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Waldorf Quantum
Old 2nd December 2020
  #13261
It would be very nice to be able to use a UserWavetable in the Kernels engine. It would be possible in this way to obtain for example 6 instances with detune of a user wavetable, exactly as it is done with all the virtuals that use wavetables such as Serum or the recent Vital.
I have not lost hope yet (I have recently purchased Iridium) :-)
Old 2nd December 2020 | Show parent
  #13262
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benis67 View Post
It would be very nice to be able to use a UserWavetable in the Kernels engine. It would be possible in this way to obtain for example 6 instances with detune of a user wavetable, exactly as it is done with all the virtuals that use wavetables such as Serum or the recent Vital.
I have not lost hope yet (I have recently purchased Iridium) :-)
It is a little odd that you can't user the User table in Kernel. i guess for now you can stack/detune three using the main oscillators. The new copy function makes that much easier.
Old 2nd December 2020 | Show parent
  #13263
Gear Nut
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Ruff View Post
It is a little odd that you can't user the User table in Kernel. i guess for now you can stack/detune three using the main oscillators. The new copy function makes that much easier.
Even more important than the detune possibility, is the opportunity to create and use wavetables that are specialized for FM. Either as carrier or modulator.

Using tables with high harmonic content quickly leads to noise, aliasing, and other distortion. Unfortunately there are very few internal wavetables that specialize in very low harmonic content. Table #1 (Resonant) is somewhat useful, because it brings harmonics in one at a time, but then the effect can be duplicated by multiple sine modulators.

What would be more useful are tables that have mostly low frequency content, but with structures involving all partials to some degree. For instance, triangle or parabola waves. Just as one can get some nice animation through morphing triangle waves into saw (like PWM but more mellow), I suspect similarly interesting result in morphing between two types of parabola wave (integrated triangle -> integrated saw), in an FM context. [Now, possibly similar can be done with self-FM (feedback) of an operator with low amounts, but user wavetables would give more precise control.]

Other possibilities are very bandlimited tables, for instance single formants. These can be simply mixed, or a little FM can widen them. [I do agree there's some better internal content for this.] This would allow for the FS1R style sounds, which have been missing for the last 20 years. Which is doubly important since the general 'sound' of the Quantum, with its clarity and high-end sparkle, is so similar to the FS1R.

This is why user wavetable (and perhaps only one or two per oscillator is needed), is perhaps the single most important feature to really open up FM and take it beyond the typical DX7 stuff.
Old 5th December 2020
  #13264
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polybonk's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Can anyone tell me why patch 1317 Gradubide plays fine with the keys but if you hit it with midi over din at velocity 127 it doesn't work?
Old 5th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polybonk View Post
Can anyone tell me why patch 1317 Gradubide plays fine with the keys but if you hit it with midi over din at velocity 127 it doesn't work?
it has the "amp velocity amount" set to -100%, so at full velocity it's fully negative, which fully attenuates the signal.
Old 5th December 2020
  #13266
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polybonk's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Ah thanks for that. Trust me to pick that patch for the first try midi sequencing it from step mode on the pyramid!
I thought the midi was broken hahaha!
Old 7th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13267
Gear Addict
 
New Soundset...and Free from Waldorf Site...

https://waldorfmusic.com/en/iridium-...eder-cinematic
Old 11th December 2020
  #13268
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polybonk's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Any news on the sudden white noise bursts? I have gotten that a bunch of times.
Also pure white screen requiring reboot?
Old 11th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13269
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d33psp33d's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by polybonk View Post
Any news on the sudden white noise bursts? I have gotten that a bunch of times.
Also pure white screen requiring reboot?
nope, ive only had the white screen once.
Old 11th December 2020
  #13270
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years


Can the quantum make the sound here heard exactly 30 seconds in? Sounds like a heart beat.
Old 11th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13271
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
I still need to try to recreate the THX Deepnote with the Quantum. Anyone who did this also?
Attached Thumbnails
Waldorf Quantum-thx_deepnote.jpg  
Old 14th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13272
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Noize View Post
I still need to try to recreate the THX Deepnote with the Quantum. Anyone who did this also?
Not sure that works on a Quantum with 30 voices ;-) Maybe with Kernel engine?
Old 14th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13273
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Coorec's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by polybonk View Post
sudden white noise bursts? I have gotten that a bunch of times.
What did you do when they happened? Was it always the same thing? Different things? A certain category of things?

What OS version do you use? 2.0 release or beta?

