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Old Akais are sexy - the ultimate Akai thread
Old 9th July 2019
  #1441
Lives for gear
The S6000 is a nice sampler, for sure, but I don't know how much they would really bring to a setup if you are already using soft samplers.
For the akais, I'd stick to one of the better mpcs, S1000, S1100 (those two are very pro andhave great sound quality) or any of the 12bits for something lofi.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1442
Quote:
Originally Posted by BHW View Post
a few post before you wrote that the s1000kb blew the E3 out of the water. Technically and sonically it cant hang with the E3 so this statements are total rubbish. The filter of the S 1000 is a joke compared to the E3.

Akai won because of large library and price etc. but this does not mean that this product is in any case better then a E3.


With all respect - please read more carefully before losing your mind. I absolutely love samplers and the EIII is certainly no exception. I have explained myself but you seem stuck in a negative loop. The endless rant about any digital filter stopped being interesting 25 years ago. I certainly know the shortcomings of the S1000 but I embrace them today knowing the art of maximizing the creative possibilities with more or less abandoned gear. Is A better than B? Perhaps not in the hands of C. If your agenda in 2019 really involves going PC vs Mac on the EIII vs the S1000 I can say one thing where the Akai is a true winner: It actually still works.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1443
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bitleyTM View Post
With all respect - please read more carefully before losing your mind. I absolutely love samplers and the EIII is certainly no exception. I have explained myself but you seem stuck in a negative loop. The endless rant about any digital filter stopped being interesting 25 years ago. I certainly know the shortcomings of the S1000 but I embrace them today knowing the art of maximizing the creative possibilities with more or less abandoned gear. Is A better than B? Perhaps not in the hands of C. If your agenda in 2019 really involves going PC vs Mac on the EIII vs the S1000 I can say one thing where the Akai is a true winner: It actually still works.

so here is one of your wise statements:


Quote:
Originally Posted by bitleyTM View Post

They competed directly against the E-mu EIII with this one - the E3 probably was twice as expensive but the Akai probably sounds better.
so you bought a s1000kb which is a useless piece because you can have the same product in a rack version, but how do i justify my purchase let post some statements so i can have my peace with this space killing rubbish boat anchor. else this makes no sense. why would someone waste so much studio space for such an useless piece?


then this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bitleyTM View Post

However, the audio quality of the S-1000 blew the EIII out of the water when it came out - which forced E-mu to rush out the Emax II to have a competitive product.

The S 1000 is a good product and a good sampler, still it makes no sense to buy the keyboard version as it has nothing to offer over the S 1000 Rack. Nothing! and it does not sound better and never will. The E3 is the King. And you think the Emax2 is a better competitive product for the EMU? All i can say is the S1000 KB is a space wasting piece of ****. It does not offer anything over the S1000. So it makes no sense at all to buy the KB Version. And to clarify things the S1000 is sonically nowhere near E3 because this one has a analog VCF and VCA.


Go out and tell some more fairytales.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1444
So while I simply was philosophical about how and why AKAI became the “VHS format” back in the day, your unique communication skills made you interpret this as something against E-mu.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1445
Lives for gear
 
Sam an huel's Avatar
On the Akai subject... I wonder if the optical option on S3000 is adat 8 channel or stereo ?
I guess its stereo since it's AES/EBU on the other side but didn't find its documentation nor the S3000 one, except from a company that steals personal datas. Thanks for your help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dickseacup View Post
For several years I've fought the urge to buy an S6000. Have never used a hardware sampler, not even sure what I'd do with it...but it's so sexy. Is it worth picking one up to futz around with or are there better options? Any particular configuration/options I should be looking for?
If you want to try a hardware sampler do it and you'll have your answers. But if you don't even know what to do with it, why bother ?
Don't be too convinced by what is written on Gearslutz, many strong opinions between passionate sampler's geek. That is fine but can possibly turn to be proper bull**** for newcomers to samplers, that hardly can see the big picture.

For saving sounds better to ditch the old IDE or ultra noisy SCSI drive, or put in a SATA one with an adaptor, you can mount a SCSI2SD but that is a good amount of money to add,you have to open it and DIY.

