The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 All  This Thread  Reviews  Gear Database  Synths for sale     Latest  Trending
Eventide H9000
Old 21st July 2019
  #241
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
It's possible one of the algos can do that; I remember looking before but couldn't do exactly what I wanted to do - maybe it's there somewhere.
This however would be very easy to build in Vsig, and do pretty much whatever you wanted.

In Emote though, I'm pretty sure you can connect more than one source into a module so it can do a static mix - I believe I did this before.
I think mixing together FX Chains isn't available yet, quite possibly the next major release which shouldn't be too far away
Thanks!
It would be great to know what algo allows the mixing between audio sources within the FX chains because a MIXER is very much needed here!
Even the very first fractal had a mixer module from the beginning to bring signals in and out in between the FX modules.
It's absolutely essential if you want to perform creatively with all the FX this beast can provide for playing live!
Static Mixing with the H9000 is a waste of all it's cool FX resources and IO connectivity in my humble opinion..
I'm very inclined to purchase mine this year but I absolutely need this feature first
If I have to implement this with VSIG.. then I would look for a cheaper H8000 to be honest with you..
Cheers
Old 21st July 2019
  #242
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
Thanks!
It would be great to know what algo allows the mixing between audio sources within the FX chains because a MIXER is very much needed here!
Even the very first fractal had a mixer module from the beginning to bring signals in and out in between the FX modules.
It's absolutely essential if you want to perform creatively with all the FX this beast can provide for playing live!
Static Mixing with the H9000 is a waste of all it's cool FX resources and IO connectivity in my humble opinion..
I'm very inclined to purchase mine this year but I absolutely need this feature first
If I have to implement this with VSIG.. then I would look for a cheaper H8000 to be honest with you..
Cheers
What functions should the mixer perform?
Old 21st July 2019
  #243
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
What functions should the mixer perform?
Alright, let's see.. the most fundamental ones for me would be..

1 - Individual FX Sends for each of the signals sent from each of the Input Audio Sources to the different 4x Algorithms.
So let's say, If your guitar comes in from Analog 1, and you sent Analog 1 to 4x different Algorithms in parallel..
Same features for each of the additional Inputs you send to those same Algorithms..
Same features if you also chain the algo's to multiple algo's withing the FX chain.. [e.g. algo 1 is sent to algo 2 and algo 3+ direct to hardware output in parallel]

2 - Same for all and each of the Output Levels sent to all the hardware Outputs, etc..

Is possible to do that with the emote somehow?
I can't figure this out by looking at the manual or pictures and videos online..

Thanks
Old 22nd July 2019
  #244
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
Alright, let's see.. the most fundamental ones for me would be..

1 - Individual FX Sends for each of the signals sent from each of the Input Audio Sources to the different 4x Algorithms.
So let's say, If your guitar comes in from Analog 1, and you sent Analog 1 to 4x different Algorithms in parallel..
Same features for each of the additional Inputs you send to those same Algorithms..
Same features if you also chain the algo's to multiple algo's withing the FX chain.. [e.g. algo 1 is sent to algo 2 and algo 3+ direct to hardware output in parallel]

2 - Same for all and each of the Output Levels sent to all the hardware Outputs, etc..

Is possible to do that with the emote somehow?
I can't figure this out by looking at the manual or pictures and videos online..

Thanks
That's certainly possible with a single instrument because you can use the mix controls within each algo to control how much you hear back from each - that can be either serial or parallel. If you want to feed in multiple instruments though and just a specific amount from each then I can't see how that can be done simply.
It's not in the usual Mixer type interface though
I use my setup with a UAD so hadn't felt the need for something like this but I can see how it would be useful, and necessary if I didn't have the Apollo
Best to make a feature request on the forum - the guys are listening
Old 22nd July 2019
  #245
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
thanks
but i hope you understand that using one single instrument with this box is not my plan..
otherwise, why do i need so many dsp's?
a mixer module is really an essential thing to have for the h9000 with all those possible combinations of io's and algo's..
hard-wiring signals is not the way to go with so many dsp's, fx chains, and algos
you cannot mix signals from the algos with your apollo either..
for example, algo 1 feeds/sends one level to algo 2 and another send level to algo 3 and so on..
the true potential of this machine needs to be unlocked with mixer modules within the fx chains.
this box shouldn't be seen as another traditional 1 or two algos fx processor anymore
it's a whole studio in one box!
so just imagine a studio without a mixer, and with only the option of hardwiring all the signals with a fix patchbay
sure, everything can be done..
but what a difference having a mixer!
plus with all that connectivity and expansions cards onboard, i cannot see why it cannot be used as a proper computer audio interface too
there's no need for another rack space + having to synch multiple digital clocks especially on a daw is just looking for problems really..
i won't consider having to combine interfaces as aggregate device on the mac or asio4all on windows with the quality of this box..
sigh..
Old 22nd July 2019
  #246
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bax View Post
My Zoia sits right next to my H9. Yeah, it's pretty sweet; Empress just recently added some cool granular stuff to it and they are just getting started. It really is a modular environment. No editor available or planned like VSIG, but for simpler stuff it is easy enough to keep track of visually.