I am asking because i dont get them anymore since a very long time now.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13274
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polybonk's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coorec View Post
What did you do when they happened? Was it always the same thing? Different things? A certain category of things?

What OS version do you use? 2.0 release or beta?

I am asking because i dont get them anymore since a very long time now.
I am on 2.0.0 so I will try updating it to the latest.
Nothing really, just had a chord on a preset going.
Just randomly made the burst of nose when it was sitting there with a drone.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13275
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Noize View Post
I still need to try to recreate the THX Deepnote with the Quantum. Anyone who did this also?
How would one program something like this on any off-the-shelf synth?
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13276
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
So I was thinking about this on my iridium. With each Osc set to Waveform let's say Saw. Then user 4 kernels each with a different semitone, in one layer you could get 12 distinct frequencies. Use 2 layers and pitch down the second layer an octave and your still only at 24 different frequencies. The diagram shows 30 voices, so not sure how you would be able to do that. I suppose modulating the pitch on each layer with an opposite, slow envelope separate on each layer you might get close, but not quite. I haven't tried this but may be a fun experiment.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13277
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Another option, just sample it and press a key
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13278
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
So I was just reading about the THX Deep Note as its called, apparently it was remastered in 2015 using 80 voices as opposed to the original created in 1983. So I would say impossible now on Waldorf hardware.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13279
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthetica View Post
So I was thinking about this on my iridium. With each Osc set to Waveform let's say Saw. Then user 4 kernels each with a different semitone, in one layer you could get 12 distinct frequencies. Use 2 layers and pitch down the second layer an octave and your still only at 24 different frequencies. The diagram shows 30 voices, so not sure how you would be able to do that. I suppose modulating the pitch on each layer with an opposite, slow envelope separate on each layer you might get close, but not quite. I haven't tried this but may be a fun experiment.
we have 6 kernels/oscillators for each of the 3 kernel oscillators (we only have 5 macros though, so we'd have to cheat a bit to get control of the 6th with a different mod amount in one of the 5 macros).

We have rand trig, rand trig bipolar and 6 x s & h LFOs to give us 8 distinct on-key-press random start values for pitch modulation. [ might be able to use komplex modulator with entropy to get a 9th but not tried that ].

If we think of a kernel as a voice, that's 18 voices and 8 random values per layer, so 36 voices over 2 layer - 30 individual macro control.

I think we could do this by setting each kernel's pitch to the target note, then use an envelope with decay shaping the sweep from the random pitch mod to 0 pitch modulation and set up the mod matrix like this:

source=random, amount=0%, controller=the envelope, control amount=[ desired degree of max pitch mod], dest=the macro affecting the kernel pitch mod.

added: as it's mono, might be possible to reduce the number of kernels and use unison to stack quantum/iridium voices - could give a higher ratio of random source:note but it would come at the expense of control over target notes.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13280
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_xyz View Post
we have 6 kernels/oscillators for each of the 3 kernel oscillators (we only have 5 macros though, so we'd have to cheat a bit to get control of the 6th with a different mod amount in one of the 5 macros).

We have rand trig, rand trig bipolar and 6 x s & h LFOs to give us 8 distinct on-key-press random start values for pitch modulation. [ might be able to use komplex modulator with entropy to get a 9th but not tried that ].

If we think of a kernel as a voice, that's 18 voices and 8 random values per layer, so 36 voices over 2 layer - 30 individual macro control.

I think we could do this by setting each kernel's pitch to the target note, then use an envelope with decay shaping the sweep from the random pitch mod to 0 pitch modulation and set up the mod matrix like this:

source=random, amount=0%, controller=the envelope, control amount=[ desired degree of max pitch mod], dest=the macro affecting the kernel pitch mod.

added: as it's mono, might be possible to reduce the number of kernels and use unison to stack quantum/iridium voices - could give a higher ratio of random source:note but it would come at the expense of control over target notes.
Nice, I knew someone smarter than me would come up with a better solution
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthetica View Post
Nice, I knew someone smarter than me would come up with a better solution
I really wouldn't be so sure on that!

I've had a play with this but there are lots of things that need sorting - not least it seems to always glide down whereas the real THX has more of an upward glide to it. I think this is because the random modulations are applied to the desired end note for each - I can't think of a way yet to have them start from a pool of 200Hz to 400HZ.

I've attached a patch if anyone wants to have a laugh at my attempt.

Just press middle c - it's random every time and some plays sound far better than others.

This isn't a full 30 voice affair - it's 11 kernels going random to final note x 2 layers (2nd layer has slight detune).

