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Is the Jomox Mbase 11 an add-on to the Mbase 01?
Old 15th November 2009
  #1
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rids's Avatar
 

Is the Jomox Mbase 11 an add-on to the Mbase 01?

Wondering if the 11 is worth getting to compliment the Mbase 01. They seem pretty similar, but are they too similar to where it wouldn't be worth it to own both?
Old 15th November 2009
  #2
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Too Similar...

Save few more $, get Vermona : )

(unless you already have it)

Vermona DRM1 MKIII Kicks are very nice. I was actually shocked.
I was expecting a weaker sound, like some other analog machines.

Different sounding than MBase.

You occasionally see them used for $650... about 2X the MBase 11.
Old 17th November 2009
  #3
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rids's Avatar
 

Yeah, the DRM seems like lots of fun. Would love to play one, but don't have the extra room for it, actually for nothing, but I think I can squeeze the mbase. I guess if it were similar enough I could sell the other Mbase 01. Just wondering if the Mbase 11 would be overlap or complimentary in sound to keep both.
Old 17th November 2009
  #4
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I guess it depends what your preferences are. I had an MBase01 and found it to be totally useless. Also a DRM MK1, which never got used for anything. The Jomox Airbase99 was better, at least there was some midrange punch in the kick, but not really that great either. Now I've got a 909 as well as an 808 kickdrum module, and those two get used all the time. The kicks integrate themselves into the mix and punch through at the same time.
The MBase11 is almost the same as the MBase01, same tone at least. On a budget, I would rather get a 909 kickdrum module to have some midrange knock.
Old 17th November 2009
  #5
Bio
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I would replace the Mbase 01 with the Mbase 11, the new parameters are worth it.

For me it's a lot more flexible than a 808 and a 909 and you can create new sound than the allready overused TR sound. And you can even program dynamics sounds.

And the 11 can be really punchy with the Gate and Comp.
Old 17th November 2009
  #6
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I just bought one after hearing these..


DRIVEN MACHINE DRUMS: 24bit Electronic Drum Samples for GURU, EXS-24, and Kontakt in WAV, AIF

(download the free samples)
Old 17th November 2009
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bio View Post
For me it's a lot more flexible than a 808 and a 909 and you can create new sound than the allready overused TR sound. And you can even program dynamics sounds.
Well, if you consider kick drums with LFO pitch modulation, overdrive etc. flexible... I just remember skipping through the presets and not finding a single useful sound. Tweaking didn't do it either. I want stuff that works, and the 808 and 909 deliver. They react very well to processing, so there's no worry it will sound overused any time soon.
Old 17th November 2009
  #8
Bio
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The Jomox stuff work for a lot of people and react very good to processing too.

The Tr sounds I hear in a lot of records do sound overused for a long time allready for me, I am not worry at all.

I want creativity, and a lot of TR owner just want the sound they hear for decade.

To each is own.
Old 17th November 2009
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bio View Post
The Jomox stuff work for a lot of people and react very good to processing too.

The Tr sounds I hear in a lot of records do sound overused for a long time allready for me, I am not worry at all.

I want creativity, and a lot of TR owner just want the sound they hear for decade.

To each is own.
Whatever.
Old 17th November 2009
  #10
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jonnypowell's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bio View Post
The Jomox stuff work for a lot of people and react very good to processing too.

The Tr sounds I hear in a lot of records do sound overused for a long time allready for me, I am not worry at all.

I want creativity, and a lot of TR owner just want the sound they hear for decade.

To each is own.
Old 17th November 2009
  #11
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

It's been two decades!

Just in time for it to come back in style ; )

Don't know why, but I still love shuffled 909 low/mid toms. Must have been all that Hardfloor "Respect" in those formative years : )
Old 17th November 2009
  #12
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XAXAU's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by living sounds View Post
I guess it depends what your preferences are. I had an MBase01 and found it to be totally useless. Also a DRM MK1, which never got used for anything. The Jomox Airbase99 was better, at least there was some midrange punch in the kick, but not really that great either. Now I've got a 909 as well as an 808 kickdrum module, and those two get used all the time. The kicks integrate themselves into the mix and punch through at the same time.
The MBase11 is almost the same as the MBase01, same tone at least. On a budget, I would rather get a 909 kickdrum module to have some midrange knock.
I hear ya. I´m sending my Mbase 11 back after playing with it for a few hours straight. I can fart into a mic, drop it into simpler and make a better kick than the Mbase. Useless is the right word for it.

What units are you using?
Old 18th November 2009
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XAXAU View Post
I hear ya. I´m sending my Mbase 11 back after playing with it for a few hours straight. I can fart into a mic, drop it into simpler and make a better kick than the Mbase. Useless is the right word for it.

