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Speculation on the next Sequential instrument
Old 1 week ago
  #2131
Gear Nut
 

I love the OB6, P3 and Pro3. But what I mis from Sequential are synths at much more friendly budgets.
Most people around the world don't have 2k laying around to spent on a synth so I also think Sequential missing out on a huge market.

I like the sound of the Toriaz AS-1 but it lacks a lot of hands on controls so my hope is something like that with loads of knobs.
Why not bring 5 smaller synths to the market at 500,- first (or even cheaper and go Eurorack) before going the most expensive route again? It will please a lot more people.
Old 1 week ago
  #2132
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I don’t get the the whole Pro 6 or Pro 8 idea. You think they would make a synth with 6 or 8 voices of the Pro 3? Meaning 2 VCO and 1 digital OSC per voice 6x or 8x? I don’t think so... how much would this even cost??? I don’t know about you all, but I not buying a $15,000.00 synth... synths are like cars when you buy brand new. That value drops soon as you receive it.
There is no way it would cost more than a Moog One.
Old 1 week ago
  #2133
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Synthpark's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I don’t get the the whole Pro 6 or Pro 8 idea. You think they would make a synth with 6 or 8 voices of the Pro 3? Meaning 2 VCO and 1 digital OSC per voice 6x or 8x? I don’t think so... how much would this even cost??? I don’t know about you all, but I not buying a $15,000.00 synth... synths are like cars when you buy brand new. That value drops soon as you receive it.
$15000? Take a look at the Minilogue XD or Prologue. Two analog VCOs and one digital. if they make a premium version of that it will be fine but way below 15000$.
Old 1 week ago
  #2134
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XAXAU's Avatar
Also, Behringer have sort of lowered the price of what people are willing to pay for circuitry, they have showed it can be done

People will be hissing like vampires at crosses if anyone comes out with “overpriced” synths

I’m sure Behringer could have made the OB-6 for half of what it’s going for now $3000 in Europe)

Sure it wouldn’t be as nice but in the hands of the right project manager it would have been possible

Pro 6 would be stealing to much thunder from the P6 & OB6 unfortunately, but it would be my desert island poly. Hell, I could even have it as my only synth and still be very happy
Old 1 week ago
  #2135
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greenlights's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Champ View Post
I love the OB6, P3 and Pro3. But what I mis from Sequential are synths at much more friendly budgets.
Most people around the world don't have 2k laying around to spent on a synth so I also think Sequential missing out on a huge market.

I like the sound of the Toriaz AS-1 but it lacks a lot of hands on controls so my hope is something like that with loads of knobs.
Why not bring 5 smaller synths to the market at 500,- first (or even cheaper and go Eurorack) before going the most expensive route again? It will please a lot more people.

Now don’t get me wrong lol. I wouldn’t mind spending up $6k but that’s only because I want the Moog One 8 voice. At the same time, it’s not something I would do for every synth. A more comfortable price for me is $2-4K(and anything under of course). I’m not asking for a synth under 2k. I’m fine with their current pricing method. I see what your saying too though.
Old 1 week ago
  #2136
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greenlights's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by XAXAU View Post
Also, Behringer have sort of lowered the price of what people are willing to pay for circuitry, they have showed it can be done

People will be hissing like vampires at crosses if anyone comes out with “overpriced” synths

I’m sure Behringer could have made the OB-6 for half of what it’s going for now $3000 in Europe)

Sure it wouldn’t be as nice but in the hands of the right project manager it would have been possible

Pro 6 would be stealing to much thunder from the P6 & OB6 unfortunately, but it would be my desert island poly. Hell, I could even have it as my only synth and still be very happy
I will never buy Behringer! I understand their mission blah blah blah, but I still don’t respect their business. I don’t like companies that copy other people’s ideas, then undercut the entire market.
Old 1 week ago
  #2137
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Synthpark's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I will never buy Behringer! I understand their mission blah blah blah, but I still don’t respect their business. I don’t like companies that copy other people’s ideas, then undercut the entire market.
I can agree with that. On the other hand, Roland had more than 15 years time to make a reissue of their well beloved analog evergreen synthesizers, and they ignored customer demands. Almost the same for Korg. Now this Behringer attack is like a punishment. All the clone producers (xoxbox etc) are doing the same thing.
Old 1 week ago
  #2138
Kja
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Roland and korg undercut American companies when they made their Poly's for cheaper... But I think behringer is just not a likable company for allot of people, and they don't have good taste, ugly questionable designs that look cheap and they are not friendly. Also they "might" be a cult, or atleast might have cult tendencies with the whole "tribe- we're taking over!" thing.
Old 1 week ago
  #2139
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daviddever's Avatar
In the US, the extended Mopho family is affordable enough used, with the Prophet '08 not far behind. This may be different in Europe and elsewhere, but that ultimately has less to do with Sequential themselves than local distributors' logistics costs on relatively small-ish volume.

