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Elektron Overbridge 2
Old 21st May 2018
  #1
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jimknopf's Avatar
Elektron Overbridge 2

The main message in the first sentence of Elektron’s new “status update” reads as follows:
“The development of Overbridge continues”.
I guess now everyone is really relaxed to read this kind of earthshaking, informative news.

Then after naming some Overbridge highlights and posting some nice screenshots, of what everybody planning with Overbridge is missing since February 2018 (after Elektron had heavily advertised and announced Overbridge for buyers of their new boxes, up to January 2018!) the new “status update” ends with some more lighthearted good wishes for all those, who have been heavily fooled by the official January statements of the same company:
“In the meantime, keep making awesome music!”

We certainly needed this kind of headup, and the enormously helpful reminder to get by well without some essential functionality we paid for, and many have planned with. I for one would hardly have gotten the idea to keep on making good music without this valuable hint. It’s like someone owing you money, and instead of finally paying his debt, or even naming any rough date for doing so, encouraging you to have a great time without the money he owes you, "in the meantime". :-))

Some reactions show me, that this is no longer the hopefull or even cheerful waiting game, which Elektron seriously tries to sell to us since February. Meanwhile the first of my music friends have begun selling all their Elektron gear, because they are no longer willing to be kept in endless uncertainty about their originally planned workflow like that. And in the Elektronauts forum I just have read a similar actual message from someone now selling his Elektron gear completely, stating that his expectation meanwhile rather is, that Overbridge might be useable in one or two years, and not anytime soon.

I must admit I meawhile also doubt both:
- that Overbridge will be available anytime soon
- that it will really work with expected functionality and low latency when it finally arrives

I will not sell my Elektron Analog Rytm Mk II, despite having paid much too much for it without the advertised functionality. I simply don’t want to make my obvious loss of money and time even bigger. I will just keep on using it with the present, crippled recording workflow, as far as that still makes sense.

My consequence will be, that I learnt my lesson of trusting the wrong company. I paid my price for that experience, and never will buy anything from Elektron again, no matter what they might offer in the future. There’s plenty of hard- and software alternatives out there meanwhile, growing in numbers and quality, thankfully.
Old 21st May 2018
  #2
Meanwhile a bag of screws were dropped at Magnetogorsk screwfactory.
Old 21st May 2018
  #3
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wagoo's Avatar
Old 21st May 2018
  #4
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Woop woop!

cheap mk2's for those of us who couldn't give a **** about Overbridge!
Old 21st May 2018
  #5
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jimknopf's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by haze015 View Post
Woop woop!

cheap mk2's for those of us who couldn't give a **** about Overbridge!

Yes, absolutely: great times for those who just use it live and don't want to use Elektron gear for recording at all. Even the official price for my Rytm MK 2, at my reseller, has already fallen ~200€ since I bought the device.

You just won't get mine , because my consequence will be another one (see above).
Old 21st May 2018
  #6
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asynchro_nous's Avatar
 

As a rare gesture of realism and contrition Elektron is reportedly considering renaming this theoretical functionality “Overpromise.”

Old 21st May 2018
  #7
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sovietpop's Avatar
I dont think Overbridge is coming anytime soon, maybe at the end of summer ?
I understand that Overbridge is a very complex piece of software and i dont mind waiting for it BUT what bothers me is the fact that the Analog 4 Mk2 still have serious bugs that make the A4 mk2 inferior to the mk1 for now and we have to wait for Overbridge to get the next OS update.
I kinda regret selling my mk1 for the mk2. Just an OS update that fix the sound lock bug would be enough for me and something for samples management for the Rytm mk1.

Anyway i still like my Elektrons and i understand that software development is hard (thats what i do for a living so) so i wish them good luck
Old 21st May 2018
  #8
You just can't make music without overbridge... It's not possible...

I wonder how ppl record their other synths without overbridge...
Old 21st May 2018
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimknopf View Post
Yes, absolutely: great times for those who just use it live and don't want to use Elektron gear for recording at all. Even the official price for my Rytm MK 2, at my reseller, has already fallen ~200€ since I bought the device.

