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How to: Building ELCO/EDAC snakes Digital Converters
Old 7th February 2016
  #1
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tdot's Avatar
How to: Building ELCO/EDAC snakes

I'm going to write a little 'how to' here, on the way I've personally found best to build EDAC/ELCO snakes. I found it extremely difficult to find any resources on the internet that were very detailed on building them, so I decided it may be helpful to someone to compile everything that I've learned in one place. That being said, I am by no means an expert at doing this - though I also assume anyone actually searching for how to build an EDAC/ELCO snake won't be either. If anyone wants to leave comments on different approaches or ways they find faster, feel free.

As a disclaimer, I don't actually recommend anyone doing this. It's repetitive, time consuming work. It's not exactly 'difficult' to do (other than actually crimping the pins, which is EXTREMELY hard on your hand), but screwing up just one of 72 crimps is going to give you big problems. Looking at the images, this might look easy - but the time between the first and last image was 7:56 to 9:03. It took 1 hour just to crimp 12 of the conductors, and this is after I've been building them days straight.

First I'm going to list what I'm working with to build.

I'm using TGS-24 cable from Redco, the PTS-10 thermal wire stripper from Patco, the 'EDAC' crimp tool (same one sold from Redco), 1/8" shrink tubing (the dimensions suggested by Redco for their cable), and the 1.75" cut PTFE tubing from Redco (which is NOT the correct length, more on that later).

The first topic is going to be dimensions. ProCo has a whole bunch of PDFs online with the pin outs as well as the 'prep lengths' for all sizes of ELCO connectors. Since I'm building 90 pin, the document I have been referencing is here:

http://www.procosound.com/download/d...inout_1007.pdf

Make sure your patchbay pin outs (if that's what you're building to connect to) matches the pin outs on this document, if that is what you're going to be pinning to. I've seen various different layouts online from different patchbay manufacturers - for me, the pin outs in this PDF are correct.

Also note that the document specifies this is for a top exit cable. I can't tell you if the lengths for a side exit cable will be the same or not, as I haven't tried one (only top exit will actually fit together on my patchbay, as the connectors are side mounted).

Another thing to note that had me a little scared when I first realized - the ELCO head shells *are* switchable. Once you pop the side off, you *can* change the orientation of the strain relief portion to come out the side, or come out the top. I have no idea why ELCO/EDAC lists side/top exit covers as different part numbers. Once I realized I had bought 16 side exit head shells and they wouldn't fit in the patchbay ... I did panic a little.

The 'standard prep lengths' I've been using are as follows:

Channel # Length
1 - 6 (also 29H) 3”
7 - 12 (also 29 C/S) 2-5/8”
13 - 18 (also 30H/C) 1-7/8”
19 - 24 (also 30S) 1-1/2”
25 - 28 2-1/4”

Since my patchbay is a 96 point patchbay, each row uses two 24 channel ELCOs. Pins 25-28 (and 29/30) are unused.

After you have your snake prepped to these lengths, I go ahead and begin to *partially* strip each of the 24 channels.

At this point, I'm going to mention those lengths as well. I found a video on YouTube, about terminating ProBlox connectors (which have coax+elco on one connector). This is the only resource I could find about the individual channel strip lengths.



For reference, the video is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtVlXOnxUig

This image states 1/4" for the channel sheath. This is obviously wrong and impossible. I am under the assumption they actually meant 1 1/4", which has worked well for me. Since my strippers maximum length is something like 1.1 inches, I have been using that, which does give me enough wiggle room to fit the pins in the connector - so I'm assuming 1 1/4" would be more than enough. 0.150" for the individual connectors is just about perfect.

You should now have something like this:



The reason I do this is that I personally prefer working on 12 of the channels at a time - I pull off 12 and finish them, and then afterwards do the longer pair of 12. I don't want to reset the length of my strippers in between the two pairs, so I 'cut' all at once, but leave the sheath on to keep the ends protected. The more you pull off at once, the more chance you have to bump them or get them caught on each other, which can start to unravel the twisted copper. If you feel comfortable prepping all 24 ends for crimping at once,
it's probably fine.

Since I don't fully remove the sheath, this is the point I apply the heat shrink to each lead. You want to do that before you pull the sheath off. If you try putting the heat shrink on with the copper shield exposed, it's going to get caught and give you a bit of a pain.

