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innerclock sync lock ?
Old 21st June 2009
  #1
Lives for gear
 
isham's Avatar
innerclock sync lock ?

Hello,

Who has the pleasure to play with this innerclock sync-lock stuff : Innerclock Systems - Precision Din Sync and Midi Clock Conversion, Synchronisation and Delay

I'm not even sure if it is already available although (asked several shops and not available yet, the creator seems very busy to answer as well).
thanks a lot,
Old 23rd December 2009
  #2
Hi there,
I have the SYNC-SHIFT MKII and if you run alot of analog gear synths and drum machines "TR808.,909,606,,303,,ETC this is essential,,,

being able to move beats and arpeggiator rythms around in real time is amazing and once you find a sweet spot just record it into your DAW and layer it and so on,,,you wont beleive how slack and lose ur Arpeggiator patterns were before being able to push and pull them into the groove that you want is a god send,,,

I had to get my from a SchneidersLaden

they are the only european distrubtor that i know of,,,,and a very good company to deal with

Latency never heard of it!!

Does'nt exsist!!!

Only rock solid Beats!!!

Buy one you will never regret it!!
Old 18th February 2010
  #3
Lives for gear
 
initself's Avatar
Can you use these to sync any MIDI gear, even gear without DIN ports?

Like, can you just use it as a great clock for all your MIDI kit?

mb

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJH View Post
Hi there,
I have the SYNC-SHIFT MKII and if you run alot of analog gear synths and drum machines "TR808.,909,606,,303,,ETC this is essential,,,

being able to move beats and arpeggiator rythms around in real time is amazing and once you find a sweet spot just record it into your DAW and layer it and so on,,,you wont beleive how slack and lose ur Arpeggiator patterns were before being able to push and pull them into the groove that you want is a god send,,,

I had to get my from a SchneidersLaden

they are the only european distrubtor that i know of,,,,and a very good company to deal with

Latency never heard of it!!

Does'nt exsist!!!

Only rock solid Beats!!!

Buy one you will never regret it!!
Old 18th February 2010
  #4
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by initself View Post
Can you use these to sync any MIDI gear, even gear without DIN ports?
yes. there are people using them w/the elektron stuff and making the arps etc swing on the monomachine very cool. there are some demos using the machinedrum on youtube as well if you do a search. saw it posted on matrixsynth a while back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by initself View Post
Like, can you just use it as a great clock for all your MIDI kit?

mb
i think so. apparently it works pretty flawlessly from all i've read.
Old 18th February 2010
  #5
Lives for gear
 
nofi's Avatar
 

yeah, I've played with one.

a friend brought his over once.

It was fun and pretty simple getting stuff locked up to the computer, and the swing feature was really cool.

probably going to get one sometime this year.
Old 18th February 2010
  #6
Yesyou can,,,,

i use it in my SP1200 midi in, to lock the midiclock to the Daw,,,,Awesome!!!

Cannot recommend this enough,,,,

if you are in to oldschool analog hardware this is the icing on the cake!!!
Old 18th February 2010
  #7
Gear Maniac
 
Rozzer's Avatar
 

I have a Sync-Lock. Possibly one of the best £300 I've ever spent in the studio. It sounds like a lot but I haven't had midi clock this tight since the Atari days.

I did a lil review of it here: Rozzer.net » Gear Review - The Innerclock Sync-Lock
Old 18th February 2010
  #8
Gear Maniac
 
Rozzer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by isham View Post
...creator seems very busy to answer as well...
Hmm, David was always extremely quick at replying and he even rang me several times from the other side of the world when I was having some problems with setup.

Have you got the right email address for him? info (at) innerclocksystems (dot) com
Old 18th February 2010
  #9
I was really looking forward to using hardware synthesizers; I bought a Prophet08, but sold it (partly) because of the terrible MIDI-sync from my DAW; it seemed like it was always lagging behind, made it very difficult to work with...


This product seems like something that might change my impression with hardware synths...
Old 19th February 2010
  #10
Lives for gear
 
isham's Avatar
thanks a lot for your feedback guys, I seriously consider this sync-lock as I have some external vintage machines I want to make in-sync and I don't like midi performances I'm getting, not tight enough.

looking forward to get one (in my very short list now).

