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Moog Model D iPad app Keyboard Controllers
Old 30th March 2018
  #91
Lives for gear
 

I'm of the ancient, Julian Hirsch school of A/B Blind Tests (aka known as actually scientifically valid).

I've not seen one synth comparison, in being online since literally before there was the internet, that even comes close to that level of validity.

Most are clearly honest in effort, but the means to produce exact comparisons aren't there, or the tester's ears aren't tuned enough to notice slight differences in levels, or any one of myriads of uncontrolled factors coming into the process.

The only real comparison is in your own experience. If you've never had a "real" (aka physical) Moog of any sort, you needn't worry that you're missing out on any grand musical mystery in terms of sound experience with the iPad app. Subtle differences, sure, but only of the kind that matter to people worrying about the current eBay value of their antique.

And anyone's experience of one vs. the other is inevitably different from someone else's.

And visually tuning a patch between synths doesn't guarantee sonic similarity; often software or digital models of analogue hardware actually have more range than the originals, and less noise in the circuits, and cleaner signal path and greater bandwidth, etc. so even with the closest modelling, there are going to be differences in sound.

And comparing a 30-year-old synth with aged components to a new emulation is like comparing a statue of a woman from ancient ancient Egypt with a photo of Uma Thurman. Age will produce difference.

And as IncarnateX says, the pure, physical experience of using one type of instrument or interface vs. another is even itself a significant factor. If you have a Voyager, whether you selected walnut, oak or pine for your case is going to affect how you feel about the instrument you frequently play, if you have one, for instance. People put heavy wood side panels on their plastic synths to make them "feel better and look better."

Best not to chase this universe of subjectivity with a faux OCD engineering-style obsession with exactitude, 'cause it ain't there.

Enjoy what you enjoy, change the channel if you don't, it's really that simple.
Old 30th March 2018
  #92
Lives for gear
 

OK to what you wrote, but i am still curious how close or far a Moog emulation is to the target Moog synth in sound.
Old 30th March 2018
  #93
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Sure, I'm not trying to stifle a fun discussion on that; we'd all enjoy it, presented as a satisfying conversation.

I think most would say it is quite close. Heck, Animoog when it came out (31 October 2011) was already quite close, depending on the patch.

Closer, I think at least, than either Arturia's excellent emulation (V3) or NI's (in my opinion and experience) warmer/more-saturated-sounding Monark (in comparison with Minimoog V3).

My context is experience with the Minimoog D, Voyager and Mother 32 over the years, in terms of sonic training of my ears. Oh and SE-02, which is true analogue and comes quite close to the D in a number of ways, and veers drastically away in others (particularly with its cross-mod capabilities). Fortunately.

Given that it's only one oscillator, the Mother-32 is amazingly close.

I am confident that, whether hardware or software, Moog Music at this point knows "the Moog sound" in detail. Why I've jumped with no hesitation at all at their app releases (Animoog, Model 15 and now Model D).

In the video above (AUV3... horrible, tubby recording, btw!), as critique you can even tell there that the software version has a tiny bit more of that buzzy, metallic "sheen" than a D might have, for multiple reasons. Not enough to suffer from, but enough to render it distinct from an original.

But $4.99 vs. $3500 is, I think, a good deal and given the price differential, that trade-off in sonic signature is well worth it (and portability, for that matter!)!
Old 30th March 2018
  #94
Gear Addict
 
IncarnateX's Avatar
 

Yeah. In terms of approximations, anekdotes and impressions there is nothing wrong in making comparisons, as long as you remember that your perceptions are subjective and do not reflect universal facts. Though I own a Boog I get bored with comparisons even before making them, so I cannot offer anything in this regard. However, from immediate impression I can say that a 3 osc bass on this app (2 octaved saws + square sub) sounds more moogish to me than both Arturia iMini and Model 15. And with “moogish” I do not point to exact reproduction but the fact that the sound is fat, full, free of digital artifacts, associate better with the Boog and simply sounds better to me. This app may actually be the best iOS bass synth to me so far. It delivers what I want from it without the usual struggles.
Old 30th March 2018
  #95
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robotunes's Avatar
I'd love to compare the iPad app to a Minimoog because that would mean I had a D at my disposal. I don't, so I don't see how I for one could create a valid aural comparison of the hardware and the app. Sorry.
Old 30th March 2018
  #96
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Jamie munro's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by goom View Post
Too much trouble. Rather use a plugin. Hopefully The Legend goes on sale. My Boog is good.
Boog may be good but saying this is too much trouble is beyond shortsighted, if you've got an iPad capable of running it and you've got a Mac OR a PC you can simply connect the Lightning to a USB slot on whatever computer and be done.

