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Roland Integra 7 or Sample Tank 3 ?
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #31
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by muziksculp View Post

I feel if ROLAND shipped the Integra 7 with a totally fresh/new ROM expansion, (nothing from the older SRX Expansions), but offered a totally new and improved ROM Sample base, I would have less of an issue with it,
The XV cards are simply a BONUS - the SN Acoustic, SN Drum and SN Synth are all NEW. Well, newer than the PCM sounds you speak of. The SNA sounds are amazing.
Old 8th August 2014
  #32
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muziksculp's Avatar
 

Hi mike vee,

Thanks for the feedback & Congratulations on your Integra 7.

Actually, the fact that you went for an Integra 7 instead of something like ST3 makes me feel better about buying the Integra 7.

Q. Are you using the analog outputs on the Integra 7, or via its USB Port, Which I think sends audio to your computer. (similar to the Virus Ti).

Cheers,
Muziksculp
Old 8th August 2014
  #33
Having played with an I7 in a store, the sounds, to my ears and granted it was not going through any convertors, sound much better than any software ROMpler I've heard. So money being no object, and assuming you really have a use for it, then I think the I7 is the top of the heap, especially for studio use that is based around a computer being able to utilize the nifty editor available for bothe Mac and PC now.

I don't use a ton of stuff like this in my music so I picture the I7 as a bit of a luxury/"love to have" kind of a thing.

For my uses, Logic's outdated but serviceable EXS24, and my most hated and regrettable plugin purchase, Nexus2, give me my orchestral and piano sounds. I think the Nexus2 sounds better than EXS usually, but not always. The thing I can't stand about it, is that for what it costs, it is astoundingly inflexible. Very few of the patches actually even respond to the envelopes, and the filters are terrible. The worst part, is say there is a preset with three layers. While you can toggle on/off or adjust gain/pan of each layer, you can't swap out layers and build your own patches within a single instance. I would sell it, but the pianos and the cellos are really good and I would miss that. Still, probably could have gotten better sounds in a better interface, for less.

My favorite these days is Korg Legacy M1 and Wavestation. Both cheap, both sound great, both with tons of editing and patch building capabilities. Loaded with cheezy 80's sounds. Something like over 5,000 sounds for $100. The drawback? Sounds are not grouped very well for browsing. They are presented by ROM card like the hardware. Also, too many cheezy synth/FM sounds and not enough orchestral recordings.

I'd love an I7, but wouldn't use it enough to justify the cost. But I can very much understand that a lot of people use these sounds daily and would get a ton of use out of it.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #34
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Mind-Over-Midi's Avatar
 

Sample Tank 3 is what, $300.00? Why not just buy both? This is Gearslutz is it not?




Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #35
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by muziksculp View Post
Hi mike vee,

Thanks for the feedback & Congratulations on your Integra 7.

Actually, the fact that you went for an Integra 7 instead of something like ST3 makes me feel better about buying the Integra 7.

Q. Are you using the analog outputs on the Integra 7, or via its USB Port, Which I think sends audio to your computer. (similar to the Virus Ti).

Cheers,
Muziksculp
Right now I am using the SPDIF output as well as 4 additional analog outputs - for a total of 2 stereo and 2 mono outputs. I hate USB and have no idea what kind of latency and ASIO crap would be required with that. However, I have the added bonus of having SRC on my Lynx sound card's SPDIF input - I run my Cubase sessions at 96K and am running the Integra at it's native 44.1 (no need for double SRC and no way i'm clocking to the Integra when I have apogee) To my ears, the analog channels through my Lynx and the SPDIF sound almost identical. It's been said many time the INTEGRA's converters are top notch.

Also, what DAW are you using? KEep in mind the Pc editor is VST3 and only works with Sonar I think and Cubase. The way you have to run the editor in Cubase requires boith the USB connection (for the editor) and also a regular old midi cables for notes. This is because in order to use the editor's midi channels you must disable those same midi channels in cubase, which then doesn't allow you to send notes from midi tracks - thats why you need the regular midi cables too. its simple though. cuabse issue not really the integra's fault.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #36
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mike vee's Avatar
*disclaimer - I cannot play keys good without a sequencer

I came across this SuperNatural acoustic Electric Piano yesterday and just REALLY though it was an amazing, dynamic, realistic patch. What I play is ****, but listen to all the nuances and change in tone with velocity - pretty amazing to me!!! It even sounds gritty and hissy and 70s (because of the insert effect) not uber-clean like motifs do. Listen in the first little phrase how you can hear as I remove my fingers from the keys! wow. Now, imagine the Integra can do 16 instruments like this all at once, some VA, some XV-5080, some expansions card, all at once, no tax on CPU!!! Imagine someone who can actually play utilizing that patch (why I pay session players at times) - would sound amazing and like 99% real.
Attached Files

e piano.mp3 (1.01 MB, 1691 views)

Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #37
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WozNYC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
I came across this SuperNatural acoustic Electric Piano yesterday and just REALLY though it was an amazing, dynamic, realistic patch.
The electric pianos in the I7 are fantastic. 9 times out of 10 they are my go-to's.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #38
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wozniak View Post
The electric pianos in the I7 are fantastic. 9 times out of 10 they are my go-to's.
indeed! I imagine one could make some VERY, VERY classy 90s hiphop styles with it and would wouldn't be able to tell it was a rompler if mixed right. I was imaging that they would be very clean and sterile, very digital, very motif - noooooooooo. So nice.
Old 8th August 2014
  #39
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Stimmt's Avatar
 

Thanks Mike Vee! But you know what I have found out. The SN E-Pianos on the Jupiter 80 sound even bigger than Integra. Don't know why, maybe increased DSP Voices or just bigger Sound Stage. Check out from 1:02 in this VID:



Freaking Amazing! Smokes Motifs tenfold...
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #40
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stimmt View Post
Thanks Mike Vee! But you know what I have found out. The SN E-Pianos on the Jupiter 80 sound even bigger than Integra. Don't know why, maybe increased DSP Voices or just bigger Sound Stage. Check out from 1:02 in this VID:


Freaking Amazing! Smokes Motifs tenfold...
as far as i know dude, they are the same. in this video i can tell there is a bit of verb on there. id be interested to know the patch to see or sure...
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #41
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Thunderkyss's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
I don't know about Sampletank 3 but I always found v2 to be... lackluster. So... this doesn't mean Sampletank 3 is a dud, but I just went though it's demo tracks and... they did nothing for me. Switched to the Integra 7 demo tracks... definitely sounds better to me. There's no doubt about it. I will admit that I'm a fan of the Roland ROMpler sound though.

However, as I said earlier this week in another Roland ROMpler thread, ROMplers shed value very quickly. Soon there will be an Integra 8 and we'll see 7s going for $800 on eBay.
At that point, I'll get one. Come onnnnn Integra 8.

Still, we're talking about vs Software. How much will Sampletank 3 be worth when they come out with Sampletank 4?
Old 8th August 2014
  #42
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Quantum7's Avatar
I've already tried out ST3 at a friend's house and like him, am completely dumbfounded why IKM even released this. I can't speak for dance or hip-hop music, but if I were only to choose between ST3 and the 5080 to compose my next New-Age album, without question I would choose the 5080. I owned a 5080 years ago, but do not own an Integra, so I can only imagine how much nicer the Integra is even..
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #43
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by muziksculp View Post
I would rather get something that sounds better, has more sounds, and offers a VST editor.
Make sure you do a lot of research on the VSTi editor. I had a SonicCell and the editor was pretty wonky.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #44
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mike vee's Avatar
The V2 VST editor is nothing like any previous Roland VST editor. What you need to know is that it's VST3 - so that may limit certain DAW usage, I dunno. For me it's absolutely flawless - really amazing.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #45
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by muziksculp View Post
Hi keybdwizrd,

I have a Motif XF7. So, the Motif XS Rack is not on my list.

I would love to see Yamaha make a new sound module, that offers better, and more sounds than the Integra 7, but I kind of lost hope in Yamaha making anything exciting after the XF.

Thanks,
Muziksculp
Wut the wut?

I'm honestly a little confused. No offense, but it sounds like you're more interested in hoarding sounds than playing them. If you've got an XF7, I'd say you're done. Is the Integra 7 going to give you that much better quality? Or any better quality at all? How many sounds do you need?

Granted, I don't have direct experience owning an XF7, but my brother owns one and I found it to sound very good. I've had a number of Roland ROMplers and I thought they were good as well... different. Maybe less "hi-fi" sounding and a bit more... character? Hard to say without a direct a-b which I never did. I'm just going from memories of initial impressions.

So... maybe the Integra is a little better... or just another company's take on a pro level ROMpler. If I were you I'd forget both the Integra 7 and Sampletank 3. Keep my XF7 and wait until Integra 7 prices plummet and then see if you still G.A.S. for one. In the meantime, get Kontakt and maybe a few good commercial libraries for it as they're going to give you an extra level of realism you won't get from a ROMpler and I think it's better than Sampletank 3.

Or better yet, find yourself a nice analog to complement the XF7. That way a truly new sound is a knob tweak away at all times.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #46
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mike vee's Avatar
I disagree. I had a motif and the Integra blows it out of the water in ever single aspect. I had the older 6 but I have played the XS and XF for many hours. The difference is not subtle. If anything, sell that MOTIF BEFORE it plummets to nothing (which it will, the market is already saturated) and get the Integra for "free." Plus, you are sequencing with the computer anyway, so if you really need the motif that badly grab the XS rack. Just a tiny bit older than the XF but from what I understand 95% the same.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #47
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
Never a bigger bunch of BS has been spoken on this forum.
You should try reading your own posts. They're often doosies!


Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
First of all, the last Roland rack rompler came out like 12 years ago so I doubt you have any worry of an "Integra 8" anytime soon.
Yeah, I guess it seems like it wasn't that long ago... how times flies. Maybe I'm confused because when they did release a new one, they loaded it up with all their old content. Yeah, I know it has new stuff too, and trust me it sounds good but... well a large portion of it is rehashed. Not that there's anything necessarily wrong with that, I do like the old sounds, but nothing I've heard from the Integra 7 makes me feel it's 12 years more advanced than the XV-5080.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
Second, software is worthless IMMEDIATELY, how that for value?
FALSE. Secondary market price and value are two different things. If you get good use out of your software than you extract value from it. If you're looking for B.S. statements, this is as good as it gets. Do not think that the Integra 7 isn't a computer, keyboard, DAC and software.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
Third, if you can build a computer with DAW, midi controller and sample tank that will run 16 tracks OF sample tank with zero latency at 24/96 (as the Integra does) well GOOD LUCK! It's such a lame comparison anyway - the dude already has a computer...so who cares about this dumb ass scenario? Also, again, you wanna talk value? A computer is worthless as soon as you build it unless it's a Mac since the fanbois will buy anything Mac even used - so I'd assume Macs have a decent resale value. But, wow! He didn't say hes looking SELL anything did he? He's looking to MAKE MUSIC.
I brought that up merely as an example. Again, secondary market and value are two different things that you seem to be confusing. I paid about $2K for an eight core G5 Powermac back in the day and only recently retired it and I'll tell you that G5 wasn't far off from modern computers. It's only crime was using a processor that was no longer supported by modern software. So, while it was worth hardly anything in the used computer market, the fact that I did a lot of good work on it up until about a year ago made it very valuable to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
Anyway, anyone knows that a dedicated PC library CAN be better than any hardware rompler simply because of the sheer file size that is possible. but anyone also knows that you can have issues running that many tracks on a computer with 40 GB samples loaded up. You would need a TOP 6 core xeon computer with 64GB of RAM costing closer to 4K with all SSDs and all that to properly reproduce with the Integra does - and even then you cannot because you still wouldnt have access to the XV-5080 and all of it's cards. Also, getting all the best sample libraries for a computer will cost you a ton - and again be completely worthless once you buy them.
Worthless, but not valueless. Again, you might want to look up those words in the dictionary. My cat, the late Mewberta, cost me a few grand the last week of her life in medical bills. Of course, there was a few dozen cats in a shelter a couple of miles away that I could have walked out the door with for nothing. In fact, I did get a stray kitten for nothing (some people actually paid to have her neutered and never returned for her) after Mewberta died. I'd probably do the same thing for the new cat. They are without monetary worth, but very valuable.

I'll also say that unless you're doing heavy duty orchestral scoring, I couldn't imagine running 40 gigs of samples at one time. Also, if you took the time to read the original post, the OP is already considering a software solution so he's obviously fine with it. A smart producer will use RAM where it does most good, ie, you're obviously going to want a large instrument with lots of articulations if it's a featured solo instrument, but if you've got basic string swells going on in the background, those can be a lot smaller. It's not like you're going to load up a full violin sample based instrument for each instance of a violin in your virtual orchestra.

That said, the hardware ROMplers we're talking about do really well with little resources. A big part of it is great sound design and high quality effects. I sold my XV-5050 when I put it up against software ROMplers but I disabled their internal effects and used high quality VSTs instead. The difference was amazing. Even the lowly Dimension Pro comes alive when you run it through high quality software effects. Try it some time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
I just got the Integra and I promise it will blow you away. The fact that you can get it 500 below retail (USED) is even better! I got mine new for 1640.

Plus, this is GEARSLUTZ - the piece is sexy! "Good morning, baby"

.
Oh, I've listened to a ton of Integra 7 examples and I've yet to be blown away. Is it good? Yes. No doubt. If money was no object there's no doubt I'd pick one up. The thing, for me, is that when I use "real" acoustic instruments, they're usually guitars and bass guitars and I play them. So I don't have a huge need for realistic acoustic instruments that seem to be the focus of the "Supernatural" sounds. Kontakt more than takes care of what I need. For synth sounds I usually use actual analogs for those types of sounds, and software synths for FM, Wavetable, Physical Modeling, Resynthesis, Additive and other types of digital synthesis.