Last edited by isham; 19th February 2010 at 10:57 PM.. Reason: typo
Old 14th March 2014
  #11
Gear Nut
 

I have an innerclock question for those of you with experience using a sync-lock-

The issue I’m running into, is that when I start ableton live (sync-gen II LE) everything plays and syncs perfectly.
I am using “zero latency mode” in the RME (monitoring off of inputs) and recording to ableton directly. (I call this the “tracking” preset in RME UFX Totalmix).
Everything sounds perfect and it’s all locked in (dialed in). So far so good. Everything works well and is locked solid if I record everything at the same time.

After I record the first pass, from here, I switch my RME totalmix window from tracking, to playback to listen to my recording.
Now, I am listening to the recorded music in Live. Everything still sounds great and totally in sync from the first pass.

So then, I want to record another track (let’s say from the Access Virus Ti2). I switch back to the tracking preset in totalmix.
While playing back recorded tracks monitoring from Live; the new tracks I record from the Virus are no longer in sync.
I'm not using viruscontrol at all; only running MIDI in from the innerclock (virus control has been a nightmare and I gave up on it).

To sum up: I can record my first pass (all my drum machines, system 100M, virus etc) perfectly when they are all playing at the same time.
When I want to add tracks however, I can’t seem to get my subsequent tracks to lock into the timing of the first pass. I can’t add any synchronized additional tracks.
Thanks so much for your help in figuring out my workflow. I would be so grateful for your guidance in getting my RME totalmix and Innerclock working together.
I've been wrestling with this for too long
Very sincerely yours-
Taiko
Old 14th March 2014
  #12
Have you looked at the audio recorded in the first pass to see if it's lined up to the grid?
You no longer need the Sync Gen IILS to record an overdub with your Virus right?


I record with the IILS all the time and haven't noticed this. I might use drums from Maschine, add a sequencer track with the IILS clocking, then overdub some softsynths.
There maybe a little latency in the audio, but you can pull it forward using Ableton's grid.
Old 14th March 2014
  #13
Gear Nut
 

Thanks Chris!

Thanks so much Chris for your reply.
Are you hardware monitoring off your interface, or software monitoring from Ableton live?

Even though I've been using the innerclock for a good while I think that I'm still murky re: some of the settings. Got to get my foundations learned!

I am not sure whether my innerclock-sync'd tracking is lining up with the grid.
In fact I suspect that it's not because of my lack of subsequent pass sync!

How can I continue to hardware monitor (so much more satisfying for me) but still have it line up with the grid...I think that it must have something to do with the latency (advance/delay/bypass) settings in the innerclock AU plugin?

I will be honest I have been playing with so many latency settings in Live, in the AU plugin, in Numerology, and in the RME interface that I'm about to cry, I just want everything to work Do I need to zoom into the timeline and count the number of samples, and then enter them somewhere? How low should I attempt to go in my RME latency settings in Live?

Thanks again for all your help as it's near impossible (so far) to find anyone in my region of the country who seems to knows any of these things!
truly thankfully for your advice- t
Old 14th March 2014
  #14
Gear Nut
 

While we're on the topic of innerclock I have a master controller question. Recently I purchased an Access Virus TI2 desktop module at a wonderful price.
The issue that I am running into is that it's cumbersome and uninspiring to continually make Live settings (midi to virus, virus audio to RME, etc) and I miss the immediacy of a dedicated keyboard.
Because I am using innerclock sync to the Virus via MIDI for clock, but still trying to get my master controller keyboard to control the notes on the virus, it's been a mess.
To compound matters I have an old M-Audio Keystation 88 with a broken MIDI port (only works via USB).

What would be ideal would be a midi controller with both a USB, MIDI IN and MIDI OUT port...so that I could run innerclock IN to the keyboard and merge it with notes that I play, with those two signals going out into the Virus.
I am sure that (as usual) I am overthinking this and that there's a much better solution. To sum up those, in true GS fashion I am jonesing after a new master controller that is way better than the keystation88.
That said there is a real lack of great boards on the market right now IMHO- the oxygen88 and AKAI mpk88 seem to be the main boards right now but I don't think either of them have any merging etc.
The other thing is that instead of all the crap on top (sliders, pads etc) I want a flat surface to place my virus desktop, KAOSS pad and ELEKTRON modules etc.