It's not instant magic or something like that, what do you plan to do ? Recording, reading soundbanks, sound design ?
Sampling from inputs or SCSI connected to a computer for file transfer ? Chopping files in a program like Recycle 2.0 and dump in the sampler (2.0 is last revision with scsi support, 32 bits only) ?
You might discover several limitations, with USB (if option is installed) and Ak.sys editor not working that good or proper nightmare.
Not compatible with 64 bits OS, unless using virtualisation software techniques or invest in a recently developed ASPI layer.
Check post #40 here: SMDI SCSI Sample transfer in Win X64 (who has the solution?)
Or keeping around a 32 bit computer dedicated to your sampler ?

You could try the Z4 too, Agents of Rush shows here a simple workaround (direct usb stick connection), and that is not doable with S5-6000 for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ6ZgmxYAk

Just some food for thoughts. Hope it helped.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1446
Quote:
Originally Posted by BHW View Post
then this:
I think it doesn't matter. It was his opinion, and he has every right for it. I think we don't meed flame wars over such insignificant matters as which sampler sounds better to someone. A friend who has E-III and E-IIIXP once told me the two machines sound near identical, with the filter having slightly more edge on the E-III. I never argued with him because one is a hybrid, other is full digital, neither i see point of arguing over his opinion. In fact i bought E-IIIXP and can confirm it actually sounds badass!
Old 10th July 2019
  #1447
No, but it wasn’t even my opinion: You see Keyboard Magazine and other important magazines during those pre internet days would publish analysis regarding whichever sampler best played back recordings of high frequency bells and stuff like that.

I don’t remember their 1988 conclusions but I bet they liked the S1000 a lot. And it was half the price of the EIII. And it indeed could play back such recordings on par or better than the EIII.

Synthesis functions were not so interesting in those days and analog circuits were often actually seen as less desireable. We’re talking late 80s / early 90s here.

In the related synth world people would trade in the JP8 plus cash to get the D-50 just for a (retro)perspective.

Anyway.

This made it a successful machine which - market and sales wise - indeed blew the EIII out of the water. Even the Synclavier systems took a beating.

The S1000 took over the mid to high end 16 bit sampler market at the time.

That’s what I have been trying to explain — so this is why E-mu released the Proteus and the Emax II (and the cheaper EIIIX & XP) in order to catch in on the monetary EIII losses. The EIII also suffered from lots of hardware problems and needed service to a much higher degree than the S1000.

Now that this has been explained the EIII was my own absolute dream machine for many years but I also experienced its hardware failures - which made me remember it as a beautiful machine that sadly was very unreliable. It was so unstable we sometimes even toyed with the idea of fitting an ESI-32 inside the beautiful casing.

But if you were to have a perfectly working EIII it is of course a way cooler machine than almost any Akai.

Now, I got lots of enjoyment from my “new” S1000KB because it gives me a little bit of that vintage hw sampler look and feel. I got it for free actually and when I made my ambient demo video the floppy drive didn’t work so those are just edits of the internal synth waveforms.

The floppy has been replaced now but this machine is of course not my go to sampler.

You see that... is the NNXT inside of Reason and if you want my real opinion — here goes; that one blows away every hw sampler ever made in every single aspect.

Which also is why I built the world’s largest Fairlight CMI library for it.

But I still enjoy my old hw machines on the side — and I still dream about a perfectly working EIII, just because it’s a wonderful machine.

Have I explained myself now? ;-)
Old 10th July 2019
  #1448
+1

Spot on. Akai S1000 essentially killed all the sampler market, including the sonicaly far far superior S-770.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1449
Ksp
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Ksp's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegreengold View Post
The S6000 is a nice sampler, for sure, but I don't know how much they would really bring to a setup if you are already using soft samplers.
for me loads , the s6000 is underrated as a workhorse and easily made to sound amazing through a desk , kontakt cant touch it even via the same desk as those akais seem to sum audio in quite a unique way.

The S5000/6000 is interesting as it feels to me like a sweet spot of limitations of memory but also modern workflow and it sums audio in a lovely way with its 16 outputs , into a desk its perfect for mix down and it does have its own sound but yeah i wish the s5000/6000 sounded like the 950 or 1100 or and old Roland but add some outboard and it sounds insane mixing 32 channel of midi via 16 outputs into a desk

what i wonder is dont people wack these akai's through spl enhancers and stuff ? thats when they can sound totally mental.
Old 10th July 2019
  #1450
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksp View Post
for me loads , the s6000 is underrated as a workhorse and easily made to sound amazing through a desk , kontakt cant touch it even via the same desk as those akais seem to sum audio in quite a unique way.

