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tuning a pro5 rev 2
Old 14th October 2013
  #1
tuning a pro5 rev 2

Hi,

I'm attempting the osc tuning procedure in the service manual for the Rev2.

kind of stuck at the first hurdle.

it mentions to hold preset 1 button, then preset 7 button to deactivate auto tune.

then is says access special unison mode by holding preset1 and preset 6 buttons.

you know this works because unison glide will be deactivated.
my glide is still running which tells me that these selections did nothing on my unit.

does anyone know what i'm doing wrong? do i have to set the pro5 into a special mode to receive these hidden functions?
Old 14th October 2013
  #2
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Xero's Avatar
what firmware are you on? If you're trying to do the updated tuning procedure, you need to be on firmware 7.0

this is the updated procedure i'm referring to:
http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_B.pdf

you can always burn a copy of 7.0 for use in re-tuning and put back 6.1 if you prefer that. Riku's new firmware also supports the new tuning procedure, but I think he may have changed some of the key mappings in order to allow for more features - pretty sure his page mentions what the new ones are though.
Old 14th October 2013
  #3
Gear Addict
 

I don't really know anything about the tuning procedure or special modes, but I just tried what you said on my Rev 2 and unison glide is indeed deactivated.
Old 14th October 2013
  #4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero View Post
what firmware are you on? If you're trying to do the updated tuning procedure, you need to be on firmware 7.0

this is the updated procedure i'm referring to:
http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_B.pdf

you can always burn a copy of 7.0 for use in re-tuning and put back 6.1 if you prefer that. Riku's new firmware also supports the new tuning procedure, but I think he may have changed some of the key mappings in order to allow for more features - pretty sure his page mentions what the new ones are though.
thanks mate. this seems like a better manual than the one i'm working from.
any chance of a full upload?
Old 14th October 2013
  #5
@KevB,

are you hitting them at the SAME time or one then the other?
does the unison switch light up when you are in this mode?
Old 14th October 2013
  #6
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by golden beers View Post
@KevB,

are you hitting them at the SAME time or one then the other?
does the unison switch light up when you are in this mode?
Okay, I was in normal preset mode with patch 11 selected.

I held preset switch 1, then pressed 7. I then released both.
Next, I held preset switch 1, then pressed 6.

The unison switch lit up when I pressed 6. I then tried editing a couple of patches with unison, and glide would not work. I had to switch off and on again to get it back.

I think my Rev 2 should be as standard in terms of firmware. I have no reason to believe it has ever been upgraded, but I don't know for certain what version is in there.

Hope that helps.
Old 14th October 2013
  #7
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Westlaker's Avatar
Just get a Prophet '08, dude. Those stay in tune.




Old 14th October 2013
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by CfNorENa View Post
Just get a Prophet '08, dude. Those stay in tune.




yeeew BASTARD!
Old 14th October 2013
  #9
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by CfNorENa View Post
Just get a Prophet '08, dude. Those stay in tune.




Did you sell golden beers a Prophet 5?

Anyway, a Prophet 08 might need calibration too ...but wont give the same rewarding sense of achievement after completing it's child's play tuning routine.
Old 14th October 2013
  #10
it is done.

tuned. took me all bloody day but

i can actually use it! for making music with!!

for any future P5 rev2 users that had my problem, here's the solution:

don't bother with what it says to do in the manual.



1) make the patch shown in xeros link but turn off unison

2) turn down your pitch bend all the way down DON'T center it. i found that the pitch bend in center is unstable. put it on the endstop, ie. bypass it.

3) turn down osc2 mix all the way.

4) look at the trimmer locations shown on section 3-19 (diagram PA416 - PCB4 trimmers and oscs) in the technical manual - this is your guide

5) turn down all the voice volumes apart from voice 1 (trimmers shown in digram PA416)

6) hold 5 keys down until you hear a sound

7) work out what key is making that sound and then release all but that.

8) then release that and hold 4 new notes. while holding them, then hit C4, which will play. this is voice 1, tape the key down.

