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-   -   TD-3 behringer 303 clone (https://www.gearslutz.com/board/electronic-music-instruments-and-electronic-music-production/1286361-td-3-behringer-303-clone.html)

Deleted 80b9b09 8th December 2019 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamie munro (Post 14371077)
Music store has been Feb 20 since 3 days after release bud kfhkh

Thomann next drop is 20.12 but red and blue only and all sold out

Their next one is a month later apparently

Here's the kicker: I ordered 10.11 and was supposed to get on Thomann first run but for whatever reason mine didn't get here, they said I was confirmed as being on the next run so I thought ok I'll sit tight but I only ordered silver from Thomann, now they confirm they only have red n blue on this next run, I asked for clarity on wtf they are talking about as in a previous mail I was told my silver defo arrives in next run due on 20.12, all of a sudden they don't speak great English on email and just repeat the same message.....

I am bored of the BS so I've cancelled and will now wait until uk shops actually have stock, yes I'll pay a bit extra but I won't get messed about and I won't need an adaptor

How annoying.

Music Store originally said end of November, then they emailed me.

Thomann currently saying still available in 1-2 weeks in red and blue.

Inclined to follow your lead, however, and just wait until they're in the UK.

salamander 8th December 2019 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wishy washy (Post 14371070)
I've been waiting for a long time this comparison with the Cyclone, and here is the first one I came across! Haven't listened to it yet.
ps, I assume this unit will be without the Maffez finetuning of course


I have 2 TT-303's mk1 and a mk2 also and I find my TT's sound more genuine and rubbery squelchy and barky with the accents than the TD-3.

I also have a TD-3

There is a big difference the TD-3 just is lacking in comparison with shorter accents that dont sound as good and the squelch factor is lost by this also.

I dont think the trim pot can compensate for this in the Behringer.

Deleted 3858745 8th December 2019 02:44 PM

Have you tried to adjust the trim pot on the td and back off the accent a bit?

01rsa 8th December 2019 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371109)
I have 2 TT-303's mk1 and a mk2 also and I find my TT's sound more genuine and rubbery squelchy and barky with the accents than the TD-3.

I also have a TD-3

There is a big difference the TD-3 just is lacking in comparison with shorter accents that dont sound as good and the squelch factor is lost by this also.

I dont think the trim pot can compensate for this in the Behringer.

You should share a particular recording you think that can't be done well with the TD-3
so TD3 owners can make their opinion.

It's just many times those kind of statements are over amplified like: X sucks because 'A+' said is was not as good as Z for this.
In reality the differences maybe insignificant for most and Z maybe slightly better than X in other contexts, but.. not really, so Z is definitely pure garbage. :)

salamander 8th December 2019 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deleted 3858745 (Post 14371150)
Have you tried to adjust the trim pot on the td and back off the accent a bit?

The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control ;)

Deleted 3858745 8th December 2019 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371163)
The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control ;)

OK, but it can have an impact on your perception and from the video comparison above it is clear that there is a difference when accent is at max so maybe the TD has higher range.

So I’ll take that as a no then. But you have adjusted your TT to your liking?

salamander 8th December 2019 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelurch (Post 14371169)
OK, but it can have an impact on your perception and from the video comparison above it is clear that there is a difference when accent is at max so maybe the TD has higher range.

So I’ll take that as a no then. But you have adjusted your TT to your liking?

You are ignoring what I have said - again I say

The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control

Deleted 3858745 8th December 2019 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371177)
You are ignoring what I have said - again I say

The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control

No, I addressed that in my first sentence. Seems it is you that is ignoring what I am saying.

pppch 8th December 2019 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deleted 3858745 (Post 14371179)
No, I addressed that in my first sentence. Seems it is you that is ignoring what I am saying.

maybe this helps ;) Behringer TD3 DIY Mods

rasseru 8th December 2019 03:15 PM

The polychain, are filters all controlled from one box or are they all independent?

goom 8th December 2019 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mutilatedlip (Post 14371073)
Music Store contacted to say my blue one is due February 2020.

I'm considering cancelling and going with Thomann.

Anyone else in this position?

