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I will never sell my JV 1080 again....
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #421
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
honestly, i had a jv-880 and it was much less comfortable than the jv-1080 - which i got because it was cheap and i was curious about memories i had of the 880. soundwise, i couldn't say, everything is relative, and i wouldn't remember accurately. i was pleased to sell the 880 and replaced it with an easier EMU at the time (completely different sound, but a rompler that was easier to program). the 1080 design is much better as a physical format and design, and i wouldn't look at an 880 now - you could get them for 70eu not so long ago (1080 was 100eu).
did have some ripping sound from the 880 though, have no idea if the 1080 can do it.

interesting from an archive point of view to find out differences between models of same genus though. especially when you think of the groovebox or XP(80, cool features workstation) versions.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #422
Here for the gear
 
conforce's Avatar
 
amen. it's a powerhouse. and actually the internal effects are not so bad compared to more modern machines.. this synth blends well in many productions.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #423
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
I finally woke to what you might be suggesting here.

Remote SL61 MK1 arrived. It's pretty nice. I use older verisons of Logic X and Mac OS, so for fun I installed the now discontinued "Automap" to see what would happen. Once in there I could quickly label and map my knobs and faders to seemingly anything, with help of the novation map editor that runs in realtime. The LED labels on the SL are priceless and the MK1 has the most, like this: I've only mapped this instrument on left side, but it's updating all values realtime. Fast to assign and name them. All knobs and buttons, and there are multiple pages. You hit a button and suddenly the whole row is showing you the button values, move slider and that "row" is instantly up there, with parameter names and values. I was shocked.



Automap, unlike the Remote SL standard templates is two-way. BCR 2000 is also one way with Roland parameters, if I'm not mistaken. The Automap editor visible on screen works with Kontakt and Logic instruments-perhaps not as designed but good enough. The JV-XP now has a plugin I think will run in logic.

My new plan is to install that and see if I can map the SL61 as I'm able to do already with installed instruments and see JV1010 values on my SL61 LEDs. Could save me some serious hexidecimal time. The Remote is using USB so I will 5-pin to the 1010 from my old MBP. Knock on wood.

At least I'd be able to pretend I'm dawless LOL, I can use that old 15" for sheet music once I'm running. Logic does seem to want a map for every preset, but they are saveable, and return when you do. These are not the same as the standard maps, you save em in a folder on the PC fast. No dumps.

Better lucky than good. Undoubtably designing a layout for the 1010 labryith with be pockmarked with pitfalls. I better pace myself, or I will stop practicing for fiddling. 5 of 5 of the 2 right? Which song was that....which chord had a flat 9? MOXF6 coming next week with a crappy keybed (the SL mk1 has good one w/AT and note off V)...there must be a plugin for that thing too, right?

The MOXF parameters make the 1010 look like Hemingway. Better study up on the dreaded "enviroment", yikes. Automap had me in there today on orders during the install.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #424
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
Automap
i've never tried Automap
that's just for plugins, isn't it? i was aiming for a use in a computerless scenario, with the templates. (and then spent ages programming the editor )
didn't know that it worked 2-way.

yes, you should be able to draft a VST plugin from the *.bpanelz file. or else run the panel standalone, since each parameter should have a VSTID number.

let us know if the templates with the the 1010. they will only edit on one MIDI channel though, but you can get somewhere editing a preset, and fiddle with effects to some extent.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #425
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
i've never tried Automap
that's just for plugins, isn't it? i was aiming for a use in a computerless scenario, with the templates. (and then spent ages programming the editor )
didn't know that it worked 2-way.

yes, you should be able to draft a VST plugin from the *.bpanelz file. or else run the panel standalone, since each parameter should have a VSTID number.

let us know if the templates with the the 1010. they will only edit on one MIDI channel though, but you can get somewhere editing a preset, and fiddle with effects to some extent.
I was also looking to be Dawless, but what hardware controller will reach every thing? The SL MK1 Roland sysex is 12 bytes I think, is that enough or do I have wrong?

page 72 SL manual:
Length: This determines the length of the sysex message sent when the control is operated. The value sets the number of bytes and is variable between 0 and 12, or 9 and 12 for ROLAND type sysex messages.

How do you get around the 12 byte limit?

I know it will reach a bunch of stuff, but not sure what it can't do, besides receive info, which the BCR2000 also cannot do.

As I'm slowly learning the Remote SL, I'm going to try your template pretty soon, even if the plugin route works.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #426
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
I was also looking to be Dawless, but what hardware controller will reach every thing? The SL MK1 Roland sysex is 12 bytes I think, is that enough or do I have wrong?....

...I'm going to try your template pretty soon, even if the plugin route works.
...
*just*try*my*mapping*, Dawless
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #427
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
unzip it, and load them into the slots in the editor, and then upload. all done.
i can't remember, it's maybe even easier than that.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #428
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
unzip it, and load them into the slots in the editor, and then upload. all done.
i can't remember, it's maybe even easier than that.
I will and I apreciate it

Again, what about the Remote SLmk1 12 byte sysex limit?

http://www.chromakinetics.com/handsonic/rolSysEx.htm

It's clear in the reference above messages longer than 12 bytes are used for some functions, and JV1010 is specifically mentioned.

MKII also shows 12 byte limit in Manual.

Is this not the case, or you ignore longer commands or you found workarounds...

Thanks
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #429
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
I will and I apreciate it

Again, what about the Remote SLmk1 12 byte sysex limit?
yeah you're right, there's a limit, and i can't remember, but i got it to work, and it's got an adaptable parameter when you select 'roland' when you sort out the checksum on the unit. so you have to get your editor stuff up into the device, then sort out the checksum for each parameter (work...), and then export it back as a file, and save that, export it, whatever, - but then you can just reload it and you don't have to do all that again. i think it's 11 bytes or something. cannot recall offhand. i like feedback :-) so give it a go. you know, the entire ff'n internet gives no feedback, it's weird. (unless someone's grumpy, and then you hear about it)

and: if you decide to edit the mappings, you have to do all of that all over again..
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #430
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
yeah you're right, there's a limit, and i can't remember, but i got it to work, and it's got an adaptable parameter when you select 'roland' when you sort out the checksum on the unit. so you have to get your editor stuff up into the device, then sort out the checksum for each parameter (work...), and then export it back as a file, and save that, export it, whatever, - but then you can just reload it and you don't have to do all that again. i think it's 11 bytes or something. cannot recall offhand. i like feedback :-) so give it a go. you know, the entire ff'n internet gives no feedback, it's weird. (unless someone's grumpy, and then you hear about it)

and: if you decide to edit the mappings, you have to do all of that all over again..
Thank You! Haha, that little post could save me or somebody some time down the road.

So I have: "remoteSL JV1080 beta3.zip" from your post in this thread, does that sound like the latest? I'm getting confused having DLed various tidbits for this project.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #431
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
Thank You! Haha, that little post could save me or somebody some time down the road.

So I have: "remoteSL JV1080 beta3.zip" from your post in this thread, does that sound like the latest? I'm getting confused having DLed various tidbits for this project.
yes, that's the only one i uploaded. that's my naming system so i don't accidentally overwrite the last good file :-)

possibly it could be improved. i'd be interested to get hold of anyone else's Remote templates for it (or any other MIDI unit: i'm collecting all that i can find).

in fact it can be improved, because i made a mistake throughout - but it still works: if you remember, earlier in the thread i asked about a 'receiving sysex' message displayed on the LCD each time you send a message. so this is because my sysex messages are addressing the actual preset memory, rather than the 'temporary' edit memory. that needs to be fixed and ideally i have to do it all again including uploading each one of the 17 fixed templates, and going through and redoing the checksum for every parameter, saving it on the Remote, then backing them all up to computer again as finished files which i couldn't quite face at the time - and wasn't sure about, tbh, until i could get a bit of feedback (which never came). so i played around with it a bit and tested to check it was all working, and then started another project (i started learning Ctrlr at that point).

what it is (i'm firing up the editor right now to look at it) is that i read the sysex implementation literally, looking at the address system - you have to add together base address and offset address (forget what it's called) with Roland multi-timbral units. so i was looking at that, but in fact there's a 'temporary' memory area for everything as well, and i should have been using that. it isn't very difficult to fix, just one byte in the messages.