9) connect a tuner to the output (i did this by monitoring through cubase, using the stock tuner plugin) tune C4 to be exactly C5 on the tuner 523.25Hz, using osc freq A set to 4 and adjustment of master tune.

10) move osc 2 mix up and move the osc2 frequency to 4 and the fine tune to 0. they should be roughly the same note, unless your oscs are way out of whack.

11) turn down osc2, turn up osc1 - follow the tuning procedure in xeros link - just numbers 25-29 but DONT use an oscilloscope. use the tuner. get it to exactly C and 0cent and do adjustments using that tuner as a guide -tune 1 oct higher - ie c4 should be 523.25Hz c0 should be 32.70Hz - this will give you a usable range when you've finished.

use the 4-notes-held-trick to select the correct voice on all the notes you need: ie. C0, C4 & C5. tape them down as and when you need to, so you need 3 bits of tape.

12) do the same now with osc2 up and osc1 down.

13) turn the voice volume trimmer down and turn up voice volume trimmer 2

14) same for this voice and so on.



any questions feel free to ask.

phew!
Old 14th October 2013
  #11
Gear Addict
 
adhmzaiusz's Avatar
Never tried to tune a pro 5 yet, sounds like you've spent a lot of time on it. Isn't it possible to use the horizontal and vertical ins on a scope and tuning the lissajous in unison mode? Can't remember which synth I had to do that on but it was the only way to tune because the lack of voice mutings. May have been a jp8.
Old 14th October 2013
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by adhmzaiusz View Post
Never tried to tune a pro 5 yet, sounds like you've spent a lot of time on it. Isn't it possible to use the horizontal and vertical ins on a scope and tuning the lissajous in unison mode? Can't remember which synth I had to do that on but it was the only way to tune because the lack of voice mutings. May have been a jp8.
i had to mute manually by turning down each of the final level trimmers.
the pro5 rev3 has voice defeat which makes things easier.

i HAD to do it this way because my rev 2 machine wouldn't enter 'special unison' mode.

unfortunately normal unison mode changes the tuning.

so i did it all in poly mode, but one voice at a time. pretty simple once you've 'got it'

and regardless of what method you use, scope or tuner, you will still do lots of toing and froing between the 3 trimmers used for scale and tune on each of the oscs
Old 15th October 2013
  #13
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Xero's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden beers View Post
thanks mate. this seems like a better manual than the one i'm working from.
any chance of a full upload?
wish I had it all, I asked Riku about that, but he said rather than scanning the whole thing again, he'd only scan the differences from the older manual, that said, here's the "updated" parts of the manual:

http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_B.pdf
http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_C.pdf
http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_E.pdf
http://www.xero.cc/p5cass/P5r2_sec_F.pdf

This is from rev2 of the rev2 manual, or so I like to call it, haha. At some point it'd be nice to maybe get a pdf editor and chop/splice those pages into the rest of it

Glad to hear your tuning went well though - I take it you must be on an older firmware given the lack of the special unison mode? You've got some guts working on your rev2 - I'm afraid I'll end up dropping a screw driver in it and blowing all the SSMs or something, hah. I'm usually pretty careful about stuff, but the rev2 just scares me for some reason. I've worked on my jp8 before though, hah, but that's not loaded with ****tons of SSM chips.

i've heard of people doing the equivalent of the minimoog deadzone mod on the rev2's pitch wheel, it just creates a bigger "dead center" point. I believe the rev3 had more digital control over the pitchwheel so it was never an issue as much with the rev3. I had a near brand new pitch wheel and mod wheel put on and the whole mod panel was replaced on mine due to the old one being all messed up, so everything's near perfect at the moment, it's fairly stable when centered. That said, I'm not going to change it for now on mine, but if it ever becomes a problem I'm definitely doing the deadzone mod.

