The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Synths for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
My Kicks are making things vibrate Dynamics Plugins
Old 6th August 2008
  #1
Gear Nut
 

My Kicks are making things vibrate

Ok guys this question is a nitty gritty question on production. When I make a track I notice when I turn it up loud the kickdrum tends to make things vibrate.The reason why I care is that the vibrations interfere with the sound when turned up.

Now when I listen to other dance tracks such Eric Prydz music and in particular Prodigy's Smack my bitch which has a very big kick no matter how much I turn it up the kick sounds exactly what it does when a lower listen levels and very clear.


What am I doing wrong with the kick??? Undercompressing/Overcompressing not eqing right etc....I've tried cutting some 60hz but as soons as I do that it doesn't sound as full and the pros kicks do sound full

Anyway I posted a sample of my track I am working on so you know what I mean.....
www.pgmrefiners.com/images/RockIt_By_KarvanJ.mp3

The kick has the 1176UAD compressor on it + the Waves linmb multiband compressor.

Any adivice would be greate. Thanks in advance
Old 6th August 2008
  #2
Lives for gear
Your kick may have a little too much release,

Otherwise, try cutting a bit of frequencies between 150/200hz, as the track sounds more "boxy" than "boomy".

If it half solves your problem, try cutting the bass in the same frequencies instead of the kick,

You may need to compensate for the eventual loss of bass by bringing back some lowest frequencies under 60hz
Old 6th August 2008
  #3
Lives for gear
 
d1rtynyc's Avatar
Is it vibrating things in many rooms or just your studio?
Old 6th August 2008
  #4
Lives for gear
 

Your kick has too much energy in the low mids/high lows. Might be overcompensation due to room issues.
Old 6th August 2008
  #5
yes, sounds like the room.
try decoupling your speakers, use spikes, and a slab of concrete (the bigger the better). download a sinewave sweep (or make one) and listen, while standing/sitting in various places in your room. what do you hear?
PS it might be a good idea to write down observations or measurements.
you can also do it by ear, but then first you have to have an idea how it's supposed to sound.

what kind of monitors do you use btw?
Old 6th August 2008
  #6
Lives for gear
 
alexstringer's Avatar
 

Do you sidechain the kick ?
Old 6th August 2008
  #7
....and why the LinMB? do you really need that?

my kicks usually sounds great with just a bit of eq and sometimes a simple comp.

my thought is that if you have to tweak too much, its not a good kick. specially when you are sampling that kick.....if you are mixing something that's been recorded wrong or badly and you dont have other choice, the tweaks may be necessary, but if you are sampling i think its better to get another sample than to tweak it to the extreme, cause that usually doesnt work.

all my kicks are done in soundforge using a plain n simple sine waves with a pitch bend, a bit of eq and i'm done. works very good, at least on psy.

regards!
Old 6th August 2008
  #8
Lives for gear
 
crufty's Avatar
are the kicks too loud maybe? multimeter shows freq 125 is locked right at 0 db, while rest of frequencies hover at -15
Old 6th August 2008
  #9
Lives for gear
 
sleepwalker's Avatar
 

Change your shoes. Maybe sandals?
Old 6th August 2008
  #10
Lives for gear
 

Probably just a case of having the kick be so much bigger than anything else in the mix...
Old 6th August 2008
  #11
I have some PA speakers that rattle sometimes. The handle is loose.

Check your nuts and bolts.
Old 7th August 2008
  #12
Lives for gear
 
cynic one's Avatar
 

there's a problem with kicks vibrating things? that's what i go for when i mix
Old 7th August 2008
  #13
Gear Maniac
 
Shim's Avatar
 

"Now when I listen to other dance tracks such Eric Prydz music and in particular Prodigy's Smack my bitch which has a very big kick no matter how much I turn it up the kick sounds exactly what it does when a lower listen levels and very clear."

