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Speculation on the next Sequential instrument
Old 26th June 2019
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
I’d go as far as to say that things got a lot better for Moog without Bob. The last thing he did was the Phatty, eh? I think they’ve really come a long way since then. Sequential isn’t a one man show. I think someone from the company did mention that there’s already an FPGA in the Prophet 12, though not as an oscillator. I’d actually be surprised if he wasn’t grooming the next generation of instrument designers to continue the Sequential name.
Even one of the reasons he mentioned for going back to the Sequential name was that he wouldn't be there forever, and 'Dave Smith Instruments' makes little sense without Dave Smith
Old 26th June 2019
  #62
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unease's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Life View Post
Even one of the reasons he mentioned for going back to the Sequential name was that he wouldn't be there forever, and 'Dave Smith Instruments' makes little sense without Dave Smith
Well, just like ”Moog”
Old 26th June 2019
  #63
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unease's Avatar
Some of you say that now with the Summit, the P12 has been surpassed and there is no room for another hybrid in that price range. I’m not so sure about that. The Summit is pretty close to the Peak sound wise and I never felt that the Peak did the same thing as the P12. I don’t think the Summit changes that so much.

Also, having two hybrid synths in the same price range doesn’t seem very crowded compared to the flood of cheap analog mono synths that have been released the last years.

Then there is the Quantum, which arguably surpasses both at a higher price. But again, that is a very different animal to the P12. Sequential has always been good at designing synths that are very hands-on with a lot of real time control. The Quantum is a multi-engine synth with a lot of possibilities but that comes at the price of a more complex UI that is more screen centric. So, different animals!
Old 26th June 2019
  #64
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by unease View Post
Some of you say that now with the Summit, the P12 has been surpassed and there is no room for another hybrid in that price range. I’m not so sure about that. The Summit is pretty close to the Peak sound wise and I never felt that the Peak did the same thing as the P12. I don’t think the Summit changes that so much.
Whether or not you think the Summit surpasses the Prophet 12 depends on your taste. I personally don’t hear much overlap in those two instruments at all, and if you look at it on paper, the Prophet 12 surpasses the Summit in most ways. I’ve got a 12 and a Peak, and if I had to keep one, it would be the 12 for sure.
Old 26th June 2019
  #65
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I want one of two things, and either thing gets my money. I’ll try to fight it, but I’ll lose.

1) expanded VCO based synth with at least 8 voices, but I want 12+. At least 2 LFOs. 5 octaves. Basically Uber P6/OB6.

You’re not going to let Behri have this are you?

2) just give me an Evolver with all the new Sequential stuff: new digital oscillators, new VCOs, new filters, new FX, tuned feedback. Minimum 6 voices (ReVolver idea). 8 voices yum. No DCOs and no CEM chips. If the analog oscillators aren’t VCOs, I’ll be soul crushed. Same for the Curtis filters - gotta use the new ones.

Gun metal blue.

Sorry. I know it’s a reissue, but if there’s a view that’s there’s “nowhere left to go” or “let’s groom the company to move forward”, there’s something of a statement to revolve back to where it all started and start over. Although we might have to wait for an Evolver 2.0AE - 20th Anniversary Edition.

Oh and Fatar TP-8S please.
Old 26th June 2019
  #66
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I wasn’t trying to claim better or worse for Summit vs. P12, though. I just think in terms of what the company has done and how it can keep its distinct approach to the market, simply going head to head with recent or upcoming top-line synths isn’t in their modus operandi.

To do their own distinct thing and not repeat themselves, providing a more ambitious analogue VCO synth would be a useful challenge, and leverage a lot of what they’ve done recently.

The problem with deep synths like the Moog One and Quantum is that they don’t lend themselves to instant sonic appeal; we’ve seen that in discussions of the One, certainly it was the case with the Andromeda of long ago, and I’d say it was probably a limiting factor for the P12 as well.

Sequential I think has done best when they’ve focused on the sonic results and playability first, features last.

Whatever criticisms can be made of their current lineup, there is absolutely no doubt they sre all beautiful-sounding first, very playable next.

That’s what they should stick with as the core of their identity.
Old 26th June 2019
  #67
bax
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by blewis_13 View Post
2) just give me an Evolver with all the new Sequential stuff: new digital oscillators, new VCOs, new filters, new FX, tuned feedback. Minimum 6 voices (ReVolver idea). 8 voices yum. No DCOs and no CEM chips. If the analog oscillators aren’t VCOs, I’ll be soul crushed. Same for the Curtis filters - gotta use the new ones.
This.

