The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Hardware polysynth for MPE with Roli
View Poll Results: Hardware polysynth for MPE with Roli
Micromonsta
7 Votes - 77.78%
Blofeld
2 Votes - 22.22%
Parva
0 Votes - 0%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 9. You may not vote on this poll

Old 12th April 2018 | Show parent
  #31
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOYZ View Post
Incidentally, in principle any sufficiently multi-timbral (hardware or software) synth can be used with an MPE controller. It's just that you need to do some of the legwork of setting up the various MIDI channels and settings yourself.

For instance, my Fantom X7 and XV-5080 are both 16 parts multi-timbral. I haven't gotten around to trying my Rise 49 with either of them (in fact I haven't even touched my Rise or any other keyboards for weeks now) but it should definitely work just fine.

I even think it should be quite possible to write a bit of software that automatically configures a multi-timbral synth such as those mentioned to interact seamlessly with an MPE controller. When I get more time I'll probably give that a go.

Some of the things such a utility would have to do would be to automatically send program changes to the channels M+1 to M+N (M being the MPE 'master channel', N being the number of channels being used) if you change the patch for the master channel M.

If you make the software aware of the synth it's controlling, it could also replicate any changes you make to the patch on the master channel to the other channels. I know that would be possible with the Fantom X7 and the XV-5080 at least.

You could also do this with something like a Raspberry Pi. Perhaps a company like Kensington could even produce a small MIDI processor that does this. Or perhaps Roli could (should?) commission such a device, or embed such functionality in the firmware.

Not holding my breath for that to happen so as soon as I get the time I will write it myself.
When I first got my Rise I thought, “I should buy an XV-8050,” but the truth is, Equator is pretty great and for what it can’t do, Falcon is excellent. Eric Persing said that MPE compatibly is slated for Omnisphere too.
Old 12th April 2018 | Show parent
  #32
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOYZ View Post
Incidentally, in principle any sufficiently multi-timbral (hardware or software) synth can be used with an MPE controller. It's just that you need to do some of the legwork of setting up the various MIDI channels and settings yourself.

For instance, my Fantom X7 and XV-5080 are both 16 parts multi-timbral. I haven't gotten around to trying my Rise 49 with either of them (in fact I haven't even touched my Rise or any other keyboards for weeks now) but it should definitely work just fine.

I even think it should be quite possible to write a bit of software that automatically configures a multi-timbral synth such as those mentioned to interact seamlessly with an MPE controller. When I get more time I'll probably give that a go.

Some of the things such a utility would have to do would be to automatically send program changes to the channels M+1 to M+N (M being the MPE 'master channel', N being the number of channels being used) if you change the patch for the master channel M.

If you make the software aware of the synth it's controlling, it could also replicate any changes you make to the patch on the master channel to the other channels. I know that would be possible with the Fantom X7 and the XV-5080 at least.

You could also do this with something like a Raspberry Pi. Perhaps a company like Kensington could even produce a small MIDI processor that does this. Or perhaps Roli could (should?) commission such a device, or embed such functionality in the firmware.

Not holding my breath for that to happen so as soon as I get the time I will write it myself.
Some very interesting thoughts here. I think the R-Pi approach makes sense since intermediate 'computers' with tiny footprints is more appealing to me than full-blown systems. And a common midi processor that could serve many non-MPE instruments might be a good niche product idea that could make the dozens of multitimbral options in the market immediately accessible to MPE.
Old 12th April 2018 | Show parent
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
When I first got my Rise I thought, “I should buy an XV-8050,” but the truth is, Equator is pretty great and for what it can’t do, Falcon is excellent. Eric Persing said that MPE compatibly is slated for Omnisphere too.
Assuming that I go the softsynth route, what would be a good setup so that I don't have to depend on my main computer and monitor for my basement studio setup? Obviously, I need the computer that runs the softsynth to be beefy enough to meet recommended system requirements, but I do have a secondary computer which at least meets the requirements of Equator and Falcon.

