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Sequential Prophet X
Old 14th May 2019
  #5311
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astraeus000's Avatar
Prophet T8 add-on now . . . they are going through the world of analog synths first apparently.

It looks like I'm going to waiting a long time for my Epic choir/ethnic vocal/shamanistic rituals of the world/Djinn summoning Prophet X pack.
Old 14th May 2019
  #5312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astraeus000 View Post
Prophet T8 add-on now . . . they are going through the world of analog synths first apparently.

It looks like I'm going to waiting a long time for my Epic choir/ethnic vocal/shamanistic rituals of the world/Djinn summoning Prophet X pack.
Got the T8 add-on pack, installed, not impressed, preset examples are average and I'm being kind.

A long wait for anything more diverse and inspiring I think.
Old 14th May 2019
  #5313
Gear Addict
 
REwire's Avatar
Putting out T8 samples doesn't make sense to me. The T8 is exactly the same oscs and filter as the P5 with more voices, aftertouch, velocity and a sequencer. How could that enhance the basic waveforms for use in the PX unless they sampled the sequences and made patches with aftertouch and velocity, which we can do with the P5 samples and the PX facilities? Passing on this one.
Old 14th May 2019
  #5314
rsv
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I dont know if i gonna get the t8 tonigh. Does the t8 samples are the same t5 samples ?
Old 15th May 2019
  #5315
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Thanks for the response Studio. I haven’t had a chance to try one yet. If I could play some piano, ep and Hammond sounds, some nice moogish leads, and incorporate the ability for weird soundscapes in between songs....I would buy it instantly. I already have a guitar rig so hauling in one keyboard for some shows would be awesome!
Old 15th May 2019
  #5316
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by REwire View Post
Putting out T8 samples doesn't make sense to me. The T8 is exactly the same oscs and filter as the P5 with more voices, aftertouch, velocity and a sequencer. How could that enhance the basic waveforms for use in the PX unless they sampled the sequences and made patches with aftertouch and velocity, which we can do with the P5 samples and the PX facilities? Passing on this one.
The T8 is more like the Prophet 600 with faster envelopes.

Stephen
Old 15th May 2019
  #5317
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Personally, I'd just be happy if they sorted user sampling out.

Stephen
Old 15th May 2019
  #5318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Bennett View Post
Personally, I'd just be happy if they sorted user sampling out.

Stephen
Didn’t PXtools sort all that out?
Old 15th May 2019
  #5319
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertflyer View Post
Didn’t PXtools sort all that out?
Lady G did a brilliant job and it's miles better than 8DIO's attempt—but, much more is needed to make the Prophet X a proper, and easy to use sampler. All you can do now is import WAVs of the correct format (making sure you don't lose root notes after conversion) and create the archaic directory structure that the PX requires.

I've posted this before in the PX forum, but I'd like to see ...

The ability to easily add velocity layers (PXTools does this)
The import of files of different sample rates, bit depths and file types (AIFF, for example). Conversion often destroys metadata.
Graphical sample looping and auto looping
Proper audio and MIDI support
Some basic processing (normalize, levels) of the imported samples.
The option to transfer from computer to Prophet X via a USB cable rather than dongle
The ability to organise instruments on the PX from the computer
The ability to delete individual instruments on the PX—you currently have to delete the whole of one of the 8 slots.

It's 2019, not 1985.

I'm sure other users would like to see other improvements.

I'm sure something like this could be developed. Sequential Circuits Prophet 2000 / 2002 Editor. The PX is the best-sounding sampler I've heard and a true successor to the 2000.



Stephen
Old 15th May 2019
  #5320
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
PXToolkit will pick up one pair of loop points from each WAV file’s metadata, as this is what the Prophet X supports.
The canonical WAV definition doesn't include loop points. There are various extensions and I believe, for example, there's a chunk by Digidesign defining loop points. Just curious what you're basing it on. I wasn't aware if there is some generally accepted spec for loop points.
Old 15th May 2019
  #5321
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by minorguy View Post
The canonical WAV definition doesn't include loop points.
The WAV standard covers both required and optional content. Sample rate and number of channels are part of the required “fmt” chunk, and sample data makes up the other required “data” chunk. The formal specification also defines quite a few other standard but optional chunks, including “smpl” and “inst” which PXToolkit will use if present.