So... that's why I don't own an Integra 7 and probably never will. If I were playing live again, yes, I'd most likely get one because I do value having a large selection of sound that loads up instantly in a roadworthy case. That's not what the OP is asking for though. He stated he's looking for
Quote:
"the best option as far as Module Romplers go."
Is that the Integra 7? I'm not even sure. Maybe it's the Kronos. I haven't done enough comparison shopping to tell. I had a friend who used to hate the Roland ROMplers, so part of it is a matter of personal taste.

...and finally, he's comparing it to Sampletank 3, which IMO isn't the best of it's kind. So he's fine with using software, I'm just suggesting that if he's going to put the Integra 7 up against a software solution, first research what the best software solution is.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #48
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WozNYC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
I do like the old sounds, but nothing I've heard from the Integra 7 makes me feel it's 12 years more advanced than the XV-5080.
I think you need to take a better listen to the Integra 7 if you really think that. The SuperNatural acoustic and synth stuff is light years beyond what the XV-5080 was capable of.
Old 8th August 2014
  #49
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i haven't tried either so take this with a grain of salt, but i'd take the integra. sampletank 2 was the worst of that generation of software romplers i've tried (hypersonic2, dimension pro, sampletank 2.5.) it was still solid and useful though, miroslav and sampletron made it much better than factory IMO.

that said the demos i've heard sound good, i need a 64 bit rompler and this being the real world where money is a factor i'm probably getting sampletank 3 and the fa-06 (kind of a stripped own integra.)
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #50
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mike vee's Avatar
i have no time to read that - i'd rather play with my new Integra
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #51
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
i have no time to read that - i'd rather play with my new Integra [and yet I'm looking at Gearslutz instead...]
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #52
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mike vee's Avatar
actually i'm at work and of course i really read it - i am glad you are a fellow animal lover.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #53
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stimmt View Post
Thanks Mike Vee! But you know what I have found out. The SN E-Pianos on the Jupiter 80 sound even bigger than Integra. Don't know why, maybe increased DSP Voices or just bigger Sound Stage. Check out from 1:02 in this VID:



Freaking Amazing! Smokes Motifs tenfold...
Exactly the same as the Integra.
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #54
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DNGmaestro View Post
Exactly the same as the Integra.
I think they really mis-marketed that keyboard man. It should have just been an Integra Keys with sequencer and without the Jupiter name and colors. It would have been a lot more classy and respectable. I would have looked at it right away, but the Jupiter name turned me off from the get-go. even just watching that video, the rompler sounds coming from a jupiter colored keyboard is just so lame - but imagine an integra color themed unit...and the XV sounds on board
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #55
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
I think they really mis-marketed that keyboard man. It should have just been an Integra Keys with sequencer and without the Jupiter name and colors. It would have been a lot more classy and respectable. I would have looked at it right away, but the Jupiter name turned me off from the get-go. even just watching that video, the rompler sounds coming from a jupiter colored keyboard is just so lame - but imagine an integra color themed unit...and the XV sounds on board
Yes they did. However, i think people are too stuck up with names.. They disregarded it in general based on the name.

Regardless, the Jupiter-80 is one of the most amazing sounding synths ever made and was always unfairly (ignorantly) received.
Old 8th August 2014
  #56
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Dont know he integra but Im sure its great but have you thought of a V-Synth? I just found out about them as for some stupid reason Ive previously relied on software for this type of thing. Apart from a couple, to me, a waste of time. V-synth XT
Old 8th August 2014 | Show parent
  #57
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mike vee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DNGmaestro View Post
Yes they did. However, i think people are too stuck up with names.. They disregarded it in general based on the name.

Regardless, the Jupiter-80 is one of the most amazing sounding synths ever made and was always unfairly (ignorantly) received.
well, that's the world you can't change it. them changing the name would have been the smart thing to do. it's not too late! re-issue as integra keys with the XV sounds.
Old 9th August 2014 | Show parent
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee View Post
well, that's the world you can't change it. them changing the name would have been the smart thing to do. it's not too late! re-issue as integra keys with the XV sounds.
You're right. But that's kind of what they did with the FA series.
The next step would be a flagship FA.

But the Jupiter-80 works in a different way than the Integra.
The base engine is the same but the effect routings are different and more flexible.
Old 9th August 2014 | Show parent
  #59
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muziksculp's Avatar
 

Hi,

Thanks for all the feedback.

OK... I decided to get the Roland Integra 7. Most likely around the end of Sept.

I will post some demos, and feedback about the Integra 7, after spending some time discovering, experimenting, and playing it for a while.

Cheers,
Muziksculp
Old 9th August 2014 | Show parent
  #60
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Miiko's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by muziksculp View Post
Hi,

Thanks for all the feedback.

OK... I decided to get the Roland Integra 7. Most likely around the end of Sept.

I will post some demos, and feedback about the Integra 7, after spending some time discovering, experimenting, and playing it for a while.

Cheers,
Muziksculp
You chose....wisely.
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