The S5000/6000 is interesting as it feels to me like a sweet spot of limitations of memory but also modern workflow and it sums audio in a lovely way with its 16 outputs , into a desk its perfect for mix down and it does have its own sound but yeah i wish the s5000/6000 sounded like the 950 or 1100 or and old Roland but add some outboard and it sounds insane mixing 32 channel of midi via 16 outputs into a desk

what i wonder is dont people wack these akai's through spl enhancers and stuff ? thats when they can sound totally mental.
I mixed a track back in the day all inside the S5000 (think apart from the kick and maybe bassline).

Will have to try the SPL thing on the S1000. Sounds great through a Culture Vulture though, the slightly muted high end gets a nice lift from the valves, stays warm but really crisp. Modern drum samples would be too harsh under the same circumstance
Old 11th July 2019
  #1451
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
I think it doesn't matter. It was his opinion, and he has every right for it. I think we don't meed flame wars over such insignificant matters as which sampler sounds better to someone. A friend who has E-III and E-IIIXP once told me the two machines sound near identical, with the filter having slightly more edge on the E-III. I never argued with him because one is a hybrid, other is full digital, neither i see point of arguing over his opinion. In fact i bought E-IIIXP and can confirm it actually sounds badass!

it is about his attitude. facapalms all over the place. he thinks he knows everything but knows ****.

everyone can his opinion, no problem. but dont play the sampler guru if you dont have a clue. and post 20 facepalms in one post.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1452
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bitleyTM View Post
No, but it wasn’t even my opinion: You see Keyboard Magazine and other important magazines during those pre internet days would publish analysis regarding whichever sampler best played back recordings of high frequency bells and stuff like that.
...

nice summary which you can find on many places on the internet. first you played the sampler guru with facepalms everywhere. telling the people the s1000kb boat anchor blows the E3 out of the water and a few posts later the E3 is your dream machine. You are a joke.

Old 11th July 2019
  #1453
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
+1

Spot on. Akai S1000 essentially killed all the sampler market, including the sonicaly far far superior S-770.

he was talking about sound!

So in this perspective he missed the topic entirely. Sonically there was much better samplers. But akai took over the market because of library and reliability. so this has nothing to do with his statement, that the S1000 killed the other samplers sonically.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1454
Lives for gear
 

Some people like myself like Akai samplers.Ease of use,sound that cuts through,price ectec.And this is an akai's are sexy beasts thread!!!!!!!Best chip on out if you come with an anti Akai sampler agenda.Kinda entertaining tho-carry on
Old 11th July 2019
  #1455
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goa-Dubs View Post
Some people like myself like Akai samplers.Ease of use,sound that cuts through,price ectec.And this is an akai's are sexy beasts thread!!!!!!!Best chip on out if you come with an anti Akai sampler agenda.Kinda entertaining tho-carry on
i like akai samplers. i have a bunch of them, they have their strenghts. but why try to play the sampler guru with false statements? if he has no clue it is better to shut mouth.

akais are good samplers and every generation of them is usefull in the studio.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1456
mp3
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Jones Sr View Post
There hasn’t been an Akai sampler that imparts any sort of ‘sound’ to the output since the S3000. Everything after that is mostly indistinguishable from a software sampler,
Disagree there. I could distinguish between my 1000/2500 (had one or the other for over a decade) and my DAW (Logic and then Ableton, and a plethora of different soft samplers, through a black lion modded MOTU) no problem. Sounded to me like a newer version of that characteristic Akai sound I was already familiar with from having owned or used several older models over the years.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1457
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by BHW View Post
i like akai samplers. i have a bunch of them, they have their strenghts. but why try to play the sampler guru with false statements? if he has no clue it is better to shut mouth.

akais are good samplers and every generation of them is usefull in the studio.
What a delight you are
Old 11th July 2019
  #1458
BHW
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by earwolf View Post
What a delight you are
thank you, you are too cute.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1459
Old 11th July 2019
  #1460
mp3
Lives for gear
 

Question: why are you guys' samplers in the water in the first place?
Old 11th July 2019
  #1461
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp3 View Post
Question: why are you guys' samplers in the water in the first place?
Wave modulation
Old 11th July 2019
  #1462
mp3
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by earwolf View Post
Wave modulation
Ohhh ok! Because that makes the filter sweep right?
Old 11th July 2019
  #1463
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Jones Sr View Post
There hasn’t been an Akai sampler that imparts any sort of ‘sound’ to the output since the S3000. Everything after that is mostly indistinguishable from a software sampler, so the reasons for using anything later would be ergonomics/creative reasons etc. If you wanted a S6000 I’d say the number one reason would be the latency (still being smaller than anything you can achieve on the best computer), and having all your sampling in one playback device separate from computer, with it’s own dedicated controller/screen (as opposed to the constant hiding unhiding plugin window hell on a VST). There are downsides though, the S6000 has no globalLFO like the S3000, so it’s hard to achieve any kind of smooth coherence of LFO on parts as it’s all keygroup based, a backward step in design I think. The S6000s gui can slow down a lot once you are hitting it with a lot of midi.