The “smpl” chunk can specify an arbitrary number of loops, while the Prophet X supports only one. If at least one is specified, PXToolkit will use the first one. This chunk can also specify the recorded pitch as a MIDI note and detuning, which PXToolkit will use.

The “inst” chunk can also specify the MIDI note and detuning which PXToolkit will use. I can’t remember offhand which I’ll give priority to if both this and the smpl chunk are present, but it shouldn’t matter much in practice.

Vendors are free to add proprietary extensions which will be gracefully ignored by PXToolkit. They should also emit the standardized metadata as appropriate but not all of them do a great job of it since they’re generally happy to lock customers into using their software. I’m not especially interested in trying to reverse engineer their formats, but if you know of any official specifications I could look into supporting anything that’s well documented.
Old 15th May 2019
  #5322
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Bennett View Post
All you can do now is import WAVs of the correct format (making sure you don't lose root notes after conversion) and create the archaic directory structure that the PX requires.
PXToolkit does create the appropriate directory structure for you, but it’s true that I’ve seen a few people get caught up on how exactly it should be represented on the USB drive.

Quote:
The option to transfer from computer to Prophet X via a USB cable rather than dongle
The ability to organise instruments on the PX from the computer
A direct connection for installing samples over a USB connection would be welcome, but also not a small amount of work on Sequential's part. I don’t know if the USB device port on the Prophet X is fast enough to make it practical. Who knows whether this will emerge as a priority? If they do decide that it’s a good use of their time it would be something I’d consider supporting.

Quote:
The import of files of different sample rates, bit depths and file types (AIFF, for example). Conversion often destroys metadata.
Graphical sample looping and auto looping
Some basic processing (normalize, levels) of the imported samples.
I’ve considered doing something in this space but find that SampleRobot is pretty good at it and meets 90%+ of my needs while preserving metadata. Building something new simply hasn’t been a priority for me as a result.

Quote:
Proper audio and MIDI support
I’m not sure what you mean here, as it’s not clear without more context. Can you elaborate?

Quote:
The ability to delete individual instruments on the PX—you currently have to delete the whole of one of the 8 slots.
I know I’ve mentioned this on the official forum, but it bears repeating for those who are curious here: you can also overwrite individual instruments simply by installing new ones with the same Group, Category, and Index #. What you can’t do currently is delete them individually without replacing them.

Quote:
It's 2019, not 1985.
Sure, but keep in mind that Sequential is a relatively small, very focused company. They appear to have no interest in writing macOS or Windows software, preferring to build amazing instruments and document their interoperability mechanisms so others can write librarian software, full-featured MIDI sequencers, etc. I don’t see user sample support for the Prophet X as fundamentally different.

Quote:
I'm sure other users would like to see other improvements.
It never hurts to ask!
Old 15th May 2019
  #5323
Gear Addict
Yes, "smpl" is the one I was referring to. I wasn't aware of anywhere it says this is accepted as a standard. Just some tacit consensus? Then again, I also don't know of any other chunk that handles loop points so I suppose that's good enough. Anyway, you answered my question.
Old 15th May 2019
  #5324
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

LG—I'm talking about the 8DIO editor re: MIDI and Audio—a proper preferences window would help!

It's frustrating. The potential is enormous for this fantastic synth/sampler.

I fear it'll remain as crippled as a sampler as it is now. Maybe that's too harsh, but who wants to deal with something that could be so much easier to manage? Every time I sample, I know it's taking me ten times longer than it should do and I can use that time better.

I suspect DS has a relationship with 8DIO that doesn't allow them to throw this out to a third party and the latter comapny, understandably, have little reason to help improve the ease of user sampling. Maybe that will change when that relationship ends? A third party integrated sampling/librarian utility could be a profitable product. I guess I'm spoiled using Nord gear. Their software isn't perfect, but it's a damn sight better than what's available for the the PX.

That's the cynic in me. I hope I'm proved wrong and I will humbly admit it if so!

Stephen
Old 16th May 2019
  #5325
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Bennett View Post
Personally, I'd just be happy if they sorted user sampling out.

Stephen
They keep threatening to take it out of Beta...……….
Old 16th May 2019
  #5326
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roland. View Post
They keep threatening to take it out of Beta...……….
Let's hope so. It's more ε at the mo.

