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Moog Sub 37 does not have the moog sound why?
Old 18th May 2020
  #1
Lives for gear
Moog Sub 37 does not have the moog sound why?

Its an impressive looking keyboard but the moment you touch a key, meh.....

The Little Phatty line blows it out of the water with its Harmonically rich big Moog sound.

Been comparing my Slim Phatty to the Sub37 and it sounds thin lacking in harmonics and quite sterile.

What was changed? I wonder if some things has to be sacrificed in order to add a more complex modulation matrix etc? All they needed to so is just get the LP sound and add the additional features on top.

My advice to someone who wants to add the Moog sound to your studio, just get a LP or Slim Phatty.
Old 18th May 2020
  #2
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Looneytune's Avatar
Not sure about that, I think it beats the Phatty.
Old 18th May 2020
  #3
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Jpro600k's Avatar
 

I bought moog sub sequent37cv for the first time, but I feel the sound is that of moog. It is very nice and no problem.
Old 18th May 2020
  #4
Gear Guru
 
Jamie munro's Avatar
Don't push it so hard, 37 drives

Also, the filter doesn't open as far iirc
Old 18th May 2020
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie munro View Post
Don't push it so hard, 37 drives

Also, the filter doesn't open as far iirc
Exactly. Keep the OSC levels below 12 in the mixer and don't add extra drive on the filter and you can get a very similar sound to the Matriarch for example. All the Moogs sound a little different but they all sound Moogish for sure.
Old 18th May 2020
  #6
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greenlights's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elsapo2001 View Post
Its an impressive looking keyboard but the moment you touch a key, meh.....

The Little Phatty line blows it out of the water with its Harmonically rich big Moog sound.

Been comparing my Slim Phatty to the Sub37 and it sounds thin lacking in harmonics and quite sterile.

What was changed? I wonder if some things has to be sacrificed in order to add a more complex modulation matrix etc? All they needed to so is just get the LP sound and add the additional features on top.

My advice to someone who wants to add the Moog sound to your studio, just get a LP or Slim Phatty.
I owned the the Slim Phatty a long time ago. Also had the Sub 37 and Subsequent 37(returned for warped keys multiple times) it had a great sound but the keys kept bothering me lol. I will say that the Subsequent 37 or Sub 37 had a fatter sound. The SP IMO was a little more smooth.
Old 18th May 2020
  #7
Gear Guru
 
Jamie munro's Avatar
Easy to forget the thinking and the subsequent meaning behind the 37, a company tries to go a slightly diff direction and they get lambasted for not staying true to history

Shame
Old 18th May 2020
  #8
eb7
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eb7's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie munro View Post
company tries to go a slightly diff direction and they get lambasted for not staying true to history
Right. I could understand the complaints about the Sub37 more five years ago, when it was either that or the much more expensive Voyager. But Moog offers more options today, so someone looking for that "classic" tone should just focus on the Matriarch/Grandmother/M32 line. Many of us like that the Sub37 sounds different.
Old 18th May 2020
  #9
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SkyWriter's Avatar
I find the Sub37, Little Phatty and Slim's all sound good together.
Old 18th May 2020
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elsapo2001 View Post
Its an impressive looking keyboard but the moment you touch a key, meh.....

The Little Phatty line blows it out of the water with its Harmonically rich big Moog sound.

Been comparing my Slim Phatty to the Sub37 and it sounds thin lacking in harmonics and quite sterile.

What was changed? I wonder if some things has to be sacrificed in order to add a more complex modulation matrix etc? All they needed to so is just get the LP sound and add the additional features on top.

My advice to someone who wants to add the Moog sound to your studio, just get a LP or Slim Phatty.
Do you own a Sub 37?