Would it be better to get a reasonable sized multitouch touchscreen monitor and keep it slanted in the midst of my hardware setup? Or is the touchscreen more pain than it is worth?

The other options are to just use a traditional keyboard mouse combo or go for a midi control surface (and do all the midi-learns).

For serious production work on a DAW, I will still go to the main computer, but for jamming and noodling, it just feels tiring to have to deal with the main computer monolith
Old 13th April 2018 | Show parent
  #34
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by shankzz View Post
Assuming that I go the softsynth route, what would be a good setup so that I don't have to depend on my main computer and monitor for my basement studio setup? Obviously, I need the computer that runs the softsynth to be beefy enough to meet recommended system requirements, but I do have a secondary computer which at least meets the requirements of Equator and Falcon.

Would it be better to get a reasonable sized multitouch touchscreen monitor and keep it slanted in the midst of my hardware setup? Or is the touchscreen more pain than it is worth?

The other options are to just use a traditional keyboard mouse combo or go for a midi control surface (and do all the midi-learns).

For serious production work on a DAW, I will still go to the main computer, but for jamming and noodling, it just feels tiring to have to deal with the main computer monolith
Honestly, if it were me tooling up for live gigs, imd get a good regular laptop, maybe Mac, and a Novation Remote and be done. The 5d expression is plenty for live tweaking and anything else the Remote can easily handle. Get a big SSD. If you really want a touchscreen, add an iPad and Lemur to the mix and forget the Remote.
Old 13th April 2018 | Show parent
  #35
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
When I first got my Rise I thought, “I should buy an XV-8050,” but the truth is, Equator is pretty great and for what it can’t do, Falcon is excellent. Eric Persing said that MPE compatibly is slated for Omnisphere too.
That is good to hear. Can you tell me where he said that?

I asked back in November if they had plans to add MPE support to Omnisphere and all I got back was "We don’t publicly discuss our development plans, though MPE support is something we are looking into.".

There's only a few sounds in Equator that I kinda like so far, and I'm not even thrilled with those.
Old 13th April 2018
  #36
Love the discussion on this thread. Thanks for the productive conversation! I am still researching my options but after coming here, I have expanded my choices to include a bunch of good ol' multitimbral 'vintage' (read 90s) synths as well. I am looking at a pretty decent offer for a Kurzweil K2000 that can play a central role in my setup just as a standalone polysynth workstation but also has the multitimbrality that people have seemed to find ways to work MPE into, like this.
Old 13th April 2018 | Show parent
  #37
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Capable, but with no explicit MPE support. Still, poly aftertouch reception or the same patch assigned to several MIDI channels can get the job done with the Seaboard appropriately configured. I am planning to try the combination out this year either when Roli has another sale or introduces something new (current bundle offers expire in just two days, so I have some hope they’ll have something new queued up one way or another.)

I’ll also check to see if Kurzweil is receptive to adding an explicit MPE mode to the Forte. It never hurts to ask.
This (as in, Kurzweil V.A.S.T) is the option I am closely looking into now, especially since there is existing documentation on how to do this with a Linnstrument. I will finalize my choices this weekend, and report back here if I ended up going down this path. Thanks
Old 13th April 2018 | Show parent
  #38
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOYZ View Post
That is good to hear. Can you tell me where he said that?

I asked back in November if they had plans to add MPE support to Omnisphere and all I got back was "We don’t publicly discuss our development plans, though MPE support is something we are looking into.".

There's only a few sounds in Equator that I kinda like so far, and I'm not even thrilled with those.
It was on the Omnisphere Power Users Facebook
Old 14th April 2018
  #39
Lives for gear
 
jiffybox's Avatar
Thank you, thread. I am now three hundred bucks poorer than before I read this.



I will report back on the MPE with my Roli Seaboard Block.
Old 14th April 2018
  #40
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I say modor nf-1
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #41
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiffybox View Post
Thank you, thread. I am now three hundred bucks poorer than before I read this.