for example, Tone1 on/off, i have here as:
41 10 6A 12 03 00 10 00 DV 00

i think the byte to change must be 03 ? have to look it up again.
the message sent, there, will actually be:
F0 41 10 6A 12 03 00 10 00 (hex value) (checksum) F7

i found out about 'setting' and storing the checksum thing by trial and error. it's pretty obvious what needs to be done when you're setting it up once you load to the RemoteSL. i then tested to see if it needed to be done again when i reloaded an exported template, and discovered no, that it was still saved/set up from the first time i exported it. so the editor itself cannot deal with it. i wrote to Novation about it, and they said that the editor was 'only a beta anyway'. you can see all this when you navigate a template, i can't remember offhand where it is; think it's the top left navigation button, up (?). have to dig out my RemoteZero and have a look.

-i reckon Novation could take all this a bit further if they wanted to rewrite the editor a bit, maybe add some stuff in firmware? but it didn't seem to be part of their plans (as their mkIII is a quite different concept).

so what do we need to change that '03' to? ... or is it the '12' ? you see, i've forgotten, it was around 5 yrs ago.

but it will/should work as is anyway, in the meantime. (oof long post, soz)
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #432
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
yes, that's the only one i uploaded. that's my naming system so i don't accidentally overwrite the last good file :-)

possibly it could be improved. i'd be interested to get hold of anyone else's Remote templates for it (or any other MIDI unit: i'm collecting all that i can find).

in fact it can be improved, because i made a mistake throughout - but it still works: if you remember, earlier in the thread i asked about a 'receiving sysex' message displayed on the LCD each time you send a message. so this is because my sysex messages are addressing the actual preset memory, rather than the 'temporary' edit memory. that needs to be fixed and ideally i have to do it all again including uploading each one of the 17 fixed templates, and going through and redoing the checksum for every parameter, saving it on the Remote, then backing them all up to computer again as finished files which i couldn't quite face at the time - and wasn't sure about, tbh, until i could get a bit of feedback (which never came). so i played around with it a bit and tested to check it was all working, and then started another project (i started learning Ctrlr at that point).

what it is (i'm firing up the editor right now to look at it) is that i read the sysex implementation literally, looking at the address system - you have to add together base address and offset address (forget what it's called) with Roland multi-timbral units. so i was looking at that, but in fact there's a 'temporary' memory area for everything as well, and i should have been using that. it isn't very difficult to fix, just one byte in the messages.

for example, Tone1 on/off, i have here as:
41 10 6A 12 03 00 10 00 DV 00

i think the byte to change must be 03 ? have to look it up again.
the message sent, there, will actually be:
F0 41 10 6A 12 03 00 10 00 (hex value) (checksum) F7

i found out about 'setting' and storing the checksum thing by trial and error. it's pretty obvious what needs to be done when you're setting it up once you load to the RemoteSL. i then tested to see if it needed to be done again when i reloaded an exported template, and discovered no, that it was still saved/set up from the first time i exported it. so the editor itself cannot deal with it. i wrote to Novation about it, and they said that the editor was 'only a beta anyway'. you can see all this when you navigate a template, i can't remember offhand where it is; think it's the top left navigation button, up (?). have to dig out my RemoteZero and have a look.

-i reckon Novation could take all this a bit further if they wanted to rewrite the editor a bit, maybe add some stuff in firmware? but it didn't seem to be part of their plans (as their mkIII is a quite different concept).

so what do we need to change that '03' to? ... or is it the '12' ? you see, i've forgotten, it was around 5 yrs ago.

but it will/should work as is anyway, in the meantime. (oof long post, soz)
Thanks so much for taking your time to explain the background, that is so helpful, and not to long a message at all. You did a huge amount of work on these 17 templates and it will be so cool if I can get them working. There are alot of JV1010s and Remote SLs floating around, so they might see some real use if working.

I first tried to upload all 17 at once from the .blk, but although it showed them all going in on the progress bar, only the first few actually arrived. So I saved the blk as individual templates. Then moved them over one at a time and configured them as a group on the SL. I'd only just got the controller so it was an evening to get them over and ordered (and add a few others I wanted to try for general use) I got some errors loading a few templates into the editor, but they refered to not being able to create a log file, and they did load and I got them over. All your parameters now show on the SL. Whereupon it becomes evident how much work went into making them.

Projects like this can really take over "normal life", so I'm pacing myself LOL. But I'm going to march forward with it.

