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A new analog mono: Hypersynth Xenophone!
Old 1st January 2014
  #331
tone sounds better to me than DSI

£600 is not bad IMO for the feature set

I think its a very interesting piece...
Old 1st January 2014
  #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWAN808 View Post
tone sounds better to me than DSI

£600 is not bad IMO for the feature set

I think its a very interesting piece...
except it's not going to be that price because of tax
Old 1st January 2014
  #333
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Exactly. More like £750+ when UK customs get hold of it, and they will probably take it apart and have a look inside for some black tar considering where it's coming from :-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkR View Post
except it's not going to be that price because of tax
Old 1st January 2014
  #334
from hypersynth site
Depending on your location, the units will come from UAE, UK
does that mean they'll be holding stock in uk so customs wont come into it when buying from uk?
Old 1st January 2014
  #335
I thought its $800? + 23% $984 = around £600?
Old 2nd January 2014
  #336
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well it's 11% cheaper for pre order, normally it's 899 with 50 shipping
Old 2nd January 2014
  #337
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkR View Post
well it's 11% cheaper for pre order, normally it's 899 with 50 shipping
so that £675...am I missing something? How did it get to 750?
Old 2nd January 2014
  #338
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Well the 750 looked like an estimation to me, the actual total for Europe seems like it would be $1158, which would make it just under 700 at £698 and €841.

It is certainly out of the 'interesting' price range with the rest of the brilliant analogue synths on the market now, you could get a microbrute, dark energy and have change for a korg volca or nice effect/s pedal/s for the same price which would make for much more interesting results.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #339
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkR View Post
Well the 750 looked like an estimation to me, the actual total for Europe seems like it would be $1158, which would make it just under 700 at £698 and €841.

It is certainly out of the 'interesting' price range with the rest of the brilliant analogue synths on the market now, you could get a microbrute, dark energy and have change for a korg volca or nice effect/s pedal/s for the same price which would make for much more interesting results.
not interested in a microbrute and volca personally...

I still dont quite get the shipping...if its coming from the UK why would we have to pay duty and vat to the courier?
Old 2nd January 2014
  #340
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Although i started this thread out if interest and enthusiasm revolving this new synth - i gotta say i'm feeling less and less confident in getting one. The whole shipping thing, warranty (in case it'll need repairing) etc seems just too risky. The sound is good - though not amazing, at the end of the day. Now, apples vs oranges - but i rather add some money and get the A4 with its new OS 1.1b, which i can buy from a local dealer, i have someone to go to in case something happens, and as a synth it's much more interesting (and polyphonic). I know they're completely different, and it's not so much a direct comparison. I just came to a conclusion i'd rather add more money and get an A4 rather than make a pre-order of a synth coming from Iran, with shipping, VAT and the lot - un-known. Not feeling particulary adventurous at the moment...
Old 2nd January 2014
  #341
I'd love to pre-order one for the sheer fun of trying a new synth and to encourage synth builders from all over the world to show us what they have achieved!
But that would be my eleventh monophonic synthesizer (not counting the small ones like Stylophone S2 and bC9), and I really but sadly couldn't justify that purchase using my ratio...

Good look to Hypersynth nevertheless - may 2014 be your breakthrough year!

Cheers,
Bert
Old 2nd January 2014
  #342
I like the new layout. It's cleaner than the prototype.

A couple of questions from what I read on the site. These are mostly just my curiosity about the architecture.

- Are the oscillators VCOs, DCOs, Wavetables, or something else? (not looking to start a debate on merits of each, just curious). I'm assuming these are digital oscillators similar in concept to the Prophet 12 as most people take pains to call out "Analog Oscillators" or VCO/DCO.

- Are there really three usable tunable oscillators, or is the third one just noise? From looking at the front panel and the helper app, looks like OSC 3 is just noise?

- What does the CV input control? Is it actually two CV inputs with Tip/Ring for Gate and CV for all oscillators together? Or is it assignable to a number of things (like the modulation matrix, I see called out), filter frequency, etc? If it controls pitch on the three oscillators, and those are DCOs or wave, is the osc handled using an ADC? What are its ranges (like, can it integrate with the relatively hot CV from a dotcom modular?)