Stephen
Old 17th May 2019
  #5327
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For some reason my global settings don’t save after I power cycle the PX. Is this normal or is there some trick to saving global settings?
Old 17th May 2019
  #5328
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huggie's Avatar
Working on my PPG library for the PX...

Sequential Prophet X-d6u0gzqu0auumav.jpg
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Sequential Prophet X-d6u0gzqu0auumav.jpg  
Old 17th May 2019
  #5329
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertflyer View Post
For some reason my global settings don’t save after I power cycle the PX. Is this normal or is there some trick to saving global settings?
Any settings in particular? There are some settings that won't save until you exit the mode where you're editing them. Play Lists are one such example, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if changes to global settings weren't saved until you exit Global mode.
Old 17th May 2019
  #5330
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drockfresh's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by huggie View Post
Working on my PPG library for the PX...

Old 17th May 2019
  #5331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Any settings in particular? There are some settings that won't save until you exit the mode where you're editing them. Play Lists are one such example, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if changes to global settings weren't saved until you exit Global mode.
I switched the midi channel to 3, local off, program change on, multimode on and then I do leave the global settings page. None of those settings are saved after a reboot.
Old 17th May 2019
  #5332
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Lady Gaia's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertflyer View Post
I switched the midi channel to 3, local off, program change on, multimode on and then I do leave the global settings page. None of those settings are saved after a reboot.
Curious. I definitely see my MIDI channel and multimode settings preserved across a power cycle, and I'd expect the others to be saved as well. It's worth writing to Sequential support who are, in my experience, very responsive.
Old 17th May 2019
  #5333
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markwalkerjr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by huggie View Post
Working on my PPG library for the PX...

Good lord I can't wait! ETA?
Old 17th May 2019
  #5334
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huggie's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by markwalkerjr View Post
Good lord I can't wait! ETA?
The main release is early next week with Kontakt, Ableton Live EXS24 and TAL-Sampler support. The PX version might take a bit longer. I'm hoping by the end of the month.

Hugo
Old 17th May 2019
  #5335
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drockfresh's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by huggie View Post
The main release is early next week with Kontakt, Ableton Live EXS24 and TAL-Sampler support. The PX version might take a bit longer. I'm hoping by the end of the month.

Hugo
Awesome
Old 18th May 2019
  #5336
Here for the gear
I really want to thank Lady Gaia for all the work she did on the various PX tools. Also blewis_12 and AlanC3 (and anyone else I've missed) for the work they did on the VCO library.

I purchased the PX based largely on the possibility of using deep sampled libraries from 8Dio. I have 8Dio sample libraries and it was my expectation that there would be a lot of velocity layers used for their samples so I could get different timbres based on the velocity played; but I really don't see that in what is in the factory banks. Deep sampling is supposed to be all about velocity layers... Right now I'm not overly excited about the 8Dio samples.

I've been sitting on the fence wondering if maybe a P12 would be a better use of my money. The PX is $4k vs under $2k for a P12. I could take the left over $2k and buy another P08 to chain with my existing P08 and still have $1k leftover. Yes the P12 doesn't have samples (per se), but it has 4 digital oscillators similar to the PX, a good number of waveforms, lots of modulation options, and it has FM. It has fewer voices and lacks the true stereo samples - but we've all lived without true stereo forever.

I've now installed the VCO pack and with the 8Dio P VS samples I'm trying to see just how far I can go with a "4 digital oscillator" synth (2 inst + 2 osc). So far I'm having a lot more fun with it and I'm seeing a large amount of sonic possibilities. With that I'll probably start looking how to better use the 8Dio samples. I'm guessing that there is still a lot of space left in the "factory" 150GB part of the SSD. So maybe there are more possibilities if 8Dio gets serious about this.

Still sitting on the fence a little bit. I still have 2 weeks to play with it before making a hard choice. Looking forward to trying LG's PXToolkit so I can try some of my own samples!

Lenny
Old 18th May 2019
  #5337
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markwalkerjr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by lennyh View Post
I really want to thank Lady Gaia for all the work she did on the various PX tools. Also blewis_12 and AlanC3 (and anyone else I've missed) for the work they did on the VCO library.

