for Behringer DM12.
Try it.

best regards
Old 6 days ago | Show parent
  #18797
Gear Addict
 
rjay's Avatar
 

I'm trying to re-organise my patches so that (for example) all my pads are in Bank A. I cant find any way of doing it using any software (MidiQuest, KnobKraft, Behringer's own app, etc.) It's a real PITA. I don't mind dragging and dropping to build the bank - I don't expect it to automatically sort - but most apps (except Behginer's) don't even show the patch category the patch is assigned to. Behringer's app does, but it doesn't allow re-ordering patches. It might eventually be possible in Knobraft but it's very alpha at the moment ....
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18798
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjay View Post
most apps (except Behginer's) don't even show the patch category the patch is assigned to. Behringer's app does, but it doesn't allow re-ordering patches. It might eventually be possible in Knobraft but it's very alpha at the moment ....
Try Knobcraft Orm, which is free on Github. It does show categories.

You can import banks from the synth, or from disk, into one big database that you can filter in different ways - e.g. if you load a bank into it, you can select just the patches in that bank, then you can filter that with a category button.

Mostly what it does is let you load a patch into the edit buffer of the synth to play it, but you can then save that to where you want, manually, on the synth.

Bank management is planned for the future, but that's a way to do it, for now.

https://github.com/christofmuc/KnobKraft-orm

Look for "Releases", on the right hand margin.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18799
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjay View Post
I'm trying to re-organise my patches so that (for example) all my pads are in Bank A. I cant find any way of doing it using any software (MidiQuest, KnobKraft, Behringer's own app, etc.) It's a real PITA. I don't mind dragging and dropping to build the bank - I don't expect it to automatically sort - but most apps (except Behginer's) don't even show the patch category the patch is assigned to. Behringer's app does, but it doesn't allow re-ordering patches. It might eventually be possible in Knobraft but it's very alpha at the moment ....
Hi rjay,

it's really easy with the Behringer app, but you need to be careful not to destroy any data:

1. Go to Settings -> Connections
The DM must always be correctly recognized and connected (input and output), otherwise you will have bad effects.

2. Go to Preset Manager
You have two columns with banks listed that act identically
Let the left column show the original banks on the synthesizer and use the right bank to create banks on the computer (my suggestion).

Important: Banks marked with a keyboard symbol are the original banks on the synthesizer! If you change something there, it will be executed on the synthesizer and you cannot go back. So it is probably a good idea to first copy all of the original banks on Synth to new banks on your computer.
All banks without a keyboard icon are banks saved on the computer.

In the right column, click New Bank. Now there is a bank called "New Bank".
Unfortunately, the new bank is now also marked in the left column.

You should rename the bank. Click on it and hit Enter and give it a name.

Now you have an empty new bank on computer and you can mark another bank in the left column and copy patches from this left bank into any patch slot in the new bank in the right column.

After you have created your new bank independently on computer, you can copy it as a whole to the synthesizer and overwrite a selected bank.

best regards
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18800
Gear Addict
 
rjay's Avatar
 

KnobKrafts shows it's own categories - not the categories from the Deepmind unfortunately.

But Behrmoog's instructions are very helpful, and I shall definitely be trying that.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18801
Here for the gear
 

The Deepmind Editor is very easy to use once you understand how it works.
I have reorganised my bank several times and it‘s really fast with the DM Editor.
Just start with a backup of the original banks.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18802
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjay View Post
KnobKrafts shows it's own categories - not the categories from the Deepmind unfortunately.

But Behrmoog's instructions are very helpful, and I shall definitely be trying that.
Hi,

sorry, I forgot to mention that there is no drag and drop, you have to use the "Copy to Right" button, at the very bottom, and first you have to select a patch on the left and right banks to copy from / to.

best regards

PS: All of these somewhat "strange" use cases are due to the fact that the app is intended for a tablet.
Old 5 days ago | Show parent
  #18803
Gear Addict
 
rjay's Avatar
 

I get it now. It's not a very intuitive app, but I can see now how to accomplish what I want.

Many thanks !
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