With PC you do need to buy a £10 plugin called studiomux but it's one lightning cable to a PC USB slot for audio and midi which I imagine is less cabling than the boog to the PC
Old 30th March 2018
  #97
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Jamie munro's Avatar
 

I love my ipad4 and my iPhone but F**K Apple
Old 31st March 2018
  #98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie munro View Post
I love my ipad4 and my iPhone but F**K Apple
Yeah, they’re losing their way. Been so for a while now. Hard to say it, but it seemed to coincide with the death of Steve Jobs. Things are getting more complicated and needless software updates are rampant. Might as well buy a PC and Android now!

I spent almost an hour on the phone with them today. I was kind of miffed about the sudden announcement of the new iPad two weeks after I bought a new one and insantly the model I bought is like $100 cheaper now. I made the call to tell them they should start discounting their product before the new releases like a lot of other manufacturers do, and also give a notice a new revision is going to happen. I’m not returning mine and I wasn’t dicky about it but I asked if they could at least throw me a bone and give me the $100 extended warranty for free so I didn’t feel so hosed. Dude checked with his supervisors and their supervisor and they wouldn’t do it.

I didn’t really expect them to and I’m okay with that but still, c’mon! I told them I’ve been buying their products since 1996 and also have “sold” many of their products to friends and family through recommendations. I didn’t feel entitled to it but it would’ve been a nice gesture on their part.
Old 31st March 2018
  #99
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Analog Rob Lowe's Avatar
I get the ipad hate, but get the overpriced pencil and the pro, if your an artist, you’ll know, well a graphics type at least, many uses, aka: blurring the line
Old 31st March 2018
  #100
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Moonwhistle's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plaid_emu View Post
Yeah, they’re losing their way. Been so for a while now. Hard to say it, but it seemed to coincide with the death of Steve Jobs. Things are getting more complicated and needless software updates are rampant. Might as well buy a PC and Android now!

I spent almost an hour on the phone with them today. I was kind of miffed about the sudden announcement of the new iPad two weeks after I bought a new one and insantly the model I bought is like $100 cheaper now. I made the call to tell them they should start discounting their product before the new releases like a lot of other manufacturers do, and also give a notice a new revision is going to happen. I’m not returning mine and I wasn’t dicky about it but I asked if they could at least throw me a bone and give me the $100 extended warranty for free so I didn’t feel so hosed. Dude checked with his supervisors and their supervisor and they wouldn’t do it.

I didn’t really expect them to and I’m okay with that but still, c’mon! I told them I’ve been buying their products since 1996 and also have “sold” many of their products to friends and family through recommendations. I didn’t feel entitled to it but it would’ve been a nice gesture on their part.


That's life with Apple. In the last 2 years they've really become a lot worse and the hardware is so freaking fragile now.

Wait until you start realising a lot of things work better on iPhone than they do on the iPad.
Old 31st March 2018
  #101
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Analog Rob Lowe's Avatar
Good luck if you put your hopes into windows wish you the best, no problems between the phones and the pads, but I don’t trust any of them. That’s called going outta the f*cking box....... OTFB
Old 31st March 2018
  #102
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Moonwhistle's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analog Rob Lowe View Post
Good luck if you put your hopes into windows wish you the best, no problems between the phones and the pads?
Haven't touched Windows in over a decade and don't plan on it but let's not even get close to that kind of discussion...

& Yeh a lot of stuff works better on my iphone than it does on the iPad. This app actually works better on the iPhone at the moment when using Live Link & the looper.
Old 31st March 2018
  #103
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Analog Rob Lowe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonwhistle View Post
Haven't touched Windows in over a decade and don't plan on it but let's not even get close to that kind of discussion...

& Yeh a lot of stuff works better on my iphone than it does on the iPad. This app actually works better on the iPhone at the moment when using Live Link & the looper.
Fair enough. I use mine together, I can answer my iphone with my iPad, video or like a big ass phone, ‘now that gets looks’ they even know where the other one is, and share WiFi, damn, those bastards may be on to something
Old 31st March 2018
  #104
Gear Nut
 

Old 31st March 2018
  #105
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re5etuk's Avatar
I have no idea how accurate it is , if they called it moog bloop idve bought it as I think it sounds good , better than any actual moog model d i’ll Ever have.
And a bit cheaper. If it sounded bad I wouldn’t have bought it , moog apps seem to be good though.
Very happy with my iPad Pro too , sure it’s expensive and pencil is expensive but I’ve barely drawn on paper since I got it. I draw a lot more art / animation / graphic design than I have before. Cheap apps for synths and very flexible routing in aum to automate everything.
Also cheaper than pc plus cintiq though obviously not quick enough to go near afterfx, zbrush , maya territory.
Old 31st March 2018
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dp_6026 View Post
Thanks for posting that comparison.
The Model D app sounds great on basic patches. The “overload” sounds are terrible, though, not even close. And the FM is thin, I wouldn’t use it. For Moogy bass and leads the app would be good, I think.

