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I have joined the cult of Eventide H3000
Old 20th October 2016
  #1531
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
The ones in the first link have a patch to fix a bug.
Which patch to fix which bug, If I can ask...
Old 26th October 2016
  #1532
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Guitfiddle's Avatar
Joining the club

Still searching for my H8000a...Thanks Italo, and all you other guys for all the info!
Attached Thumbnails
I have joined the cult of Eventide H3000-20161025_231651.jpg  

Last edited by Guitfiddle; 26th October 2016 at 04:52 PM..
Old 30th October 2016
  #1533
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Alrighty then, I'll bloody say it - If you are getting new H3000 EPROMs from D/SX to D/FX please use Ichip3000 as simply his burns are not only well known, functional though contain no bad header data or back end crud. Remember this is Eventides IP though as its been somewhat left abandoned time being - I'm kind sitting here saying well...what option etc. Just do remember if you've got a /S sampling version often the mix of other burnt 28 pin and 30 pin EPROMs can be a touch messy etc, There's already a well known problem with certain battery types, so my point here - Seriously do your homework and if upgrading from SE and other early editions, yes, your going to need the trace and jump cut done! Make sure you don't have the H3000 board full of 512KB chips as often some 256K EPROMs not only work faster, though smarter and better with PEL Processors. For the battery thing - Google The GS Forum. Mostly it's certain Dallas battery (Plug In) chips and Software that it seems is simply slow, slower and/or not compatible etc. Do please check!

Regards
TLB
Old 30th October 2016
  #1534
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
Which patch to fix which bug, If I can ask...
A MIDI bug..apparent sluggishness and freezing on some machines.. The ones I have here are 256K too.
Old 31st October 2016
  #1535
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
A MIDI bug..apparent sluggishness and freezing on some machines.. The ones I have here are 256K too.
No, not really....there is no real Midi Bug so as to speak of on the H3000 range other then the simple fact that as the algorithm set grew in programming each new upgrade could become a serious midi pain. If, if you want to use midi and an H3000 then just make sure you know exactly witch parameters you want and are required.

The Difference:
In certain Eventide H3000 units their is a hardware Midi problem. This starts from the
H3000
H3000/S
H3000/B (BF and Broadcast Editions)
H3000/SE
H3000 all early units.

Basically on the back of the unit a cut and jump (add on) can often be required to boost the Opto Isolators on the back of the H3000 as they simply do not in many cases and have enough power, and yes it's a case by case scenario alongside a unit by unit scenario all to do with having enough power for: Midi In /Out /Thru etc. In these cases you must refer to the service Manual for the required fixes to make the H3000 keep enough power to transmit the Midi messages etc. now I've seen some seriously bizzare and odd rumours on the GS Forum so let's stamp this one out ASAP.

H3000 Midi Vs The PCM-70 Version 2.0 Stupidity & The Nirvana Trick?

Remember the "Fuss" made about the Lexicon PCM-42 and it's supposed "Limiter and Compression" type curve at a 6dB Slope after 15dBm has hit its overdrive circuit? Well it's the same thing here. All midi units of old used "OPTO ISOLATORS" to provide that tiny extra current that means you can drive your midi signal 30 feet not just 2 feet. It's only been in the last 10-15 years where the price and rarity of Opto Isolators became not only bulky though expensive where SMD devices took over and thus the older Optos where no longer required. Though can still be purchased in big lots.

Once again the same ordeal was made in the last 10 years of often idiot aficionados thinking that a Lexicon PCM 70 was only decent, good and working if it had version 2.00 software. This was clearly not the case. Lexicon and their PCM 70 Dynamic midi was anything save Dynamic and took until software version 3.2 to mature and fully evolve, though....hang on? Presets and Algos changed, well maybe, though none, none were taken away only added etc. Entering by hand a PCM 70 preset takes as much time as signing a hallmark card to the one you loathe, let alone the one you love!