You just won't get mine , because my consequence will be another one (see above).
You can still very easily use all of them for recording. Overbridge is far from essential, just will make certain things easier/quicker.

While I can understand the annoyance, the "essential to my workflow" BS is well BS, if its that important, why buy it to start with? It wasn't a secret it wasn't ready at any point and secondly, why spend £1500 on a drum machine to just use it as a plugin?
Old 21st May 2018
  #10
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donato's Avatar
They should’ve scrapped the idea before releasing the mk2’s. Too many people had issues the first go around, they had trouble chasing OS updates, AU never worked as originally intended, etc.

Yet they decided to double down anyway.
Old 21st May 2018
  #11
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So.. what's exactly the issue here?
Old 21st May 2018
  #12
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xanax's Avatar
I sold all my elektron gear a while ago and hence don't follow their product development but i am quite shocked to hear they haven't yet rolled out overbridge for any of their current machines considering how heavily they advertise the feature (second tab on their website). The digitakt was released over a year ago (may 2017) and stated very clearly:

Later this year, the Overbridge2 software suite will become available for Digitakt. It offers powerful tools and features when using Digitakt with computers, for example a dedicated VST/AU plugin interface for hardware control and USB audio streaming of internal tracks. Overbridge even lets Digitakt to be used as a sound card.

Digitakt out now!

I feel sorry for those still waiting a year later, and honestly getting tired of companies releasing unfinished products and not holding advertised promises.. I sure hope Prophet X users won't have to deal with similar shenanigans from DSi on the promised "later this year" user sample software functionality..
Old 21st May 2018
  #13
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jimknopf's Avatar
I have bought the Analog Rytm Mk II both for standalone use and for recording. I seriously think, that wanting to do both with some smart workflow, might be a legitimate purpose for buying gear nowadays. I happen to think so, among others, for knowing dozens of musicians working like that. It is clear from this thread that this kind of workflow has not yet reached everyone.

In fact a whole new generation of possible drumbox buyers, who probably could easily outnumber the traditional ones by far, wants the same hardware for both live and recording purposes, and the latter with time saving workflow. There's good reasons for using the same gear for both purposes.

Oh, and why use it as plugin at all? Pehaps because, at the moment, I have no other plugin, offering me to build kits with analog drum synth sounds, along with or layerd with sampled drum sounds, both runing through analog filters and an analog signal path???

I for one will not seriously discuss the usefulness of the latter approach with anyone. As a keyboard player, I heavily rely on nowadays standards for hardware synth recording, and sometimes I am wondering about forms of ignorance not showing much knowledge of this kind of workflow. We live in an age, where you don't have to choose between hardware or software, or are limited to some reel to reel recording of hardware, or even better: plus recording some midi notes. We are some steps ahead of that meanwhile. Integration is the actual key word, and it offers useful things like not having to plug and unplug separate outs every time (like 16 cables), and use audi over usb channels instead, have total recall in recording projects, normally get perfect backup solutions for your whole synth state including everything in it, easier automation integration etc. etc.. Ever heard of it?

And yes: I have not regarded it as outright stupid NOT to assume, that an official statement from a company, announcing a delayed release to apperar finally in February 2018 in connection with a whole new generation of gear, would seriously not have any clue and/or remotely stick to what they talk about, one month before release, while HEAVILY advertising it (and even keeping on with that public advertising at the point when the status changed to "not available for unknown time"). I was obviously wrong, and irresponsible impertinence can amount to degrees so far unknown to me.

So what again is the problem of not understanding some really basic essentials of nowadays gear use - and of Elektron's way of not delivering what was announced as essential part of a whole new range of products???
Old 21st May 2018
  #14
The thing is, your "I'm done with elektron" rant won't change anything.

Elektron sold more Digitakts within a year of existence than Octatracks since launch.

