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Is there any reason to own hardware effects in 2019?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #841
One great reason to have some hardware for FX is distortion. ITB distortions are very weak currently compared to even a dirt cheap little guitar pedal.

Oh and workflow, physical controls are just nice.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #842
Here for the gear
 

Fully agree with you. What kind of effects do you prefer?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #843
Gear Maniac
 

can anyone show me an eventide H8000 in software ? that sounds identical ? love to know if that exists in software .

i did try and compare the h3000 and Eventide bundle to the hardware versions and wondered who engineered the dsp versions as most of them sounds just way off the mark , the H3000 plugin just did not have the same weight of sound or depth or anything and seemed to rob most signals of their inherent energy.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #844
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zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPogo View Post
DAWs do undoubtedly make the whole process easier.
I see this written a lot, but it’s really not true. All the same things that go into traditional recording have to happen in a DAW. It does make some things easier, like automation, but prior to computers that kind of thing wasn’t really even possible... at all. You’d have to manually do it. MIDI and computer assisted mixing desks came into things at one point, making some things possible, but a DAW really takes it to another level in a way that 70 production could never touch.

What it does do is make it cheaper. A lot cheaper. I paid more for my Yamaha MT44 than I did for my Dell XPS. In 1982 money. I don’t know how much you spent for your Midiverb when it was new, but since we’re talking about Valhalla, Sean charges $49 for reverbs that sounds arguably better and can be used multiple times in a project. So, while the first instance costs you $49, the second, third, etc, will cost nothing.

Quote:
At the same time, they make everything sound an awful lot alike -- because so many of the sounds being used are the same sounds, or processed the same way, or both. And when someone comes along with something different, then that becomes the new thing to imitate. Every adventurous soul trudges a lone path.
That’s a nice picture you’re painting of yourself, but like the false premise that the American pioneers were all on their own (they got giant free plots of land and other incentives) this one is a myth as well. Do you have a bunch of n00b’s using all stock loops and effects from Ableton Live? Yes, yes you do, but how is that any different than all the kids who bought Stratocasters and Twins in the 50s? Every era has a signature sound and its pretty easy to hear. Now is no different. Hell, how many people used the Midiverb? If anything, there are a lot more low price alternatives to the Midiverb now, so there is a larger chance that you’ll find someone working in a DAW that’s not using a Valhalla plugin. Of course, because of their inexpensive price and very high quality, a lot of people do use them, including myself, but am I supposed to not use something that I like for the sake of not sounding the same? I’m not really worried though. There’s plenty of other choices I make, in gear, software and composition wise, that make me a musical maverick. Ask my cat, she’ll tell you!

So, anyway, I have nothing against people who choose to work without a computer, but please don’t propagate false information about something that you clearly have little experience in.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdme_sadie View Post
One great reason to have some hardware for FX is distortion. ITB distortions are very weak currently compared to even a dirt cheap little guitar pedal.

Oh and workflow, physical controls are just nice.
This is true, though there are a bunch of plugins that do a pretty good job if used in subtle ways. I don’t think it’s the digital nature of software distortion, because I have a few hardware distortion devices that do a great job, but it must be so processor intensive that the proper amount of oversampling needed to produce an aliasing free signal is more CPU intense than a DAW setup can easily handle. I fully expect that at some point we’ll see this barrier broken, but until then, yeah, a cheap pedal or other device is a better bet.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #846
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leaf studios View Post
can anyone show me an eventide H8000 in software ? that sounds identical ? love to know if that exists in software .

i did try and compare the h3000 and Eventide bundle to the hardware versions and wondered who engineered the dsp versions as most of them sounds just way off the mark , the H3000 plugin just did not have the same weight of sound or depth or anything and seemed to rob most signals of their inherent energy.
Way off?

I’ve not got golden ears, but I could not say that I heard a quality difference in this shoot out. Certainly not one that would effect a hobbiest or non professional.



I don’t own that software, though. Frankly when I demoed it, I didn’t think it was more special than other multieffects software that I already own, and the UI is kind of crap. If you just care about quality and not sounding “exactly” like something else (wait, didn’t I just respond to a post about how unique you can be OTB? ) I’d suggest looking into plugins by...