- MIDI Out: What goes out there? Arps?

Thanks

Pete
Old 2nd January 2014
  #343
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According to the specs, there are 3 *real analog* oscillators (each one with 6 waveforms), plus two subs, plus 4 types of noise. I guess the oscs are either DCOs, or have some kind of digital compensation/calibration for stable tuning. This is pure speculation on my part, however... for what I know, they could be pure VCOs as well.

I guess MIDI out is for patches and sequences.

I've noticed a kind of "bashing race" on this synth lately, perhaps fed by a subtle 'fear of the different' (see the instrument's name! heh); personally, I still think that it has all the right features, and it sounds good to my ears. Probably, the most interesting monosynth of the new generation. No, it doesn't sound like a Micromac, but then again, it costs about half of the Macbeth and has a million more features.
Yeah, leaving VAT out of the price equation was a bad marketing move... but thinking of it, there are other small manufacturers, like MFB, that let you buy directly from them - and in that case, of course you have to take VAT, taxes and shipping into account.

I like the concept and sound of the Xenophone a lot; I would have pre-ordered one already if I wasn't horribly broke. I still hope to get one when the situation permits. I wish this instrument great success.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #344
Quote:
Originally Posted by marino View Post
I've noticed a kind of "bashing race" to this synth lately, perhaps fed by a subtle 'fear of the different' (see the instrument's name! heh); personally, I still think that it has all the right features, and it sounds good to my ears. Probably, the most interesting monosynth of the new generation. No, it doesn't sound like a Micromac, but then again, it costs about half of the Macbeth and has a million more features.
I like the concept and sound of the Xenophone a lot; I would have pre-ordered one already if I wasn't horribly broke. I still hope to get one when the situation permits. I wish this instrument great success.
I agree to be honest. I cant afford one right now - but it looks pretty tasty.

It seems to me the people behind this synth could be making extra effort because they know of the perhaps additional hurdles they are facing. Or maybe its because they are ambitious - who knows!

But it seems like we have a very well thought out Mono with lots of capability, inbuilt fx and a full software editor. More capable than most on the market certainly with more features than most - at a price that is competitive or less than similarly featured...

yet people are comparing it to microbrutes, and giving it a hard time for posting a +vat price.

I think it could easily turn out to be one of the best new monos on the market.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkodaboY View Post
quoting from site
EU-Residents should normally pay (3.2% duty + 20% VAT)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkodaboY View Post
from hypersynth site
Depending on your location, the units will come from UAE, UK
Duty? The UK is part of the EU. There should be no duty.
And VAT is not the same in every EU country.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #346
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junosound's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by teceem View Post
Duty? The UK is part of the EU. There should be no duty.
And VAT is not the same in every EU country.
But Persia isn't, is it?
I don't understand the criticism about the price. If you order goods from an economic alliance (EU, states) but live outside of it, the tax from the alliance gets subtracted but you pay the tax of your own country. Hypersynth merely listed the price without taxes of Persia as they probably don't have to pay VAT as they export it.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #347
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Did you see what I quoted? Nothing about Persia, but about UK(EU)->EU.
And I believe Persia is called Iran these days. Unless you're talking about cats...
Old 2nd January 2014
  #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teceem View Post
Did you see what I quoted? Nothing about Persia, but about UK(EU)->EU.
And I believe Persia is called Iran these days. Unless you're talking about cats...
It's not relevant to list the UK VAT as it gets subtracted anyways..:
Persia -> UK (distributor, not recipient) | +UK VAT -Persian VAT
UK (distributor) -> countryX (recipient) | -UK VAT +countryX VAT
---------------------------------------------------------------
final taxes (VAT): -Persian VAT +countryX VAT