I'd love to see them create a "Zoia MAX" as a 1-2U rack with more CPU/RAM/channels and additional higher-end Empress algos; I'd spend good money on that bad boy. Patchstorage has a very solid (and very growing) group of folks churning out really cool stuff for Zoia.

Eventide would be foolish not to see this, and also not to see where Line6 has gone with the Helix platform... I have hope...
they should do an editor, or at least create a text file format that could be uploaded to Zoia - what do the preset files that you save look like if you open in text editor?
With that the community would make something!

I'll probably pick one up in January; got my hands full with the H9000 at the moment

People need to voice this on their forums, showing interest goes a long way


Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
thanks
but i hope you understand that using one single instrument with this box is not my plan..
otherwise, why do i need so many dsp's?
a mixer module is really an essential thing to have for the h9000 with all those possible combinations of io's and algo's..
hard-wiring signals is not the way to go with so many dsp's, fx chains, and algos
you cannot mix signals from the algos with your apollo either..
for example, algo 1 feeds/sends one level to algo 2 and another send level to algo 3 and so on..
the true potential of this machine needs to be unlocked with mixer modules within the fx chains.
this box shouldn't be seen as another traditional 1 or two algos fx processor anymore
it's a whole studio in one box!
so just imagine a studio without a mixer, and with only the option of hardwiring all the signals with a fix patchbay
sure, everything can be done..
but what a difference having a mixer!
plus with all that connectivity and expansions cards onboard, i cannot see why it cannot be used as a proper computer audio interface too
there's no need for another rack space + having to synch multiple digital clocks especially on a daw is just looking for problems really..
i won't consider having to combine interfaces as aggregate device on the mac or asio4all on windows with the quality of this box..
sigh..
Yea I get you!! I was actually wrong though, it's one instrument per FX chain to get a bit closer to the flexibility that you're looking for.
A mixer would be an amazing addition in particular for Live situations - Raise on the forum
Old 22nd July 2019
  #247
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
(...)A mixer would be an amazing addition in particular for Live situations - Raise on the forum
not really, i prefer mixing live on - well - a real mixer!
Old 22nd July 2019
  #248
bax
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
they should do an editor...
So, in a thread over at Electronauts in January 2018 someone posted a response (which originally came from /r/synthesizers on reddit) where Empress officially responded in the negative, but stated that "the preset structure would be open, so if someone wanted to write such a thing, they could."

Haven't really seen much about any third-party attempts at such an editor at this point, but I agree that it would be an awesome tool.

Thanks!
bax
Old 28th July 2019
  #249
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
not really, i prefer mixing live on - well - a real mixer!
I don't think you get my point mate.

You CANNOT have this level of custom rig design and control with an external mixer:

https://youtu.be/mmAMqQeGWow

The H9000's emote absolutely needs a MIXER MODULE within the FX Chain
Otherwise, the H9000 is a total waste of resources.

FYI, Gig performer is starting to get very popular within performers
e.g. Trey Gunn is now using it for performing live:

https://www.instagram.com/p/ByQ1_0nh..._web_copy_link

Cheers

p.

