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Eventide H9000
Old 5th August 2019
  #271
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pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
Can someone clarify if we can use different digital connections on each of the different FX chains?

Just reading on the manual (page 18):

"You can only use one of the following digital audio protocols at any given time:

○ AES3 (aka AES/EBU) over the DB25 connector ○ AES3 (aka AES/EBU) over the XLR connector ○ S/PDIF over the optical connector
○ S/PDIF over the RCA connector
○ ADAT over the optical connector"


However, is this a global restriction affecting all the FX Chains, or does it only affect a single FX Chain individually.

In other words, could I use 8x Adat inputs on FX Chain 1 + 8x AES/EBU on FX Chain 2??

Thanks
Can someone let us know this please??

Cheers
Old 5th August 2019
  #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
i've got an h9000 on loan and am having massive troubles integrating it like you say it can below.. with "no other analog or digital connections"
So how's been your experience with the H9000 so far?
Easy operation and routing in the end?
and sound wise??

Cheers,

p.
Old 5th August 2019
  #273
t_d
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after talking to the product rep @ eventide i got everything sorted out on the USB audio routing, and it was very easy to do after realizing what i was doing wrong.

the problem i'm having now is a pro tools one.. because of pro tools' 3rd party hardware 32 output limit, making an aggregate device with a UA Apollo and the h9000 means there are workarounds that need to be done in order to access the channels and outputs i need for my particular setup. this may or may not be a problem for others depending if you want to use USB audio on the h9000 and whatever other outputs and routings you need in general.

but, once that's all out of the way it's really a fantastic device. the Emote control plug in is quite easy to use and makes everything quicker to operate than on the h8000 which i always found a bit sluggish.

it sounds amazing, of course, as it should, and the ability to run 4 chains of 4 algorithms each on a combination of hardware/XLR/console connections and USB audio pro tools tracks is pretty amazing. as is the ability to randomize algorithm settings for some really unexpected results.

i'm a bit disappointed that out of the gate the h9000 doesn't offer any NEW algorithms that aren't on the 8000. you'd think with all this horsepower available they'd at least make one or two new treats for users at the beginning but i'm hoping they do develop new processes as they go forwards.... how about they're Physion plug in? that would be cool.... stuff like that.

and, on a more comical note, with the regular version of the h9000, with the front panel, naming patches is as backwards and hard to use as the h8000... eventide still, for some reason, can't just make patch naming on an LED screen like every other device on the market with a scroll wheel and cursor buttons. where the 8000 had a clumsy-to-use QWERTY style interface, the 9000 opts for a push-button telephone/flip phone texting style naming system.... in 2019? odd.

but, i don't think UI design has ever been eventide's strong suit.. and we buy the units for their sound... that's what's important in the end, and the 9000 certainly has that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
So how's been your experience with the H9000 so far?
Easy operation and routing in the end?
and sound wise??

Cheers,

p.
Old 5th August 2019
  #274
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pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
after talking to the product rep @ eventide i got everything sorted out on the USB audio routing, and it was very easy to do after realizing what i was doing wrong.
glad to hear that

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
the problem i'm having now is a pro tools one..
well the word 'pro tools' explains it all..
pro tools disappointed me in terms of stability/compatibility so many times..
so no surprise with that..


Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
but, once that's all out of the way it's really a fantastic device.
the Emote control plug in is quite easy to use and makes everything quicker to operate than on the h8000 which i always found a bit sluggish.
nice!

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
it sounds amazing, of course, as it should,
i'm so happy to HEAR that from you!
does it sound very different to the H8000?
Did you noticed any difference on how the H8000 algorithms sound on the H9000????

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
and the ability to run 4 chains of 4 algorithms each on a combination of hardware/XLR/console connections and USB audio pro tools tracks is pretty amazing. as is the ability to randomize algorithm settings for some really unexpected results.
The USB port just kills this unit for me because it's just not capable for live tracking and real time performance.

I'm having a blast at the moment with my pc, a persons quantum interface and Gig Performer

So I would just dream to be a able to do half of what i'm doing with the H9000.
That would be a dream forever and ever..

If they could just release an ultrafast thunderbolt expansion card..
but at this stage I don't have any faith on that.

So I think the only way to unlock the great potential of the H9000 is to invest in a dante or AVB card.