Yes certain parts in units of long Run History FX Processors and Midi keyboards evolved over time meaning exactly that when the Eventide H3000 D/FX D/SE and D/FX Sampling were released these Midi problems had now been sorted out and later mature units don't suffer these same problems, as to Midi Bugs in the Software. No that's something I've not heard. Slow, scrambled, missing presets and Algorithims being skipped and or presets and patches doubled yes, alongside simply "Bad Burns" etc. Yes, alongside bad header data and no help options as they've been erased by a bad programmer etc.

Also guys, I've been hearing quite a few stories of people loading their H3000 units with full 512K EPROMs and this makes the machines slow and near overloads the four PEL Processors. Eventide EPROM kits come in certain sized banks from
256k
512k
And usually the operating system and Algo Eoroms are on different sized chips, this again is in the service manual, and So called Professional EBay EPROM sellers will sell you numerous kits of 512K EPROM chips, so please do check before buying that the 28-pin sizes (mostly preferred by sellers these days) that are....correct replacement kits and/or upgrades etc. Though lastly don't just read the operational manual, read the service manual as well. This units require a RTFM type attitude!

If anyone cares to expand on this please do so!
Cheers
TLB
Old 2nd November 2016
  #1536
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Space Station's Avatar
No I mean a MIDI bug caused by some EPROM kit's sold on Ebay that others have reported. As far as eprom sizes go on these DFX kits, there is no need whatsoever to use 512Kbyte eproms since the maximum file size is 256K on only 2 of the Eproms, and the others are 128k and 64K.
Old 2nd November 2016
  #1537
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Ok... that makes sense now.
Thanks for clarifying...
Old 15th November 2016
  #1538
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exoterrestrial's Avatar
 

1537 posts to check...
Better ask immediately .
Does anyone of you guys use software to edit the H3X00?
I have an H3500 myself and 2 H9's.
Editing the H9's is very easy using a computerscreen.
I'm looking for some midi software to edit the H3500.
Are some of you guys familiar with MidiQuest ?

Cheers,
Exo.
Old 15th November 2016
  #1539
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TheBrightSide's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by exoterrestrial View Post
1537 posts to check...
Better ask immediately .
Does anyone of you guys use software to edit the H3X00?
I have an H3500 myself and 2 H9's.
Editing the H9's is very easy using a computerscreen.
I'm looking for some midi software to edit the H3500.
Are some of you guys familiar with MidiQuest ?

Cheers,
Exo.
MidiQuest is the only working editor I know of, but it only works with one of the older software revisions (3000B maybe?) It won't work with later models or updated revisions.
Old 17th November 2016
  #1540
Gear Maniac
 

Ok I'm in. H3000 w/ full program upgrades and 11.8 sec. sample time. Fully gone through. Plugging in tomorrow for a first drive.

I am shaky and stoked I finally found one to these specs locally and pulled the trigger.

I may have a few questions for the experts moving forward.
Old 23rd November 2016
  #1541
Quote:
Originally Posted by MindMachine View Post
Ok I'm in. H3000 w/ full program upgrades and 11.8 sec. sample time. Fully gone through. Plugging in tomorrow for a first drive.

I am shaky and stoked I finally found one to these specs locally and pulled the trigger.

I may have a few questions for the experts moving forward.
Ooh, a sampling 3000! I just upgraded mine to the High Tide "kitchen sink" upgrade EPROMs last night. Actually I have 2 H3000s, one is an original black face (which I upgraded), and the other is a D/SE. Neither have the sampling board, though. Have fun!
Old 23rd November 2016
  #1542
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Space Station's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
Folks, beware of the "all presets BDFX" , "high tide" Eventide upgrades. It will cripple down your machine and make it sluggish.
I have the 'maximum BDFX preset kit' it made no difference. Just as responsive.

I also have the biggest sampling board.. so i guess mine is as maxed out as you can go...(well almost no servo/capstan control board!)
Old 25th November 2016
  #1543
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

For the H3000 fans...


