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Special Pitch Bend Wheel
Old 5 days ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Special Pitch Bend Wheel

Hello Howdy, I had an idea for a pitch bend with multiple stops. Meaning a pitch wheel that has tension and stop, more tension another stop, and so on. About 3 additional stops other than the normal 1 stop pitchwheels available. Im looking for something that you could tune to say pitch 5, then pitch 7, then pitch 12(full octave); bend the wheel where it will stop at 5, bend it more to stop it at 7, then bend it even more to have it stop at 12. Then be able to bend it from 0 down 3 seperate notes also. I cant find a wheel with stops along its tracking to program this I have to rely on approximation to pitch bend to exact notes.. Does anything like this exist?

Thanks so much in advanced
Old 5 days ago
  #2
Here for the gear
Interesting idea!

I'd be tempted to try a ribbon controller it might get you close ?
Old 5 days ago
  #3
Lives for gear
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
I don't think that exists.
Old 5 days ago
  #4
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabrams88 View Post
Hello Howdy, I had an idea for a pitch bend with multiple stops. Meaning a pitch wheel that has tension and stop, more tension another stop, and so on. About 3 additional stops other than the normal 1 stop pitchwheels available. Im looking for something that you could tune to say pitch 5, then pitch 7, then pitch 12(full octave); bend the wheel where it will stop at 5, bend it more to stop it at 7, then bend it even more to have it stop at 12. Then be able to bend it from 0 down 3 seperate notes also. I cant find a wheel with stops along its tracking to program this I have to rely on approximation to pitch bend to exact notes.. Does anything like this exist?

Thanks so much in advanced
Yes, I worked on this a number of years back, but it hasn't yet been implemented on any synth yet for legal/licensing reasons. I've been working with some guys on a synth set for release in 2020 and I've been implementing the multiple-stage pitch wheel - I'll link below to a sample, but first to the problem:

The problem is relativistic notch assignation i.e. if the max value is set to less than an octave, the notches are relativistically reduced intervals - which can, in turn, result in non-diatonicism (not necessarily undesirable though, depending on context) - or even non 12-TET values - which can confuse the internal language of the synth if standard-tuning-only.

The solution is to have assignable notch parameters i.e. the ability to program the pitch of each notch, e.g.

N1 = 5 (with '5' being the # of chromatic steps)
N2 = 8

etc etc.

Which becomes interesting i.e. one can create a non steady-state slope. With this approach, N1 can be 1, N2 can be 4, then a large jump to N3 as 12. If graphed, the slope becomes obvious.


You'll hear the concept of non-steady state slope multiple notch at about 3:32 in the following clip -



All best
Kris
Old 4 days ago
  #5
Lives for gear
 
monomer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabrams88 View Post
Hello Howdy, I had an idea for a pitch bend with multiple stops. Meaning a pitch wheel that has tension and stop, more tension another stop, and so on. About 3 additional stops other than the normal 1 stop pitchwheels available. Im looking for something that you could tune to say pitch 5, then pitch 7, then pitch 12(full octave); bend the wheel where it will stop at 5, bend it more to stop it at 7, then bend it even more to have it stop at 12. Then be able to bend it from 0 down 3 seperate notes also. I cant find a wheel with stops along its tracking to program this I have to rely on approximation to pitch bend to exact notes.. Does anything like this exist?

Thanks so much in advanced
The way you describe it i don't think it's physically viable.
Old 4 days ago
  #6
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KrisL1982 View Post
Yes, I worked on this a number of years back, but it hasn't yet been implemented on any synth yet for legal/licensing reasons. I've been working with some guys on a synth set for release in 2020 and I've been implementing the multiple-stage pitch wheel - I'll link below to a sample, but first to the problem:

The problem is relativistic notch assignation i.e. if the max value is set to less than an octave, the notches are relativistically reduced intervals - which can, in turn, result in non-diatonicism (not necessarily undesirable though, depending on context) - or even non 12-TET values - which can confuse the internal language of the synth if standard-tuning-only.

The solution is to have assignable notch parameters i.e. the ability to program the pitch of each notch, e.g.

N1 = 5 (with '5' being the # of chromatic steps)
N2 = 8

etc etc.

Which becomes interesting i.e. one can create a non steady-state slope. With this approach, N1 can be 1, N2 can be 4, then a large jump to N3 as 12. If graphed, the slope becomes obvious.


You'll hear the concept of non-steady state slope multiple notch at about 3:32 in the following clip -



All best
Kris
Yes this exactly, I wanted to use it for arp's like you do in the video. I have a lot of fun bending arps but always want to take it another step and bend to an even higher interval (or lower). maybe even have multiple pitchwheels one next to the other with the same type of tension. I guess you could change the mod wheel to pitch bend aswell and do it that way, but that has a different attenuation and tracking?

I am going to speak to my synth builder friend and see if he can come up with any solution and will update when I get some results back.
Old 3 days ago
  #7
Gear Head
It might be more viable to do something like that with haptic feedback, where the physical travel and force of the wheel doesn't change at each "notch," but you can feel each step as a subtle vibration.
Old 3 days ago
  #8
Gear Maniac
 

Interesting idea. I think it could be physically viable to implement without too much trouble, though getting and keeping everything in calibration may (or may not) be a bit of a difficulty. One reasonable approach is to have additional sets of centering springs that come into contact with the wheel or pedal or whatever at the appropriate spots on its travel; if they have preload, that makes for a "stop" where a certain amount of additional force is needed to overcome the spring preload before the control travels further and the pitch bend changes more. Some sort of adjustable positioning for these, using setscrews for example, would presumably be needed to get the stop at the right place on the wheel travel.

Another interesting implementation option would be to use a force sensor rather than a positioning one, and using software map the force in to pitch bend out as a non-linear function with flat sections for the stops (i.e. a range of changes for force would produce no change in bend output). This would have the general feel of hitting a stop, I think, when active. Getting used to having no or practically no motion in the controller might take a bit of use, but probably not as much as one may imagine initially. Some fighter jets have been designed with control joysticks that don't actually move (or that move very little) and are primarily force sensors--the F16 is a notable example.
Old 3 days ago
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

That's a cool idea. What about some sort of endless encoder with brakes that can be electronically turned on and off, like little bicycle brakes? So the stops could be programmable. The stops at the end could brake hard so you can't push it anymore while the stops in the middle could be gentler so you could push past them.
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