I'd suggest getting a silver one. I bet they're making way more in that color.

I plan on getting 3 or more of these for various duties (within the next few years).

GarLander 8th December 2019 03:48 PM

where is my order?

https://youtu.be/sKD9gofmAUQ

mossie23 8th December 2019 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371109)
I have 2 TT-303's mk1 and a mk2 also and I find my TT's sound more genuine and rubbery squelchy and barky with the accents than the TD-3.

I also have a TD-3

There is a big difference the TD-3 just is lacking in comparison with shorter accents that dont sound as good and the squelch factor is lost by this also.

I dont think the trim pot can compensate for this in the Behringer.

You mean what happens around 8:10, right? It's quite obvious.

Deleted 3858745 8th December 2019 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mossie23 (Post 14371267)
You mean what happens around 8:10, right? It's quite obvious.

My guess would be no as it looks like the accent pot is turned all the way to the left.

There the slide seems longer on the TT and maybe the decay a bit higher (or the mysterious gate error?)

mossie23 8th December 2019 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelurch (Post 14371288)
My guess would be no as it looks like the accent pot is turned all the way to the left.

There the slide seems longer on the TT and maybe the decay a bit higher (or the mysterious gate error?)

I think it's about the length of the slide, it's too short on the TD it seems. Antto has also shown this in some graphs. It could be that this is partly responisble for the TD sounding less 'bubbly'.

Klankdroid 8th December 2019 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamie munro (Post 14371077)
Music store has been Feb 20 since 3 days after release bud kfhkh

Thomann next drop is 20.12 but red and blue only and all sold out

Their next one is a month later apparently

Here's the kicker: I ordered 10.11 and was supposed to get on Thomann first run but for whatever reason mine didn't get here, they said I was confirmed as being on the next run so I thought ok I'll sit tight but I only ordered silver from Thomann, now they confirm they only have red n blue on this next run, I asked for clarity on wtf they are talking about as in a previous mail I was told my silver defo arrives in next run due on 20.12, all of a sudden they don't speak great English on email and just repeat the same message.....

I am bored of the BS so I've cancelled and will now wait until uk shops actually have stock, yes I'll pay a bit extra but I won't get messed about and I won't need an adaptor

I'm gonna wait in patience, silver should arrive last week of january and the blue one a month later, both Musicstore, but not going to cancell as I have both of them ordered with a 10€ discount, so it's a bargain... eventually they will arrive and no money is booked as long as they are not shipped...

Klankdroid 8th December 2019 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371109)
I have 2 TT-303's mk1 and a mk2 also and I find my TT's sound more genuine and rubbery squelchy and barky with the accents than the TD-3.

I also have a TD-3

There is a big difference the TD-3 just is lacking in comparison with shorter accents that dont sound as good and the squelch factor is lost by this also.

I dont think the trim pot can compensate for this in the Behringer.

This comparison is not that good because he is not setting them up by ear, just by the knobs, but there is always going to be a difference in sound like that, I bet if you dial them both in you can get close enough... makes no difference for me
every clone brings something to the table...

mossie23 8th December 2019 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klankdroid (Post 14371366)
This comparison is not that good because he is not setting them up by ear, just by the knobs, but there is always going to be a difference in sound like that, I bet if you dial them both in you can get close enough... makes no difference for me
every clone brings something to the table...

There's no knob for accent or slide length, so any differences in those is 100% down to the design.

salamander 8th December 2019 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klankdroid (Post 14371366)
This comparison is not that good because he is not setting them up by ear, just by the knobs, but there is always going to be a difference in sound like that, I bet if you dial them both in you can get close enough... makes no difference for me
every clone brings something to the table...

You just believe what you want to believe and ignore facts all you like

It is like talking to a small child that just doesn't want to accept the truth as he doesn't like it and wants it to be different.

Just carry on with your cognitive dissonance

Deleted 80b9b09 8th December 2019 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371468)
You just believe what you want to believe and ignore facts all you like

It is like talking to a small child that just doesn't want to accept the truth as he doesn't like it and wants it to be different.

Just carry on with your cognitive dissonance

But he's right.

And the VCF trim will definitely affect the overall sound, like the slide and the accent.