The H3000 Swept Combs is a powerful multi-voice chorusing/flanging structure, featuring 6 modulatable delay lines. At the time the H3000 was released there was only another unit offering a similar algorithm, the Lexicon PCM70 CHORUS. Both are really nice sounding and powerful effects, delivering multi-voice modulation effects or chorus/flangers/delays combos.
Swept Combs offers more tweaking possibilities because each single delay line discloses every parameter to the user (level/pan/delay/depth/rate/feedback) and introduces the GLIDE effect which became a standard offering in later Eventide and Lexicon Products (300/Pcm80/81).
Gliding is a wide change of delay times with a speed control that will reduce any glitching artifact, making delay change slowly and smoothly in time. The difference with chorusing is the much wider delay range you can change a delay value to another, without noise and delivering a larger ratio modulation effect, typical of analog delays. Thus deeper flanging effects and "12 strings"-like chorusing are possible, with a very transparent tone.

You can create GLIDE effects by patching the Function Generator to the Glide Speed parameter and patching two Soft Functions (Knobs) to the Function Generator Func Amp and Func Freq.

Here are 4 audioclips showing the Swept Combs GLIDE effect, combined with a stereo delay created with 2 TC2290s using envelope modulation.

The first one is a 6 voice Glide Chorus tweaked for chords. The Glide is applied to the higher range of the delays settings to get a wide sweep ratio. Notice how TC1210 it sounds like, thanks to the large sweep ratio of the glide.
GLIDE HEXHORUS
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing

The second audioclip is tweaked for single notes playing. Very smooth chorus from this classic algorithm.
GLIDE HEXHORUS_2
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing

The third clip features a multivoice gliding flanger; delay lines use very short delay times here and the glide between min/max values is very fast. The flanger is rich and wide.
GLIDE FLANGES
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing

The last audioclip shows an "in between" chorus/flanger tweak, optimized for lead playing... pitch is modulated but notes are still very tight and the sweeping never gest in the way. A touch of feedback adds the flanging color.
GLIDE LEAD
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing

Long live the Mighty H3000!

Enjoy...
Old 25th November 2016
  #1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
I have the 'maximum BDFX preset kit' it made no difference. Just as responsive.
Press the program button, type 320 and press enter, press program button again, now turnning main dial going from preset 320 down to 260. Watch what happens once it reaches 300 area.

What's the matter Space Station?

Someone ate yer fingers?

Old 2nd December 2016
  #1545
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Space Station's Avatar
Hah not had a chance yet, but will do.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1546
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
Folks, beware of the "all presets BDFX" , "high tide" Eventide upgrades. It will cripple down your machine and make it sluggish. Not sure why that happens, but i've learned my lesson. My H3500 is no longer as responsive as it was when i bought it first time. Downgrading back to D/SE. I would never know this info if it wasn't for the friend's D/SE which i've tried and was surprised how fast and immediate the unit is.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...uOo/edit#gid=0
So you dont have the sampling preset anymore? I have a H3500 with DFX is that a problem too?
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1547
Quote:
Originally Posted by hearteh View Post
So you dont have the sampling preset anymore? I have a H3500 with DFX is that a problem too?
All that i can say at this point is that Italo and others were right about upgrades!
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1548
Gear Addict
 

I dont know what that means? Isnt the H3500 like that when you buy it? I havent upgraded but bought it used.
H3500 DFX-Sampling it says on the front.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1549
Quote:
Originally Posted by hearteh View Post
I dont know what that means? Isnt the H3500 like that when you buy it? I havent upgraded but bought it used.
H3500 DFX-Sampling it says on the front.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...en_US&hl=en_US

I bought an upgrade along with my early rev H3500 DFX. I never paid attention to speed. But one day i tried friend's D/SE i've realized how sluggish my unit actually is. So we put his D/SE eproms into mine unit and it became super fast. I know it sounds crazy but i'm telling you the way it happened.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1550
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...en_US&hl=en_US

I bought an upgrade along with my early rev H3500 DFX. I never paid attention to speed. But one day i tried friend's D/SE i've realized how sluggish my unit actually is. So we put his D/SE eproms into mine unit and it became super fast. I know it sounds crazy but i'm telling you the way it happened..
Ok I have the DFX that is second to the right.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1551
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
All that i can say at this point is that Italo and others were right about upgrades!
I bought a 'kitchen sink' upgrade kit when I got my H3000B.. I did the speed test, and there's no issues. Whew.. I guess I got a good one.