Just a thought, but unless the tracks you're comparing against have a very similar kick frequency, are you sure that you're not just getting desk resonance from the fundamental of your kick? I know i get wierd vibrations from anything that gets to hot around 75hz... it might just be a room quirk. Recoil stabilizers maybe? i know mopads don't work well when you get that low, hence my problem.
Old 7th August 2008
  #14
Gear Nut
 

Wow guys thanks for all the suggestions....

No the vibrations doesn't just happen in my studio but also in my car, computer speakers(that is the plastic vibrates) etc

The kick is not sidechained but is sent to a drum buss with the fairchild on it....but I have it so the buss is sitting under the dry signal

I used the LinMb because when doing a test in my room i found it was around the 60hz range where I was getting the most of the vibrations

I do I agree if I don't push it as much it does sound better....
I probably try cutting it in 150/200hz and put the volume down....I think the bass may need some equing as if I do put the volume down for the kick, the kick doesn't come out so well(the low end gets lost)


Oh yeah my gear is:
Monitors: Focal Twins
Headphones: Seinheiser HD25
Soundcard: RME Fireface 400
And a really **** room with some homemade bass traps in each corner
Old 7th August 2008
  #15
Gear Nut
 

Give a min will also post a loop of just the original kick sample(without any processing) love to hear thoughts if the sample **** or not
Old 7th August 2008
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by cynic View Post
there's a problem with kicks vibrating things? that's what i go for when i mix
you beat me to it!

but seriously what diogo_c said. ime if you need more than light compression and a little eq, then its most probably not the right sound/sample for the mix.
Old 7th August 2008
  #17
Here for the gear
 

The only kick you'll ever need YouTube - Museum of Techno - Recording a Kick Drum
Old 7th August 2008
  #18
Gear Maniac
 

i'd say it's simply the wrong kick for the track. the kick has too much around 120hz and nearly nothing in the lowend around 50-70hz. if you want to keep it turn it down a little bit and try to layer it with a sine wave or better another kick the has more boom around 50-70 hz.
Old 7th August 2008
  #19
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by trancekid View Post
i'd say it's simply the wrong kick for the track. the kick has too much around 120hz and nearly nothing in the lowend around 50-70hz. if you want to keep it turn it down a little bit and try to layer it with a sine wave or better another kick the has more boom around 50-70 hz.
Exactly... I use to wrestle with this (and at times still do)...and usually is just the wrong type of kick.
Old 7th August 2008
  #20
FBM
Gear Addict
 
FBM's Avatar
 

Hi, Oké a little EQ lesson or how to remove annoying feed-backs and interfering frequencies out of any audio part: (This is only how I do it!)

It's not about ready made samples, it's about raw samples of machines/synths hardware/software or kicks made out of waveforms with soundForge/Wavelab etc.!!!!!!!(You can of course scan for bad freq in your ready made samples)

This is for the kick: Use the Waves Q10/Uad1 Cambridge

FIRST TURN THE VOLUME OF YOUR MONITORS/HEADPHONE DOWN!!!!!!!!

Only use a EQ with a narrow Q like the Waves Q10 or Uad1 Cambrige, because when the Q is to
wide it will effect the sound.

* To start do not use any compression at all .
* Apply a low-cut (use a high-pass filter slowly going down from 80Hz to
20Hz) Always use your ears! 80Hz is a starting point. (Can also be 60Hz or 90Hz)
* Now with a Q of 100 (Q10) and a gain of + 18db start scanning slowly
from low to high till you notice a feedback noise/resonance, at the loudest point dip
the bad freq. to -5db/-7db and start with the next one. I do this mostly from 30Hz to
300Hz. (But it can be necessary to go a little higher) And you will have 4 to 6 dips at the end.

Some people are trying to tame those peaks with a compressor but only make it worse!

* Then try a (wider q) low-cut around 250Hz (removes mud)
* A other (wider q) low-cut around 400/500Hz (removes a honky sound)
* Cut (wider q) some around 800Hz (removes a wacky sound)
* Cut (wider q)some at 2000Hz (creates more room for other instruments)
* Adjust the makeup gain of your EQ (only make up what's cut, use your eyes!)

Only use as much as needed keep listening don't take the soul out of it!!!