The whole overbridge issue is annoying but 'til it'll arrive I can jam on the machines just fine.
Old 21st May 2018
  #15
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The only solution is to buy vintage gear, preferably from long defunct companies, so you know “it is what it is” and don’t have to hope that new features are coming.

With modern gear I am very weary of buying gear because of its pipeline promises, if I wouldn’t be happy with it as it comes out of the box then I’m better off waiting or moving on to something else .
Old 21st May 2018
  #16
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drxcm's Avatar
 

Agree this is poor form - especially since they announced a release date previously.

However, I know well enough never to buy gear based on promised features. Only what’s functional at the time. Caveat emptor.

In any case I couldn’t care less. No computer in my studio and my Digitakt and Digitone still working great without OB
Old 21st May 2018
  #17
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jimknopf's Avatar
Instead of ignoring or belittling the problems of others, as long as I am not directly concerned, I feel with everyone being let down, and being fed with cheap excuses, and respectless neglect, by companies like Elektron. But I also respect, that some simply work DAWless, are more or less happy in standlone mode, and can't be concerned in the way others are.

- I feel with all the poor Digitakt users who expected to become able to record, who don't even have physical separate outs and can't seriously record at all, until Overbidge arrives. Even if it is fun to toy around with it standlone - what a huge letdown for everyone who wants to record!

- I feel with all the Rytm 1 users, who don't even get the really much needed and much used transfer tool, which I at least can use with my Rytm Mk 2. It makes sample exhange SO much easier and faster (with an "Explore" view where you have your PC dircetory and your Rytm folder structure side by side for fast exhange and for changes), thus also at least delivering sample backup (though not any kind of complete project backup). This kind of tool is so necessary, that I can hardly imagine getting by without it. I would be utterly frustrated, if I would be one of the first generation buyers, paving the path and helping Elektron to become bigger, and then being treated like that.

- but I am also quite sure, that the news about the whole ongoing Overbridge letdown for many devices will have very significant consequences, which will warn Elektron not to try this kind of heavily misleading advertising and customer treatment ever again.

As far as I can see, many Digitakt owners are meanwhile just as heavily annoyed, as other buyers of the latest generation of Elektron gear, along with buyers of former devices being ignored altogether by the company.

None of the more than justified rants can immediatly change what Elektron does. But as soon as they get numbers telling them how many customers they lost on the way, they WILL have to change their behavior for sure, simply because it's the only way to survive for them, in a market where competition is getting MUCH tougher, then anything they have faced, when they started out in a niche of their own.
Old 21st May 2018
  #18
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re5etuk's Avatar
I’ve got lots of elektron gear , I like them , even the devices that run overbridge right now ( I’ve never used it )
It’s interesting to read comments , such as being unable to record from digitakt as it has only 2 outputs , I’m quite sure some devices only have one and can be easily recorded.

Right now my feelings are mixed , digitakt wasn’t very stable when it came out. , especially with midi , so. Im more cautious with any new release from any company
I’d prefer them to do more incremental releases with more thorough testing .
Im also sure that the dev team aren’t happy with the situation either and understand the impact it has had on their reputation.

In summary , it’s not great but the equipment I. Have is. Very usable , unlike this annoying iPad Pro which barely recognised my keyboard input the older it gets. Hence the odd grammar and full stops during this response.

And. I’m reminded I need. To. Find. That new matrix 1000 rom that fixes a few issues from whenever it got released.
Old 21st May 2018
  #19
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Ok, my wording was imprecise concerning Digitakt recording.

Of course I was referring to the fact, that nowadays it is regarded as standard to record drum machine tracks to separate outs for flexible editing with the powerful tools in your DAW. Digitakt's stereo mix is not nearly good enough to replace that kind of DAW mixing, from my view and from the view of plenty of others who don't intend to record from such a stereo out mix in 2018.

But hey, of course I know that in the age of cassette recorders people definitely had other problems...
Old 21st May 2018
  #20
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You can’t record that Digitakt? Why? You don’t have an audio interface or converters?