It's been a few years, but I think I got the one from 'scientific community' on the bay.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1552
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

There are other algorithms you can use GLIDE to get a different kind of modulation (much wider sweeping ratio/crystal sound):
LONG DIGIPLEX (mono delay)
DUAL DIGIPLEX (stereo/dual delay)
SWEPT REVERB
(similar to SWEPT COMBS as it runs 6 modulatable delays -the difference is it uses a MULTIPLEX to manage the 6 feedbacks in a matrix recirculating all fbacks back to each single delay line).

I have been using the H3000 since 1992 and have talked to hundreds of users at any level, including several world class studios engineers; never ever I heard of anybody using the GLIDE as an effect rather than just a way to change delay in great amounts avoiding artifacts. Even at the factory... nobody did that!
So.. what I mean is that there is a lot to explore in it as a source for new sounds not exactly known to most. There is no factory preset based on GLIDE... in 1000 presets available on board.
The key to use GLIDE is very simple:
-patch m_delay (or the single delay line(s) in the Digiplex algorithms) to the Function Generator (simply a system resident LFO). This will sweep the m_delay parameter.
-patch Function Amp (that's the F_Gen Amount parameter) to a SOFT FUNCTION*. The H3000 allows patching parameters to 4 SOFT FUNCTIONS which are simply custom parameters that will show up on the display once a patch is created. It's like having 4 Soft Knobs assigned to parameters. This patch will control how much you are sweeping the m_delay.
patch
-patch Glide Sp (speed) to another SOFT FUNCTION**. This will control how fast the GLIDE will run. You will find lower speeds sounding better.
-patch Func Freq. (the Function Generator rate) to a third SOFT FUNCTION***. This will control how fast the m_delay is being swept.
Your display will show 3 new parameters. Choose names for them. Maybe GLdepth*/GLrspeed**/GLrate***... that's ALL you'll need to use to make your presets, once you have set your 6 delays as you want.
If you use a low GLdepth by using the soft knob to shift the modulation to the lower end of m_delays (between 0% and 30% with delays set no longer than 10 ms - offset them for richer effects) you'll get tight chorusing/flanging effect... use feedback to enhance that.
Using the soft knob ro shift the m_delay to a higher sweeping range (60% to 100% with delays set between 15 and 35 ms), you'll get TC1210 chorusing.
One peculiat thing here... when you use the GLIDE as explained you won't be able to hear the single delays LFOs. Looks like there is some kind of processing priority here as GLIDE takes over single LFOs. Maybe some limitations in the power split across the 3 internal DSPs or just the way the algorithm is designed. On the PCM80/81 CHORUS you can use the GLIDE AND the 6 individual LFOs to create a very rich multiple modulation for each delay line.

If you decide to work on patching parameters to FUNCTION GENERATOR and SOFT FUNCTIONS you'll need to refer to the user manual descriptions of parameters modulation, about the range of control. That is a very important aspect of the game.