I purchased the PX based largely on the possibility of using deep sampled libraries from 8Dio. I have 8Dio sample libraries and it was my expectation that there would be a lot of velocity layers used for their samples so I could get different timbres based on the velocity played; but I really don't see that in what is in the factory banks. Deep sampling is supposed to be all about velocity layers... Right now I'm not overly excited about the 8Dio samples.

I've been sitting on the fence wondering if maybe a P12 would be a better use of my money. The PX is $4k vs under $2k for a P12. I could take the left over $2k and buy another P08 to chain with my existing P08 and still have $1k leftover. Yes the P12 doesn't have samples (per se), but it has 4 digital oscillators similar to the PX, a good number of waveforms, lots of modulation options, and it has FM. It has fewer voices and lacks the true stereo samples - but we've all lived without true stereo forever.

I've now installed the VCO pack and with the 8Dio P VS samples I'm trying to see just how far I can go with a "4 digital oscillator" synth (2 inst + 2 osc). So far I'm having a lot more fun with it and I'm seeing a large amount of sonic possibilities. With that I'll probably start looking how to better use the 8Dio samples. I'm guessing that there is still a lot of space left in the "factory" 150GB part of the SSD. So maybe there are more possibilities if 8Dio gets serious about this.

Still sitting on the fence a little bit. I still have 2 weeks to play with it before making a hard choice. Looking forward to trying LG's PXToolkit so I can try some of my own samples!

Lenny
I owned the P12 from release. Loved it. But the PX is world class and does so much more than the P12 and the filters are night and day better. Sold the 12 and haven’t looked back.

Last edited by markwalkerjr; 18th May 2019 at 09:32 PM.. Reason: Siri is an awful correction help
Old 18th May 2019
  #5338
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by markwalkerjr View Post
I owned the P12 from release. Loved it. But the PX is world class and does so much more than the P12 and the filters are night and day better. Sold the 12 and haven’t looked back.
Thanks Mark - That's encouraging
Old 18th May 2019
  #5339
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Stephen Bennett's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lennyh View Post
I really want to thank Lady Gaia for all the work she did on the various PX tools. Also blewis_12 and AlanC3 (and anyone else I've missed) for the work they did on the VCO library.

I purchased the PX based largely on the possibility of using deep sampled libraries from 8Dio. I have 8Dio sample libraries and it was my expectation that there would be a lot of velocity layers used for their samples so I could get different timbres based on the velocity played; but I really don't see that in what is in the factory banks. Deep sampling is supposed to be all about velocity layers... Right now I'm not overly excited about the 8Dio samples.

I've been sitting on the fence wondering if maybe a P12 would be a better use of my money. The PX is $4k vs under $2k for a P12. I could take the left over $2k and buy another P08 to chain with my existing P08 and still have $1k leftover. Yes the P12 doesn't have samples (per se), but it has 4 digital oscillators similar to the PX, a good number of waveforms, lots of modulation options, and it has FM. It has fewer voices and lacks the true stereo samples - but we've all lived without true stereo forever.

I've now installed the VCO pack and with the 8Dio P VS samples I'm trying to see just how far I can go with a "4 digital oscillator" synth (2 inst + 2 osc). So far I'm having a lot more fun with it and I'm seeing a large amount of sonic possibilities. With that I'll probably start looking how to better use the 8Dio samples. I'm guessing that there is still a lot of space left in the "factory" 150GB part of the SSD. So maybe there are more possibilities if 8Dio gets serious about this.

Still sitting on the fence a little bit. I still have 2 weeks to play with it before making a hard choice. Looking forward to trying LG's PXToolkit so I can try some of my own samples!

Lenny
I think Gordon summed it up in the Sound on Sound review. If you look at the PX as a ROMpler, you'll be disappointed. If you look at it a synthesiser with an almost infinite variety of waveforms to process, it makes more sense. The stereo filters are fantastic.

Stephen
Old 18th May 2019
  #5340
Deleted cec0d5b
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Bennett View Post
If you look at the PX as a ROMpler, you'll be disappointed. If you look at it a synthesiser with an almost infinite variety of waveforms to process, it makes more sense.
Except it does actually feel like a rompler in use - at least it did to me. Not that that's particularly a bad thing - I spent most of my musical life playing a Yamaha SY-85 - but that is how it felt to me when I played it. Perhaps that feeling would dissipate over time if I owned it (and especially once I started using my own samples), but, on the flip-side, the P12 felt very much like a synth.
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