Valhalla
U-He
Melda
Soundtoys
PSP
NI
IK Multimedia
Softube
2C Audio

I’m sure there are more that I’m not aware of or can think of off the top of my head, but plugins from those companies are excellent and can provide very good quality. Of course, if you’re running a pro studio and need the H8000 sound exactly, you should just use the H8000.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NawSon View Post
The entire working style of DAWs (unlimited tracks, the ability to slice and dice performances into comped “takes” that are microedited until they are flawless, the ability to put heavy EQ and compression on each of the tracks, etc etc) is what makes music made on them sound the same. Pop music sounds like rock which sounds like rap which sounds like dance. It’s very boring.

It’s an odd thing because this is just the way that DAW production is made to facilitate. And you CAN fight it.... but you pretty much have to fight it all the time. Specifically don’t do exactly what this technology has made easy for you. And then I ask myself... why use this technology if you’re actively fighting it?

It’s disappointing because it feels to me like the production and engineering techniques back in the day was widely varied. In DIY electronic music alone you had multitrack tape, cassette multitrack, recording the two track from a mixer to DAT, ADAT, and even early DAW style multitracking. This diversity in production style and technique made an audible difference in how the music was made. These days there is a lot less of that and it all sounds very homogeneous.

Think I’m lying? Go look at any comment section on discogs or wherever else when someone does use a different technique. People get actually angry when their music isn’t compressed to death and noiseless.

I’m just going to keep on pretending music production technology ended in 1995.
And you can pretend that your music doesn’t sound like it was made in 1995. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but to think that each era of technology and production style doesn’t have a signature sound is ridiculous, and it’s very easy to avoid the “slice and dice” options that you mention. I do seem to have a vague memory of doing a lot of punch in/outs back in the day...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #848
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On the software front FabFilter's work gets lots of raves as well. I like the UI and thankfully it doesn't require an iLok, so I'll be on the lookout for a Black Friday deal or similar through the holidays.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #849
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
All the same things that go into traditional recording have to happen in a DAW. It does make some things easier, like automation, but prior to computers that kind of thing wasn’t really even possible... at all. You’d have to manually do it. MIDI and computer assisted mixing desks came into things at one point, making some things possible, but a DAW really takes it to another level in a way that 70 production could never touch.

What it does do is make it cheaper. A lot cheaper. I paid more for my Yamaha MT44 than I did for my Dell XPS. In 1982 money. I don’t know how much you spent for your Midiverb when it was new, but since we’re talking about Valhalla, Sean charges $49 for reverbs that sounds arguably better and can be used multiple times in a project. So, while the first instance costs you $49, the second, third, etc, will cost nothing.
I don't disagree with any of this. I can't recall what the Microverb (not even a Midiverb!) (and actually a Microverb II) cost me in 1988. My comment was expressing amusement at the fact that I'm still using it (and relief, after seeing the prices for used Lexicons on ebay). Does it sound worse? I guess. But isn't lo-fi the hot new thing all the kids are into?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
Do you have a bunch of n00b’s using all stock loops and effects from Ableton Live? Yes, yes you do, but how is that any different than all the kids who bought Stratocasters and Twins in the 50s?
Most obviously, that they sounded like crap until they learned to play, because there was no play button to do it for them. In the process they necessarily developed their own sounds -- often through trying to duplicate someone else's sound -- or gave it up and became stockbrokers. And now buy those stressed/relic'd monstrosities, which look great on the wall, don't they? Really brightens the den. Here's your beer.

I think you're mistaking me as criticizing ITB as if I thought it was inherently worse. It isn't and I don't -- in fact, there's stuff in my head that I can't see making any other way. At the same time, I'm sorta tickled to still be using older stuff. As long as it sounds good, right?

Like any tool, it's the people using it who make the results outstanding or dull. I don't know if I'm outstanding; I just hope not to be dull. I don't always succeed.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #850
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
And you can pretend that your music doesn’t sound like it was made in 1995. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but to think that each era of technology and production style doesn’t have a signature sound is ridiculous, and it’s very easy to avoid the “slice and dice” options that you mention. I do seem to have a vague memory of doing a lot of punch in/outs back in the day...
Oh boy, did we ever. And why not? Jimmy Page's solo on "Stairway" and David Gilmour's on "Comfortably Numb" were both made by doing three passes and cobbling together the best parts of each.

One of the surprises in listening to older recordings is how full and warm some 50s recordings are: Miles Davis "Kind of Blue", Buddy Holly, Georg Solti's Ring cycle. And then it's a joy to hear 90s recordings of old-fashioned music (e.g., bluegrass) and realize how much recording quality affects the listening experience.