Last edited by pangea2003; 28th July 2019 at 03:43 PM..
Old 28th July 2019
  #250
t_d
Lives for gear
 
t_d's Avatar
i've got an h9000 on loan and am having massive troubles integrating it like you say it can below.. with "no other analog or digital connections"

i've got it USB'd to my mac, and an aggregate device made together with my UA apollos 16

but in pro tools (you're using logic, so it may be quite different)...but in pro tools i/o i don't know if i'm supposed to create BUS channels, INPUT channels, or OUTPUT channels corresponding to the h9000 USB channels...

basically, i'm having no luck getting a track, using a send and an aux channel, to be able to go through the H9000 over USB and be effected.

there is zero information on how to do this in the manual and i can't find anything online.

anyone here with pro tools able to use the H9000 with *only* a USB connection to route to as a send effect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
I think the Logic I/O plugin confused this which is why I went into the I/O Labels later to rename it.
The default detection by Audio Midi and Logic labelled the H9K USB In/Outs as "Analog" but they are however the USB In/Outs with zero physical connection other than USB cable. Essentially, you can hook up the H9000 to the computer and use no other analog or digital connections and have amazing outboard processing
Old 28th July 2019
  #251
bax
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bax View Post
I've been eyeing an Orville and maybe thinking of stretching to the H8000 but those are both complete overkill for a non-professional's rig.
What an absolute slut (and completely without self-control) I have managed to become. I say stuff like the comment above just a week ago, and now an H8000FW + EVE/NET will be in my rack this coming Wednesday...

Wasn't gonna even consider laying out the $$$ to get up to the H9000 but I got IMHO an outstanding deal that in good conscience I just couldn't pass up on the 8000FW+Remote so I guess that is where I'm gonna be at for *quite* the forseeable future.

Looking forward to a little more flexibility and power wrt VSIG even if the tools aren't going to be updated for legacy equipment (which has now been officially confirmed over at the Eventide forums), and the EVE/NET will allow me to be truly interactive with it while playing halfway across the room which was a big workflow issue for me with the 7000. I even acquired an old-school 80's-looking PC joystick to go with the remote for real-time mayhem

Thanks!
bax
Old 28th July 2019
  #252
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
Does protools use some kind of I/O plugin to route out/in?

Perhaps find a YouTube video that demonstrates using outboard with protools. Even with analogue connections it should be exactly the same.

To get a basic test done, you able to output a channel to the H9000 then output from H9000 back to an input channel and record enable to monitor through. If that's how it works there, i remember

In emote, you've been able to route the USB channels through an FX Chain?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
i've got an h9000 on loan and am having massive troubles integrating it like you say it can below.. with "no other analog or digital connections"

i've got it USB'd to my mac, and an aggregate device made together with my UA apollos 16

but in pro tools (you're using logic, so it may be quite different)...but in pro tools i/o i don't know if i'm supposed to create BUS channels, INPUT channels, or OUTPUT channels corresponding to the h9000 USB channels...

basically, i'm having no luck getting a track, using a send and an aux channel, to be able to go through the H9000 over USB and be effected.

there is zero information on how to do this in the manual and i can't find anything online.

anyone here with pro tools able to use the H9000 with *only* a USB connection to route to as a send effect?
Old 28th July 2019
  #253
t_d
Lives for gear
 
t_d's Avatar
pro tools can easily route to external hardware, but that's more if you want to use analog XLR connections.. i want to use audio over USB on the H9000 with no analog connections at all.

unfortunately there are no youtube videos that demonstrate this. there is one with Logic, but it doesn't help since this question is all about the pro tools I/O

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
Does protools use some kind of I/O plugin to route out/in?

Perhaps find a YouTube video that demonstrates using outboard with protools. Even with analogue connections it should be exactly the same.

To get a basic test done, you able to output a channel to the H9000 then output from H9000 back to an input channel and record enable to monitor through. If that's how it works there, i remember

In emote, you've been able to route the USB channels through an FX Chain?
Old 28th July 2019
  #254
Lives for gear
 
oldgearguy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
pro tools can easily route to external hardware, but that's more if you want to use analog XLR connections.. i want to use audio over USB on the H9000 with no analog connections at all.

unfortunately there are no youtube videos that demonstrate this. there is one with Logic, but it doesn't help since this question is all about the pro tools I/O
Quickest answer is to ask on the Eventide forum. Employees have generally been quick to jump in with usage suggestions for the H9k.
Old 28th July 2019
  #255
t_d
Lives for gear
 
t_d's Avatar
yeah, i've got a post on the forum as well as a direct email back and forth with the rep at eventide who let me borrow his personal unit...

but no one's been able to figure it out!

i can't be the only wanting to use pro tools with this thing!

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldgearguy View Post
Quickest answer is to ask on the Eventide forum. Employees have generally been quick to jump in with usage suggestions for the H9k.
Old 28th July 2019
  #256
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
I haven't done this setup for a while but I think it's exactly the same as if it's physical analog I/O.