I think for designing sounds and kits and multis the Overbridge simplifies.

Also, for people who score for TV and film etc and the dedicated DAW enthusiasts the plugin is probably critical.

I feel sorry for you guys.

Elektron is a strange company. Neat products (I own 5) but the management is shady for sure.

I do think they try like hell, though. It is a small firm, so ....
Old 21st May 2018
  #21
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baethku's Avatar
This past year I bought my first functional Elektron product, the Digitakt, and man was I excited. I was bummed out the previous year when I purchased an open-box Analog Keys that was DOA. Got a full refund--no harm, no foul.

But the Digitakt looked like the thing for me. And I was especially excited that, like the Analog Keys, it would have Overbridge. I work in a DAW and I wanted those individual outs, particularly since I like mangling my sounds individually with plugins, etc.

Gotta say that I feel a little burned. Yeah, sure, I can use it. But my decision to pull the trigger was based in part on the promise that Overbridge would be coming soon. Would I have purchased it knowing that I would be waiting many months for Overbridge? That it might not actually ever appear? Almost certainly not.

It's not that I feel ripped off so much as I know what I envisioned doing and I know how that factored into my purchasing decision. Lesson learned. Never trust a company when it makes promises for future functions. The company is too busy doing other things that make money.

I should have guessed this would be the case when they informed everyone that Overbridge would be free. They might as well have said, "Well, you can't complain now if it does not ever appear. After all, you didn't really pay for Overbridge, did you? Now excuse us while we partially develop another product and put it on the market before it is actually complete."

I am beginning to wonder whether this box lacks the processing juice to pull off Overbridge functionality.

ETA: It is especially irksome that Overbridge itself is not really new. It would be one thing if they did not have Overbridge working on other products. I could more easily accept that, hey, I should have known not to buy before this completely unknown quantity was promised but not there. But Overbridge is a thing we kinda believed they knew how to do. You know, like they have already done on other products.
Old 21st May 2018
  #22
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re5etuk's Avatar
i'd love to record individual outs, but i do fine .ive got a tr8 and never used it , though i dont use a daw much.
i'm not entirely sure i'll use it when its released , managing samples 'properly' , backing up easily would be nice.

i'm not sure theyre 'shady' , that tends to imply theyre not very legit (depends where you may be i guess , this is a world wide forum) , i think theyve had to balance commercial interests (new machines , new hardware for digitakt/digitone) , grow as a company and still deal with the never ending overbridge , i dont envy them but can empathise with their situation having been in software development for 30 years ... how games ever got through nintendo QA and got released on cartridge with no issues/no way to patch things is unheard of now , luckily we can patch games .

i do hope theyre improving their QA , i dont mind obscure quirky issues but if its something basic they dont get right then its not good enough , for both hardware and software , thats not only elektron who are guilty of this.

and i'm trusting they did their due diligence on their new hardware platform to get overbridge improved , rytm/analog4 hopefully gave them experience on how to improve things for digitakt , digitone and the updated rtym2/analog4 mk2
Old 21st May 2018
  #23
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baethku's Avatar
Part of the problem is the endless treadmill of products at low prices. Digitakt & Digitone hit that sweetspot pricepoint for people who could stretch a little beyond $500 for a much-vaunted Elekrton product. On occasion I will spend over $1000 bucks for something but not often. I hesitated to get an Octatrack because I feared I would never get past the unfamiliar button combinations to have fun with the machine, and I would kick myself for having spent over $1000 on something I really couldn't get into. I will say this about the Digitakt: it is fairly straightforward and it does not cost over $1000.

But it is tough for companies to keep pumping out new products while attending to the firmware and software associated with their old products. When these guys weigh the excitement and profit of developing new boxes against the unprofitability of developing firmware, etc., it can't be too difficult to arrive at a strategy that privileges the former over the latter. I know I would find editing firmware as exciting as proofreading the ingredients on a bag of Doritos, hell, much less so really.
Old 21st May 2018
  #24
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buy for what it is, not what it says it will be

that way you'll always be happy
Old 21st May 2018
  #25
Deleted cec0d5b
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimknopf View Post
I learnt my lesson of trusting the wrong company. I paid my price for that experience, and never will buy anything from Elektron again
Sheesh dude. No need to throw your toys out of the pram.