While I haven't heard a lot of newer music that appealed to me, Jarre's last two albums were hybrids of ITB and old-time synths, and sounded all the better for it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #851
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPogo View Post
Oh boy, did we ever. And why not? Jimmy Page's solo on "Stairway" and David Gilmour's on "Comfortably Numb" were both made by doing three passes and cobbling together the best parts of each.

One of the surprises in listening to older recordings is how full and warm some 50s recordings are: Miles Davis "Kind of Blue", Buddy Holly, Georg Solti's Ring cycle. And then it's a joy to hear 90s recordings of old-fashioned music (e.g., bluegrass) and realize how much recording quality affects the listening experience.

While I haven't heard a lot of newer music that appealed to me, Jarre's last two albums were hybrids of ITB and old-time synths, and sounded all the better for it.
It’s funny. I listen to a radio show called “Snap Judgment,” and I had a thought to see what hardware the composer was using. It really sounds great to me. I did some digging and found that he’s totally ITB, so fwiw, I was fooled.

I think a lot of people here conflate modern aesthetics and production style with the proliferation of DAWs, and while they do enable that sort of thing, they don’t cause it. Use the same techniques that you use in a traditional recording studio in a DAW and you will get a very similar result. It’s just a cheaper way to go. Maybe not quite as good in many ways, but fine for my purposes, though I will use hardware instruments and effects when they make sense.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #852
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
Way off?

.

Sure... like WAAAAY OFFFF!!!
If you don't have an H3000 you simply have no idea about the sound difference.
The analog input stage, the input filters, the algorithms running at different sample rates (an impossible technique on DAW as they need full stable digital sync).
The H3000 plugin has very little in common with the H3000 hardware. Code is light years apart, very different and hardware has its own character the plug simply can't have as it has no hardware. Let me also add the plug only does a very small part of the efx the H3000 does. So many missing algorithms...
No comparison. I wish they'd call the plug "H3000 inspired"... that would be the honest truth!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #853
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leaf studios View Post
can anyone show me an eventide H8000 in software ? that sounds identical ? love to know if that exists in software .

i did try and compare the h3000 and Eventide bundle to the hardware versions and wondered who engineered the dsp versions as most of them sounds just way off the mark , the H3000 plugin just did not have the same weight of sound or depth or anything and seemed to rob most signals of their inherent energy.
No plugin can do what the H8000 does... simply.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #854
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPogo View Post
I don't disagree with any of this. I can't recall what the Microverb (not even a Midiverb!) (and actually a Microverb II) cost me in 1988. My comment was expressing amusement at the fact that I'm still using it (and relief, after seeing the prices for used Lexicons on ebay). Does it sound worse? I guess. But isn't lo-fi the hot new thing all the kids are into?


Most obviously, that they sounded like crap until they learned to play, because there was no play button to do it for them. In the process they necessarily developed their own sounds -- often through trying to duplicate someone else's sound -- or gave it up and became stockbrokers. And now buy those stressed/relic'd monstrosities, which look great on the wall, don't they? Really brightens the den. Here's your beer.

I think you're mistaking me as criticizing ITB as if I thought it was inherently worse. It isn't and I don't -- in fact, there's stuff in my head that I can't see making any other way. At the same time, I'm sorta tickled to still be using older stuff. As long as it sounds good, right?

Like any tool, it's the people using it who make the results outstanding or dull. I don't know if I'm outstanding; I just hope not to be dull. I don't always succeed.
Indeed. I just think there’s a lot of “in the good ol’ days” talk on here that presents the old ways as not having any problems. I’m of the generation who remembers having to record early tracks with a high frequency bump because I knew that by the end of the session I’d loose some to wear. I remember cross talk and misaligned tape heads. Scratchy pots, etc. I’m all for everyone using what works best for them. Let’s not get overly romantic about it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #855
I remain unconvinced on Eventide, not my cup of tea ... mostly because I dislike reverb and digital delays, pitch shifters, kind of everything they do.

Did you know you can create an entire band with just moogerfoogers?


Last edited by iksrazal; 3 weeks ago at 07:28 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #856
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NawSon's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
And you can pretend that your music doesn’t sound like it was made in 1995. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but to think that each era of technology and production style doesn’t have a signature sound is ridiculous, and it’s very easy to avoid the “slice and dice” options that you mention. I do seem to have a vague memory of doing a lot of punch in/outs back in the day...
Except that you have it exactly wrong. Things made now with the same equipment as 1995 only sound like 1995 if you’re trying to make that same music. If you make music nobody would have made in 1995 but on 1995 equipment, it will not sound like 1995.