If you removed any single component characteristic the 303 would not sound like it does.

Any alteration to one of these is indirectly going to affect the other. The brightness of the accent will be dulled slightly and the perceived sound will be different.

Of course, you could all just get Roland TB-303 Cloud as it's superb.

salamander 8th December 2019 05:59 PM

Again and for the last time - The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control.

pppch 8th December 2019 06:04 PM

since most do not read the mod thread ..

"I don´t have lab grade analyzing equipment, using my ears the effect of c52 seems to be this:

- notes: pitch goes lower

- slides: pitch goes higher, different timing/feeling

- attack: smoother

- accent: rounder

- slides melt better into the running pattern somehow, hard to describe

- bass response is the same though, it only feels lesser due to the attack time and less impact on the beginning of a note

- also, accent seems to be tamed a bit by this mod, as if it melts better with the pattern"

Deleted 3858745 8th December 2019 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371483)
Again and for the last time - The vcf trimpot has nothing to do with and cannot affect the accent length and squelch factor. It is just a filter brightness up and down control.

You keep ignoring what me and others are posting and keep regurgitating that as a mantra while calling other people little children.

It has an impact on your perception most definitely whether you like it or believe it to be true.

antto 8th December 2019 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pppch
since most do not read the mod thread ..

"I don´t have lab grade analyzing equipment, using my ears the effect of c52 seems to be this:

- notes: pitch goes lower

- slides: pitch goes higher, different timing/feeling

- attack: smoother

- accent: rounder

- slides melt better into the running pattern somehow, hard to describe

- bass response is the same though, it only feels lesser due to the attack time and less impact on the beginning of a note

- also, accent seems to be tamed a bit by this mod, as if it melts better with the pattern"

sorry but this is bullsh*t

i could use similar words and write a pseudo technical poem too

antto 8th December 2019 06:20 PM

good luck with salamander, folks
he is a bassbot fanboi and doesn't cooperate

he is correct about the TM3 having no impact on the accent "length"

but on the other hand, he might be forgetting that the bassbot has extended parameter ranges, specifically the accent and iirc the envmod
i have the impression that his 303 was modified (but my memory is rusty)

gentleclockdivid 8th December 2019 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelurch (Post 14371288)
My guess would be no as it looks like the accent pot is turned all the way to the left.

There the slide seems longer on the TT and maybe the decay a bit higher (or the mysterious gate error?)

On the original ( and good enough clones )
Accented notes will sound different to non accented notes , even when accent trimpot is set to zero and when there is env mod env + decay going on
And when env mod + accent is set to zero + some decay , accented notes will still sound (subtly ) different .

pppch 8th December 2019 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antto (Post 14371522)
sorry but this is bullsh*t

i could use similar words and write a pseudo technical poem too

why so friendly today? fact is maffez and friends are at it, so calm down.

ps. that's not mine, so footnote

Klankdroid 8th December 2019 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mossie23 (Post 14371394)
There's no knob for accent length, so any differences in that is 100% down to the design.

I'm not talking about the trimpots, I'm talking about the knobs on the frontpanel !!

antto 8th December 2019 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pppch
why so friendly today? fact is maffez and friends are at it, so calm down.

ps. that's not mine, so footnote

i know exactly which post you copy/pasted, and you should read my post following that, then think
unfriendly because they told me "shaddap, we're talking technical here" and then they posted stuff like that.. and now you copy paste it here too

as soon as someone writes something.. "the sky is brown" it turns into a fact on teh internetz and spreads

Klankdroid 8th December 2019 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamander (Post 14371468)
You just believe what you want to believe and ignore facts all you like

It is like talking to a small child that just doesn't want to accept the truth as he doesn't like it and wants it to be different.

Just carry on with your cognitive dissonance


But I'm just saying I have not problem with small differences, I will own the td-3 next to a tt-303 a tb-3 and a tb-03 , they all sound different and I don't care... would be silly to own them all if they all sounded the same so that's why for me personally it does not matter, i'm not trying to convince you.... you is you, me is me.... different cases for different people... have a nice day !! by the way I like your records more then the way you behave against me... but no problem dude