Unlike most companies (Roland and the System-8, I'm looking at you). Elektron have been honest with their customers. They've owned up to their error, they've apologised and they've reassured their customers that Overbridge is still being developed - it's no shelved, it's not forgotten, and their customers aren't left wondering if it is. Their customers clearly know that it will happen and that they will have to wait. No doubt they'll update us again in a couple of months. I envisage the release to be within the next 6 months at the latest.

In the meantime, you have a stonking analog / sample hybrid drum machine with 8 individual balanced outputs(!) and you've already mentioned that you use them. There is no problem here. You've already found an interim solution and that solution will work regardless of any software, regardless of any OS and regardless of any computer.

This thread / rant (and the identical one that you posted pre-superbooth) will not speed up Elektron's progress no matter how much you want it to. They have developers on the case so just let them do their job and when Overbridge is finally released, use it instead of your current solution - if that's what you want. In the meantime - enjoy the Rytm MKII as it's an awesome piece of kit.
Old 22nd May 2018
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimknopf View Post
Ok, my wording was imprecise concerning Digitakt recording.

Of course I was referring to the fact, that nowadays it is regarded as standard to record drum machine tracks to separate outs for flexible editing with the powerful tools in your DAW. Digitakt's stereo mix is not nearly good enough to replace that kind of DAW mixing, from my view and from the view of plenty of others who don't intend to record from such a stereo out mix in 2018.

But hey, of course I know that in the age of cassette recorders people definitely had other problems...
Sorry, but I think you might need to learn more about recording and production if you think you need Overbridge for separate tracks from a stereo output. Whilst its a slow process, can record one track at a time - In fact overdubs is a big part of production in most genres and that is basically how its done.

So yes, you can get separate tracks from a Digitakt into a DAW without Overbridge, however OB will simplify the process, but its not a necessity. With the RYTM, it has individual outputs already.
Old 22nd May 2018
  #27
Deleted ea69e11
Guest
Quote:
This thread / rant (and the identical one that you posted pre-superbooth) will not speed up Elektron's progress no matter how much you want it to.
of course it wont but at the same time this is a forum, elektron isn't delivering on their promises(yet) and its been a year since they said they would.

ppl generally rant about things like that, especially when there is no date in sight to when it will be fixed.
Old 22nd May 2018
  #28
Deleted cec0d5b
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f33 View Post
of course it wont but at the same time this is a forum, elektron isn't delivering on their promises(yet) and its been a year since they said they would.

ppl generally rant about things like that, especially when there is no date in sight to when it will be fixed.
Of course they do, and normally I would understand, but... in this instance there is already a solution to the "problem" so it's purely a rant for rant's sake. It's not as though the unit itself is crippled as the OP stated in his opening thread:

Quote:
I will just keep on using it with the present, crippled recording workflow


Sheer hyperbole.
Old 22nd May 2018
  #29
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REwire's Avatar
I just sold my Digitone. When it was on my lap when I first got it it was fun but the minute it was on a shelf with my other synths I could not even bare to drill in and scroll and shift hold and tap.

Overbridge was the promise of getting all that deep stuff on my screen where I could deal with it. I don't care how good it sounded, no use, no keep.

Battery power would have helped.

Dan
Old 22nd May 2018
  #30
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donato's Avatar
Amazing some people will defend any broken corporate promise. The fact is they sold a ton of these units with the promise of Overbridge by a specific date (which has been pushed back twice with no end in sight) that otherwise wouldn't have been sold. I used to love Elektron. Anyway, everyone has a different view on this, just goes to show some consumers will put up with a lot, and some won't put up with much at all.
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