hence Persian and UK VAT don't need to be listed...
by the way, most online stores don't list the VAT of your country if your country isn't the same as the online store is located. The VAT of your country is your responsiblity, regardless if the product comes from the US, EU or from Persia. meow
Old 2nd January 2014
  #349
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I was talking about duty (in a EU context), not VAT (I just mentioned it because they listed 20%).
Iran - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
But maybe you're typing this from pre-1935? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia_(disambiguation)
Or Iowa? Or New York? (but probably not, since you say "US, EU or from Persia")
Old 2nd January 2014
  #350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teceem View Post
I was talking about duty (in a EU context), not VAT (I just mentioned it because they listed 20%).
Iran - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
But maybe you're typing this from pre-1935? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia_(disambiguation)
Or Iowa? Or New York? (but probably not, since you say "US, EU or from Persia")
Why do you make such a big deal out of it? It has a nicer ring to it and doesn't get associated with the current political climate as easily which would be in favor of Hypersynth which to me seems like a honest, dedicated synthesizer manufacturer. Or are you afraid of receiving a 'webben of ms destruggton' instead of a synth We all know Persia is full of them, even if not a single one could be found, and they are the only nation down there who has them including the accusating super-powers
Old 2nd January 2014
  #351
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I don't care about the political climate, I'm not a politican.
But I can see some entertainment value on forums. From now on I will refer to the US as "The Ex-European Colonies".
Old 2nd January 2014
  #352
I guess they should have stated taxes/duty paid locally and left it at that!
Old 2nd January 2014
  #353
Quote:
Originally Posted by marino View Post
According to the specs, there are 3 *real analog* oscillators (each one with 6 waveforms), plus two subs, plus 4 types of noise. I guess the oscs are either DCOs, or have some kind of digital compensation/calibration for stable tuning. This is pure speculation on my part, however... for what I know, they could be pure VCOs as well.

I guess MIDI out is for patches and sequences.

I've noticed a kind of "bashing race" to this synth lately, perhaps fed by a subtle 'fear of the different' (see the instrument's name! heh); personally, I still think that it has all the right features, and it sounds good to my ears. Probably, the most interesting monosynth of the new generation. No, it doesn't sound like a Micromac, but then again, it costs about half of the Macbeth and has a million more features.
Yeah, leaving VAT out of the price equation was a bad marketing move... but thinking of it, there are other small manufacturers, like MFB, that let you buy directly from them - and in that case, of course you have to take VAT, taxes and shipping into account.

I like the concept and sound of the Xenophone a lot; I would have pre-ordered one already if I wasn't horribly broke. I still hope to get one when the situation permits. I wish this instrument great success.
Hopefully my post didn't come across as any sort of bashing. I was looking for clarification for things I didn't see on the site.

The specs on the site just say "3 Oscillators with 6 Waveforms: Saw, Square, Triangle, Variable Shape Saw-Sqr and Tri-Sqr". It specifically calls out "Analog Drift" as a feature, which makes me think these are wavetable or otherwise DSP type oscillators.

Other features are called out as "true analog". Like I said, not making a quality judgment, just wanted to know what is what. There are advantages to DSP oscillators, especially if firmware updates are supplied over time.

Similarly, it says 3 oscillators, but it's unclear to me that the third oscillator is anything but noise. I have enough single and dual osc synths for now.

The audio demos on the site haven't helped me make up my mind just yet. I'm also considering building an Ambika (which is similar price range, but 6 voices) or something adapted from it, but am researching ways to make it more knobby before I embark on that.

Pete
Old 2nd January 2014
  #354
best to leave the politics alone otherwise you get an infarction like I did the other day (posting a link to an article saying how nice Iranian people are...)...
Old 2nd January 2014
  #355
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Psychlist - the very first words on the Xenophone page describe the instrument as an "analog mono-synth with 100% analog signal path". I would consider them seriously screwed up if they wrote such a description for a synth with DSP oscillators.
Old 2nd January 2014
  #356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
The specs on the site just say "3 Oscillators with 6 Waveforms: Saw, Square, Triangle, Variable Shape Saw-Sqr and Tri-Sqr". It specifically calls out "Analog Drift" as a feature, which makes me think these are wavetable or otherwise DSP type oscillators.
Definitely not DSP or wavetable oscillators. Almost certainly DCOs, however (hence the need for the Analog Drift parameter to introduce a bit of subtle pitch instability like the similar "Slop" parameter on DSI synths).