(only uses 2 voices, so can do 4 voice unison per layer to thicken it up more).
Attached Files
File Type: zip 02177-thx.qpat.zip (22.6 KB, 3 views)

q_thx.wav (1.03 MB, 666 views)

Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13282
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthetica View Post
Another option, just sample it and press a key
This one wins the internet.
Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13283
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_xyz View Post
I really wouldn't be so sure on that!

I've had a play with this but there are lots of things that need sorting - not least it seems to always glide down whereas the real THX has more of an upward glide to it. I think this is because the random modulations are applied to the desired end note for each - I can't think of a way yet to have them start from a pool of 200Hz to 400HZ.

I've attached a patch if anyone wants to have a laugh at my attempt.

Just press middle c - it's random every time and some plays sound far better than others.

This isn't a full 30 voice affair - it's 11 kernels going random to final note x 2 layers (2nd layer has slight detune).

(only uses 2 voices, so can do 4 voice unison per layer to thicken it up more).
Close, nice attempt. I think you need to have one layer with an upward pitch envelope while the second layer has a downward pitch envelope, from looking at the posted diagram.
Old 15th December 2020
  #13284
Gear Maniac
 
Synthetica's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
For reference

Old 15th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13285
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthetica View Post
Close, nice attempt. I think you need to have one layer with an upward pitch envelope while the second layer has a downward pitch envelope, from looking at the posted diagram.
having the s&h LFOs cycle rather than being static start values, 4 voices of unison per layer, having chorus wet follow the amp env and changing the curves gives something more pleasing to my ears, but still not close really.

in the diagram makes it look like the notes follow sinusoidal paths - but that might not be a true illustration of how the pitches track. not sure how I'd do the pitch envelope idea but I'll give that a try at some point.

(I had been using that video for reference already, so I knew I was a million miles away from the original!)

I have no doubt that it can be done far closer with this sound engine - but it has been fun trying out ideas

[ added: just realised I've got a bum note so redone it - also added reverb with wet that drops as the sound progresses ]
Attached Files
File Type: zip 02178-thx2.qpat.zip (22.7 KB, 3 views)

q_thx2.wav (2.60 MB, 573 views)

Old 16th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13286
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
closest i ever got was using kurzweil pc3, using all 32 oscillators each with their own lfos and drift settings. its a great programming exercise though

mine wasn't as good as this one though-
http://enjoythesirens.com/audio/live/THX-kids.mp3

Last edited by psythor; 16th December 2020 at 01:01 AM.. Reason: update
Old 16th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13287
Gear Nut
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by polybonk View Post
Any news on the sudden white noise bursts? I have gotten that a bunch of times.
Also pure white screen requiring reboot?
I get bursts on 2.0 but it's rare. At first I thought it had something to do with the reverb, but most of my patches don't use reverb, so it just kind of happens randomly.

I also have an issue where 1-2 of the voices sometimes sound like buffer under-run (crackling, bit-crush), it's solved only by power-cycling the machine. It will appear only on two voices in succession, like 1+2 or 5+6 and be fine for the other voices. Perhaps there's some correlation to patches that have lots of user-data, but I don't know for sure. I think it happened once on a 'simple' patch.

Both issues happen about the same frequency but very rarely, so it's not disruptive to me in the studio.

No white screens so far, though it's still under a month since I've had the machine.

Anyway, while we each have huge wishlists of features, what I hope most is that some time for 3.0 is just given over to these bug fixes. In fact, new features often introduce new bugs....
Old 16th December 2020 | Show parent
  #13288
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
About a 30 voices I wonder what the results would be on the Waldorf Kyra that has 128 voices. To bad I don't have the Kyra.

But on the other hand I do have the Waldorf STVC that has 2 parts: the 128 voice string section and 16 voice solo section. But it's too limited to modulate those 30 notes individually.
Old 16th December 2020
  #13289
Lives for gear
 
I've been reading down this, and need to enlarge the handwritten and watch the video, but first impressions are that the Kyra is the tool I need to reach for, not the Iridium ...
Old 16th December 2020
  #13290
Lives for gear
I'm really not sure about that. This seems to be all about the pitch modulation rather than the number of voices as it's about where the voices start, their path, and where they land.

The iridium can muster 16 voices of 3 kernels oscillators of 6 kernels = 288 individually addressable "voices" (144 on quantum). I'm ignoring that the waveform oscillator can do 8 as they are not 8 individually addressable.
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