DCO vs VCO for the analog oscillators isn't a 100% deal-breaker for me, but absolutely keep dedicated Slop if so (don't want to waste LFOs).

I definitely still want the ability to load user waves for the digital oscillators (like the Evolver) but it would be nicer if that was expanded upon a little bit. Not looking for multisampling or anything crazy like that, but larger than 128 sample single-cycle waveforms would be a nice luxury...

The Character Effects are interesting, and having 3-4 delay lines is also nice (at least 1 second max per???). Dedicated reverb would be a very nice addition, as well as a reasonable amount of mod fx. Totally get that you can do a lot with 4 delay lines, but many of us are lazy

True stereo path all the way through. Stereo input. Lotsa knobs and buttons and wheels and sliders and stuff. Same OLED screen/interface from Pro12/Pro 2. Poly chain capability like PEK/PER implementation for folks who have won a lottery and can afford it. For the price it's gonna have to cost anyway, make a deal with SoundTower to include the librarian with every purchase.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blewis_13 View Post
Gun metal blue.
And I even like the color! But please don't go crazy with super-brite blue LEDs like the Evo.

Take my money (and I'm sure it would be a LOT of my money; north of Prophet X territory I'm sure)!

Thanks!
bax
Old 26th June 2019
  #68
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unease's Avatar
A new big VCO synth with more features would make sense at some point but maybe not right now? The just stopped production of both the P12 and P2 - surely they will add some kind of hybrid synth to their lineup.
Old 26th June 2019
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unease View Post
A new big VCO synth with more features would make sense at some point but maybe not right now?
Yes and no.

There’s a small window preceding the UB-Xa to make money off a 8+ voice VCO synth. And the development path seems “straightforward” from where they are now.

Maybe they’ve already decided that money is gone? Maybe anyone in their market will buy both?
Old 26th June 2019
  #70
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daviddever's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by unease View Post
A new big VCO synth with more features would make sense at some point but maybe not right now? The just stopped production of both the P12 and P2 - surely they will add some kind of hybrid synth to their lineup.
Arguably, the Prophet X range fits that (hybrid) description.

A Tempest redux with sample import, more voices, and analogue SSI filters could be a thing, notwithstanding space concerns (there's a lot of small embedded boards out there that can run QNX Neutrino, small enough to fit inside a drum machine form-factor).
Old 26th June 2019
  #71
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unease's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by blewis_13 View Post
Yes and no.

There’s a small window preceding the UB-Xa to make money off a 8+ voice VCO synth. And the development path seems “straightforward” from where they are now.

Maybe they’ve already decided that money is gone? Maybe anyone in their market will buy both?
My guess is that the design of the new synth(s) began well before they knew anything about the UB-Xa. But it could of course still have affected their plans. The window you mentioned might already be closed since everyone knows that Behringer will release the UB and other polys.

Now that CEM chips are made available again, Behringer are announcing several analogue polys and also MFB has a really affordable 8-voice VCO synth coming, I think it won’t be enough for Sequential to release a slightly extended P6 or OB6 that costs more than those. They need to differentiate themselves and an advanced hybrid might be a way to do something more unique.
Old 26th June 2019
  #72
My comment is: why would Sequential create more competition for their existing poly synth lines? They have the Rev2, Prophet 6, and OB6 in production, all of which are doing well.

That's why my bet is either: (a) analog monosynth, or (b) digital poly.

Most likely it will be an analog monosynth because, currently, they will lack a mono in their product lineup once the Pro2 is retired.
Old 26th June 2019
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Meeker View Post
My comment is: why would Sequential create more competition for their existing poly synth lines? They have the Rev2, Prophet 6, and OB6 in production, all of which are doing well.

That's why my bet is either: (a) analog monosynth, or (b) digital poly.

Most likely it will be an analog monosynth because, currently, they will lack a mono in their product lineup once the Pro2 is retired.
Assume you are in the market and have budget for an analog monosynth. Assume all features relevant to you are present.

What would you be willing to pay for one from DSI?
Old 26th June 2019
  #74
If they can make a vco mono that is programmable, has a 3 octave keyboard and affordable then there should be a market.
Old 27th June 2019
  #75
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by drockfresh View Post
My bet is Tempest-X
Dave Smith did express interest in a product like that during the Sonic State interview back at NAMM this year. He also specifically ruled it out as their next product, also stating that whatever comes next will be significantly different than the Prophet X. So I’m not expecting samples to play any major role. There is definitely something in the works for this year, and it sounded like he was aiming for a summer reveal at the time.