Analogue filters are a prominent component of Sequential products, then and now, so I'd be wary of anyone who, lacking experience in product development and sourcing, declares that Sequential can develop even cheaper products solely on principle without cutting corners somewhere.

On the flag-waving front, there are some baseline costs involved with engineered-/made-/built-/assembled-in-USA products that, as an American, I'd PREFER to pay on principle. And I realize that, while this is less significant to those outside the US, that capital ultimately sustains the global MI industry by maintaining an engineered standard of performance and functionality (rather than cost or affordability, in a race toward the bottom) that sets the bar for other manufacturers.

If Sequential builds mid-price products that are aspirational, sound great, and are revered in a decade or two, then they've ultimately succeeded.
Old 1 week ago
  #2140
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tjontheroad's Avatar
I doubt a poly PRO 3 is in the works. PRO 3 is a deep synth with complexity. Dave Smith said it would be something simple or at least simpler. I’m thinking something lower priced.
Old 1 week ago
  #2141
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greenlights's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kja View Post
Roland and korg undercut American companies when they made their Poly's for cheaper... But I think behringer is just not a likable company for allot of people, and they don't have good taste, ugly questionable designs that look cheap and they are not friendly. Also they "might" be a cult, or atleast might have cult tendencies with the whole "tribe- we're taking over!" thing.
Korg and Roland made their own unique synthesizers with their own name. Nothing wrong with that if they’re making synths at a lower budget. They didn’t make things mimicking instruments such as the Prophet 5, and call it the Korg Brophet 5 or Roland RS-80(Yamaha CS-80) charging 25% of the cost. And to my knowledge Korg and Roland’s synths were not cheap. Take the Jupiter 8 for example.
Old 1 week ago
  #2142
This is probably a no brainer but would there ever be a chance of Tom Oberheim working with someone else asides from Sequential? I'm guessing his close friendship with Dave and experience with DSI that he probably would have no reason to change, but I was just wondering how he will make this next polysynth that he has been mentioning.
Old 1 week ago
  #2143
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I will never buy Behringer! I understand their mission blah blah blah, but I still don’t respect their business. I don’t like companies that copy other people’s ideas, then undercut the entire market.
What about people that undercut the entire market but with original ideas?

I will buy any brand of gear though, BTW my first mono synth was a DSI Mopho SE.

Some of us don't have the luxury of being able to afford the originals....or think they are overpriced.

The only Behringer gear I currently have is the MS-1 and RD-8. Most of my synths are older than me though, the cheaper ones that less people want (mostly digital).

P.S. My MS-1 stopped working when I updated the firmware...so I am pretty mad about that and still haven't received a response from Behringer.
Old 1 week ago
  #2144
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FlyingMusician's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebodyperson View Post
What about people that undercut the entire market but with original ideas?
That's a free market and competition at work to being prices down. Nothing wrong with that, but very different to what Behringer has a long history of doing.

Just take a moment and read this article:
https://books.google.com/books?id=iQ...%20bus&f=false

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I will never buy Behringer! I understand their mission blah blah blah, but I still don’t respect their business. I don’t like companies that copy other people’s ideas, then undercut the entire market.
I have great respect for this
Old 1 week ago
  #2145
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Synthpark's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebodyperson View Post
What about people that undercut the entire market but with original ideas?

I will buy any brand of gear though, BTW my first mono synth was a DSI Mopho SE.

Some of us don't have the luxury of being able to afford the originals....or think they are overpriced.

The only Behringer gear I currently have is the MS-1 and RD-8. Most of my synths are older than me though, the cheaper ones that less people want (mostly digital).

P.S. My MS-1 stopped working when I updated the firmware...so I am pretty mad about that and still haven't received a response from Behringer.
Behringer seems to **** up the firmware regularly. That is quite surprising given the size of the company. I cannot believe that Behringer does not realize how important it is to have a full functioning firmware or, in general, a product without major flaws. A good company will analyze the weakest point in development and take appropriate actions quite fast.