I didn't think so.
Old 18th May 2020
  #11
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pr0gr4m's Avatar
It most certainly does sound like a moog. Why would someone want every synth to have the same sound?
Old 18th May 2020
  #12
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It has bottom but it seems lacking in harmonics VS the LP Its quite odd.
Old 18th May 2020
  #13
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WozNYC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRSC View Post

Do you own a Sub 37?
I didn't think so.
I did (sold both Sub 37 and Subsequent 37) and I agree with the OP.
I love the layout and features of the Sub 37 models but much prefer
the sound of my Slim Phatty. Love my Voyager the most.
Old 4 days ago
  #14
Gear Nut
 

I found this topic because I was going to post yesterday and ask what the best way was to make the Sub37 (which I JUST got) sound more like a GM/Matriarch (both of which I have owned). Before I posted though, I realized that if I did what a few people have suggested here - turn down the OSCs and drive - it comes a lot closer to what I am aiming for and I'm pretty happy with it.

IMO maybe some of the problem is that (maybe other than 1 or 2), every single preset is uhh... not great. If you just jump through those and/or tweak the panel settings for them a bit, I think it's really easy to wind up with something unimpressive - in my opinion anyway.
Old 4 days ago
  #15
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by chochochocho View Post
I found this topic because I was going to post yesterday and ask what the best way was to make the Sub37 (which I JUST got) sound more like a GM/Matriarch (both of which I have owned). Before I posted though, I realized that if I did what a few people have suggested here - turn down the OSCs and drive - it comes a lot closer to what I am aiming for and I'm pretty happy with it.

IMO maybe some of the problem is that (maybe other than 1 or 2), every single preset is uhh... not great. If you just jump through those and/or tweak the panel settings for them a bit, I think it's really easy to wind up with something unimpressive - in my opinion anyway.
The Subsequent presets are a lot better, I think you can download them somewhere from the Moog website and load them into the Sub37 via the editor.
Old 4 days ago
  #16
Gear Nut
 
papoon's Avatar
 

I admit I do not have the best ear for this sort of thing, endless discussion regarding everything form 808 kick samples to slight difference in guitar pickups always made me question if the average listener really hears the difference. Again I admit I do not have the most discerning ear. As a sub 37 owner who has had it for about 3 years I read this thread and I am kinda confused.

I guess my question here is this, are we saying that with a sub 37, if one is trying to get a classic synth sound for a track/song they are recording it can't be done on a sub 37 but can be done on the other Moog synths mentioned?

I totally get having a preference (I sure do) for choosing one synth over another for a specific situation/song/recording. As such preferring a voyager or mini Moog over a sub 37, I totally get it. I just can't imagine having a Sub 37 in your studio and then going and renting a mini Moog to get the sound you need. Having said that, I almost never use presets and always start from scratch when I build patches and the sub 37 is crazy versatile to get what you are after from one extreme to the other. One should be able to dial in "classic " sounds easily.
Old 4 days ago
  #17
Lives for gear
 

Half the time I see a successful techno artist playing a livestream or jamming in their studio, they are using the Subsequent 37 for either the main bassline or one of the lead sounds for many of their tracks. The Sub37 is absolutely fine, sounds great.
Old 4 days ago
  #18
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XAXAU's Avatar
The more I use my Subsequent 37 the more impressed I get, the wobbly plastic pots annoy me tho, it’s very pricey for what you get but if you have to have the sound...

Have owned quite a few different moogs, slim phatty, slim phatty, minitaur, voyager and the 37 has its own signature Moog sound

That said I just got a Poly D as I had to have that vintage MiniMoog/Moog modular sound as well
Old 4 days ago
  #19
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie munro View Post
Don't push it so hard, 37 drives

Also, the filter doesn't open as far iirc
This took me a while to figure this out. Not with the 37, but even with the Lil’ Phatty and Sub Phatty that replaced it. The only “Moog” I had before it was a Studio Electronics, which has more headroom to the mixer and doesn’t get as hard if you crank it. The Phatty line was sort of about that, I figured. I ended up getting rid of the Sub Phatty because I liked the ATC-X more, though I missed that drive circuit thing. That really had a great harmonic buzz, but in the end it wasn’t enough to keep it and it was taking up a lot of space.