Personally, I really want a poly with a flexible dual filter configuration. Stereo filtering is only strikes me as necessary when your oscillators start out with binaural content you want to preserve (as with samples), so I’m fine with panning post-filter as in most conventional oscillator designs. The only reason I didn’t succumb to the Pro 2 sale at Sweetwater was the hope for a polyphonic synth with some of that same flexibility. I’ve been seriously tempted by the Moog One for that reason.

Somewhere upthread there was the potentially rhetorical question of “why not use a Prophet 12 in mono” instead of a Pro 2. The Pro 2 is much more of a powerhouse on the filtering side of things. A pair of discrete filters, one of them state variable, in parallel or series unlocks a world of possibilities that I really enjoyed exploring during my brief encounter. I’d be delighted to see that with even a handful of voices, even more so in a multitimbral configuration.
Old 27th June 2019
  #76
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drockfresh's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Dave Smith did express interest in a product like that during the Sonic State interview back at NAMM this year. He also specifically ruled it out as their next product, also stating that whatever comes next will be significantly different than the Prophet X. So I’m not expecting samples to play any major role. There is definitely something in the works for this year, and it sounded like he was aiming for a summer reveal at the time.

Personally, I really want a poly with a flexible dual filter configuration. Stereo filtering is only strikes me as necessary when your oscillators start out with binaural content you want to preserve (as with samples), so I’m fine with panning post-filter as in most conventional oscillator designs. The only reason I didn’t succumb to the Pro 2 sale at Sweetwater was the hope for a polyphonic synth with some of that same flexibility. I’ve been seriously tempted by the Moog One for that reason.

Somewhere upthread there was the potentially rhetorical question of “why not use a Prophet 12 in mono” instead of a Pro 2. The Pro 2 is much more of a powerhouse on the filtering side of things. A pair of discrete filters, one of them state variable, in parallel or series unlocks a world of possibilities that I really enjoyed exploring during my brief encounter. I’d be delighted to see that with even a handful of voices, even more so in a multitimbral configuration.
A poly pro-2 with 2 separate sequencers (or more) would be a home run
Old 27th June 2019
  #77
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Analog Rob Lowe's Avatar
A 21st century newly designed 6trak-drumtrak combo would suit me fine, please make it knobby this time Dave oh...and include that luscious PX filter

Last edited by Analog Rob Lowe; 27th June 2019 at 03:43 AM.. Reason: With multiple outs
Old 27th June 2019
  #78
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Dave Smith did express interest in a product like that during the Sonic State interview back at NAMM this year. He also specifically ruled it out as their next product, also stating that whatever comes next will be significantly different than the Prophet X. So I’m not expecting samples to play any major role. There is definitely something in the works for this year, and it sounded like he was aiming for a summer reveal at the time.

Personally, I really want a poly with a flexible dual filter configuration. Stereo filtering is only strikes me as necessary when your oscillators start out with binaural content you want to preserve (as with samples), so I’m fine with panning post-filter as in most conventional oscillator designs. The only reason I didn’t succumb to the Pro 2 sale at Sweetwater was the hope for a polyphonic synth with some of that same flexibility. I’ve been seriously tempted by the Moog One for that reason.

Somewhere upthread there was the potentially rhetorical question of “why not use a Prophet 12 in mono” instead of a Pro 2. The Pro 2 is much more of a powerhouse on the filtering side of things. A pair of discrete filters, one of them state variable, in parallel or series unlocks a world of possibilities that I really enjoyed exploring during my brief encounter. I’d be delighted to see that with even a handful of voices, even more so in a multitimbral configuration.
Have you tried the Matrixbrute? Its parallel/serial multi node filters are brilliant. It’s a supremely flexible beast.

Stephen
Old 27th June 2019
  #79
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kuroichi's Avatar
 

Just put the AS-1 in a keyboard with knob per function, some patch points and extra envelopes and lfos.
Old 27th June 2019
  #80
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Bennett View Post
Have you tried the Matrixbrute? Its parallel/serial multi mode filters are brilliant. It’s a supremely flexible beast.
I haven’t done more than kick the tires on one briefly. I do occasionally track down demos because I know it gets a lot of love, but it just doesn’t seem to speak to me. Perhaps it’s something about the glaringly absurd surface area to voice ratio that keeps whispering to me that I should expect something truly magical and I’m just not hearing it.