This is the issue though, most of not all people just make whatever it happening now using whatever equipment is used now. This definitely wasn’t always the case, especially between indie and major label artists who had access to wildly different studios that contained very different pieces of equipment. Whether the more expensive or cheaper studio was “better” is irrelevant, the fact is that you had a multitude of different sounds as a result.

A DIY home recording didn’t sound like a small studio’s recording which didn’t sound like a major label recording.

Now all of these use the same equipment and techniques.

You say that all eras have a sound...but the Misfits don’t sound like Steely Dan who didn’t sound like Depeche Mode who didn’t sound like Paul Simon. All were recording in the late 70s early 80s.

In terms of today’s production and overall sound there is far far less deviation from “today’s sound”.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #857
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPogo View Post
Oh boy, did we ever. And why not? Jimmy Page's solo on "Stairway" and David Gilmour's on "Comfortably Numb" were both made by doing three passes and cobbling together the best parts of each.
And I mean there’s a big difference between three passes and infinite passes with micro edits and timing correction of notes in a DAW. And that’s before you get into what happens with modern vocal production compared to back in the day. It’s even less human.

Quote:
One of the surprises in listening to older recordings is how full and warm some 50s recordings are: Miles Davis "Kind of Blue", Buddy Holly, Georg Solti's Ring cycle. And then it's a joy to hear 90s recordings of old-fashioned music (e.g., bluegrass) and realize how much recording quality affects the listening experience.
In which way? Modernized recordings of old styles do not sound better overall to my ears. But there are some exceptions. Generally I’m not trying to listen to people making music now exactly the same as what they did back in any other period.

Quote:
While I haven't heard a lot of newer music that appealed to me, Jarre's last two albums were hybrids of ITB and old-time synths, and sounded all the better for it.
I haven’t heard those so I really can’t say. But I’m struggling to think of any older musicians whose current music SOUNDS better to me. If you’re lucky they sound like themselves still. If not, they sound like everything else.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NawSon View Post
Except that you have it exactly wrong. Things made now with the same equipment as 1995 only sound like 1995 if you’re trying to make that same music. If you make music nobody would have made in 1995 but on 1995 equipment, it will not sound like 1995.

This is the issue though, most of not all people just make whatever it happening now using whatever equipment is used now. This definitely wasn’t always the case, especially between indie and major label artists who had access to wildly different studios that contained very different pieces of equipment. Whether the more expensive or cheaper studio was “better” is irrelevant, the fact is that you had a multitude of different sounds as a result.

A DIY home recording didn’t sound like a small studio’s recording which didn’t sound like a major label recording.

Now all of these use the same equipment and techniques.

You say that all eras have a sound...but the Misfits don’t sound like Steely Dan who didn’t sound like Depeche Mode who didn’t sound like Paul Simon. All were recording in the late 70s early 80s.

In terms of today’s production and overall sound there is far far less deviation from “today’s sound”.
You are saying I’m wrong and then proving me right. The gear doesn’t make the sound in terms of music style, the artist makes it. Give a Strat and a Bassman to Dick Dale and to Jimi Hendrix and get a totally different sound even if they’re recorded with the same mic though the same preamp into the same console into the same tape deck. My point was that things go in and out of fashion, and all eras do have a “sound” to them, if you overlook musical stylistic differences. Hell, a CD doesn’t sound like vinyl, even if they were both recorded in 1967. I’ve been in quite a few recording studios in my day and while you paint this picture of a vast sea of diverse gear, I saw the same gear over and over again. Gear that’s become “classic” was gear that was once popular. It was just so expensive that it wasn’t really in the hands of most artists.

The DYI or small home studio that you speak of was rarely heard by anyone out side of the artist’s circle of friends and fans, so it’s kind of irrelevant (trust me, I owned a lot of it!), but now with self publishing any artist can reach anyone. This means a lot of crap gets posted, but it doesn’t mean that the recording method or gear is the cause of the crappiness. You don’t have to “try” to make a recording sound like 1995, all you have to do is avoid doing things that a modern studio makes simple and affordable. You can even record a vintage synth with it. Good mics, mic pres, etc, are still relevant if you’re ITB for everything after that. If anything, a computer is a totally blank slate in a way that the traditional recording process never was.

