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Detroit Techno Keyboard Synthesizers
Old 7th September 2012
  #391
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Hi guys,

Bit of a bump on an old thread here but though this the best place to post.

Is anyone a member of the 313techknow yahoo group? It hasn't had any new posts in quite some time but I'd LOVE to look through the archives as they discuss production methods and stuff in there. I've asked to join the group but it's been waiting for approval for weeks and weeks now.. I can only assume whoever started it is no longer checking his emails . Does anyone have any idea how I can get access?

Many thanks.
Old 7th September 2012
  #392
Gear Addict
 
synthpunk's Avatar
Ibanez SDR1000+

Quote:
Originally Posted by binman_uk View Post
I'm just after some recommendations for cheap effects units that sound good and are worth me buying. If anyone owns any and can recommend them it'd be much appreciated. That's all .
Old 7th September 2012
  #393
Gear Addict
 
pearlywhites's Avatar
 

easier to make detroit techno without using the sounds of detroit techno

u have to have the feeling
WJLB -- STRONG SONGS - 97.9 FM 80s PROMO - YouTube
or like richie hawtin before he went ITB
Richie Hawtin - CONCEPT 1 (SideA) (PLUS 8) - YouTube
Old 7th September 2012
  #394
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by binman_uk View Post
Hi guys,

Bit of a bump on an old thread here but though this the best place to post.

Is anyone a member of the 313techknow yahoo group? It hasn't had any new posts in quite some time but I'd LOVE to look through the archives as they discuss production methods and stuff in there. I've asked to join the group but it's been waiting for approval for weeks and weeks now.. I can only assume whoever started it is no longer checking his emails . Does anyone have any idea how I can get access?

Many thanks.


I was a member of the 313techknow group. Also the 313 list too several years ago. You've been waiting weeks and have you? Ha! I have been waiting a couple years now at least. I am pretty sure the group is dead.
If I were you I would start digging througt 313 archives... you may be able come up with some tidbits here there... You are going to have to dig cause those archives are deep and go back years. You might find some posts by Shake or some others...
best of luck
Old 7th September 2012
  #395
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dubtek71 View Post


I was a member of the 313techknow group. Also the 313 list too several years ago. You've been waiting weeks and have you? Ha! I have been waiting a couple years now at least. I am pretty sure the group is dead.
If I were you I would start digging througt 313 archives... you may be able come up with some tidbits here there... You are going to have to dig cause those archives are deep and go back years. You might find some posts by Shake or some others...
best of luck
Yeah I've pretty much trawled my way through the 313 mailing list archives over the past 6 months. Some of it makes fantastic reading and that's where I found about about the yahoo group.
Does your old yahoo/313techknow account not work any more?
Old 7th September 2012
  #396
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by synthpunk View Post
Ibanez SDR1000+
It's ok now actually mate. That was an old post of mine.
I picked up quite a bit of old gear over the past 6 months... an Alesis Midiverb 2 / Quadraverb / Microlimiter / Microgate / Microverb, Zoom 1204, plus a mixer, a couple of compressors and some guitar pedals. I'm all sorted now and I'm bloody loving it .
Old 7th September 2012
  #397
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by binman_uk View Post
Yeah I've pretty much trawled my way through the 313 mailing list archives over the past 6 months. Some of it makes fantastic reading and that's where I found about about the yahoo group.
Does your old yahoo/313techknow account not work any more?
I have forgotten my old account info. The last time I was active on that list would have been 1999-2000ish. The one thing I really liked about those 2 lists is there was not the type of bull**** there is around here. If you tried some bull**** you got shut down. Its not like that around here...everybody is entitled to an opinion.
Old 7th September 2012
  #398
Lives for gear
 

Have you found Juan & Kevin's gear lists from the early days yet? Then compared it to what is being said in this thread? Lol.
Old 7th September 2012
  #399
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dubtek71 View Post
I have forgotten my old account info. The last time I was active on that list would have been 1999-2000ish. The one thing I really liked about those 2 lists is there was not the type of bull**** there is around here. If you tried some bull**** you got shut down. Its not like that around here...everybody is entitled to an opinion.


if you ever manage to recover your details and don't mind me using your old account, let me know. i'd love to look through the old posts over there
Old 10th September 2012
  #400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pearlywhites View Post
Ha. Love it.
Old 11th September 2012
  #401
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by binman_uk View Post
It's ok now actually mate. That was an old post of mine.
I picked up quite a bit of old gear over the past 6 months... an Alesis Midiverb 2 / Quadraverb / Microlimiter / Microgate / Microverb, Zoom 1204, plus a mixer, a couple of compressors and some guitar pedals. I'm all sorted now and I'm bloody loving it .
If I were you I'd still pick up that Ibanez too.......just sayin.....it does stuff those Alesis boxes can not.
Old 12th September 2012
  #402
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 View Post
If I were you I'd still pick up that Ibanez too.......just sayin.....it does stuff those Alesis boxes can not.
Cheers mate I will look out for one. How does the ibanez dm1000 compare actually? I was looking at getting one of those a while ago and they seem to crop up a lot more frequently on ebay.