After you've place the heat shrink on, it's time to pull off the sheath, and you'll end up with something like this:



This is a good time to talk about the length of heat shrink to be used. You want just enough to cover the sheath of the wire, as well as join to the start of the PTFE tubing of the drain wire. One important reason for it, is as you see on that image, covering the little portion of shielding poking out from the wire. You don't want these to end up touching inside the connector.

I find the easiest way to remove the shielding is starting from the very base and just twisting. After some practice, usually you can pull it all together in one go, and just twist it together, and then cut.

As a little warning, don't try to sweep the remains of this outer shielding off your table using your hand. I tried this once, and ended up with little pieces of copper stuck INTO my hand which I had to pull out. Not a good idea.

After this, it's time to go through and strip each individual connector. You should now end up with something like this:



This is the point I start crimping. It may be faster to cut/attach all the PTFE tubing first - and then crimp each channel together, and then heat shrink them all as a group, but since my PTFE tubing isn't the correct size, and I have to cut it per channel anyway, I prefer to go through at this point, and crimp on every end to the conductor, and worry about the drain wires afterwards.

To crimp, I find it's easiest just to pull down the wire with one hand like this, and crimp with the other:



Eventually, it will become easy to do, and you'll know if you've inserted the wire too far into the pin or not by feel.
I've learned that, you can closed the crimp tool around the pin 3 clicks using THIS specific cable, and still have enough room to crimp. IMO it makes it easier, as it has already started to bend the pin slightly, and it's easier to tell when things are in their proper place.
If you're inserting the wire and you feel it 'snag' before going deep enough, pull it out and straighten it and try again. If you feel it go in deep enough and 'snag' again, you know you've probably got the sheath into the crimp area, and it's a little too deep.

It's a good idea to give the pins a firm pull after crimping. After building 5 connectors, I've only ever had one slip off after a crimp - but they should require a pretty extreme force to pull off if properly crimped.

After crimping all the conductors, I start on the drain wires:



I'm not sure what the *proper* dimensions for the PTFE shielding should be. I bought 1.75" because I had no idea at all what I was going to be building. It seems I only need a little less than half of that for each drain wire. I cut them in half, slide them over, and if they're too long, just pull them off and chop them again. It's not extremely important that they're a 'perfect' length - as long as the heat shrink can cover any exposed area between the end of the tubing and the sheath of the channel.

If you've cut it too short, it's pretty easy to do this:



Just hold your fingers around the tubing, and when you've inserted the wire deep enough into the crimper, slide the tubing into the crimper as well. This tubing is thick enough that it won't even fit into the conductor area of the pin (especially with 2 or 3 clicks), so you can just jam it in with your fingers and crimp.

After finishing one channel, this is when I pull the heat shrink tubing over the PTFE tubing/wires and give it a second under a lighter. Here is a finished result:



Of course, you could go through and crimp all 12, and then shrink the tubing afterwards. Since I have to cut my PTFE tubing each wire, I have to switch between tools anyway, so I figure I'm not losing any time shrinking them to signify a 'done' channel.

After repeating 12 times (or 24 if you chose to do them all at once), you should end up with something like this!



Now it's time to repeat for the rest of the 12 channels.

Now after writing this, my crimp hand doesn't feel as swollen, and I think I can finish the other 12 channels

After I finish, I will follow this post with one for what I've learnt about actually pinning the ELCO 90 pin connectors.

Last edited by tdot; 7th February 2016 at 05:52 AM..
Old 7th February 2016
  #2
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tdot's Avatar
Firstly, please do buy the EDAC/ELCO extraction tool - I'm not entirely sure if you actually need the insertion tool (I haven't), but I know on my first attempt at pinning one of these I had to use the extraction tool quite often. It's not as much about putting pins in the wrong place as it is working yourself into a situation you're stuck and can't continue working. You can back yourself into a corner pretty easily with these (which is part of the reason I wrote this 'How To'). I'm not sure how one would go about removing pins without it, but it makes it pretty easy.

To actually pin the ELCO, I've found it easiest to work in this order - inner then outer, shorter then longer. Do the shorter inner leads first, then the shortest outer leads. After that, do the inner longer leads, and then the outer longer leads. If not, you're going to trap your working area between the outer pins, and the screw in the middle, and it becomes much harder to work with.

In other words, I start at the 13-18 row, and work my way over to the 19-24 row next. I prefer to start at the lower number (13 to 18, then 19 to 24), but I'm not sure if it makes a difference if you did that backwards (18 to 13, then 24 to 19).