More on SWEPT REVERB...
this is the kind of reverb used by many great artists that has become the Eventide trademark for ambient reverb others try to emulate... but can't get the same depth and 3D width.
The GLIDE will sweep the base delays (6) rather than using modulation on each of them. The type of effects you can get is really stunning. IF you are not using any feedback, you will get choruses and flangers of doom. Very light feedback there... VERY. With higher feedback values you'll get delays/ambience/reverb springing from your chorus/flangers. Using the patches range values of the modulators is what will make the whole craft and art of designing sounds here. A lot of simple tweaking and listening... and great rewards to those who will venture there.
I'm 100% positive you don't need a TC1210 once you've learned to use the GLIDE on the H3000. And a lot more will be provided by the machine in this field. Dedicating an H3000 to modulation effects isn't a rare thing.
Many use it for reverb or delays only. Peter Gabriel only uses Eventides (old SP2016/H3000/DSP4000) for all his reverbs.
The common idea people used H3000 for pitch shifting, TC2290 for delay and PCM70 for reverb has always sounded very odd and limited to me.
TC2290 does some really nice chorusing; PCM70 has GREAT chorus/flangers and is a delay heaven. After almost 3 decades many folks are surprised when they discover the many other effects these units can do really well... beyond the "common thinking" ideas they had. Just don't live by the myths... tweak the boxes.
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1553
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

So... GLIDE and SWEPT REVERB...
everything I did for the SWEPT COMBS apply here, in the same way. So once you try and build your own thing, you'll have two algorithms covered for the unusual sounds!

Beauty in out of tune sounds....
this reminds me of the great Bill Frisell in his early ECM recordings, 1980s and early '90s, when he used to pull his Gibson SG neck to get breathing detuning effects... enhanced by the use of delays.
Frisell is one of the biggest innovators in electric guitar. He has been able to blend tradition and innovation like nobody else. Check those recordings as you'll love them...

Here's a short clip where the reverb isn't exactly modulated as most would think (or like!). The sweeping rides on the verge of usable out of tune modulation, thanks to the GLIDE applied to the m_delay parameter.
I'm using a triangle waveform... but a random one would probably make things even more interesting.
The usual 2 TC2290s are set to 800/820 ms here and are only fed from the H3000. They both extend the reverb tail and pick up the detune thru envelope modulation for some dynamic warble added. You won't notice them... but they are definitely adding magic.

FrisWepT
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing
Old 2nd December 2016
  #1554
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
Me too.

Quickly browsing presets from 260 - 300 lag horridly when main dial is turned. After 300 they move normally. ie. 301, 302, 303, etc...

Which makes me believe you actually got upgrade from someone else. Because those from 'scientific community' definitely suck.
Hmm.. 99% sure it was theirs.. will try it again in a bit.
Old 3rd December 2016
  #1555
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TheBrightSide's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hearteh View Post
Ok I have the DFX that is second to the right.
I'm guessing it's most likely that your 3500 has the original eproms, so you shouldn't have a sluggish unit. (You can always take the top off and have a look at them).

Out of curiosity I just checked mine (I went from DFX to B-DFX like Don) and there is no problem with it slowing down. It was a while ago, so I can't remember which Eprom set I bought.
I usually use the keypad to dial in the presets anyway.
Old 4th December 2016
  #1556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Station View Post
No I mean a MIDI bug caused by some EPROM kit's sold on Ebay that others have reported. As far as eprom sizes go on these DFX kits, there is no need whatsoever to use 512Kbyte eproms since the maximum file size is 256K on only 2 of the Eproms, and the others are 128k and 64K.
Exactly, the Operating System is only 64K clever huh?
The 128K from memory were Big Rom 1 and 2 etc
Sampling I've not looked although two programs 64K/128K seems right plus broadcast etc.
The 256K from memory were the D/SX, D/FX-S and D/SE so either two or three?

Though whomever has been selling those 256K upgrade kits has junked the data some where in the code, often some code is removed the copyright and technical service data, often the EPROMs I've found and stuffed in years ago were working as snappy as could be came from a great seller, though he's done! New blood don't care it seems and no one should be making money if this IP!

I can only say, the DFX-S or B packages that first came out were very good and priced very well. I actually have the data of all files if you want to burn your own?
Though it's something that just doesn't sit cool with me, knowing this is another companies intellectual property, so please no dumb ass request or random ones.