Forget about the LMB!
Then I use a limiter (very little!) or compressor (very, very little!)
And not two compressors at the same time. Compression is only amplifying
the unwanted **** in your kick part. And because you cut all the unwanted freq.
you get a power full kick and need no freq. boosts at all. (Only around 7000Hz when it's
really necessary you can boost 2/3 db with a Q of 2.0)

Also important when mixing put the Master fader on 0db and start mixing with your Kick at
-7/-8 db, do not mix louder or touch the Master fader. Keep the Master signal below
0db (-3db) (This is about the total mix: Kick, Bass , Leads etc. don't touch the Master fader!!!)
When you want to hear it loud turn up the volume of your monitors/amp! It will sound softer then a CD this is because your track needs mastering afterwards.

When your EQ doesn't have enough freq. bands insert a second one!
Or do the tech.EQing offline and the creative EQing realtime.

This technical EQing can be used for all audio parts and makes your mix real pro and transparent.
Of course you apply a higher low-cut on other instruments and are the unwanted freq a little higher then Kick and Bass, but it saves you from unnecessary boosting. You have to realize that when you don't do this, all this freq. **** is as much as the amount of audio parts you have all together (Imagine what happens when you put a compressor on such a non treated audio part/mix, or you boost a part of the freq. with EQing!)
and explains the nasty digital unpleasant sound/low/hi freq. resonance we don't want.

Good Luck David
Old 7th August 2008
  #21
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FBM View Post
* Adjust the makeup gain of your EQ (only make up what's cut, use your eyes!)
Great info...can you explain what is meant by this?
Old 7th August 2008
  #22
FBM
Gear Addict
 
FBM's Avatar
 

Hi jsrockit, Some EQ's have a make up gain or master fader to compensate for the cuts/boosts you made. It can go above or under 0db.
Greets David
Old 7th August 2008
  #23
Lives for gear
 
cosmos's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by b_karv View Post
And a really **** room with some homemade bass traps in each corner
Thats your problem ..

do what Reptil wrote first thumbsup
Old 7th August 2008
  #24
FBM
Gear Addict
 
FBM's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmos View Post
Thats your problem ..

do what Reptil wrote first thumbsup
No it is part of the problem! But of course work in a acoustic treated room, or use reference headphones.
And measure the studio first with:

ETF Acoustic Measurement Software

And cosmos I'm going on holiday to Eilat (dolphin beach)

Greets David
Old 7th August 2008
  #25
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FBM View Post
Hi jsrockit, Some EQ's have a make up gain or master fader to compensate for the cuts/boosts you made. It can go above or under 0db.
Greets David
Ah, so simple...I was just confused since the software EQs I use don't have this function.
Old 7th August 2008
  #26
Lives for gear
 
cosmos's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FBM View Post

And cosmos I'm going on holiday to Eilat (dolphin beach)

Greets David
PM'd you.
Old 7th August 2008
  #27
FBM
Gear Addict
 
FBM's Avatar
 

Me to Dvid
Did you received my PM? I think I have a Internet problem.
Old 7th August 2008
  #28
Gear Maniac
 

FMB ftw
Old 8th August 2008
  #29
Lives for gear
 
duvalle's Avatar
 

after listening to your track i think
the eazy way out for you would be:

just get some of the vengeance sample cd's.
they got everything you need ...
just pick the right sounds and you are ready to go.
not much eq needed ... most of the sounds are great out of the box.



p.s.
and if you put your track at 128 bpm
you can just use the ready to go vengeance percussion loops too!
and then you will sound like 90% of the electro club stuff that's played.
try it - it's true ... no comp or eq needed ...

Old 8th August 2008
  #30
FBM
Gear Addict
 
FBM's Avatar
 

I agree! This is what I use:
http://www.jomox.com/product_details...=&product_id=4
David
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
EstateMatt / Geekslutz forum
8
Versatile255 / Rap + Hip Hop engineering and production
8
jazzy655 / Rap + Hip Hop engineering and production
9
jgrif08 / So much gear, so little time
45

Forum Jump
Forum Jump