To get the pins in, I generally just do this:



Just twist the 3 pins on a channel so that they're aligned with the hole, hold them in the correct order with your finger and run them up/down the holes until they all fall into the correct slot.

If you get lucky, and the crimps were all done just right, sometimes they just slide right in. Other times, one or two will get stuck, and you'll have to apply enough pressure to keep the one that is in to remain in, while using your fingers to slightly rotate the second, and then the third, until they start to slide in.

To get them most of the way in, should require no force at all. If you have to apply force, this is because they're either not in the correct rotation (won't go in at all), or are on an angle (will require force to get them in). If they're oriented correctly, they should just slide 75% of the way in. Sometimes, you may need to play the the angle of them a little as well as the orientation.

After they're mostly in, you can usually push them flush with the connector with just your fingernail. Yes, this is why my fingernail is a little ripped up in some of the above images. Sometimes, if the wire is under too much pressure, and is pulling at an angle, they will require a lot more force to get in. If you notice the cable pulling the pins down, you can grab the snake and push it closer to the connector, giving the individual leads some 'slack', which should make them much easier to push in.

Once you have them flush they should look something like:



At this point, you can just pop them fully in with a flat head screwdriver. It should require almost no force. They're not fully in until you hear a distinctive 'click'. Most of the time, it's quite noticeable. Once they're clicked into place, they're not coming back out.

Sometimes the pins don't want to play nice, and you can only get them most of the way down with just your finger:



As a disclaimer, I don't have the insertion tool. It may make this job easier. In this case, they may require a little force from a flat head screwdriver to go down, but be careful not to apply too much that you slip, as you could possible sever a conductor. If you're applying pressure from one side, and it doesn't want to slide in, try applying pressure from the other side of the pin. I believe it has something to do the the side of the pin the locking notch is on - but for pins that won't play nice, usually one side is near impossible to push them down with a screwdriver, but coming from the other side usually works. Just hold the screwdriver from one edge of the pin parallel to the connector and push down, if you have to push too hard, try the other edge.

Once you've finished the shorter inner pairs, you can start with the shorter outer pairs:



I can't speak for all snake cable, but for Redco this works great. The reason is, all of these channels (12-24) are in order around the outside of the snake. Once you get use to it, you don't even have to look at what you're doing - just work your way around the snake in order (for these rows at least).

After you've finished with all the shorter leads, this part is a little 'tricky' to know to do, until it's too late, and you're popping pins out or pinning an annoyance:



At this point, sort your cables. Just do it.

If you just have them all hanging over one side, or the other side, or in a random order, and you start grabbing the next channel, and inserting them, you're going to realize soon that you've trapped the rest of the channels into their current position. At best you got really lucky and were able to put a few of the channels to one side, and most on the other. At worse, you realize you're stuck with the rest of the 12 channels on one side of the casing.

For the last two rows (7-12 and 1-6), I split both of them in 'half', so that 7,8,9 and 1,2,3 are on the left side of the screw, and 10,11,12 and 4,5,6 are on the right side of the screw. This way, you don't have to fight with the head shell to stuff them all in on one side. Even though they will fit (I've got this one wrong on my first two attempts), they'll be tight against the screw and harder to wire (more pulling required). It just makes things easier.

If you listened, after the 3rd row, you should end up with something like this:



As you see, the wires inserted on the left side of the image are 'over' the 4,5,6 wire not yet connected - don't say I didn't warn you. There would be no way to move those wires to the right without pulling them through other wires, which is pretty difficult with the crimp pins attached.

At this point we're almost done, just wire the last row:



And there you have it! Your connector is complete!



As you see, the measurements given are quite precise, they give just enough room to work with, while being short enough to screw the strain relief onto the snakes outer sheath.

After that, slide the connector into the head shell, and put the strain relief portion of the head shell on after:



It should give you ample space to close the head shell, as well as a very decent area of outer sheath to screw the strain relief onto:



And that's it!

Once you have practice with a few, you should be able to complete one in a little under 3 hours.