I will report back on the MPE with my Roli Seaboard Block.
Yay, you . At least someone is in the spirit of GS here! I am still twiddling my thumbs, researching options :|

Although, I might drive 120 miles to pick up a K2000 this weekend. So, I think I am getting into the GS mode
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #42
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Let me point out that one of the potential differences between an MPE synth and a multitimbral synth is that generally the former lets you play as you edit a patch, while the latter tends to restrict you to distributing an existing patch across different MIDI channels. The latter scheme is certainly workable, but the former's a lot more convenient.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #43
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiffybox View Post
I will report back on the [MicroMonsta] MPE with my Roli Seaboard Block.
Please do; I've asked about this a couple of times here and gotten crickets. I guess my concern is whether there's enough sonically interesting things to do with press(ure) modulation. (From the specs it seems like there should be.)
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rimwolf View Post
Let me point out that one of the potential differences between an MPE synth and a multitimbral synth is that generally the former lets you play as you edit a patch, while the latter tends to restrict you to distributing an existing patch across different MIDI channels. The latter scheme is certainly workable, but the former's a lot more convenient.
Thanks! Yes, I realized this as well. More for playing prebuilt patches as MPE rather than noodling with the patch definition as we play.

The reason I am looking at the K2000 is that I will get a multitimbral workstation for $200 and then I can also get the monotimbral full MPE compatible micromonsta for another $300ish and still spend way less compared to something like a Parva or a Modor.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rimwolf View Post
Please do; I've asked about this a couple of times here and gotten crickets. I guess my concern is whether there's enough sonically interesting things to do with press(ure) modulation. (From the specs it seems like there should be.)
I echo this!
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #46
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rimwolf View Post
Let me point out that one of the potential differences between an MPE synth and a multitimbral synth is that generally the former lets you play as you edit a patch, while the latter tends to restrict you to distributing an existing patch across different MIDI channels. The latter scheme is certainly workable, but the former's a lot more convenient.
Hopefully the software I mentioned I'd like to make, once I get a bit more time, will overcome that, at least for the synths it will support directly which would be the ones I own that would support this: the Fantom X and the XV-5080. I would take care of course to make it easy to extend support to other devices.

From previous work on MIDI software for the Fantom X I know that it's possible to query and modify the current patch, including any (unsaved) edits, for each part individually so it should be possible to replicate the patch being edited in the 'master' part to the other parts.

Worst case this would be a polling scheme but perhaps it's also possible to detect changes to the master patch by listening for CC, SysEx or other MIDI messages, which could trigger replication of the patch to the other parts. Can't remember to what extent the Fantom would allow that.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #47
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOYZ View Post
Hopefully the software I mentioned I'd like to make, once I get a bit more time, will overcome that, at least for the synths it will support directly which would be the ones I own that would support this: the Fantom X and the XV-5080. I would take care of course to make it easy to extend support to other devices.

From previous work on MIDI software for the Fantom X I know that it's possible to query and modify the current patch, including any (unsaved) edits, for each part individually so it should be possible to replicate the patch being edited in the 'master' part to the other parts.

Worst case this would be a polling scheme but perhaps it's also possible to detect changes to the master patch by listening for CC, SysEx or other MIDI messages, which could trigger replication of the patch to the other parts. Can't remember to what extent the Fantom would allow that.
This might be a very interesting project. I could help work/test this for V.A.S.T since I am going to get the K2000.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #48
Gear Maniac
 
YashN's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Gaia View Post
Capable, but with no explicit MPE support
There are MANY, MANY things the Kurzweils are capable of but which are not explicit.

You should know

LS Recommended Sounds

Click on the Hardware Tab.
Click on Kurzweil V.A.S.T. instruments.
Read.
Learn.
Apply.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #49
Quote:
Originally Posted by YashN View Post
There are MANY, MANY things the Kurzweils are capable of but which are not explicit.

You should know

LS Recommended Sounds

Click on the Hardware Tab.
Click on Kurzweil V.A.S.T. instruments.
Read.
Learn.
Apply.
Thanks for giving this suggestion in the first place! Your note pushed me to explore the Kurzweils and a lucky Craigslist post later, I am pretty close to getting it this weekend itself

I have seen that page in Linn's site. Can't wait to try it out
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #50
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiffybox View Post
Thank you, thread. I am now three hundred bucks poorer than before I read this.