Having said this, considering the state of software sampling in 2019 I can see why someone would be attracted to the S6000. Just don’t go looking for a sound of any kind.
Everyboady has different ears i reckon ive heard such stuff on manymany occasions about the sound of the later akai's.Im happy to use my MPC1000 for its sound and workflow.Its got something other samplers dont quite have.Its a compact and raw no nonesense sound when used with the master compressor and eq.Bad ass tbh.Im usin JJos2xl now and it opens up the parameters nicely.The filter i never rated before is suddenly quite unique.Certainly no software sampler....In fact in many ways quite the opposite!!!
Old 11th July 2019
  #1464
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp3 View Post
Ohhh ok! Because that makes the filter sweep right?
Filter sweep? Filter sweep? How are you talk theses big talks and push broom in 7-11? S1000kb size of house but no windows. Can't even do flamenco.
Old 11th July 2019
  #1465
Gear Nut
 

I took this pic at a friend's studio recently.
Attached Thumbnails
Old Akais are sexy - the ultimate Akai thread-towerofakai.jpg  
Old 12th July 2019
  #1466
Ksp
Lives for gear
 
Ksp's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Jones Sr View Post
There hasn’t been an Akai sampler that imparts any sort of ‘sound’ to the output since the S3000. Everything after that is mostly indistinguishable from a software sampler, so the reasons for using anything later would be ergonomics/creative reasons etc. If you wanted a S6000 I’d say the number one reason would be the latency (still being smaller than anything you can achieve on the best computer), and having all your sampling in one playback device separate from computer, with it’s own dedicated controller/screen (as opposed to the constant hiding unhiding plugin window hell on a VST). There are downsides though, the S6000 has no globalLFO like the S3000, so it’s hard to achieve any kind of smooth coherence of LFO on parts as it’s all keygroup based, a backward step in design I think. The S6000s gui can slow down a lot once you are hitting it with a lot of midi.

Having said this, considering the state of software sampling in 2019 I can see why someone would be attracted to the S6000. Just don’t go looking for a sound of any kind.
i hear the s6000 / 5000's sound , its not an s950 but it does have its character and the filters do so i guess one of us is deaf or delusional.I am not sure which though i would like to think having spent 25 years working with every akai ever made i can hear the difference between them !
Old 12th July 2019
  #1467
Here for the gear
Appreciate the responses on the S6000. Out of curiosity, is the Z8 an improvement over the S6000? Smaller, loses the (very appealing to me for reasons I can't explain) detachable big screen, no clue about usability beyond that or any sonic differences. To answer the question about why I'd want a hardware sampler...just to futz around with, something different, maybe it'll trigger some creativity that Kontakt and Simpler/Sampler don't. Mostly, though, just because I'm a gear slut and suffer from chronic GAS.
Old 12th July 2019
  #1468
Lives for gear
 
Sam an huel's Avatar
Quote:
but loses the (very appealing to me for reasons I can't explain) detachable big screen
less sexy than S6000's but realtime control via the 8 q-links is one of the improvements.


Last edited by Sam an huel; 12th July 2019 at 03:04 PM..
Old 12th July 2019
  #1469
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam an huel View Post


Ergonomically how does that work, just put it in your lap? Is the cable long enough to move it comfortably?
Old 12th July 2019
  #1470
Gear Addict
 
Bilb's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Jones Sr View Post
the sampler doesn't physically vanish from the rack or table when you turn your attention to something else for a moment. I used to use Gigastudio and in some ways I much preferred the approach of 'dedicated' app (I had it on a 2nd monitor permanently) than the mess that is using sampler VST/AAX inside daws now.
Off topic but that's part of why I like Reason, it's so much less jarring to scroll around the instruments and effects on the virtual rack without clicking between VST windows (although you can still use VSTs if you need).
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