What units are you using?
That's what I thought, too. And I really tried to make it work, but couldn't even with lot's of outboard processing. Now I mostly use the 909. That drum machine has the most useful kick IMO, it's still the basis of most house/dance/trance/techno kicks, even if only hidden in some layered sample.
What I really don't get is why Jomox makes no attempt at useful presets. The vast amount in all their drum machines is weird, experimental stuff nobody is ever going to need/use. The 909 doesn't do much, but what it does is always excellent.
Old 18th November 2009
  #14
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Well it turns out my order at Nova for the Mbase11 was never processed.
Thank god for that.. I know I should always back up my own opinion, but without an opportunity to demo and hearing so much negative feedback, I think it's been made for me!
Old 18th November 2009
  #15
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rids's Avatar
 

From what I can tell, the 11 is going to be the same base sound. I appreciate the input. I think I'm going to get it because I enjoy Jomox kicks. Lots of fun can be had if you don't worry about getting the sweetest and tightest kick sound, even though I find it both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by living sounds View Post
What I really don't get is why Jomox makes no attempt at useful presets. The vast amount in all their drum machines is weird, experimental stuff nobody is ever going to need/use. The 909 doesn't do much, but what it does is always excellent.
Ok, this getting out of hand. It's obvious some people like to hear and experiment with new stuff and others like to stick with stuff that has proven to work time and time again. This is one of those topics that can go on and on about Jomox vs. TR. I much prefer 909 kicks to 808s. They cut like butter. But the Jomox kicks are punchy and unique. One of the best modern kicks out there.

It might be kind of fun to look at the wave of a Jomox kick next to a 909 just to see graphically if any differences are visual.

(BTW, I noticed you keep saying '909/808 module'. Aren't you talking about the actual TR units or do you use something else?)
Old 18th November 2009
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rids View Post

Ok, this getting out of hand. It's obvious some people like to hear and experiment with new stuff and others like to stick with stuff that has proven to work time and time again. This is one of those topics that can go on and on about Jomox vs. TR. I much prefer 909 kicks to 808s. They cut like butter. But the Jomox kicks are punchy and unique. One of the best modern kicks out there.

It might be kind of fun to look at the wave of a Jomox kick next to a 909 just to see graphically if any differences are visual.

(BTW, I noticed you keep saying '909/808 module'. Aren't you talking about the actual TR units or do you use something else?)

The thing is that the Jomox machines are supposed to do all your 808 and 909 kicks. And that's what many users claim. Same for the DRM1. Like "it's close enough". Which is patently false.
The 808 and 909 have punchy envelopes. The MBase hasn't. I can do much better kicks on my SH-2 or Littly Phatty. The Mbase is almost entirely sub bass. The midrange is weak, so it won't cut through the mix. It also doesn't mix in well for just the sub, I don't know why. If you crank up the pitch envelope to try and have more midrange it sounds like a space movie FX sound, but not like a kick drum. The final nail is that outboard processing won't help.
And the presets... every other one has these weird modulated volume LFO. Has anyone every heard a track that actually uses them?

To clarify it, I'm using a TR-909 (the whole machine) as well as an 808 kickdrum module (which is simply a box with the 808 kickdrum circuit in it, triggered externally).

All that said, I think the MBase888 can produce some good kicks. It has a nice attack and generates a good punch. But the sampled sounds hurt my ears.
Old 18th November 2009
  #17
Bio
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I think it's just a question of taste, I don't know why the Jomox stuff shouldn't work.

Oh, I never care for the preset, I never even look at the preset.

Quote:
every other one has these weird modulated volume LFO. Has anyone every heard a track that actually uses them?
You cannot modulate the volume with the LFO, what are you talking?

Quote:
Has anyone every heard a track that actually uses them?
There is a heavy use of it in "The Great Destroyer" by NIN, just for exemple.

There was a topic about the kick of this song, here is the answer :
You see, it work even for big producer like NIN.

Old 18th November 2009
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bio View Post
I think it's just a question of taste, I don't know why the Jomox stuff shouldn't work.

Oh, I never care for the preset, I never even look at the preset.

You cannot modulate the volume with the LFO, what are you talking?



There is a heavy use of it in "The Great Destroyer" by NIN, just for exemple.

There was a topic about the kick of this song, here is the answer :
You see, it work even for big producer like NIN.

Pitch envelope.

Industrial, maybe. That's not in the real of dance/trance/house/techno, not my cup of tea. If you want to do experimental get a modular system, sounds much better.

Also, NIN seem to use an XBase09, not the MBase. Like I said, the XBaise/Airbase is better. Not great, but better.
Old 18th November 2009
  #19
Bio
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Quote:
Also, NIN seem to use an XBase09
It's a 999.

Quote:
Like I said, the XBaise/Airbase is better. Not great, but better.
I had a 999, have a 888 and a Mbase 11, and for me the Mbase 11 is better than 999.

And very great for me. At least great enough for NIN.

Quote:
Pitch envelope
I think you mean the Pitch? and not the pitch enveloppe...

Quote:
Industrial, maybe. That's not in the real of dance/trance/house/techno, not my cup of tea
Ok , you start to realize everybody does not make the same music, good!