I think if you come to analog from VA where headroom is more plentiful, you don’t really think about cranking oscillators to vary the harmonic content of the oscillators. Now I know better. It’s one of the first things I mess with when getting the feel for a synth.
Old 4 days ago
  #20
Gear Head
 

The tuning is a lot more stable on the 37's, maybe that is what the OP is noticing as well?

The 37 can definitely get classic sounds, you just need to mind the osc levels. Also if you use an expression pedal you can open the filter a bit more...still darker than a Minimoog for example but it does help slightly. That being said every time I would hear a Minimoog I kept feeling like my 37 was missing something in its sound, and eventually sold it. It'd make a wonderful monosynth for live performance though.
Old 4 days ago
  #21
I absolutely love my Sub37.
I had the sub phatty but sold that after getting the sub37 and remade my patches on the 37.

I do understand people having a hard time getting it to sound creamy like a minimoog, bus as said before, set multidrive and feedback to zero and the osc levels to a maximum of 4.
This means you have to crank the main volume as you will loose a lot of output, but this will make sure the sub37 stays nice and sweet.

One different thing I do hear is the filter is a lot darker in the sub37 when fully open, compared to a mini.
I fitted a new filterboard with metal shaft and had to recalibrate the filter. I would love some tech-savvy to be able to tweak this calibration to get the filter to open up more. I'd say there should be a alway to do this, otherwise by modding the filter.

I'm still lurking for a model d, just because it's so damn cheap and the way it sounds. Might sell it again after I find out it overlaps too much with the sub37.

Just to mention, I had a voyager in the studio for a long time and have a MG1 for about 10 years
Old 2 days ago
  #22
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by papoon View Post
I admit I do not have the best ear for this sort of thing, endless discussion regarding everything form 808 kick samples to slight difference in guitar pickups always made me question if the average listener really hears the difference. Again I admit I do not have the most discerning ear.
Haha yes, I am the same on this - guitar pickup discussion is usually super funny to me. I saw 2 guitars at a store last week that are related but different, so I watched a Youtube video comparing their sound, and it's so close that's funny, and even though you can hear a bit of a difference when they've selected a certain setting, the idea that one is BETTER is just silly, there's maybe a 5% difference between them.

There's that saying that people listen with their eyes, and I 100% believe it (and probably do it myself.) Guys who just spend hundreds of dollars to upgrade something always think it's miles better.

Anyway back to the Sub37, I'm a bit surprised to hear people say that the filter doesn't get bright enough - to me, in almost every situation I've used it in so far, I couldn't even imagine turning it much past maybe 70% of the way because it's just way too harsh/trebly. Maybe I just prefer the dark sounds, or something else I'm doing is brightening it up a lot.
Old 2 days ago
  #23
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pppch's Avatar
 

maybe it's because bob didn't want a model-d reissue during his lifetime. he was more interested in new other synths.
could be the reason for the other sound. whether you like it is a matter of taste
I have the sub phatty (supposedly the best of the series ... roughest sound) and two model-d
Old 2 days ago
  #24
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chochochocho View Post
Haha yes, I am the same on this - guitar pickup discussion is usually super funny to me. I saw 2 guitars at a store last week that are related but different, so I watched a Youtube video comparing their sound, and it's so close that's funny, and even though you can hear a bit of a difference when they've selected a certain setting, the idea that one is BETTER is just silly, there's maybe a 5% difference between them.

There's that saying that people listen with their eyes, and I 100% believe it (and probably do it myself.) Guys who just spend hundreds of dollars to upgrade something always think it's miles better.

Anyway back to the Sub37, I'm a bit surprised to hear people say that the filter doesn't get bright enough - to me, in almost every situation I've used it in so far, I couldn't even imagine turning it much past maybe 70% of the way because it's just way too harsh/trebly. Maybe I just prefer the dark sounds, or something else I'm doing is brightening it up a lot.
Pickups have a huge effect on guitar tone. It’s similar to the effect speakers have on amps.
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