But that increases the price substantially for me as I would also need to buy a fast dante computer interface like a rednet or similar..
and sadly, i can't afford that altogether..

I would just love to know if we can use 8x I/O of Adat and 8x I/O of AES/EBU at the same time if we select those routing on different fx chains..
do you know that?


if that would be at least possible, i might pull the trigger..


Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
i'm a bit disappointed that out of the gate the h9000 doesn't offer any NEW algorithms that aren't on the 8000. you'd think with all this horsepower available they'd at least make one or two new treats for users at the beginning but i'm hoping they do develop new processes as they go forwards.... how about they're Physion plug in? that would be cool.... stuff like that.
sure, but the fact is that they haven't done it even when they could at this stage.

just imagine to have all their mastering plug ins running on this box with these converters..

they haven't given us the option to even purchase them at extra cost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
and, on a more comical note, with the regular version of the h9000, with the front panel, naming patches is as backwards and hard to use as the h8000... eventide still, for some reason, can't just make patch naming on an LED screen like every other device on the market with a scroll wheel and cursor buttons. where the 8000 had a clumsy-to-use QWERTY style interface, the 9000 opts for a push-button telephone/flip phone texting style naming system.... in 2019? odd.
that's the main reason I will get the H9000R..

Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
but, i don't think UI design has ever been eventide's strong suit.. and we buy the units for their sound... that's what's important in the end, and the 9000 certainly has that!
Totally, I want this unit for it's SOUND
So if the algorithms sound as sweet as on the h8000 I think the upgrade is compulsory.

Even though, they really have to sort out so many things with this box.. (so many)

And I just don't quite understand why they are going so slow

It looks that there's a single individual (maybe two people) working as mad locked in a room..

I mean, it's 2019.. welcome to the digital era..
They should have released so many firmware updates by now!

I'm always laughing when I see that their big news and announcement of the year is a single algorithm for the H9 pedal.. or a little app for the phone..

In my opinion they are resting in their laurels and left the H9000 in the shadow.
It's been two years since they released to the public I think..

They say it's their flagship?
I think they are investing more resources on the development of plug ins..



Thanks for sharing your insights with us here!
Old 5th August 2019
  #275
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macgee's Avatar
there's a few algorithms that are available for the H9000 that aren't included on H8000, e.g. Unitide...Phaser and Flanger MKII, Stereo Room if I remember correctly and an H3000 algo as well..
Also Vsig 3.0 support which sets a much better future

There's been several Firmware updates, as well so things are definitely moving forward.. It's a marathon though, not a sprint.
Next big update is due soon, that will tell us much..

Regarding the digital interfaces, I think I recall that you can only have either SPDIF or ADAT at one time so if the manual says that then that rings true - that would be system wide then.

For Dante, you don't actually need a Dante interface on the other end. I only learned this recently that you can install the Dante audio driver and then pick it up on your network so a Rednet or similar is not needed but will give even lower latency. I'm considering this route so interested to hear others feedback about this.

Physion (transient split) is available as a module in Vsig and there's a bunch of others for which there aren't any algos even using them yet, e.g. DLYSMP2n.
I'm building an Algo using DLYSMP at the moment and it's very interesting.

Anyone interested in testing it and giving some feedback for improvements? Structurally it's done, now it's about usability - images attached
Looking for about 2 people to test it

* It's 6 samplers, that record and play automatically at specified interval
* The interval can be as low as 90ms and the recording length can be from 0 to interval length.
* Each sampler can run at different speeds, forward, reverse, loop, etc.. and outputs to it's own multitap so interesting textures can be achieved.
I've called it's a granular sampler which may be bending the truth
Attached Thumbnails
Eventide H9000-granular-sampler3.jpg   Eventide H9000-granular-sampler2.jpg   Eventide H9000-granular-sampler1.jpg  
Old 5th August 2019
  #276
t_d
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wow, very cool about vSig containing some new modules. yeah, official vSig Mac support for this is another huge benefit over the previous units.

i was hoping they would have more granular stuff out of the gate with this.. and am super interested in your patch for sure.

i'd love to try it out.. i should be getting my own until hopefully by the end of the week.

hit me with a PM if you want to share. i'm a bit of a looper/granular junky, so i may have some useful feedback (or not!)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
there's a few algorithms that are available for the H9000 that aren't included on H8000, e.g. Unitide...Phaser and Flanger MKII, Stereo Room if I remember correctly and an H3000 algo as well..
Also Vsig 3.0 support which sets a much better future

There's been several Firmware updates, as well so things are definitely moving forward.. It's a marathon though, not a sprint.
Next big update is due soon, that will tell us much..