Incidentally, I recently re-acquired an MKS-80 after about 15 years. The "natural" pitch instability of the VCOs in the MKS-80 definitely warms up the sound. But there are times when you really want rock solid pitch. So I would almost rather have DCOs with a really good "drift" algorithm that would allow me to dial in just the right amount of pitch drift for a particular sound.
Old 3rd January 2014
  #357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
- Are the oscillators VCOs, DCOs, Wavetables, or something else? I'm assuming these are digital oscillators similar in concept to the Prophet 12 as most people take pains to call out "Analog Oscillators" or VCO/DCO.
DCO, that means no DAC in audio path of oscillators (no wavetables). The "Analog Drift" function makes it behave like VCO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
- Are there really three usable tunable oscillators, or is the third one just noise? From looking at the front panel and the helper app, looks like OSC 3 is just noise?
Yes. but the third oscillator can only generate Square wave.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
- What does the CV input control? Is it actually two CV inputs with Tip/Ring for Gate and CV for all oscillators together? Or is it assignable to a number of things (like the modulation matrix, I see called out), filter frequency, etc?
As you see in specification : CV-IN assignable to a number of things via mod matrix. But the hardware has the potential to receive/send gate (via Ring), even send out the CV using the same connector with selectable options in software. The final product may include these new features or they will be unlocked after OS updates.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
- MIDI Out: What goes out there? Arps?
Sysex (sending out patch), NRPN, CC. Arp and sequencer notes.
Old 3rd January 2014
  #358
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iman_J View Post
DCO, that means no DAC in audio path of oscillators (no wavetables). The "Analog Drift" function makes it behave like VCO.
Perfect, thanks for clearing that up.

Quote:
Yes. but the third oscillator can only generate Square wave.
Is the intent that OSC3 would then be more like a third sub? How do you tune it? I'm trying to discern a lot from the panel, but OSC3 is a bit of a mystery.

Edit: Just saw in the video that you tune OSC3 using the screen.

Quote:
As you see in specification : CV-IN assignable to a number of things via mod matrix. But the hardware has the potential to receive/send gate (via Ring), even send out the CV using the same connector with selectable options in software. The final product may include these new features or they will be unlocked after OS updates.
Thanks. So if I understand correctly, once you unlock the gate feature, I could use this like any other analog synth box and send to it Pitch CV and Gate to control it? I'm looking for a little clarification because DCOs aren't voltage driven typically, they're clock-driven. If CV can only be used for other mod matrix stuff, that's ok, just need to know that so I don't assume it can be used like my SEM or something and sequenced using my analog gear.

I'll trust your comment that sending out CV is possible with software updates, but I don't get how that could be done without additional HW, unless it's limited to 0..+5v.

Can the CV input be used to clock the internal arp/sequencer?

Final question: is XEditor a native / C++ app or a Java app? Some time ago, I ended up having to return a much awaited Mode Machines SID after a couple days with it because I won't allow Java on any of my machines, and their hardware wasn't functional without the software piece.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply here.

Pete
Old 3rd January 2014
  #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
I won't allow Java on any of my machines
I'm curious: why not?
Old 3rd January 2014
  #360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rimwolf View Post
I'm curious: why not?
Very OT, and not worth affecting this thread, so please PM for any follow-up as I won't reply here.

Nut shell: Java was the single source of every single bit of malware I had seen on the machines any of my friends or family had, or that I ran across. Once I removed it years ago, zero problems. My wife had a couple drive-by malware installs that were zero day Java exploits, even though Java was turned off in her browser and the actual JVM was kept up to date.

That was regardless of browser, and was true on Win 7, 8, and 8.1. Even the DHS (not that I trust their opinion) came out and declared it dangerous. Java was eventually updated to address many of those, but I simply don't trust it at this point. Plus, I get along just fine without it -- it has gone the way of other untrustworthy software like RealPlayer and others. Even Apple no longer ships with Java enabled on their machines.

http://www.zdnet.com/homeland-securi...aw-7000009713/
http://www.bits.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ecessary/?_r=0

Unfortunately, I do miss out on some cool software like Eclipse, but the lack of calls from friends and family has made it worth it

Pete

Last edited by Psychlist1972; 3rd January 2014 at 03:26 AM.. Reason: Added links
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