BTW, how exactly does it work if you tuned it with the wheel all the way down? Does that mean you can only pitch bend up now? When I first got my rev2, it was tuned with the pitch wheel all messed up, you had to put it like, in some random position, then it'd be in tune and everything would be fine. I guess whoever tuned it just said screw it and left it in whatever position? Hah. That's all fixed now. I do feel like one of my voices envelopes or filter's is slightly different from the rest - i'd be interested in recalibrating that at some point, but for now its fine, just adds 'character' hahaha.
Old 15th October 2013
  #14
It works fine with the pitch wheel down. Yes you can't bend down on the unit itself, but you can over midi.

Yea got my pitch very much in tune using my adapted method yesturday. Very curious to see if its still in tune today! Once it's had a 'cool down'.

I must have an early firmware version. The board says rev 2.0. One hidden function that does work for me is A440 osc. (Preset 1+2).
Old 31st January 2019
  #15
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sleepwalker's Avatar
 

Holy **** golden beers. Thank you so much for posting this. I've never figured out how to tune my P5 so I've paid a couple times to have it done. I tried to follow the manual, but got a spark when probing and decided to never try anything like that again. I'll make a YouTube video at some point to help anyone that needs to do this in the future.

I am a bit confused by these steps:

"9) ...tune C4 to be exactly C5 on the tuner 523.25Hz, using osc freq A set to 4 and adjustment of master tune.

10) move osc 2 mix up and move the osc2 frequency to 4 and the fine tune to 0. they should be roughly the same note, unless your oscs are way out of whack."

If I set the Osc Freq to 4, I can't get 32hz on C0 and 523Hz on C4. If Osc Freq is 0, then these are good and the keyboard eventually matches the rest of my keyboards.

Anyway, I'm in love with the synth again. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by golden beers View Post
it is done.

tuned. took me all bloody day but

i can actually use it! for making music with!!

for any future P5 rev2 users that had my problem, here's the solution:

don't bother with what it says to do in the manual.



1) make the patch shown in xeros link but turn off unison

2) turn down your pitch bend all the way down DON'T center it. i found that the pitch bend in center is unstable. put it on the endstop, ie. bypass it.

3) turn down osc2 mix all the way.

4) look at the trimmer locations shown on section 3-19 (diagram PA416 - PCB4 trimmers and oscs) in the technical manual - this is your guide

5) turn down all the voice volumes apart from voice 1 (trimmers shown in digram PA416)

6) hold 5 keys down until you hear a sound

7) work out what key is making that sound and then release all but that.

8) then release that and hold 4 new notes. while holding them, then hit C4, which will play. this is voice 1, tape the key down.

9) connect a tuner to the output (i did this by monitoring through cubase, using the stock tuner plugin) tune C4 to be exactly C5 on the tuner 523.25Hz, using osc freq A set to 4 and adjustment of master tune.

10) move osc 2 mix up and move the osc2 frequency to 4 and the fine tune to 0. they should be roughly the same note, unless your oscs are way out of whack.

11) turn down osc2, turn up osc1 - follow the tuning procedure in xeros link - just numbers 25-29 but DONT use an oscilloscope. use the tuner. get it to exactly C and 0cent and do adjustments using that tuner as a guide -tune 1 oct higher - ie c4 should be 523.25Hz c0 should be 32.70Hz - this will give you a usable range when you've finished.

use the 4-notes-held-trick to select the correct voice on all the notes you need: ie. C0, C4 & C5. tape them down as and when you need to, so you need 3 bits of tape.

12) do the same now with osc2 up and osc1 down.

13) turn the voice volume trimmer down and turn up voice volume trimmer 2

14) same for this voice and so on.



any questions feel free to ask.

phew!
Old 1st February 2019
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepwalker View Post

"9) ...tune C4 to be exactly C5 on the tuner 523.25Hz, using osc freq A set to 4 and adjustment of master tune.

10) move osc 2 mix up and move the osc2 frequency to 4 and the fine tune to 0. they should be roughly the same note, unless your oscs are way out of whack."
.
in step 9, i'm talking about the actual c4 key on the keyboard, you tune that to = c5 on a tuner.

in step 10 i'm talking a bout the knobs. turn frequency knob (of osc 2) to number 4 and turn the fine tune knob all the way anti-clockwise. this is just checking that your osc 2 is playing roughly the same note as osc1
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