Having studied and run the 1010 from software, I understand about the temp area where the messages need to be redirected. That change should be easy.

On thing I'm still trying to grasp is why the checksum needs to be recalculated after the templates are uploaded, and this must be entered actually on the controller instead of the editor. The checksum value is finite based on the mesaage content, no? A msg to do X will always have the same checksum, or that's my reading at the moment. Or maybe you are jsut saying the checksums will need to be redone as the address to "temp" changes, which might be done either on the SL or the editor?

I really apreciate your communication on this,
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #433
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
Thanks so much for taking your time to explain the background, that is so helpful, and not to long a message at all. You did a huge amount of work on these 17 templates and it will be so cool if I can get them working. There are alot of JV1010s and Remote SLs floating around, so they might see some real use if working.

I first tried to upload all 17 at once from the .blk, but although it showed them all going in on the progress bar, only the first few actually arrived. So I saved the blk as individual templates. Then moved them over one at a time and configured them as a group on the SL. I'd only just got the controller so it was an evening to get them over and ordered (and add a few others I wanted to try for general use) I got some errors loading a few templates into the editor, but they refered to not being able to create a log file, and they did load and I got them over. All your parameters now show on the SL. Whereupon it becomes evident how much work went into making them.

Projects like this can really take over "normal life", so I'm pacing myself LOL. But I'm going to march forward with it.

Having studied and run the 1010 from software, I understand about the temp area where the messages need to be redirected. That change should be easy.

On thing I'm still trying to grasp is why the checksum needs to be recalculated after the templates are uploaded, and this must be entered actually on the controller instead of the editor. The checksum value is finite based on the mesaage content, no? A msg to do X will always have the same checksum, or that's my reading at the moment. Or maybe you are jsut saying the checksums will need to be redone as the address to "temp" changes, which might be done either on the SL or the editor?

I really apreciate your communication on this,
i will have to test here to see if it loads ok. i have a mk1, so it may be a bit different on a mk2. maybe the actual files can be loaded into the mk2 editor and adapted there for mk2.

it seems the unit needs to generate a checksum process for a parameter, and it asks you to define the message length. this isn't covered by the editor software. i got the impression that exporting the file from the Remote once saved on it, ensured that the checksum assignment didn-t have to be done the next time it was loaded. is that wrong? did you have to assign checksum etc.?
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #434
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
i will have to test here to see if it loads ok. i have a mk1, so it may be a bit different on a mk2. maybe the actual files can be loaded into the mk2 editor and adapted there for mk2.

it seems the unit needs to generate a checksum process for a parameter, and it asks you to define the message length. this isn't covered by the editor software. i got the impression that exporting the file from the Remote once saved on it, ensured that the checksum assignment didn-t have to be done the next time it was loaded. is that wrong? did you have to assign checksum etc.?
Sorry, I probably wasn't clear. I wasn't sure if yours was Mk1 or 2, but mine is Mk1 Remote SL61. My editor version might be newer, but it's the MK 1 editor they have now for all "remote SL" aka MK1 on the novation site here:

https://resource.novationmusic.com/s...duct=ReMOTE+SL

Again, thank you for great comms
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #435
Lives for gear
 
๐ŸŽง 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by uhoh7 View Post
... editor version ...
ah, my mistake: the two editor version were both for mk1. but one is for the keyboard models and covers the XY pad and Joystick, and the Zero version doesn't have that. otherwise it's the same thing. and templates should work with both.

do you have the navigation buttons on the sides? there might be some difference between regular and zero models, causing your error messages. (still haven't checked on my unit)
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #436
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibtl View Post
ah, my mistake: the two editor version were both for mk1. but one is for the keyboard models and covers the XY pad and Joystick, and the Zero version doesn't have that. otherwise it's the same thing. and templates should work with both.

do you have the navigation buttons on the sides? there might be some difference between regular and zero models, causing your error messages. (still haven't checked on my unit)
Yes, on both sides. That's the cool thing about the original Mk1 it has the led panels over both knobs and faders. Really like the keys on the SL61, the Fatar. I'm sure they must BE plastic but they have the hard gloss of an old hammond, and exactly the perfect weight for synths.

The price for that is it's not super light, about 15 lbs or maybe more. That's OK.
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