I wrote them that their Model D has a serious problem with retrigger mode: when enabled it introduces some huge delay (like 15ms). And the work behind cannot be that complicated so I wonder what kind of team is doing the work.

As an answer I get that I should make for them a video. "I am not doing your job"! If the service is too lazy to check my very precise problem case then it is useless.

It also means that I will have reservations towards new products from them.
Old 1 week ago
  #2146
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingMusician View Post
That's a free market and competition at work to being prices down. Nothing wrong with that, but very different to what Behringer has a long history of doing.

Just take a moment and read this article:
https://books.google.com/books?id=iQ...%20bus&f=false


I have great respect for this
Ok just asking, because that is what I do. ;P

I do wish Behringer's focus was 50% new stuff, 50% clones....instead of 90% clones, 10% new stuff....and that they fix the code before releasing the stuff. Polish it, don't rush.
Old 1 week ago
  #2147
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Am I the only one hopeful that we will be shown something before the month is over?
Old 1 week ago
  #2148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebodyperson View Post
Ok just asking, because that is what I do. ;P

I do wish Behringer's focus was 50% new stuff, 50% clones....instead of 90% clones, 10% new stuff....and that they fix the code before releasing the stuff. Polish it, don't rush.
True. But... mass market is their whole thing, and probably the only way to recoup their costs.

Boutique developers can take a long time because it can be 1-3 people doing everything a company does. Behringer can take a long time because they only make $10-$30 (totally made that up) on every synth and there no financial incentive to fix what's broken vs. release a new clone the hoards will snap up.

Sequential is in the middle, toward the boutique side, it seems. That's a good place to be. I hope. 1 or 2 quality products per year with enough of them made that people aren't lacking or competing for limited runs.

I still think the next release will either be a version of something already existing (e.g., desktop Pro3, Rev3, etc.) or a stripped down version of something already existing to come at a lower price point.
Old 1 week ago
  #2149
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by vitocorleone123 View Post
True. But... mass market is their whole thing, and probably the only way to recoup their costs.

Boutique developers can take a long time because it can be 1-3 people doing everything a company does. Behringer can take a long time because they only make $10-$30 (totally made that up) on every synth and there no financial incentive to fix what's broken vs. release a new clone the hoards will snap up.

Sequential is in the middle, toward the boutique side, it seems. That's a good place to be. I hope. 1 or 2 quality products per year with enough of them made that people aren't lacking or competing for limited runs.

I still think the next release will either be a version of something already existing (e.g., desktop Pro3, Rev3, etc.) or a stripped down version of something already existing to come at a lower price point.
I am hoping Sequential releses something at a low price point and something that is the most powerful synth they have ever made.....one product to lust after and 1 product that I can buy. My first mono synth being the Mopho SE it overwhelmed me and I sold it...now that I know more about synths and synthesis it would be no problem, so I want to get another Sequential synth.

P.S. I bought it new too and sold it cheap....I was dumb.
Old 1 week ago
  #2150
Gear Maniac
 



Behold, the Prophet-4 .
Old 6 days ago
  #2151
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Sequential should name a synth "Reposado"

Dave loves a lot of those powerful, crazy, and hard sounds; the Reposado would be a synth based on delicacy, ambience, and restraint.
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Old 6 days ago
  #2152
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daviddever's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthpark View Post
Behringer seems to **** up the firmware regularly. That is quite surprising given the size of the company. I cannot believe that Behringer does not realize how important it is to have a full functioning firmware or, in general, a product without major flaws. A good company will analyze the weakest point in development and take appropriate actions quite fast.

I wrote them that their Model D has a serious problem with retrigger mode: when enabled it introduces some huge delay (like 15ms). And the work behind cannot be that complicated so I wonder what kind of team is doing the work.

As an answer I get that I should make for them a video. "I am not doing your job"! If the service is too lazy to check my very precise problem case then it is useless.

It also means that I will have reservations towards new products from them.
In the past, I'd have agreed, though it's pretty important these days to be able to demonstrate that an event happened, under certain conditions, so that the team responsible knows that there exists, at the least, a real (if not intermittent) bug.
Old 6 days ago
  #2153
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greenlights's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebodyperson View Post
Sequential should name a synth "Reposado"

Dave loves a lot of those powerful, crazy, and hard sounds; the Reposado would be a synth based on delicacy, ambience, and restraint.
6 voices!!!
Old 6 days ago
  #2154
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Ha! We have the same lime squeezer, and for the same purpose. We're also a tequila + Cointreau margarita household, though we probably use more of the latter than Dave and add a splash of St. Germain as well.