In protools, can you see the 16 DAW I/O as available choices for in out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
yeah, i've got a post on the forum as well as a direct email back and forth with the rep at eventide who let me borrow his personal unit...

but no one's been able to figure it out!

i can't be the only wanting to use pro tools with this thing!
Old 28th July 2019
  #257
t_d
Lives for gear
 
t_d's Avatar
i can.. i've made an aggregate device with the H9000 and my UA Apollog 16.

so the AudioMidi setup has assigned channels 1-34 or something for the UA and 35-52 or something for the H9000.

my two big questions are... which of those 30 eventide channels are the USB ins and outs.. i've tried random ones and have no luck getting audio in and out of it.

and two, it's not clear to me whether in pro tools i/o if i am supposed to make INPUTS, OUTPUTS and/or BUSSES to get audio to the H9000 over USB


and i suppose that would lead to a 3rd question.. do i then just treat everything as it were a normal send plug in in pro tools. ie: put EMOTE on an aux track and send a track bus to that emote track input.....?

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
I haven't done this setup for a while but I think it's exactly the same as if it's physical analog I/O.

In protools, can you see the 16 DAW I/O as available choices for in out?
Old 28th July 2019
  #258
Lives for gear
 
macgee's Avatar
What i would do in your case is route main outputs to the first 2 H9000 outputs and prove that working
Then in emote you make the inputs visible for routing into the FX CHAIN. Then take the DAW ins 1&2 and route into the FX CHAIN.
The emote manual shows this i think.
Then route the FX CHAIN output to the analog outs 1&2 and just get that working.

Not sure what you're intending putting emote on a track, but just to clarify that won't route any audio to the H9000. It's for automation and session recall.

If i remember correctly, the labelling of the channels by audio midi was confusing. So try using the the outs and ins in reverse just to be sure.
It confused me a little, is an Out from the DAW actually an out to the H9000 or an in to the H9000.
So i had to mess around a little and eventually relabeled in audio midi.
Not in front of my system


Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
i can.. i've made an aggregate device with the H9000 and my UA Apollog 16.

so the AudioMidi setup has assigned channels 1-34 or something for the UA and 35-52 or something for the H9000.

my two big questions are... which of those 30 eventide channels are the USB ins and outs.. i've tried random ones and have no luck getting audio in and out of it.

and two, it's not clear to me whether in pro tools i/o if i am supposed to make INPUTS, OUTPUTS and/or BUSSES to get audio to the H9000 over USB


and i suppose that would lead to a 3rd question.. do i then just treat everything as it were a normal send plug in in pro tools. ie: put EMOTE on an aux track and send a track bus to that emote track input.....?
Old 28th July 2019
  #259
t_d
Lives for gear
 
t_d's Avatar
thanks for making a point of that. that the emote itself doesn’t process audio. while i know that i think i’ve been thinking of my routings in terms of using it like a standard audio plug in

so really it doesn’t matter what actual track the emote is on since it’s just a remote control for the hardware.

i guess what i need to do is figure out which inputs in the giant 52 channel aggregate device are actually the usb audio ins and outs.

and route accordingly in PT.


Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
What i would do in your case is route main outputs to the first 2 H9000 outputs and prove that working
Then in emote you make the inputs visible for routing into the FX CHAIN. Then take the DAW ins 1&2 and route into the FX CHAIN.
The emote manual shows this i think.
Then route the FX CHAIN output to the analog outs 1&2 and just get that working.

Not sure what you're intending putting emote on a track, but just to clarify that won't route any audio to the H9000. It's for automation and session recall.

If i remember correctly, the labelling of the channels by audio midi was confusing. So try using the the outs and ins in reverse just to be sure.
It confused me a little, is an Out from the DAW actually an out to the H9000 or an in to the H9000.
So i had to mess around a little and eventually relabeled in audio midi.
Not in front of my system
Old 29th July 2019
  #260
Lives for gear
 

I think if someone is investing in this product then Eventide need to make a few tutorials on its workflow.

6999$ usd is a big chunk of change however it looks like it covers a few bases such as an interface ad/da and fx unit.

The routing within the PC/mac and the DAW for the 16 channels is not yet concise.

Cheers
Old 29th July 2019
  #261
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickknack View Post
I think if someone is investing in this product then Eventide need to make a few tutorials on its workflow.

