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Roland, Korg and GAK fined, how is this going to effect us?
Old 4 days ago
  #61
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by vitocorleone123 View Post
Stores can choose to sell many products below MSRP that may still be above their cost to carry the item(s). Stores can also choose to sell below cost (some restrictions apply) if they're willing to take a loss - for marketing or whatever reasons.

Not allowing stores to do that takes away flexibility to respond to the market and their customers.
I was always under the understanding that we could sell anything for whatever price we wanted to, but we couldn’t advertise a price that was lower than some set price. We got around it by saying we had an open box return for sale (loophole) and there was no such object. When they got into the store we’d say, “oh, our stock system was wrong. Here, let me get you a fresh one for the same price.” Happens all the time.
Old 4 days ago
  #62
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Good thing my synth buying days are over.
Old 4 days ago
  #63
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syntonica's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by sds1fs1r View Post
Good thing my synth buying days are over.
So, waiting until July then?
Old 4 days ago
  #64
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syntonica's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
I was always under the understanding that we could sell anything for whatever price we wanted to, but we couldn’t advertise a price that was lower than some set price. We got around it by saying we had an open box return for sale (loophole) and there was no such object. When they got into the store we’d say, “oh, our stock system was wrong. Here, let me get you a fresh one for the same price.” Happens all the time.
I love all the online retailers with the "Our prices are so low!!!! Put this item in your cart to see the low, low price! Do it! Do it!!!"
Old 4 days ago
  #65
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Shadowkast's Avatar
Free Boss pedals and Korg Volcas to all paying customers should be part of the settlement.
Old 4 days ago
  #66
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breakmixer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
I was always under the understanding that we could sell anything for whatever price we wanted to, but we couldn’t advertise a price that was lower than some set price. We got around it by saying we had an open box return for sale (loophole) and there was no such object. When they got into the store we’d say, “oh, our stock system was wrong. Here, let me get you a fresh one for the same price.” Happens all the time.
In the UK you have RRP, recommended retail price, you can not sell above that price but discounting below that price is allowed, I did not know that price fixing between outlets/manufacturers was a thing.
Old 4 days ago
  #67
Most shops in the UK advertise the same exact price, even if it's a discounted price.
I think if someone is going to sign on as an official dealer for a brand, it is reasonable for that brand to ask them to stick to a certain range of pricing.
there are two sides to this...
One is that customers should not be overcharged and market competition should work so that customers can shop around for the best price.
On the other hand, a brand wants to protect it's value. There is no real reason a Hermes bag should cost 10 times more than a Marc Jacobs bag. It's all about branding and perceived worth.
Old 4 days ago
  #68
Gear Addict
If I’m a store and I bought a ton of something thinking it would sell but I only sold a few, then something like covid happens and my revenue tanks, I need cash fast. I should be able to sell at a discount, nay a loss, because I cannot pay my bills in volcas.

But of course you can’t be sure that those situations happen. You don’t want scalpers out there undercutting you’re partners because it’s those big store partners that push your products and keep you going.

It’s a really tough balance and one that wasn’t really a problem until the internet. As a manufacturer your only choices are to severely limit who you sell in bulk to (hurting the few independent shops out there) or you start selling direct only.
Old 4 days ago
  #69
Most stores don't hold much stock, they order it in as it is sold.
Actually since the Covid crisis I think music stores have done pretty well.
People buying online or via telephone and having stuff delivered.
A lot of people were paid to stay at home and they've used that time to follow their hobbies.
Old 4 days ago
  #70
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakmixer View Post
In the UK you have RRP, recommended retail price, you can not sell above that price but discounting below that price is allowed, I did not know that price fixing between outlets/manufacturers was a thing.
It’s not really a thing because you can sell something for whatever you want. It’s the advertising. If you advertise a lower price, they’ll pull your dealership. Of course, a lot of people just walk in and pay the advertised price, so it does have that effect, but if you’re savvy you can haggle a bit and get a better price.
Old 3 days ago
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowkast View Post
Free Boss pedals and Korg Volcas to all paying customers should be part of the settlement.
How about free coupons for 5% off? 'cause that's what's coming...
Old 3 days ago
  #72
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
It’s not really a thing because you can sell something for whatever you want. It’s the advertising. If you advertise a lower price, they’ll pull your dealership. Of course, a lot of people just walk in and pay the advertised price, so it does have that effect, but if you’re savvy you can haggle a bit and get a better price.
America is much more competitive.
Many times I've stood in a UK store asking for a deal and they will just stick to the marked price. If you are lucky, after a lot of "I'll check with the manager" they might reluctantly offer you 5-10% discount.
I mostly buy slightly used or B stock.
Old 3 days ago
  #73
HSi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
America is much more competitive.
Many times I've stood in a UK store asking for a deal and they will just stick to the marked price. If you are lucky, after a lot of "I'll check with the manager" they might reluctantly offer you 5-10% discount.
I mostly buy slightly used or B stock.
Nah, you can do that in the UK too. I've done it in GAK. If they say no, they're probably muppets or they have the lowest prices on market.
Old 3 days ago
  #74
It's never worked for me.
Old 3 days ago
  #75
HSi
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How do you go about it? Do you quote their price match? I did that in a clothes shop on Brighton, Blacks, high street, North face jacket that was half price on the North Face website, but only 33% off in Blacks, he checked with the manager and then they did it.

https://www.blacks.co.uk/price-promise

They sure as hell wouldn't have give me 50% on that if I'd just walked in and asked for it, they probably would have called for security.
Old 3 days ago
  #76
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lost_the_peace's Avatar
 

I got £150 off a guitar at GAK by pleading on Reverb, it does often work
Old 3 days ago
  #77
HSi
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HSi's Avatar
 

They used to be a lot cooler about it, there were older blokes working in there. I think sometimes they must get fed up of people just treating it like some kind of play center with no intention of buying, it's in a bad location for a shop like that, right in the middle of the tourist area.
Old 3 days ago
  #78
Lives for gear
 

Instead of listing a MAP, a retailer could say "Call - our prices are too low to advertise!" They could use Comic Sans font.

