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Roland System 8
Old 3 days ago
  #8641
Gear Maniac
 
EnochLight's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Dairy View Post
I don't have any JX presets I made, my patches are mainly for S8 engine and they are all still intact so no worries.. but I want to restore the factory presets to the JX3P, they are all just gobbledygook.
When you transfer a Plug-Out from Roland Cloud, as far as I know any of the presets loaded at the time are transferred as well. Use Roland Cloud as your librarian - do the gobbledygook presets on your System 8 slot with the JX3P match what’s currently loaded in your Roland Cloud instance?
Old 3 days ago
  #8642
Gear Nut
 

Thanks I got it restored from the Cloud.
Old 3 days ago
  #8643
Gear Maniac
 
EnochLight's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Dairy View Post
Thanks I got it restored from the Cloud.
Good to hear. Enjoy!
Old 1 day ago
  #8644
Lives for gear
 
jbuonacc's Avatar
Seriously considering the System-8 lately, but I’m worried that they’ll soon release a better v2 and I’d be kicking myself for not waiting a bit. I’d be very surprised if they didn’t update it eventually, even with the recent ZEN-core offerings I don’t think for a minute that they’ve “given up” on ACB or the plug-out technology.

I guess I’ll just sock the money away and keep saving, maybe keep an eye out for a reasonably priced used S-8 in the meantime. The VST versions drive my pc nuts. Not so much that they use a lot of CPU, but the whole system goes nuts and the fans run hard. Maybe it’s telling me that there’s something else going on with the pc that I need to look into.
Old 1 day ago
  #8645
Gear Nut
 

Thing is, is there really a need for a v2?

It could have more voices obviously, and more plug out slots, and multi color lights. But no further ACB models have surfaced and the lights thing is purely cosmetic.

I think the Jupiter X has taken place of a v2 S8. The S8 plays and controls the analogue emulations it was made for perfectly as is. I wouldn't let this hold you back. Hands on control makes it much more fun and usable than the VST.

Give your PC a good clean, I did mine recently and there was a TON of oose clogged in the heatsink and covering the fans. You could actually hear it breathing clearly afterwards, the sound signature changed, and no more rpm increase with the fans when it was under stress.
Old 1 day ago
  #8646
Lives for gear
 

I see no reason to expect a V2 S8 any time soon. It's a solid product more or less alone in its niche (all the other VAs around have a pretty different value proposition). It works so no need to fix anything.

More likely would be other SYSTEM synths in a different format, like 5 octave or a module, but in the grand scheme of Roland I can't imagine that being a high priority. They need the ressources to flesh out the Zen platform.
Old 1 day ago
  #8647
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbuonacc View Post
Seriously considering the System-8 lately, but I’m worried that they’ll soon release a better v2 . . .
I would bet money that there will be no V2, ever. Buy one and enjoy it now.
Old 1 day ago
  #8648
Lives for gear
 
GregkoNYC's Avatar
I'll offer a counterargument in favor of Roland releasing a V2.

Imagine the "ultimate" controller for Roland Cloud. 61 keys (and perhaps an 88K version too), unlimited plug in slots, OLEDs for each control section that map to the specific instrument, more voices, etc.

Probably would come with a 1-year unlimited subscription to RC.

I can totally see it...


Greg
Old 1 day ago
  #8649
Lives for gear
 

Yeah but that's more a "SYSTEM-Other Number" than a "SYSTEM-8 V2". It's like how the S8 is not a "S1 V2" but another option in the same product line. As long as the S8 is doing well there's little point having another 4 octave SYSTEM synth.
Old 1 day ago
  #8650
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Stormchild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregkoNYC View Post
I'll offer a counterargument in favor of Roland releasing a V2.

Imagine the "ultimate" controller for Roland Cloud. 61 keys (and perhaps an 88K version too), unlimited plug in slots, OLEDs for each control section that map to the specific instrument, more voices, etc.
I've never seen "Roland" and "unlimited" in the same sentence before. Are we still talking about the same Roland that gave us a chintzy 64 preset slots for the plugouts in the System-8 in an era where it could easily fit thousands?

I can't picture a controller that's specifically tied to Roland Cloud, because no one will buy hardware that stops working (or is at least downgraded to a MIDI controller) if you stop paying for the subscription service. If it worked like the System-8 (where the plugouts you've loaded into it never expire) and really did have unlimited slots, you could just load all the Roland Cloud plugouts into it and immediately cancel the service, so they would have to make the world's first keyboard that needs to be connected to the Internet to keep working. Tough sell. That's probably why the System-8 only has three plugout slots.