6999$ usd is a big chunk of change however it looks like it covers a few bases such as an interface ad/da and fx unit.

The routing within the PC/mac and the DAW for the 16 channels is not yet concise.

Cheers
well.. how about a fully documented written manual??
i think that should be compulsory for a sophisticated machine as this one..
Old 29th July 2019
  #262
Lives for gear
 
italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Embarassing what one can read here. Feeling sorry for so many wrong or absent choices.
Old 29th July 2019
  #263
Lives for gear
 

[QUOTE Embarassing what one can read here. Feeling sorry for so many wrong or absent choices.][/QUOTE]

Please explain !!!

Cheers
Old 29th July 2019
  #264
Lives for gear
 
italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nickknack View Post
[QUOTE Embarassing what one can read here. Feeling sorry for so many wrong or absent choices.]
Please explain !!!

Cheers[/QUOTE]

Bad manual? unclear routing? Mixing? Unclear outputs numbering? A lot of confused users? etc. etc....
Old 29th July 2019
  #265
Lives for gear
 
spiderman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
Please explain !!!

Cheers
Bad manual? unclear routing? Mixing? Unclear outputs numbering? A lot of confused users? etc. etc....[/QUOTE]

It seems many companies are releasing electronic/software tech into the music userbase without these things. Akai is doing similar. Surprised to hear Eventide doesn't have a solid manual ready for this unit. Is that correct? If so... big fail on their part. The manual should be complete and deep from version 1.0
Old 29th July 2019
  #266
Lives for gear
 
TheBrightSide's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by spiderman View Post
Bad manual? unclear routing? Mixing? Unclear outputs numbering? A lot of confused users? etc. etc....
It seems many companies are releasing electronic/software tech into the music userbase without these things. Akai is doing similar. Surprised to hear Eventide doesn't have a solid manual ready for this unit. Is that correct? If so... big fail on their part. The manual should be complete and deep from version 1.0[/QUOTE]

Yes I’ve noticed a lot of new products are almost like “Beta versions”, with bug fixes and updates promised in the future.
I’d rather wait a while till the product is finished.
Old 29th July 2019
  #267
Lives for gear
 
oldgearguy's Avatar
 

It seems to depend on how you use it whether you think the current support is adequate or not. Analog I/O, using Emote for some detailed edits, the current version of the H9000 manual for set up and basics, the H8000 presets manual for algorithm details and I've had no complaints.

Others working the h9k into a live setup seem to have gotten things sorted out with a bit of tech help and seem to be happy.

Others using different I/O paths and tighter DAW integration seem to be having more problems.

Yes, there's no excuse for not having a full, current manual covering all the setup and configuration combinations. However, not all owners are equally impacted.
Old 29th July 2019
  #268
Lives for gear
 
italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by spiderman View Post
Bad manual? unclear routing? Mixing? Unclear outputs numbering? A lot of confused users? etc. etc....
It seems many companies are releasing electronic/software tech into the music userbase without these things. Akai is doing similar. Surprised to hear Eventide doesn't have a solid manual ready for this unit. Is that correct? If so... big fail on their part. The manual should be complete and deep from version 1.0[/QUOTE]


It's a very bad trend that has going on for the last 15 years or so...
You can't get a manual as good as most of the '80s/'90s manuals these days.
I call it "the Apple idiot syndrome"... anything and everything has to look simple and fool proof... but that can't be possible. Any piece requires a calibrated amount and type of info to be properly used.
Old 29th July 2019
  #269
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Can someone clarify if we can use different digital connections on each of the different FX chains?

Just reading on the manual (page 18):

"You can only use one of the following digital audio protocols at any given time:

○ AES3 (aka AES/EBU) over the DB25 connector ○ AES3 (aka AES/EBU) over the XLR connector ○ S/PDIF over the optical connector
○ S/PDIF over the RCA connector
○ ADAT over the optical connector"


However, is this a global restriction affecting all the FX Chains, or does it only affect a single FX Chain individually.

In other words, could I use 8x Adat inputs on FX Chain 1 + 8x AES/EBU on FX Chain 2??

Thanks
Old 30th July 2019
  #270
Lives for gear
 

I see this unit as half interface and half fx machine.

Its quite an investment and it does tick a few boxes however some of the routing
is a little vague.

Wouldnt mind seeing some diagrams please Eventide.

Cheers
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump