The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Synths for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
joystick midi controllers? Desktop Synthesizers
Old 21st January 2018
  #1
Gear Maniac
 

joystick midi controllers?

I'm currently hunting for a joystick or similar x/y midi controller. not midi over usb either, proper old school 5 pin midi.

Thinking about a nord g1 and the lack of of a pitch and mod wheel is bothering me.

Hit me up with options and/or other oddball midi solutions!
Old 21st January 2018
  #2
Lives for gear
 
xanderbeanz's Avatar
Yamaha TG33/SY22/SY35 have a joystick that sends out X and Y on CC16&17.

I have had my (keyboard version) Nord Modular G1 only a few days, so have mainly been patching and not hooking up anything external as of yet, but I’m assuming that any CC can be mapped to synthesis parameters.

I shall have to fire my trusty TG33 up and do some experimenting. The TG33 is probably the most expensive of these 3, 2OP FM+AWM instruments as it has double the polyphony...but all of them have the nice joystick, though it’s not centre sprung, mind. A SY22/35 should be under £150.

One or two of the very cheap Yamaha PSS keyboards also had a tiny vector joystick, the PSS 790/795, it would be interesting to find out if these sent MIDI too...
Old 21st January 2018
  #3
Lives for gear
 
xanderbeanz's Avatar
Just looked at midi specs, sadly the PSS 790/795 joystick does not send CC. So that option is out.
Old 21st January 2018
  #4
Lives for gear
Interesting that you ask this. As part of my attempt to tame the joystickless Wavestation SR, I'm presently eagerly awaiting one of these bad boys to attach to Gizmo and will soon thereafter have code posted to use Gizmo as a MIDI joystick.
Old 21st January 2018
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Rob Ocelot's Avatar
I was just going to say that this would be a fairly straightforward Arduino project, but a MIDI plumbing solution with interfacing like Gizmo or MidiPal would work too if you already have the hardware.

Strange that someone doesn't already make a finished product like this with some other useful bells and whistles -- make it like a modern version of the Voyetra Cat Stick
Old 21st January 2018
  #6
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by feijai View Post
Interesting that you ask this. As part of my attempt to tame the joystickless Wavestation SR, I'm presently eagerly awaiting one of these bad boys to attach to Gizmo and will soon thereafter have code posted to use Gizmo as a MIDI joystick.
if it's twisting normal potentiometers. that could be pretty handy.
Old 21st January 2018
  #7
Gear Maniac
 
tsrono's Avatar
 

This reminds me of a design I mocked up for a MIDI controller last year. Started down the path of planning out functions and so forth, came up with a crude 3D model with the help of a friend, but then I sort of gave up when I realized I had absolutely zero engineering know-how that going any farther would require. Any tinkerers need an ideas man??? CONTACT ME???!?!?!

Old 21st January 2018
  #8
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
if it's twisting normal potentiometers. that could be pretty handy.
It is. These kinds of joysticks just act like two 10K pots. The challenge is finding one which is springless, that is, it doesn't spring back to recenter itself when you let go of the stick. The video game industry dominates joysticks (of course) and they're all center-sprung.
Old 21st January 2018
  #9
Lives for gear
 
grasspike's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xanderbeanz View Post
Just looked at midi specs, sadly the PSS 790/795 joystick does not send CC. So that option is out.
I'm pretty sure the joy stick on my PSS 790 is just a 4 way analog mixer of some sort. I don't think any digital control is at play

It does make some really beautiful pads however when used with external effects
Old 21st January 2018
  #10
Lives for gear
 

The Kawai K1/K1m/K1 II has a great non-sprung joystick, but unfortunately it doesn’t send MIDI. I keep thinking about popping a small Arduino in my K1 just to get MIDI CCs from the joystick.
Old 22nd January 2018
  #11
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by feijai View Post
It is. These kinds of joysticks just act like two 10K pots. The challenge is finding one which is springless, that is, it doesn't spring back to recenter itself when you let go of the stick. The video game industry dominates joysticks (of course) and they're all center-sprung.
any idea what kind of values the pots read, when the stick is in the centre ?
on either sprung or non sprung..
Old 22nd January 2018
  #12
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
any idea what kind of values the pots read, when the stick is in the centre ?
on either sprung or non sprung..
Don't have mine yet so I can't say, but I must assume it reads somewhere around 5K (out of 10K).
Old 22nd January 2018
  #13
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by feijai View Post
Don't have mine yet so I can't say, but I must assume it reads somewhere around 5K (out of 10K).
I'm just wondering if I can use one for a case, where I basically replace a common pitchbend wheel. I'm supposing I could. as pitchwheels must calibrated for the centre of the pot as well.
Old 22nd January 2018
  #14
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
I'm just wondering if I can use one for a case, where I basically replace a common pitchbend wheel. I'm supposing I could. as pitchwheels must calibrated for the centre of the pot as well.
I couldn't imagine why you wouldn't be able to do that: but pitchbend wheels are sprung. An unspring joystick would be really, really annoying. :-) On the other hand, you have lots more joystick options if they're center-sprung.
Old 23rd January 2018
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Rogue Ai's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by feijai View Post
The video game industry dominates joysticks (of course) and they're all center-sprung.
Not all... the Atari 5200 joystick did not center (part of the reason it failed because most of the games required precise movements which was impossible).

Also, the Vectrex has a controller with a non self-centering analog joystick but it had games that were meant for that sort of thing.

But modern joysticks self-center no matter if they are analog or digital.
Old 23rd January 2018
  #16
Lives for gear
 
Rob Ocelot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Ai View Post
Also, the Vectrex has a controller with a non self-centering analog joystick but it had games that were meant for that sort of thing.
Vectrex controllers have springs and are self-centering. A healthy proportion of the games use rotate-thrust-fire mechanics (think Asteroids) which are better suited to buttons clusters versus joysticks.

Other than Atari 5200 the only other non-centering joysticks I can recall were the standard Tandy CoCo sticks, but Radio Shack also sold a Deluxe stick (licensed from Kraft) and CH products (aka Hayes) made a nifty one that you could switch between self centering and floating (and could even lock only one axis).
Old 23rd January 2018
  #17
Lives for gear
 

Just remove the spring(s) from a sprung one that otherwise does what you want. If they were installed, odds are the can be uninstalled.

Also, there are unsprung modern CV joysticks, and there are CV to MIDI converters... it won't be cheap, but you don't have to reinvent a thing.
Old 23rd January 2018
  #18
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by feijai View Post
I couldn't imagine why you wouldn't be able to do that: but pitchbend wheels are sprung. An unspring joystick would be really, really annoying. :-) On the other hand, you have lots more joystick options if they're center-sprung.
right. I was thinking about the centre sprung one.
Old 23rd January 2018
  #19
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RunnyKine View Post
Just remove the spring(s) from a sprung one that otherwise does what you want. If they were installed, odds are the can be uninstalled.
Have you actually tried this with a modern joystick? It’s very hard to do without destroying the whole mechanism.
Old 23rd January 2018
  #20
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by krylenko View Post
Have you actually tried this with a modern joystick? It’s very hard to do without destroying the whole mechanism.
I've had it happen by accident on game controllers (PS3), with the bumper buttons and one of the thumbsticks.
Old 27th February 2018
  #21
Lives for gear
So I purchased this bad boy and hooked it up to Gizmo. Made some custom software for it, and now everything looks great -- I can use it as a general MIDI controller (emitting CC, NRPN, aftertouch, etc.). It's a bit noisy, so I'll need to add a capacitor across each pot, but overall it works just fine.
Old 27th February 2018
  #22
Lives for gear
 
Rogue Ai's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ocelot View Post
Vectrex controllers have springs and are self-centering. A healthy proportion of the games use rotate-thrust-fire mechanics (think Asteroids) which are better suited to buttons clusters versus joysticks.

Other than Atari 5200 the only other non-centering joysticks I can recall were the standard Tandy CoCo sticks, but Radio Shack also sold a Deluxe stick (licensed from Kraft) and CH products (aka Hayes) made a nifty one that you could switch between self centering and floating (and could even lock only one axis).
The video I saw of the Vectrex the controller did not center... maybe it was broken.
Old 27th February 2018
  #23
Lives for gear
 
namnibor's Avatar
My Elektron Analog Key's joystick can be assigned to several different CC's, in it's external midi multimap modes. The sequencer does not record joystick movements on the AK's analog synths.

Works a charm on my Wavestation SR. Vector/Joystick on AK is center sprung and always returns to dead center.
While you may have the AK's internal synths and sequencer tracks doing it's thing, you can use the external controller mode while the AK is doing what you want, while laying whatever you are playing and perhaps adjusting parameters with AK's knobs via your own multimap set-up.

Very versatile Swedish Swiss Army Knife of a synth, sequencer, FX, external CV control, and midi controller...and a very nice joystick that's super responsive.
Old 19th November 2018
  #24
Here for the gear
 

Did you find what you needed? My old Faderfox LC2 and LV2 controllers both have X/Y joysticks which don't centre and so are excellent for controlling filters and grain delays which is how I use them. If they centred like gaming sticks they would be useless. This way you can change the filter slightly every 4 or 8 bars and do other things in the meantime.

They are also MIDI, not USB which proves vital with my crap old macbook because when I get the pizza of death, the only thing which still works is MIDI…luckily the audio on ableton doesn't cut out.

The joysticks aren't very big though so a visual performance element is lacking with them.

I may sell them when I have my custom controller built in 2019 sometime. I aim to use full on industrial farm machinery type ones so the crowd will see me give it some elbow, haha. Most of them do centre but one or two have • Friction Clutch : The joystick does not mechanically return to center, maintains present position. instead. It's a steady ball bearing type thing. Nice engineering. I don't know if I can get MIDI although they have USB output. Can it be converted does anyone know?
Old 19th November 2018
  #25
Lives for gear
 
WozNYC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Ai View Post

Also, the Vectrex has a controller with a non self-centering analog joystick but it had games that were meant for that sort of thing.
Still own my Vectrex and play it regularly.
The joystick is definitely self-centering.

Not sure what you mean by "it had games that were meant for that sort of thing."
No, it doesn't. That would suck. Hard.
Old 1 week ago
  #26
Here for the gear
Check this fantastic Web
ControllerMate
Old 1 week ago
  #27
Lives for gear
 
jazzcabbage's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by xanderbeanz View Post
Yamaha TG33/SY22/SY35 have a joystick that sends out X and Y on CC16&17.
Thanks for the tip!
Old 2 days ago
  #28
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by carlos shaw 1 View Post
Check this fantastic Web
ControllerMate
you don't happen to know if that software handles the steam type controllers per chance ?

for anyone using Macs, USB overdrive says it works with USB and Bluetooth mice, keyboards, trackballs, trackpads, joysticks, gamepads and gaming devices from almost any vendor.

I actually have it working with a Nintendo Gameboy controller. but I think those steam controllers have a unique protocol and I couldn't find anything to handle it.
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump