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Miking a Kit with just Omni Mics?
Old 21st February 2019
  #1
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Miking a Kit with just Omni Mics?

Anyone ever try this? I don't know if I have enough omni dynamics to pull this off, but thinking of using 100% omni mics to record a kit.

No proximity effect and nice-sounding bleed is what I'd be hoping to achieve with it.
Old 22nd February 2019
  #2
YMMV. I've done it but the key IME is the drummer balancing the kit very well through his/her playing. Also, each drum should stand well on its own, as to not need much, if anything in post. The hi hats, for example, will be a lot louder in the snare mic compared to a cardioid, for example. IME, you also have to be easier on EQ and dynamics as well, preferably very little, if at all, as that will affect the surrounding elements more, comparatively speaking. But who knows, maybe that could be interesting. The advantage, of course, is generally better off axis response, so bleed is usually more natural and useable. If you're used to using gates, you'll likely find they won't have nearly as much usefullness, if any here, but then again, you'll likely have less desire to use them, if the drummer is balancing everything well. Avenson STO2s do well here. Very natural all around the mic, and they can take the level, and don't require preamps (for close mics, and if you have separate phantom power) unless you want to add color with external preamplification.
Old 24th February 2019
  #3
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Drumsound's Avatar
I'll be interested to hear with what you get.
Old 24th February 2019
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
I'll be interested to hear with what you get.
My mic closet is sorely lacking in the omni department:

CAD M179s (3)
EV 635a (1)

I could do a Glyn Johns or Recorderman, use M179 on kick out with a pad, EV 635a on snare top.
Old 24th February 2019
  #5
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Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Until someone stole it, I used a 635a as a single overhead fairly often. And one of the best kick sounds I've ever experienced was the house kit at a place where I was on staff. Altec Saltshaker omni on a sweatshirt on a cinderblock inside the kick. It heard a whole bunch of sympathetic snare wires.

Not sure how an omni snare mic would work out, though. The proximity-thump is part of the deal, y'know?
Old 24th February 2019
  #6
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Drumsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
My mic closet is sorely lacking in the omni department:

CAD M179s (3)
EV 635a (1)

I could do a Glyn Johns or Recorderman, use M179 on kick out with a pad, EV 635a on snare top.
Or...use this as an excuse to get more 635as. The great thing about those is, almost all of them work, no matter what shaper they're in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Until someone stole it, I used a 635a as a single overhead fairly often. And one of the best kick sounds I've ever experienced was the house kit at a place where I was on staff. Altec Saltshaker omni on a sweatshirt on a cinderblock inside the kick. It heard a whole bunch of sympathetic snare wires.
One of my favorite records I ever made has a 635a as the OH. It was a mostly live in the room thing, so a lot of the brightness of the cymbals came from the acoustic guitar mic...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Not sure how an omni snare mic would work out, though. The proximity-thump is part of the deal, y'know?
Good point, but I have a feeling it would still be interesting,
Old 24th February 2019
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
Or...use this as an excuse to get more 635as. The great thing about those is, almost all of them work, no matter what shaper they're in.


One of my favorite records I ever made has a 635a as the OH. It was a mostly live in the room thing, so a lot of the brightness of the cymbals came from the acoustic guitar mic...



Good point, but I have a feeling it would still be interesting,
Yeah, I had two. Sold one. Figured I didn't need it.

Wonder what the other EV omnis are like? There are so many of them; Beyerdynamic too, from the 60/70s broadcast market.

Pretty cheap, wonder about low end response as some drop off pretty steeply around 100Hz.
Old 24th February 2019
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
Yeah, I had two. Sold one. Figured I didn't need it.

Wonder what the other EV omnis are like? There are so many of them; Beyerdynamic too, from the 60/70s broadcast market.

Pretty cheap, wonder about low end response as some drop off pretty steeply around 100Hz.
I haven't jumped down that particular rabbit hole...

I did almost buy a pair of Beyer M101s, the omni version of the M201 a few years back. I probably should have.
Old 24th February 2019
  #9
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with lots of condensers in omni, you might end up with way too much lf and hf

i once did mic up a double bass kit with five b&k (or schoeps?) omnis (two on kicks, one on snare, two overheads in wide a/b) as the producer of an album wanted me to redo a huge drum break with an entirely different sound long after recording ended (brilliant idea?!)

dunno what happened to the tracks but i heard that the mixing engineer was pretty much pissed - the producer however keeps asking me to this day how i managed to get this (what he considered) an enormous sound just on the raw tracks...

never told him, not even who played drums :-)
Old 24th February 2019
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
I haven't jumped down that particular rabbit hole...

I did almost buy a pair of Beyer M101s, the omni version of the M201 a few years back. I probably should have.
Ooooo, that could be good for room mics.

Speaking of that, pulled the trigger on a matched pair of RM BIV-1 Royer R121 clones, setup a blumlein array on the rooms. Holy cow, smashed with a Waves API 2500.
Old 24th February 2019
  #11
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matt thomas's Avatar
The 3 mic Earthworks drum mic kits are just a pair of omnis, with a cardioid for kick.

They sound great (I own some), but require a really good drum and room sound.

Matt
Old 24th February 2019
  #12
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Drumsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
Ooooo, that could be good for room mics.

Speaking of that, pulled the trigger on a matched pair of RM BIV-1 Royer R121 clones, setup a blumlein array on the rooms. Holy cow, smashed with a Waves API 2500.
Yeah, the Albini omnis taped to the floor thing is fun. I've done it with 635a and Octava MC012 (and maybe 12 gauge omnis, whouch I should use more often).

Are you tracking the smashing with a hardware 2500? I use the API 2500 for drum parallel pretty regularly.
Old 24th February 2019
  #13
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bicarbone's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
Ooooo, that could be good for room mics.

Speaking of that, pulled the trigger on a matched pair of RM BIV-1 Royer R121 clones, setup a blumlein array on the rooms. Holy cow, smashed with a Waves API 2500.
Beyer M101 sounds great! I have two of them, and would use when 635a's are too dirty. RM BIV-1 is my new favourite ribbon!
Old 24th February 2019
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
Yeah, the Albini omnis taped to the floor thing is fun. I've done it with 635a and Octava MC012 (and maybe 12 gauge omnis, whouch I should use more often).

Are you tracking the smashing with a hardware 2500? I use the API 2500 for drum parallel pretty regularly.
No, plugin after. Recorded dry.

I picked up an Art Pro MPA II for really cheap yesterday, so I'm going to try that with my CM3s in ORTF on overheads.

The MPA II sounds really good: Class A discrete, variable impedance, low/high voltage mode for the tubes, variable low pass filter, Mid-Side/Stereo/Dual Mono modes; controls are all detented, so easy to dial in.

Haven't really driven the tubes yet, but on High Voltage mode, there's tons of headroom. Going to drive it a bit with the CM3s to shave off some cymbal edge.
Old 24th February 2019
  #15
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I used once a Sennheiser MD21 to mic a snare and the sound was pure magic. Tried it again many times since then, it appears it was that snare and drummer and song arrangement that made the drum sing through this particular mic.

Got a spare channel? Try to stick an omni (KM83, or a dynamic like a 635a or a Beyer M101) somewhere in between floor tom (just above the rim) and kick drum, some nice results can be achieved : beater attack, floor tom whack and lows, cymbals, kit "glue".
Old 24th February 2019
  #16
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Buy a pair of RFT DM622 dynamics. Also omni and have a top end that will make awesome old school overhead sizzle. And yeah, more 635a's lol. Or just put the one you have in heart mic position over the kick edge and compress it to feck and call it done.
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