Or they could list the product with no price except a "make an offer" field. You submit an offer, and if they reject it, you can haggle with the chat bot.

They could have continuously variable micro-pricing based on momentary demand.

I just saw a video of a guy looking for a hotel room in Varanasi, and at one point he passes by a small monkey holding a hand mirror and putting on makeup while smoking a cigarette. We live in strange times.
Old 3 days ago
  #79
HSi
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HSi's Avatar
 

They could all just offer competitive prices and monitor the competition like every other business on the planet.

I know this thinking might seem radical, but bear with me..
Old 3 days ago
  #80
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
America is much more competitive.
Many times I've stood in a UK store asking for a deal and they will just stick to the marked price. If you are lucky, after a lot of "I'll check with the manager" they might reluctantly offer you 5-10% discount.
I mostly buy slightly used or B stock.
Oh, it can be like that here too. It depends on where you shop. Haggling is sort of a cultural thing. I was never brought up to even think about it, but we were super sale conscious.

I worked in a home electronics shop once in a college town. We got people from all over. It was an adjustment. I learned it’s a dance. I used to have a gentleman from India come in and ask for the “most best price.” I’d honestly give him the best price I was able to, and then he’d press me for more. It took forever. Finally, I realized I wasn’t doing my part of the dance right. He wanted me to ratchet down my price for at least 3 times until I got to the lowest price. One day I said to him, “Do you actually want the best price, or should I give you a lower price with some room to haggle some more?” He responded, “best price, right now.” I gave him a discount with some room to haggle. He haggled again... and again. He ended up buying it for my “best price,” which I had already known from the start. We were pretty friendly, so as he was leaving I said, “well, now I know that I should never actually give my best price up no matter how much you seem to mean it.” He responded, “yes, you’re learning!”

Other times when someone was paying for what the item was listed for, I’d just charge them for the price they would have got if they’d haggle. We sort of had to jack up the marked prices for people who expected to haggle. I don’t know of a compromise that would work for everyone.
Old 3 days ago
  #81
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Gnalvl's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by percussion boy View Post
In the U.S., it’s sort of “nudge nudge, wink wink.” You can certainly call up one of the big online retailers and pay the full asking price—but if you dig in and start grinding them, or have a good relationship with a sales rep, the price can fall.
Yeah, this is weirdly prevalent enough that at one point years ago when I made an ebay "best offer" with one of the bigger online stores, they somehow pulled my phone number from my ebay account (thought that was private???) and left a voice mail trying to haggle with my offer.

This was not even a big price item either, I think it was $200 or under.
Old 3 days ago
  #82
Gear Nut
 

Amazon must be happy. Everybody else, it's an email, or phone call and you pay street price.

The fines sound like more musician bashing to me. The DAWs have killed these guys, they don't need to be fined. Stop it! would be just fine.
Old 3 days ago
  #83
Lives for gear
 

It could be like the stock market, where online retailers adjust by the minute to each other's prices and to market demand. You could buy synth futures, to lock in a price. You could tell your bot to "buy Iridium" if it breaks $2200. Or you could follow the whales; invest in whatever synth they do, as soon as you can find out.

Sometimes I wonder how it all would have gone down if octopuses, instead of monkeys, had thumbs. Or hive insects. Would they need to have a rule for every loophole, and vice versa? Imagine if pack rats were the dominant species!
Old 3 days ago
  #84
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnalvl View Post
Yeah, this is weirdly prevalent enough that at one point years ago when I made an ebay "best offer" with one of the bigger online stores, they somehow pulled my phone number from my ebay account (thought that was private???) and left a voice mail trying to haggle with my offer.

This was not even a big price item either, I think it was $200 or under.
That’s kind of an icky move by the store. But ... yeah.
Old 3 days ago
  #85
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by djwaxxy View Post
I think a few off us on here have regular stores and sales people they buy from. I used too buy from dv247 until the shit on there staff and they got sacked.. They were always great with prices and sometimes you'd get freebies or amazing bundles.
Best one I got was when everyone was wanting protools setups.. I got pt9, avid firewire interface, nova mic, maudio bx5as, novation launchpad, novation remote 25sl,all cables and some vsts and sample cds.. All that cost £300!!!
We watched the old DV247 trash prices galore, mess things up for the rest of us and knew they wouldn't be able to sustain their business that way. BOOM, they went, along with a few others.

Actually, another problem was european stores. UK stores were trying to price-match certain european stores.
Old 3 days ago
  #86
HSi
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HSi's Avatar
 

Never seen so many people argue for higher prices. BTW guys, I have some Magic Beans for sale on the marketplace.
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