Physion (transient split) is available as a module in Vsig and there's a bunch of others for which there aren't any algos even using them yet, e.g. DLYSMP2n.
I'm building an Algo using DLYSMP at the moment and it's very interesting.

Anyone interested in testing it and giving some feedback for improvements? Structurally it's done, now it's about usability - images attached
Looking for about 2 people to test it

* It's 6 samplers, that record and play automatically at specified interval
* The interval can be as low as 90ms and the recording length can be from 0 to interval length.
* Each sampler can run at different speeds, forward, reverse, loop, etc.. and outputs to it's own multitap so interesting textures can be achieved.
I've called it's a granular sampler which may be bending the truth
Old 5th August 2019
  #277
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
there's a few algorithms that are available for the H9000 that aren't included on H8000, e.g. Unitide...Phaser and Flanger MKII, Stereo Room if I remember correctly and an H3000 algo as well..
Also Vsig 3.0 support which sets a much better future

There's been several Firmware updates, as well so things are definitely moving forward.. It's a marathon though, not a sprint.
Next big update is due soon, that will tell us much..

Regarding the digital interfaces, I think I recall that you can only have either SPDIF or ADAT at one time so if the manual says that then that rings true - that would be system wide then.

For Dante, you don't actually need a Dante interface on the other end. I only learned this recently that you can install the Dante audio driver and then pick it up on your network so a Rednet or similar is not needed but will give even lower latency. I'm considering this route so interested to hear others feedback about this.

Physion (transient split) is available as a module in Vsig and there's a bunch of others for which there aren't any algos even using them yet, e.g. DLYSMP2n.
I'm building an Algo using DLYSMP at the moment and it's very interesting.

Anyone interested in testing it and giving some feedback for improvements? Structurally it's done, now it's about usability - images attached
Looking for about 2 people to test it

* It's 6 samplers, that record and play automatically at specified interval
* The interval can be as low as 90ms and the recording length can be from 0 to interval length.
* Each sampler can run at different speeds, forward, reverse, loop, etc.. and outputs to it's own multitap so interesting textures can be achieved.
I've called it's a granular sampler which may be bending the truth

Thanks for reporting on the digital connections but I still think that there is probably a chance for that restriction to happen only on one processor/FX Chain at the time?

Could you check that for me next time you switch on your H9K please??

I researched on the Dante Virtual Soundcard option but it's slow.
You need a dedicated ethernet audio interface connected to the PCI or Thunderbolt to make Dante as fast as it should.

That's a really nice idea for an algorithm by the way.

I just wish those 'two' Eventide engineers they have would come up with things like these on that 'marathon' they are currently running..

Thanks!
Old 5th August 2019
  #278
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macgee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
Thanks for reporting on the digital connections but I still think that there is probably a chance for that restriction to happen only on one processor/FX Chain at the time?

Could you check that for me next time you switch on your H9K please??

I researched on the Dante Virtual Soundcard option but it's slow.
You need a dedicated ethernet audio interface connected to the PCI or Thunderbolt to make Dante as fast as it should.

That's a really nice idea for an algorithm by the way.

I just wish those 'two' Eventide engineers they have would come up with things like these on that 'marathon' they are currently running..

Thanks!
If I remember correctly, the choice for which digital interface to use was in the system settings which applies to whole machines but will check next time...will be a little while though

thanks, when you get your H9000 you can test it out.

Also made a Harmonic Trem which I should release...though Eventide rained on my parade a bit haha...mine stands up well next to theirs though with some other cool functionality included
Old 6th August 2019
  #279
t_d
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does anyone know if you can transfer custom patches from an 8000 to a 9000? and if so.. how?

perhaps saving onto the CF card, transferring data to a computer and opening in vSig?