If you’re looking to get that missing character when working ITB, then you do have to look to using things like emulations of tape or even hardware compressors, but I have to say that I have several and they sound pretty great to me and if I had to buy the original gear that they’re emulating, I wouldn’t be able to. Not because I don’t have the money, but because I’ve made things like my daughter’s education a priority. If all of the sudden I came into a ton of money... well, I’d buy a house, but if there was a nice chunk left over, I probably would invest in some more hardware effects, but mostly analog. I’m unconvinced that digital ITB is worse than digital OTB.

One thing more, and that’s I seem to see a lot of people speaking as if their sonic quality is contingent on their gear, and its rare that I come across a lot of music that sounds great to me or is creative in a way that justifies all the money spent. Lately an album that’s getting a lot of play at our house is Billie Eilish’s “When We All Fall Asleep, Where Do We Go?” It’s a fun modern pop album and it covers a pretty wide range of styles. I think it sounds good, and it was totally recorded in a dude’s bedroom using Logic.

https://www.prosoundnetwork.com/reco...in-his-bedroom

Now, her music might not be your thing, but from a pure production standpoint, I’d put that album up against anything done by the Doors or Hendrix and it sounds way, way, way better to me. I love that old classic music (well, not the Doors so much) but I think it’s hilarious that people think it all sounded great. A lot of it was great music recorded poorly.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NawSon View Post
I haven’t heard those so I really can’t say. But I’m struggling to think of any older musicians whose current music SOUNDS better to me. If you’re lucky they sound like themselves still. If not, they sound like everything else.
Bowie always sounds like Bowie to me and Blackstar was recorded using Pro Tools. Even used a few plugins, or so they say.

https://www.emusician.com/artists/da...kstar-sessions
Old 3 weeks ago
  #860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leaf studios View Post
can anyone show me an eventide H8000 in software ? that sounds identical ? love to know if that exists in software .

i did try and compare the h3000 and Eventide bundle to the hardware versions and wondered who engineered the dsp versions as most of them sounds just way off the mark , the H3000 plugin just did not have the same weight of sound or depth or anything and seemed to rob most signals of their inherent energy.
Keep an eye out for the newer MKII plugins that Eventide has been releasing, post H9000 launch. The Instant Phaser and Instant Flanger are actually very good.

Their earlier plugins are really weak!. In general, Soundtoys sounds more like a real Eventide than Eventide.

Going forward, I would speculate that porting identical-sounding algos from the ARM-based H9000 to VST will be relatively easy for them to do, something that was never practical with earlier models.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #861
Software ... will be better in the future, and always will be.

Been hearing that since the 80's ... been waiting for a Led Zeppelin tour to my city since then too.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #862
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iksrazal View Post
Software ... will be better in the future, and always will be.

Been hearing that since the 80's ... been waiting for a Led Zeppelin tour to my city since then too.
One of these things becomes more likely as time passes, and the other becomes less likely (1).

(1) Ignoring impact of the Greta Van Fleet effect, which is still hotly debated in the relevant literature.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #863
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
One of these things becomes more likely as time passes, and the other becomes less likely (1).

(1) Excluding Greta Van Fleet effects, which are still hotly debated in the relevant literature.
In both cases the future somehow never arrives.

Never heard of Greta, will look her up ... I tune out almost everything so that is normal for me.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #864
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Singleton's Avatar
Oh boy, read all 29 pages of this thread.

Italo said what I wanted to say, but better on page 27:

Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
Plugs are more about the single effect... hardware still rules in bigger structures where fx stages interact in a nicer and more musical way. A lot of people use hardware for those reasons, let alone the sonic character....
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
I wish you would take a careful analitical observation of Barry Blesser (god bless the master!) algorithms on the PCM80/81, in the way the 6 voice fx and the reverb are interconnected, working together as a single fx environment rather than two fx, each one working on its own. Look at how the diffusion makes things unique, merging signals across the blocks....
One reason to get a good (high end) hardware effects unit is exactly this: you can learn a lot from studying the presets and fixed-function structure.

I wonder how many of the "software can do everything hardware can" folks here are actually at the kind of a level in sound design/engineering where they can make an informed call on this vs. the usual "software gets better every year and it's all 0s and 1s anyway"-logic? Don't get me wrong, I believe this to be the case for professionals who learned on the expensive hardware and now find that they can get a better sound ITB; but people bailing on the H3000 plugin due to how the GUI looks doesn't exactly convince me that your typical all ITB bedroom producer has much idea what an Eventide is capable of.