I like the sound of the Model 15 app, this Model D less so. I might skip this one.

Last edited by ljefe; 31st March 2018 at 01:16 PM..
Old 31st March 2018
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcearl View Post
Ive got three, frozen in different OS through age or wanting them still to work with stuff like the idock or as editors like the iPG800.

I have no doubt I could make interesting stuff with the ios daws and synths Ive bought...just dont really need to, so I use them for librarians for non preset machines. You can make patches on the sofa then transfer them to hardware. For apps its pretty incredible how close they can sound to hardware, much the same as vsts I guess.
ipg800 doesn’t need an old ipad, I don’t think...I’ve got it running in ios 11, and it’s still in the app store.
Old 31st March 2018
  #108
Deleted User
Guest
I was using a PC and 3d Studio DOS back when it wasn't cool circa 1992.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Analog Rob Lowe View Post
I get the ipad hate, but get the overpriced pencil and the pro, if your an artist, you’ll know, well a graphics type at least, many uses, aka: blurring the line
Old 31st March 2018
  #109
Gear Nut
 

aww thing i missed the sale its back up to £15 now :(
Old 31st March 2018
  #110
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Analog Rob Lowe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaphod Betamax View Post
I was using a PC and 3d Studio DOS back when it wasn't cool circa 1992.
I know cut my teeth on an Atari St and Steinberg before it was even known as Cubase, I love this new stuff
Old 31st March 2018
  #111
Lives for gear
 

I really like Starsky Carr's comparison.

His demo of the limitations of the app's saturation and FM characteristics are probably valid, but the only question I'd have is whether some more tweaking across the signal chain for gain staging might produce more comparable results.

Thing is though, it's clear he paid close attention and worked honestly within the limits in the comparison.
Old 31st March 2018
  #112
Quote:
Originally Posted by percussion boy View Post
ipg800 doesn’t need an old ipad, I don’t think...I’ve got it running in ios 11, and it’s still in the app store.
No I meant thats what I mainly use ipads for. Ipg800 works on any ipad. I have an ipad just for my AJ2 and JX8, you can buy old first gens for $50 to run the app on too
Old 31st March 2018
  #113
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcearl View Post
No I meant thats what I mainly use ipads for. Ipg800 works on any ipad. I have an ipad just for my AJ2 and JX8, you can buy old first gens for $50 to run the app on too
Ah, got it.

Yeah, I just keep the old ipad around for misc music tasks too.
Old 5th April 2018
  #114
Gear Head
 
interruptor's Avatar
 

And that´s what the problem with todayˋs consumerism is: They tricked you into loving their company and you expected to be loved back!

Quote:
Originally Posted by plaid_emu View Post
I’m not returning mine and I wasn’t dicky about it but I asked if they could at least throw me a bone and give me the $100 extended warranty for free so I didn’t feel so hosed. Dude checked with his supervisors and their supervisor and they wouldn’t do it.

I didn’t really expect them to and I’m okay with that but still, c’mon! I told them I’ve been buying their products since 1996 and also have “sold” many of their products to friends and family through recommendations. I didn’t feel entitled to it but it would’ve been a nice gesture on their part.
Old 5th April 2018
  #115
Lives for gear
 
autoy's Avatar
Hint: if you touch the wood while turning a knob it goes into precision mode.
Old 5th April 2018
  #116
Moog's software is a little eccentric in design, but generally their apps sound really good. I don't own a Model D, Boog, etc, the Model D app is never going to satisfy hardware slutz 100%. But this app works better than Arturia emu, it's only a few bucks and gets me 90+% of the way there.
Old 5th April 2018
  #117
Gear Head
 
interruptor's Avatar
 

Price dropped to 4.99 again, according to appshopper.
Old 6th April 2018
  #118
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string6theory's Avatar
I wasn’t very impressed with this tbh... presets were kind of meh... manipulating the panel was kind of meh too (for me). I could of been having a bad day, but it seemed sort of rushed to market to coincide with the Boog, which is cool and all. But, I’m not feeling this released version at all. I won’t even get into a comparison to my D reissue, cause there ain’t any.

Now, Animoog on the other hand... that’s probably my favorite synth app and absolutely brilliant sonically and interface-wise (for an iPad, that is). I would love this in hardware keyboard form.

My iPad 2 screen is too small for the squished in Model 15 interface, so it’s almost too difficult to use, but it sounds impressive.

I think the Mini D app needs some serious enhancements & improvements to come close to these other two apps - esp Animoog, which set quite a high bar to be sure.

Old 6th April 2018
  #119
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by interruptor View Post
Price dropped to 4.99 again, according to appshopper.
Not in the US anyway, checked shortly after you posted and again today, $14.99
Old 6th April 2018
  #120
Gear Head
 

The price seems to be jumping around a bit. I’m in the US and bought it yesterday for $4.99, but a few days ago it was $11.99.
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