So- something with great midi functionality, merging power, a flat surface, modwheels, and 88 weighted keys is what I'm asking for (maybe I should ask for the moon instead
Thanks for your advice fellow GSz- T
Old 15th March 2014
  #15
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by taiko View Post
… when I start ableton live (sync-gen II LE) everything plays and syncs perfectly. I am using “zero latency mode” in the RME (monitoring off of inputs) and recording to ableton directly. (I call this the “tracking” preset in RME UFX Totalmix). Everything sounds perfect and it’s all locked in (dialed in). So far so good.

(1) What's your Sync Gen Sync Offset set to when using your "tracking preset" (direct monitoring)? Do you change the Sync Offset when you switch back to input/software monitoring via Live? (your "playback preset").


(2) What's your Overall Latency (i.e. Roundtrip Latency) in Live's Preferences > Audio? It's probably a good idea to tell me what Live says your Input Latency and Output Latency is too. If you can post a screenshot like this below, that would be even better for me:




(3) How are your Delay Compensation and Reduced Latency When Monitoring Options set? I recommend having Reduced Latency When Monitoring switched Off (un-ticked) at this stage, which means PDC is fully switched on. Delay Compensation (PDC) should also be on (ticked):



Quote:
Originally Posted by taiko View Post
I will be honest I have been playing with so many latency settings in Live, in the AU plugin, in Numerology, and in the RME interface

(4) I don't know much about Numerology. Is it running as a Rewire slave, with Live as the rewire master? It might be best to leave Numerology out of the equation initially.


Quote:
Originally Posted by taiko View Post
After I record the first pass, from here, I switch my RME totalmix window from tracking, to playback to listen to my recording.
Now, I am listening to the recorded music in Live. Everything still sounds great and totally in sync from the first pass.
Instead of switching back to input/software monitoring (your "playback preset"), after recording your synth's first pass, stay with direct monitoring ("tracking preset") and play back that newly recorded audio print of that first pass at the same time as re-playing the synth running in realtime/live and synced from the Sync Lock. Don't have anything else from Live playing, and certainly don't have any other external synths playing (keep the test simple).


(5) Is the recording of that synth AND the live sequence from that synth in sync? Do they phase or sound doubled? Or do they sound flammed or obviously out of sync instead?



Quote:
Originally Posted by taiko View Post
To sum up: I can record my first pass (all my drum machines, system 100M, virus etc) perfectly when they are all playing at the same time.
When I want to add tracks however, I can’t seem to get my subsequent tracks to lock into the timing of the first pass. I can’t add any synchronized additional tracks.

(6) When your RME interface is configured for direct monitoring ("tracking"), are you also input/software monitoring any external synths via Live at the same time?
[^^ this is related to question 1]


ALSO…


Keep things simple for now. Preferably a synth/drum machine with an internal sequencer that is just being clocked by Din Sync or MIDI clock (no MIDI notes or CCs). And only test one synth or drum machine at this stage.

It would help me if you could attach a short recording of the first 2-4 bars of that synth, where your "first pass" was recorded whilst using your "tracking preset". Lossless format only (wav/aiff), preferably recorded at 48k or 96k, and 120 BPM (here's why). Please also state whether there is any pre-roll recorded at the front of the audio file (and how long that pre-roll is, if any).
.
Old 15th March 2014
  #16
Gear Addict
 

I'm keenly awaiting the future retro swynx, am I right in thinking this is the only competition? Be interested to see some side by side comparisons when the swynx finally lands
Old 15th March 2014
  #17
Lives for gear
 

No, it isn't competition for the Sync Lock at all really.

Future Retro SWYNX - very similar to Innerclock Systems?


Expert Sleepers and SND Acme are direct competitors. Expert Sleepers is also the cheapest solution out of all three, in the UK at least.

Expert Sleepers is the only complete solution, but it has a steep learning curve. Sync Lock, and SND Acme (I think) are clocking only.
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