Quote:
If you want to do experimental get a modular system,
I have a 26U modular system, thanks.

The only tools I use appart from my modular is my Jomox stuff.
Old 19th November 2009
  #20
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XAXAU's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by living sounds View Post
That's what I thought, too. And I really tried to make it work, but couldn't even with lot's of outboard processing. Now I mostly use the 909. That drum machine has the most useful kick IMO, it's still the basis of most house/dance/trance/techno kicks, even if only hidden in some layered sample.
What I really don't get is why Jomox makes no attempt at useful presets. The vast amount in all their drum machines is weird, experimental stuff nobody is ever going to need/use. The 909 doesn't do much, but what it does is always excellent.
Yeah the presets were utter crap. Didn´t find a single one that I liked. And I couldn´t make a single kick to sound good, and forget about it sounding anything like a 808 or a 909. It´s truly false marketing.

Are you using a Roland TR-909 or a module of some sort? (EDIT: Missed that in your post, I´m tired.)

I´m currently playing around with the D16 Drumazon which is a 909 emulation, but I can´t get the kick to sound right and it´s not loud enough.

Do you have any golden tricks for me?
Old 19th November 2009
  #21
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XAXAU's Avatar
I want to be able to make kickdrum like this little devil, but I have no idea what synth I should start out with. I´ve got the compression and saturation plugins covered though.
Attached Files

AFLON.wav (689.1 KB, 2356 views)

Old 19th November 2009
  #22
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The xbase/mbase can nail these sounds quite well actually. The pulse attack gives you the zap and then you can tweak the body a lot with distortion, internal compression, low pass, pitch env, etc...you can even delay the initial pulse and get all sorts of tonal variations from it. It's actually pretty versatile and you have way more control than on the 909 and the 808.

The only thing you need to put in front of it is a processing chain. But that's standard/obvious I'd say. I hope you weren't expecting the jomox to sound like that out of the box. Maybe you can get closer with the MD layering 2 or 3 sounds, but you are still going to need further processing.

Another option you have is getting an analog synth with fast envelopes. The trick is to use a resonant filter with a short decay filter env. I like synths with filter FM so you can add another tone or distortion to the body of the kick. Usually vintage synths are less reliable under extreme settings so I usually sample some hits an then choose the best and trigger it from Live.

but given how thorough you were exploring the mbase I think your best bet is to buy the vengeance sample packs...oh let me guess, you already have them...
Old 19th November 2009
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XAXAU View Post
I want to be able to make kickdrum like this little devil, but I have no idea what synth I should start out with. I´ve got the compression and saturation plugins covered though.
A 909 kick and lot's of compression, long attack and fast release on a Distressor should do it. Plugin compressors are no use in this IMO.

I've shot out Drumazon against the 909 when I got it. No contest. In 10 years or so when CPU power is sufficient, component modelling may give us a adequate emulation, but for now the hardware can't be beat. I would rather use good samples. Or, on a budget, buy or build a 909 kick module.
Old 18th August 2015
  #24
Here for the gear
Stimming and Kollektiv Turmstrasse are among the famous house/techno producers who use MBase.

Stimming: "My bassdrum usually comes out of a jomox mbase".

Kollektiv Turmstrasse: "We are big fans of Jomox since so many years, and the reason for that is quite simple. Big, characteristic and analog sound. We appreciate the Mbase 11 so much, the tool has got only one sound and this is BASS! Almost every kick drum in our tracks comes from here; we are often laying an old dirty sample as a kick and the Mbase as a belly from below".

Layering a sample on top of it is common practice. I've talked with another famous producer who said he usually combine 3 to 4 samples to get kick sound.

Mbase can produce strong mid/hi frequencies too, but they sounds too aggressive, too 'old school techno' to me, so I prefer to layer sample of a real, acoustic, 'softer' kick, HiPass filter applied to it. I think this way you can create more interesting sound than with 909, overpriced just because of hype and rarity. Everybody say that 909 cut through the mix, but again, there's side-chain and EQ for separating kick from bassline. I'm not 'big producer', please don't take my advice too seriously. I just like long (or fast if you know it better) process of tuning MBase 01 much more than just sampling kick from vinyl that just works on dancefloor. Will receive Mbase 11 this week and I think will keep both.

Preset 37 on MBase 01 is good starting point for tuned kick, it play a tone kick with pitch going down, so you can very fast find a kick in key with tour track using midi keyboard.
Old 12th March 2017
  #25
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I use Mbase 11 too,it has such a good low end but when it comes to hi mid range as you said it's so thin and aggressive.I'm producing more house stuff and i need more punch.So i'm trying to layer it with another attack kick.But i believe that i'm not doing it perfectly.When i layer them with Jomox my kicks get lost in the mix and i thought Jomox is more for deep-minimal music.Actually i didn't talk before with an Jomox owner.Do you still use Jomox ?
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