I agree that it's important to have the ability to create subtle nuance in sound. That said, restraint in sound design should be up to the sound designer, not a built-in limitation of the synth itself IMHO. So long as you can dial in just a little of some of the harsher elements to spice things up without going overboard, I'm good. If a synth can't sound awful then it's not flexible enough!
Old 6 days ago
  #2155
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Somebodyperson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Ha! We have the same lime squeezer, and for the same purpose. We're also a tequila + Cointreau margarita household, though we probably use more of the latter than Dave and add a splash of St. Germain as well.

I agree that it's important to have the ability to create subtle nuance in sound. That said, restraint in sound design should be up to the sound designer, not a built-in limitation of the synth itself IMHO. So long as you can dial in just a little of some of the harsher elements to spice things up without going overboard, I'm good. If a synth can't sound awful then it's not flexible enough!
What I meant by it is a synth that has extra features that are aimed more at the ambient realm, not restricting things. Most of his added features, like tuned feedback are more for the extreme....which I do love, I just am curious what Dave could do on the opposite side of the spectrum. Not many synths aim themselves in such a way, one of the only synths that comes to mind is the UDO Super 6.
Old 6 days ago
  #2156
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guyaguy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somebodyperson View Post
What I meant by it is a synth that has extra features that are aimed more at the ambient realm, not restricting things. Most of his added features, like tuned feedback are more for the extreme....which I do love, I just am curious what Dave could do on the opposite side of the spectrum. Not many synths aim themselves in such a way, one of the only synths that comes to mind is the UDO Super 6.
I don’t think of features like that as specifically harsh vs ambient. Most demo show tuned feedback in conjunction with at least one oscillator to add grit and harmonics and often end up gnarly. But remove the oscillator and you have pure Karplus-Strong synthesis which is capable of quite subtle textures as well as harsh ones. But even using it in conjunction with oscillators can add complexity to a patch—whether soft or harsh.
Old 5 days ago
  #2157
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights View Post
I will never buy Behringer! I understand their mission blah blah blah, but I still don’t respect their business. I don’t like companies that copy other people’s ideas, then undercut the entire market.
Name one big business that isn't shady?

This obsession with people thinking that capitalism brings forward honest businesses is beyond stupidity. The only reason people think this way is because A. they never had a big business. (or small, it doesn't really matter). B. They only think this way because marketing from previous companies already stole their hearts and they can't think straight again.

At least we have some choices now which is better than no choice at all. And btw originality doesn't exist either. We as people copy known stuff and put those together to create something new or it happens by accident during research etc. Inventors don't exist, we don't create something new out of nothing. So basically what some call stealing is just how we always have done things.

All you do is defending companies that looked 40 year the other way. How long does it take to know these companies care more about their own pockets than what synths people are really asking for?
Old 5 days ago
  #2158
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PeteJames's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjontheroad View Post
I doubt a poly PRO 3 is in the works. PRO 3 is a deep synth with complexity. Dave Smith said it would be something simple or at least simpler. I’m thinking something lower priced.
Sorry I missed this. Do you have a link to the interview or quote? If that's the case i'm not really that interested which frees me up to make some new synth purchases without concern.
Old 5 days ago
  #2159
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PeteJames's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by XAXAU View Post

I’m sure Behringer could have made the OB-6 for half of what it’s going for now $3000 in Europe)
I'm sure they could make it for a quarter
Old 5 days ago
  #2160
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Champ View Post
Name one big business that isn't shady?

This obsession with people thinking that capitalism brings forward honest businesses is beyond stupidity. The only reason people think this way is because A. they never had a big business. (or small, it doesn't really matter). B. They only think this way because marketing from previous companies already stole their hearts and they can't think straight again.

At least we have some choices now which is better than no choice at all. And btw originality doesn't exist either. We as people copy known stuff and put those together to create something new or it happens by accident during research etc. Inventors don't exist, we don't create something new out of nothing. So basically what some call stealing is just how we always have done things.

All you do is defending companies that looked 40 year the other way. How long does it take to know these companies care more about their own pockets than what synths people are really asking for?


so defeated.
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