Having said that, IMHO, if all you need are great reverbs and delays, you're best off with the likes of Valhalla and Soundtoys. As much as I would love to have a 480L, I don't think it would ever be practical for me to own one, nor do I think I would appreciate the sonic character *that much more* compared to a good modern reverb plugin. Just my $.02.

To the OP, I have a few digital hardware effects units, good in 2019 and hopefully many more years to come:

- Lexicon PCM81, MPX1
- Eventide DSP4000
- Roland SRV-330, SDX-330, RSP-550 (x2)

I use them with my synths, mostly to change the sound when going into the DAW already. The combined selection of presets on these boxes is a sort of an encyclopedia of "things you can do with effects" which to me was worth the price of admission alone since these are not the most expensive units out there.

P.S. I'll add a short clip here, who is guru enough to know which unit it is? (This particular reverb is not that great on a piano btw).
Attached Files

PianoDryWet.mp3 (1.54 MB, 615 views)

Old 3 weeks ago
  #865
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by leaf studios View Post
the H3000 plugin just did not have the same weight of sound or depth or anything and seemed to rob most signals of their inherent energy.
Nicely worded. How I heard it too, hence couldn't get excited about the H3000 plug.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #866
If its digital it can be done in software ... you could argue CPU architecture however I have often programmed in assembly on several of those and am skeptical.

I have no digital effects, partly because of that but I simply don't like what they are good at no matter who does it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #867
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Singleton's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by iksrazal View Post
If its digital it can be done in software
It can, but is often not done, for several reasons. I feel like most people who make that comment believe that Cubase or Logic come with better effects than what I have in my rack (they do not).

Quote:
Originally Posted by iksrazal View Post
you could argue CPU architecture however I have often programmed in assembly on several of those and am skeptical.
I have wondered about the same, this was more true in the past when you could certainly hear the superiority of plugins on dedicated DSP platforms based on Motorola or SHARC vs native x86 plugins, possibly due to things like word length, internal oversampling etc. Today that difference no longer exists as long as the programmers are similarly skilled.

Btw you are forgetting one important thing mentioned here already which is that especially the older Lexicon and Eventide units have analog sections that are part of the sound.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #868
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The 'if it's digital, I can do it in the computer and doesn't warrant a box of hardware' is about as demented a studio logic trap as you can find yourself looking up out of.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #869
Lives for gear
A simple test for me is if something makes me smile it's a keeper. It could be cheap SE-70, Curve Bender eq, even a utility reverb like M300. If it makes me feel good I keep it. There are many very good plugins but none of them make me feel the same way as hardware.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singleton View Post
Oh boy, read all 29 pages of this thread.

Italo said what I wanted to say, but better on page 27:





One reason to get a good (high end) hardware effects unit is exactly this: you can learn a lot from studying the presets and fixed-function structure.

I wonder how many of the "software can do everything hardware can" folks here are actually at the kind of a level in sound design/engineering where they can make an informed call on this vs. the usual "software gets better every year and it's all 0s and 1s anyway"-logic? Don't get me wrong, I believe this to be the case for professionals who learned on the expensive hardware and now find that they can get a better sound ITB; but people bailing on the H3000 plugin due to how the GUI looks doesn't exactly convince me that your typical all ITB bedroom producer has much idea what an Eventide is capable of.

Having said that, IMHO, if all you need are great reverbs and delays, you're best off with the likes of Valhalla and Soundtoys. As much as I would love to have a 480L, I don't think it would ever be practical for me to own one, nor do I think I would appreciate the sonic character *that much more* compared to a good modern reverb plugin. Just my $.02.

To the OP, I have a few digital hardware effects units, good in 2019 and hopefully many more years to come:

- Lexicon PCM81, MPX1
- Eventide DSP4000
- Roland SRV-330, SDX-330, RSP-550 (x2)

I use them with my synths, mostly to change the sound when going into the DAW already. The combined selection of presets on these boxes is a sort of an encyclopedia of "things you can do with effects" which to me was worth the price of admission alone since these are not the most expensive units out there.

P.S. I'll add a short clip here, who is guru enough to know which unit it is? (This particular reverb is not that great on a piano btw).
Dude; wtf, that piano riff was killer. I just made a whole song in my head
from that small clip....is it original?

I don't know why, I just found it very inspiring for some reason.
Thanks for sharing that...

~juise~
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