The Pro 2 really surprised me but you’ll note I don’t own one of them, either. I’ve simply never felt the need to devote that much space to a mono (or paraphonic) instrument. It is certainly the one that has come closest.
Old 27th June 2019
  #81
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
I haven’t done more than kick the tires on one briefly. I do occasionally track down demos because I know it gets a lot of love, but it just doesn’t seem to speak to me. Perhaps it’s something about the glaringly absurd surface area to voice ratio that keeps whispering to me that I should expect something truly magical and I’m just not hearing it.

The Pro 2 really surprised me but you’ll note I don’t own one of them, either. I’ve simply never felt the need to devote that much space to a mono (or paraphonic) instrument. It is certainly the one that has come closest.
It is rather big! I'm a mono fan and and the MB sounds very different to my Moogs and ARP. I can coax some very MS20 and VCS3-type sounds out of it. But it does have teh 'brute 'sound' for good or ill. The paraphony is nice too as are the analog effects.

But the Pro 2 is very different of course.

Stephen
Old 7th July 2019
  #82
Here for the gear
Having just bought a Prophet 12, I kinda hope the next one is not a new take on the Prophet 12 idea. I do find myself drawn quite heavily towards a Prophet 6 for my next hardware synth. I think the idea of doing the OB-6 with the same formfactor was very smart, it also creates a P6 vs OB-6 discussion instead of, is the P6 worth it kind of discussion? (And also the desire to have both side by side) In talks I've heard Dave say the P6 have been very successful, so that may lead one to belive more VCO based synths could be in the works.

I'd say one or two more "flavours" of the same analog poly form factor/price tag as the P6 would be very interesting. No idea what it would be exactly though, but I guess it would start with the filter setup being something different.

Since I'm in the market for a P6 in the not too distant future, I'm a bit mixed on the idea of a super P6 on steroids with a double price tag, because then I may feel like I must have that instead of the P6, and that will likely cost alot more. On the other hand, I picked the P12 over the P6 first because of all the options and knowing the P6 featureset would feel more limiting.

Whatever they are up to I'm sure it's gonna be something exciting though. Summer NAMM is closing in quite fast, around 2 weeks, what's the probability that they will show something off there? If I had to guess anything, I'd guess a PX module maybe?
Old 7th July 2019
  #83
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Fuseball's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuroichi View Post
Just put the AS-1 in a keyboard with knob per function, some patch points and extra envelopes and lfos.
I was hoping for a monophonic OB6 flavoured sister to the AS-1 but I’m guessing that’s never going to happen now.

Part of the appeal of the P6 and OB6 is how straightforward they are to program. You just twiddle some knobs and they sound good. As powerful as the Pro2 was, I never found it particularly enjoyable to program. Too many options. Too much driven by the display. I still hope there’s room in Sequential’s lineup for an affordable VCO based mono with patch memory. The AS-1 proved how good one could sound and I love it even with such a limited UI.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #84
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tripp2k's Avatar
I don't monitor this but noticed Sweetwater has dropped the price on the Prophet X/XL. Wondering if this is signalling something new.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #85
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drockfresh's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripp2k View Post
I don't monitor this but noticed Sweetwater has dropped the price on the Prophet X/XL. Wondering if this is signalling something new.
Excellent work GIA operative
Old 4 weeks ago
  #86
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Interesting. One of the advantages of building around mainstream technology is that the much larger market is constantly pushing your costs down. The Solid State Drive at the heart of the Prophet X is significantly less expensive today than it was a year ago, so I would expect prices to go down over time alongside costs, or for the drive size to increase, or both.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #87
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Maybe it’s a new oberheim with dco’s and more modulation
Old 4 weeks ago
  #88
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Wavetable synth with the SEM filters and full MIDI 2.0 SPEC...

Signed,
John Lennon.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #89
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drockfresh's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Treebase DMX View Post
Wavetable synth with the SEM filters and full MIDI 2.0 SPEC...

Signed,
John Lennon.
I love the idea of more hybrid

I prefer their digital to their analog

But the new DSI filters are gr8
Old 4 weeks ago
  #90
The other day I figured what would be great: essentially the Pro2 architecture (P5 rev 2 filter and SEM filter) with VCOs. That would be a great synth.
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