A new or upgraded System-8 doesn't seem very likely at this point, but if they did do one, it wouldn't be anytime soon. All of their marketing weight is behind ZenCore right now, and probably will be for at least a couple more years.
Old 1 day ago
  #8651
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jbuonacc's Avatar
cripes, you guys really get hung up on some odd details. no way they'd have "unlimited plug-in slots", but the System-8 itself could be seen as a "controller" for the Cloud synths.

Roland has a pretty good track record of making "mkII" successors to all sorts of products, most recently with the JU-06A. even the TR-8S could be seen as a "v2" of the TR-8. i don't see any reason for them to "abandon" this technology, even with the newer ZEN-Core synths. maybe not a direct v2 of the System-8, but maybe a desktop or nice 3-octave synth for the mono plug-outs. whatever, who knows. i wouldn't be surprised at all to see them come out with a new ACB synth/module, i'd actually be more surprised if they didn't. i'd love to see something with the form factor of the MC-707 and TR-8S.

anyway, i don't really have any complaints about the System-8 just how it is. need to think about it a little more, not in any hurry.
Old 1 day ago
  #8652
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post
[...]

I can't picture a controller that's specifically tied to Roland Cloud, because no one will buy hardware that stops working (or is at least downgraded to a MIDI controller) if you stop paying for the subscription service. If it worked like the System-8 (where the plugouts you've loaded into it never expire) and really did have unlimited slots, you could just load all the Roland Cloud plugouts into it and immediately cancel the service, so they would have to make the world's first keyboard that needs to be connected to the Internet to keep working. Tough sell. That's probably why the System-8 only has three plugout slots.

[...]
They fixed this leaking issue with Zen: the hardware expansion are separate from the software products/expansions, so even if you have full access to the Cloud, you can't load anything to hardware unless you have the specific key for that. They'd just have to update Plug Out to work that way.

In fact, I suspect/expect Plug Out will become Zen Core expansions and just join that system.
Old 1 day ago
  #8653
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Stormchild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbuonacc View Post
the System-8 itself could be seen as a "controller" for the Cloud synths.
Indeed it is. All of the plugout plugins (awkward term) already respond to the expected controls on the System-8, and even have a "System-1/8 Layout" option that rearranges the UI to match.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbuonacc View Post
Roland has a pretty good track record of making "mkII" successors to all sorts of products, most recently with the JU-06A. even the TR-8S could be seen as a "v2" of the TR-8. i don't see any reason for them to "abandon" this technology, even with the newer ZEN-Core synths. maybe not a direct v2 of the System-8, but maybe a desktop or nice 3-octave synth for the mono plug-outs. whatever, who knows. i wouldn't be surprised at all to see them come out with a new ACB synth/module, i'd actually be more surprised if they didn't. i'd love to see something with the form factor of the MC-707 and TR-8S.
True…the TR-8S and JU-06A are sweet upgrades, and since I greatly prefer ACB over ABM and ZenCore, I'd very much like to see all kinds of new ACB products.

One thing that would be really cool is a System-8 expansion rack module that just hosts multiple plugouts and runs them all simultaneously, which you control with the System-8 (or any MIDI controller). Even if it only supports the mono synths, it would be really cool to have an SH-101, SH-2, ProMars, and System-100 all running at the same time. I'd be first in line to buy one, but admittedly at that point I would probably cancel my Roland Cloud subscription.

David Åhlund did say (at the big event last September where the X/Xm were introduced…and yes, I learned how to type the Swedish å for some reason) that Roland hasn't given up on ACB, and the new emulations are a lightweight alternative designed for higher polyphony.

Anyway, no one knows what's up their sleeve. All I can say is the System-8 is already awesome, and easily my favorite piece of hardware (sorry to my OB-6 and ARP Odyssey, and the rest of the gang…I love you guys too). Even if they release a new one, I could see myself keeping the System-8 so I can have two plugout instances at the same time.
Old 1 day ago
  #8654
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Stormchild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToyBox View Post
In fact, I suspect/expect Plug Out will become Zen Core expansions and just join that system.
That's what worries me, though I don't see a path from here to there. They've already built a bunch of ABM models for the Jupiter-X, but they're not as detailed or accurate as the Roland Cloud versions. Since they can't just replace the old ones, they would have to introduce a second set of emulations of the same hardware and somehow distinguish them without making the new ones look bad. I don't know how they'd pull that off. Most likely they will just add the new ABM versions and not explain anything, leaving it up to users to figure out what's what.
Old 1 day ago
  #8655
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post
That's what worries me, though I don't see a path from here to there. They've already built a bunch of ABM models for the Jupiter-X, but they're not as detailed or accurate as the Roland Cloud versions. Since they can't just replace the old ones, they would have to introduce a second set of emulations of the same hardware and somehow distinguish them without making the new ones look bad. I don't know how they'd pull that off. Most likely they will just add the new ABM versions and not explain anything, leaving it up to users to figure out what's what.
? The new ABM models aren't on the Cloud yet, it's only ACB that's on there.