On my 2 Eventide D/SX upgraded H3000 units to DFX, they are as smooth and fast as Eventides D/SE Con Kit and the D/SX original software. I also have the sampling EPROM and many others, so I can only conclude something has been rewritten and badly as Don has compared machines years ago and their seemingly from memory was a difference then! Much slower from memory. Don...shoot me a Pm if I can help, though yeah...pretty sure Mr. Brightside and Myself bought near the same time and same guy....certain I've got details somewhere...Crikey I live in a house turned Audio Warehouse you could dig up old UA consoles here badged RCA...Lol!
Old 4th December 2016
  #1557
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
So... GLIDE and SWEPT REVERB...
everything I did for the SWEPT COMBS apply here, in the same way. So once you try and build your own thing, you'll have two algorithms covered for the unusual sounds!

Beauty in out of tune sounds....
this reminds me of the great Bill Frisell in his early ECM recordings, 1980s and early '90s, when he used to pull his Gibson SG neck to get breathing detuning effects... enhanced by the use of delays.
Frisell is one of the biggest innovators in electric guitar. He has been able to blend tradition and innovation like nobody else. Check those recordings as you'll love them...

Here's a short clip where the reverb isn't exactly modulated as most would think (or like!). The sweeping rides on the verge of usable out of tune modulation, thanks to the GLIDE applied to the m_delay parameter.
I'm using a triangle waveform... but a random one would probably make things even more interesting.
The usual 2 TC2290s are set to 800/820 ms here and are only fed from the H3000. They both extend the reverb tail and pick up the detune thru envelope modulation for some dynamic warble added. You won't notice them... but they are definitely adding magic.

FrisWepT
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8p...ew?usp=sharing
It's interesting you say this Italo, as seriously I can remember when the AMS 1580/S looping system was all....the rage, then it went to the TC2290, the reason no colour in their sampling, and the triggering in mono was so simple and easy to do...AMS units just sat their unloved...910/949/Primetime, PCM 41/42 TC everything, Korg and Roland in B rooms!

Then came the H3000 suddenly people went nuts, they cost a decent second hand car here...and sampling, oh lord the number of high profile names tracked and shifted and sampled and flown into the Sony 3324/A or 3348 was just up too 8-12 tracks sub mixed to 1/4" Sony digital,

The 480/L systems were hooked up to 224 systems AMS-RMX16 and talk racks of effects, my goodness their existed many a house that could've been purchased with 25 Rack Effects and A Farlight 11x sitting their...awaiting the next fee paying client at $2000 per day, not locked out!

The Most loved though unused Effects unit ever - The Publison DMH or Inferno or infernal or I give in...the FX sampling and looping one, man, that thing no one touched, the sound, stunning, the time it took, enough hours to say, no no, I've finally got it...boom client leaves! Lol! Shame the TC1210 and 2290 were kicked to the curb!far too young.

Then came the 1990's and everthing went digital, from Yamaha Eq, to compression to limiting it was odd, very odd, though studios bought into it all! I have to agree regrading Peter Gabriel using SP2016/3000/4000 etc, those 4000 units I just love, even their AMS type reverbs are so close with some added gritty compression the sound very AMS like.

Though no matter whom is making the next batch of 1210 type clones, I am always far too late, maybe we need to open up the forum to a few more dedicated Effect systems, and see us hit the H8000 or even 7600 posts, that would be very cool! Just an idea! Anybody have 1210 type examples? If so please....do your best!

Cheers
TLB
Old 15th December 2016
  #1558
Italo, i've enabled your request to edit the Eventide H3000 patch-sheet table:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...5DfuOo/pubhtml

Now I'm curious to know what are your editing plans for this table?
Old 15th December 2016
  #1559
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
Italo, i've enabled your request to edit the Eventide H3000 patch-sheet table:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...5DfuOo/pubhtml

Now I'm curious to know what are your editing plans for this table?

Don
did I requested that? I'm not sure. I have no plans really.
Old 15th December 2016
  #1560
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
Don
did I requested that? I'm not sure. I have no plans really.
Yeah. I received notification via your gmail account and thought you wanted to fix some wrong entry in the table. 3 other people requested access as well but i denied them.
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