I will report back on the MPE with my Roli Seaboard Block.
She’s a fine synth. Regardless as to how it works with your Rise, you’ll like it.
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #51
Lives for gear
 
wagoo's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by cixelsyd View Post
I say modor nf-1
I just noticed this supports MPE now. NF-1m too
Old 14th April 2018 | Show parent
  #52
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rimwolf View Post
Please do; I've asked about this a couple of times here and gotten crickets. I guess my concern is whether there's enough sonically interesting things to do with press(ure) modulation. (From the specs it seems like there should be.)
I got tripped up by the fact that Bitwig, in it’s stupidly it blocks MPE to external instruments. I could switch back and forth, but whatever the Micromonsta gives me probably pales in comparison to something like Falcon.
Old 15th April 2018
  #53
Kurzweil K2000 in the house, folks! Pretty excited. Picked it up and back home just now. It was clean and well maintained. Time to get lost in the VASTness
Old 15th April 2018
  #54
Oh boy! The sounds are beautiful and the keybed is . Fun times
Old 15th April 2018 | Show parent
  #55
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Random addition to the useful hardware list:

My old EMU Proteus 2500 (and therefore probably all of the Proteus 2000 family synths) has a quite useful bug (I don´t think it is an intended feature):

If you load the same preset on multiple channels and you edit this preset you change the sound on all channels. You can therefore use a multitimbral setup for MPE stuff, but all tweaks apply to all voices.

Only build a handful of sounds for MPE control on it, since I got too many nice new toys last year that play nice with MPE (e.g. Falcon, Repro-5).
Old 15th April 2018
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Coorec's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
If Roli would offer a keyboard with in built soundsource, they would sell more of this.
Old 15th April 2018 | Show parent
  #57
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coorec View Post
If Roli would offer a keyboard with in built soundsource, they would sell more of this.
The Roli Seaboard grand Stage has the Equator sound engine built-in. It's a bit pricey though.
Old 15th April 2018 | Show parent
  #58
Lives for gear
 
Coorec's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOYZ View Post
The Roli Seaboard grand Stage has the Equator sound engine built-in. It's a bit pricey though.
And also very big.

Thanks for the pointer, tho. I didnt know this.
Old 15th April 2018 | Show parent
  #59
Gear Guru
 
zerocrossing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by shankzz View Post
Kurzweil K2000 in the house, folks! Pretty excited. Picked it up and back home just now. It was clean and well maintained. Time to get lost in the VASTness
Is the keybed set up for poly pressure, or just monophonic aftertouch?

Let me know how it goes with the MPE. I’ve always been curious about Kurzweil’s stuff, but I’ve never directly experienced it.
Old 15th April 2018 | Show parent
  #60
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocrossing View Post
Is the keybed set up for poly pressure, or just monophonic aftertouch?

Let me know how it goes with the MPE. I’ve always been curious about Kurzweil’s stuff, but I’ve never directly experienced it.
The keybed itself is monopressure. I am looking at two use cases:

1. I don't have any polyphonic multitimbral workstation. So, I will use it as a standard polysynth and perhaps my master keyboard since it is pretty good. Mono aftertouch, attack and release velocity sensitive.

2. Do the note-per-channel gimmick with Roli and see how that plays out. Will report back here once I have it setup. Probably by mid-next week I guess.

Worst case, if #2 doesn't work, I can always get a micromonsta
📝 Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 110 views: 22654
Avatar for caronte23
caronte23 31st December 2015
replies: 218 views: 36042
Avatar for Audiorange
Audiorange 6 days ago
replies: 33 views: 4049
Avatar for The Mule
The Mule 22nd February 2019
replies: 131 views: 8462
Avatar for David Carlyon
David Carlyon 22 hours ago
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
🖨️ Show Printable Version
✉️ Email this Page
🔍 Search thread
🎙️ View mentioned gear
Forum Jump
Forum Jump