In all honesty, actually looking pretty stocked-up on the bucket-brigade outboard front at the moment... there's actually no room in my rack now. I picked up:

Alesis Quadraverb
Alesis Midiverb 2
Alesis Microverb/Gate/Limiter
Zoom 1204
DBX 166 (Original)

Also got a Fostex DN-15 for the bargain price of £13.50 on ebay which I think is excellent (I actually prefer it to the Microlimiter for drum smashing duties). I'm not too keen on the sound of the Quadraverb or Zoom though. I've considered swapping one of them with a Yamaha SPX-90 or Boss SE-50/70 because it'd cost me nothing to do so, although I'm not sure if it's worth it.

A dedicated knobby rack delay would certainly be nice as I'm currently using guitar pedals and plugins for delay-based duties although I'm not sure where I'd put it . The PSP Audioware Lexicon 42 delay gets used on everything I make.. sounds excellent.

Will be picking up an Akai S950 on Friday which I bought for a good price with the intention of selling it on. We'll see how that goes as I may end up keeping it!

I have to say though.. I'm enjoying producing much more now. It was all "relatively" cheap and it's definitely got me closer to the sound that I'm looking for. I still take bloody ages to make anything but that's not a massive issue :D.
Old 12th September 2012
  #403
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 

The SDR1000+ is mainly a reverb, although it also does delay. All I'll say is that I will never sell mine. A VERY cool space maker.

P.S. Keep that S950. Put a chord in there, sequence it up and put the wheel on filter cutoff while playing back......there you go, now you can't sell it anymore......lol.....silly to sell now anyway, as they're only getting dearer.
Old 28th March 2013
  #404
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Barfunkel's Avatar
 

Resurrecting an old, but interesting thread.

Just read through the whole thing, and couldn't find much discussion about the music itself (ie chords and notes), just the sounds.

So, the question is, what gives a track a Detroit-y feel? Certain chords or scales or what? I spent the whole day yesterday trying to sound like a rip-off of a classic Detroit record, but simply couldn't pin down how to do it. My Nintendo has some sounds that are good enough to create a half-decent replica, but I simply couldn't find the right chords and notes.

For example, take this track? Does anyone have golden ears and can dissect it?



It has a weird feeling to it, kinda sad but also hopeful at the same time. I couldn't get my strings sounding like that, even though I went through dozens of different types of chords and scales.

Any help would be much appreciated!
Old 28th March 2013
  #405
Gear Maniac
 

I can't really help but i briefly had a Korg Oasys back in 2007 & made an incredible string patch based on 'Icon' last week i was trying to recreate the drum sequence on my MPC. I got really close & then realised it was silly to do so, then went its own way & then scrapped altogether. Greatest techno track ever. 'Icon' that is, not my futile attempt.
Old 28th March 2013
  #406
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
Resurrecting an old, but interesting thread.

Just read through the whole thing, and couldn't find much discussion about the music itself (ie chords and notes), just the sounds.

So, the question is, what gives a track a Detroit-y feel? Certain chords or scales or what? I spent the whole day yesterday trying to sound like a rip-off of a classic Detroit record, but simply couldn't pin down how to do it. My Nintendo has some sounds that are good enough to create a half-decent replica, but I simply couldn't find the right chords and notes.
...
Listening to Electronic Music from Detroit for more than two decades now but I could not give you a proper definition either.

"The music is just like Detroit, a complete mistake. It’s like George Clinton and Kraftwerk are stuck in an elevator with only a sequencer to keep them company,...” Derrick May, "Techno! The New Dance Sound of Detroit", 1988

You got some classic raw stuff like K Alexy Shelby "My Medusa", some more floating stuff like Aril Brikhas "Deeparture in time", harder tracks from artists like Underground Resistance or Jeff Mills, Electro ranging from Juan Atkins, Drexcya, Flexitone and Le Car etc. And then there are people like Carl Craig, Theo Parrish, Moodymann etc. Too many artists to mention. Very versatile.

It´s a lot of eclecticism going on in that area.

And don´t forget the legacy of Detroit Funk(eg David Hamilton), Motown Records and Jazz (eg Tribe Recordings), Electrifying Mojos regular radio show in the 80s, gear sharing ...

I think it´s hard to nail down specific elements. You have to see everything in context. According the chords I think they often used minor and m7 chords. Lot´s of jazz stuff.

Cheers,
Sebastian
Old 28th March 2013
  #407
Jose Ramón Alvarado Villa
 
Don Solaris's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
It has a weird feeling to it, kinda sad but also hopeful at the same time.
Interesting. I had exactly the same feeling listening to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Halma View Post
You have to see everything in context. According the chords I think they often used minor and m7 chords. Lot´s of jazz stuff.
Basslines scream jazz in 90% of the tracks coming from the motor city.
Old 28th March 2013
  #408
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
For example, take this track? Does anyone have golden ears and can dissect it?



It has a weird feeling to it, kinda sad but also hopeful at the same time. I couldn't get my strings sounding like that, even though I went through dozens of different types of chords and scales.