Last edited by t_d; 6th August 2019 at 04:34 PM..
Old 7th August 2019
  #280
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macgee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by t_d View Post
does anyone know if you can transfer custom patches from an 8000 to a 9000? and if so.. how?

perhaps saving onto the CF card, transferring data to a computer and opening in vSig?
you can't simply transfer because the architecture is different and the parameters differ and some modules don't/won't exist on the H9000. Some have been updated, H8000 = DLYSMP but H9000 = DLYSMP2
It should be possible to port many algos if you know what you're doing.
I think Eventide have said that if you have an Algo you really need ported that they can help.
Old 7th August 2019
  #281
Gear Head
 
pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
you can't simply transfer because the architecture is different and the parameters differ and some modules don't/won't exist on the H9000. Some have been updated, H8000 = DLYSMP but H9000 = DLYSMP2
It should be possible to port many algos if you know what you're doing.
I think Eventide have said that if you have an Algo you really need ported that they can help.
what's the max delay time for the DLYSMP2??
Thanks
Old 7th August 2019
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
what's the max delay time for the DLYSMP2??
Thanks
I don't actually know but I'll say it's large enough to not be a problem.
This algorithm is using loads of delay time across 6 x DLYSMP2, 6 x EASYTAPS (6 taps each), input and output delay, etc.. so the machine has loads of it.
There's also DLYSMP2N that can record multi track
Old 7th August 2019
  #283
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
what's the max delay time for the DLYSMP2??
Thanks
DLYSMP2 is also available in the H8000. It's a modded DLYSMP used for the pedals...
Max delay time in the H9000 is an obscure point... and can be a problem if one doesn't know how much memory=delay time to expect from the overall memory and how much to allocate to modules in an algorithm.
Looks like the RAM available in the 4 cores structure is bigger than the one used on the H8000 but that memory is used/shared by all 4 cores/4 presets so you may find yourself not being able to load an algorithm using a lot of it if the other 3 use a lot of memory too.
The H8000 has a logical and simple way for the user to be aware of the RAM:
at 48 KHz sampling
-each DSP has about 43.x sec. memory, used by reverbs/delays/shifters
-DSP A also has 174 sec. because of the sampler board
so one can decide how many seconds those modules allocate and always know the size of delay of loadable presets. A few specializaed modules use the sampling board memory while most others use the native memory.
I suggest you folks ask and find out the exact amount of RAM per 4 cores in terms of MBytes and how much delay memory the full amount of it can deliver for a mono delay line running at 48KHz. It should be in the specs... but it's missing. Eventide should post those values. It doesn't take Einstein to find that out.
You could also try this:
-in a 4 cores structure load 3 dummy presets, things with nothing in them.
In the 4 slot load a single delay and check how much memory uou can allocate. Set the max. amount. Try loading it. If it works, add a second delay module and start adding delay memory to it.... by trial and error you should reach a point when the algorithm doesn't load... allocated delay memory will be the culprit.
Old 7th August 2019
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
I don't actually know but I'll say it's large enough to not be a problem.
This algorithm is using loads of delay time across 6 x DLYSMP2, 6 x EASYTAPS (6 taps each), input and output delay, etc.. so the machine has loads of it.
There's also DLYSMP2N that can record multi track
I'm a looping nerd so I need as much delay time as possible..

I believe that the long delay module of the h8000 (174 sec) is now not included on the h9000.
neither the sampler..

so i'm intrigued about how the delay time (for looping with long delays) is now managed on the h9000?
i assume there's plenty of memory for very long delays right?

thanks
Old 7th August 2019
  #285
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
I'm a looping nerd so I need as much delay time as possible..

I believe that the long delay module of the h8000 (174 sec) is now not included on the h9000.
neither the sampler..

so i'm intrigued about how the delay time (for looping with long delays) is now managed on the h9000?
i assume there's plenty of memory for very long delays right?

thanks
If you carefully re-read my post....
there is no way to know how much memory a delay can allocate, unless:
-its specifier in Vsig has been updated to reflect the increased memory amount of the H9000
-one does the described test to find out the delay memory available per 4 cores.
Looks like none of these 2 details have been pointed out, described, tried....
The previous machines had a delay specifier where you could address up to 32 sec. for a single delay module... getting more is about stringing two of them and use a knob with a multiplier or divider to split the requested delay memory across the 2 modules. Easy math. This may not be needed on the H9000 ...*IF* they realize the max amount of delay memory is much increased and thuse the specifier max. value has been extended to the new limit. Sounds like basic commonsense, doesn'it?
Old 7th August 2019
  #286
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pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
If you carefully re-read my post....
there is no way to know how much memory a delay can allocate, unless:
-its specifier in Vsig has been updated to reflect the increased memory amount of the H9000
-one does the described test to find out the delay memory available per 4 cores.
Looks like none of these 2 details have been pointed out, described, tried....
The previous machines had a delay specifier where you could address up to 32 sec. for a single delay module... getting more is about stringing two of them and use a knob with a multiplier or dicider to split the requested delay memory across the 2 modules. Easy math. This may not be needed on the H9000 ...*IF* they realize the max amount of delay memory is much increased and thuse the specifier max. value has been extended to the new limit. Sounds like basic commonsense, doesn'it?
Thanks, I think we posted the last comments at the exact same time!
Cheers
Old 7th August 2019
  #287
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
I don't actually know but I'll say it's large enough to not be a problem.
You're dreaming!

Even 4 minutes and a half seemed a LOT for many years but there were and are people using more. With much increased number of cores/presets you should expect 8xH8000 memory to be on board as it would be very easy to use that memory across 16 algorithms.
That would be 36 minutes memory at least. Given this RAM is much cheaper than the H8000's, I hope they went flat out and put some serious allowance in the new flagship.
A better design would have been using regular computer RAM, which is pretty much what they use. But not soldering it. By leaving user accessable memory slots open for bigger RAM updates. Like on the old samplers!
Old 7th August 2019
  #288
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pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by italo de angelis View Post
A better design would have been using regular computer RAM, which is pretty much what they use. But not soldering it. By leaving user accessable memory slots open for bigger RAM updates. Like on the old samplers!
I would absolutely LOVE to know that!!

I mean the arm processors can be easily upgraded
So what about the RAM???????

Could someone let us know?

Cheers
Old 7th August 2019
  #289
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
I would absolutely LOVE to know that!!

I mean the arm processors can be easily upgraded
So what about the RAM???????

Could someone let us know?

Cheers
I don't think you can update the RAM. "Fashion trend" today is about soldering it... look at Apple (shame!).
But the test I suggested about delay modules in a single algorithm, along w/3 dummy ones can be easily done by anyone who owns the H9000 and knows how to use Vsig.
Old 7th August 2019
  #290
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macgee's Avatar
I think i recall that the ram is included with the CPU module. So if that were upgraded so too would RAM but Eventide will have to confirm. Think it's on their forum.

I'm away from my H9000 for a while so can't test max delay

Vsig docs days this for DLYSMP2 so that doesn't help..
maxdelay: 5000 to <max_delay_max> milliseconds. Specifies the maximum length audio to be recorded.
Old 7th August 2019
  #291
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pangea2003's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
Vsig docs days this for DLYSMP2 so that doesn't help...
'H9000'... the mystery box....
Old 7th August 2019
  #292
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by macgee View Post
I think i recall that the ram is included with the CPU module. So if that were upgraded so too would RAM but Eventide will have to confirm. Think it's on their forum.

I'm away from my H9000 for a while so can't test max delay

Vsig docs days this for DLYSMP2 so that doesn't help..
maxdelay: 5000 to <max_delay_max> milliseconds. Specifies the maximum length audio to be recorded.
I'm looking at the DLYSMP2 in the newer Vsig.
It comes up with a default delay of 5 sec but if you look at the right side of that 5000 (those are milliseconds) you'll see two fields, a MIN and a MAX, with 2000 and 32500... that means you can use from 2 to 32.5 seconds for that module.
All values of 32500 go back to Orville/H8000 machines. With the new memory these modules should be updated to longer delay amounts... they need to work the modules in C++ probably. It's amazing how they didn't do it yet... as it was done very quickly when the 4000 was abandoned... moving to Orville, jumping from 660 ms to 32500 ms. Put them to work as this is embarassing. Years are going by....
Also... I see the LONGDLY module is still in the database. That uses sampler memory..... but there's no sampler memory in the H9000 so.... either the decription needs to be re_written or the module isn't working correctly or who knows....
Old 7th August 2019
  #293
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italo de angelis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pangea2003 View Post
'H9000'... the mystery box....
Deeper that that, believe me!
Topic:
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