Running ACB on a JP-X for example, would likely bring down its polyphony down to 8 if not less (they have one less BMC chip than the S8 by my understanding). That's rough, but some still find the added nuances worth it.

That's already enough of a distinction. They both look good and bad depending on the situation or ones point of view. They compliment one another.
Old 1 day ago
  #8656
Lives for gear
 
Stormchild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToyBox View Post
? The new ABM models aren't on the Cloud yet, it's only ACB that's on there.

Running ACB on a JP-X for example, would likely bring down its polyphony down to 8 if not less (they have one less BMC chip than the S8 by my understanding). That's rough, but some still find the added nuances worth it.

That's already enough of a distinction. They both look good and bad depending on the situation or ones point of view. They compliment one another.
I know, but the ACB plugouts don't run on the Jupiter-X, so if they wanted to offer analog emulations in Roland Cloud that are also usable on the Jupiter-X, they would have to add the ABM models.

I agree that they have distinct advantages…just think it's tricky from a marketing perspective to explain to users why there are two different emulations of the Jupiter-8, Juno-106, etc. without revealing that the Z-Core models (as they called them in the recent Zenology video) are "lightweight" versions that aren't as authentic as the existing ACB ones. Maybe they'll just focus on the fact that they're more efficient and you can run more instances or higher voice counts.

My concern is more that they might end up letting ACB fade away while putting all their energy into ZenCore/ABM, because the latter does at least have the advantage of being a (somewhat) unified platform across a wide range of hardware products.

Anyway, who knows. Back to making patches!
Old 17 hours ago
  #8657
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post
[...]

I agree that they have distinct advantages…just think it's tricky from a marketing perspective to explain to users why there are two different emulations of the Jupiter-8, Juno-106, etc. without revealing that the Z-Core models (as they called them in the recent Zenology video) are "lightweight" versions that aren't as authentic as the existing ACB ones. Maybe they'll just focus on the fact that they're more efficient and you can run more instances or higher voice counts.

[...]
Huh? They've already revealed that, it's one of the first things that they've said about ABM, that they're less detailed emulation optimized for polyphony is no secret.

The question that people have that Roland won't and can't answer is which sounds best between ACB and ABM. As far as they're concerned, they both sound, obviously, great. Just pick whichever works best for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormchild View Post
[...]
My concern is more that they might end up letting ACB fade away while putting all their energy into ZenCore/ABM, because the latter does at least have the advantage of being a (somewhat) unified platform across a wide range of hardware products.

Anyway, who knows. Back to making patches!
That's the question. Part of the raison d'être behind Zen was to unify and optimize their development platform. It's clear that ACB is still a thing for them, they've stated as much. However did they plan to integrate it with Zen? Or are they going to keep it a separate branch?

I suspect integration but time will tell
Old 17 hours ago
  #8658
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ToyBox View Post
Huh? They've already revealed that, it's one of the first things that they've said about ABM, that they're less detailed emulation optimized for polyphony is no secret.

The question that people have that Roland won't and can't answer is which sounds best between ACB and ABM. As far as they're concerned, they both sound, obviously, great. Just pick whichever works best for you.
As far as I understand, the ACB is an emulation of the entire circuit, while the ABM is just emulating the most important sections/modules, like the oscillators, filters and envelopes. But they will probably not emulate the subtle little quirks. So it probably sounds nearly the same, but just subtle differences if you listen to it closely in solo.

Quote:
That's the question. Part of the raison d'être behind Zen was to unify and optimize their development platform. It's clear that ACB is still a thing for them, they've stated as much. However did they plan to integrate it with Zen? Or are they going to keep it a separate branch?

I suspect integration but time will tell
Yeah they clearly have separated the ZEN tech from the ACB tech. It is not per se a successor. I think we still have hope for more ACB, since this is also a big part of the Cloud. Also in the Cloud the Zen is a separate category.
Old 7 hours ago
  #8659
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login's Avatar
I would like a v2 with more voices, more memory slots, 61 keys, aftertouch, 8 plugout slots, 2 lfo's and better effects.
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