Any help would be much appreciated!
In general, with this type of techno, the sampler is your friend. And Debussy. One clue is in the pitch bends halfway through the track - you sample a chord, typically a minor, and then play a melody with it. Debussy's work uses a similar approach in which the chords plane up and down (works like the Sunken Cathedral).

For one thing, there is no sense of key and you tend to this dreamy effect, which contrasts nicely with the urgency of the percussion.
Old 28th March 2013
  #409
Lives for gear
 

Binny's "Detroit Techno In a Nutshell" Guide (in work so making this quick):

Plenty of minor chords, especially minor 7. I've also had some luck playing about with min sus2 chords recently. Keep it melancholy.

Chord memory is your frield. Or sample a chord as stated above.

Pich bend some strings

Lots of FM synthesis to create bass, bleeps etc. Yamaha DX/DX presets will get you there *easily*

Compression? What compression

FX - i especially like flangers on drums, plenty of reverb. Only use 1 or 2 FX machines though. Old Alesis/Zoom/Yamaha ones work well.

Keep it raw and record everything in one go on the fly if possible. Keep it simple.

Roland drum machines.

Don't worry too much about the key of the music - a lof of older Detroit records blatantly just ignore such things
Old 28th March 2013
  #410
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Old 28th March 2013
  #411
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Solaris View Post
Basslines scream jazz in 90% of the tracks coming from the motor city.
Funny thing is that most people I know that are listening to Detroit stuff are also enjoying listening to jazz music (and vice versa). No exception in age of the listener. The mother of my girlfriend is 65 and ikes Carl Craig since I showed her CARL CRAIG VERSUS LES SIÈCLES ORCHESTRA, EXCLUSIVE CONCERT IN PARIS.
Old 28th March 2013
  #412
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Barfunkel's Avatar
 

Thanks for the tips so far, keep them coming!

Here's my first ever attempt at Detroit-influenced techno, made with the Nintendo DS as usual. It's not spot on Detroit, but I like the chords and the bassline, who cares whether it's a carbon copy or not. Portamento would be nice as it's so common in Detroit techno, but there's no such in the Nintendo.

Old 28th March 2013
  #413
Gear Maniac
 

Not bad at all for a first attempt. It's got those rolling drums, model 500 type bassline & classic sounding strings.
Old 28th March 2013
  #414
Lives for gear
 
Looneytune's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by binman_uk View Post
Binny's "Detroit Techno In a Nutshell" Guide (in work so making this quick):

Plenty of minor chords, especially minor 7. I've also had some luck playing about with min sus2 chords recently. Keep it melancholy.

Chord memory is your frield. Or sample a chord as stated above.

Pich bend some strings

Lots of FM synthesis to create bass, bleeps etc. Yamaha DX/DX presets will get you there *easily*

Compression? What compression

FX - i especially like flangers on drums, plenty of reverb. Only use 1 or 2 FX machines though. Old Alesis/Zoom/Yamaha ones work well.

Keep it raw and record everything in one go on the fly if possible. Keep it simple.

Roland drum machines.

Don't worry too much about the key of the music - a lof of older Detroit records blatantly just ignore such things
I actually really like the sampled chord stuff. Take a chord sample and go nuts.
Old 28th March 2013
  #415
sounds good. sometimes drop the chords an octave for a whole different feel.
Old 29th March 2013
  #416
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Barfunkel's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by futurethought View Post
Not bad at all for a first attempt. It's got those rolling drums, model 500 type bassline & classic sounding strings.
Thanks for listening! I'm somewhat pleased with this, but there's still obviously a lot to learn. I simply don't understand how some things work (what chords to play with the strings particularly to get a Detroit-y feel), and the lack of portamento hurts a bit.

Dissecting the classics obviously helps, but I don't have golden ears and can't hear the chords by ear. I haven't found any online tutorials either.
Old 29th March 2013
  #417
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Mcnulty's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Looneytune View Post
I actually really like the sampled chord stuff. Take a chord sample and go nuts.
Yesssss, sampled chords are the best thing in techno.
Old 29th March 2013
  #418
Lives for gear
 
Mcnulty's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
Thanks for listening! I'm somewhat pleased with this, but there's still obviously a lot to learn. I simply don't understand how some things work (what chords to play with the strings particularly to get a Detroit-y feel), and the lack of portamento hurts a bit.

Dissecting the classics obviously helps, but I don't have golden ears and can't hear the chords by ear. I haven't found any online tutorials either.
The thing that i think makes detroit techno isn't the music notation but the sounds and the way they are used, thats what parts minimal music from pop or rock is the fact that notation doesn't have much to do with that genre. Its all sounds and textures not chords and melodies imo.
Old 29th March 2013
  #419
VST
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VST's Avatar
Seminal track, complete with pitch bent chords and that crazy Detroit Techno bassline.
Old 29th March 2013
  #420
This is the first thing currently coming into my mind when i think of detroit techno



I just ordered a tickets for their latest tour so I can check them playing live in april
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