The biggest issue I have with the entire process of building these connectors is the force required to actually crimp the ELCO pins. They're not like Molex power pins I've worked with before, or Db25 pins, which require very little force to crimp. The ELCO pins require a LOT of force to actually crimp, and I can hardly finish 12 channels before my hand is swollen and I need a break.
Old 17th February 2016
  #3
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drBill's Avatar
Nice write up. But if I'd read it, I probably would never have tried wiring Elco's. LOL After thousands of pins crimped, inserted, de-pinned, re-pinned, etc. I find it much easier and nowhere near as technical or critical on the measurements as you've indicated and taken on. But kudos' for going Elco and sticking with it and learning it. Well done. IMO, the only way to do PBays.

That de-pinning tool is pretty essential isn't it?
Old 18th February 2016
  #4
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tdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
Nice write up. But if I'd read it, I probably would never have tried wiring Elco's. LOL After thousands of pins crimped, inserted, de-pinned, re-pinned, etc. I find it much easier and nowhere near as technical or critical on the measurements as you've indicated and taken on. But kudos' for going Elco and sticking with it and learning it. Well done. IMO, the only way to do PBays.

That de-pinning tool is pretty essential isn't it?
Well I guess you don't have to be exact. But if you're too far off, there's no way getting the strain relief around the cables outer sheath - if that matters. I looked inside one built by Redco, and it looks nearly identical to mine, except that the leads are a little longer. Working at 1.5 inch really sucks

I actually tried getting a precise measurement for the db25s as well, but after building 30 of them I just started cutting by eye.

And yes it is
The first few times you try guaranteed you'll get the wires tangled and won't be able to finish pinning. I actually managed to get there once even after I built 10 of them.
Old 14th April 2016
  #5
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Hi tdot,

You've got to the end of a journey I'm about to begin (pin count 1840 - you win ) - looking for tips led me here. Excellent work - thank you for taking the time to document and share.

A question: how tricky/painful/awkward/time-consuming did you find the wrapping of the strain relief (ie the part of the pin that wraps around the wires' insulation)? The photo immediately following the text "I start on the drain wires:" shows this is *very* neatly done - kudos. If my understanding is correct, the crimp tool does not do this - is that right?

I can't decide whether to solder (preferred, on principle) or crimp (extra tooling cost). Crimping has the edge as - I thought - fewer operations. But, if crimping means fiddling with a pair of tiny wrap-around wings on every pin, I might change my mind...

Any advice appreciated; thanks again,
ST

Edit: Edac only - 38, 90 & 120 pin.

Last edited by some_turnips; 14th April 2016 at 08:40 PM.. Reason: Clarification
Old 15th April 2016
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdot View Post
Well I guess you don't have to be exact. But if you're too far off, there's no way getting the strain relief around the cables outer sheath - if that matters. I looked inside one built by Redco, and it looks nearly identical to mine, except that the leads are a little longer. Working at 1.5 inch really sucks
Several times, I have found it quite handy to force the outer sheath up to reveal more "working length" of the internal wires. Then when you are all done, you can massage the outer sheath back down to cover the wires beyond the entrance clamp. If you are using cable with really stiff outer sheath, warming it with a hair-dryer or heat-gun can make it more pliable and easier to manipulate.
Old 15th April 2016
  #7
To the OP. Thanks much for sharing!!!
Old 15th April 2016
  #8
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drBill's Avatar
Crimping is the way to go! All the pro cables I've taken apart were crimped. I'm a little superstitious, so I often put just a touch of solder on the folded over part of the crimp - just a TINY bit.

And yeah, the crimping tool does all the hard work.

As for the inch and a half? I cut mine much longer than that. I think 3 inch-ish. Actually I don't measure. I've done so many I just eyeball it.

Good tip from Richard about pulling the out sheath of the snake back...
Old 16th April 2016
  #9
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tdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
Crimping is the way to go! All the pro cables I've taken apart were crimped. I'm a little superstitious, so I often put just a touch of solder on the folded over part of the crimp - just a TINY bit.

And yeah, the crimping tool does all the hard work.

As for the inch and a half? I cut mine much longer than that. I think 3 inch-ish. Actually I don't measure. I've done so many I just eyeball it.

Good tip from Richard about pulling the out sheath of the snake back...

Now I know why I wrote this - I went back to finishing the last 4 after a few weeks and completely forgot the measurements of everything. I had to re-read this to remind myself.

As for the inch and the half, you're right, it's not 'that important', but if you cut them too long its hard to push them all into the head. I think the last 4 I made I cut them from 2-3 inches by eye (cut the shortest 6 and longest 6 and the others somewhere between), the 1.5" is harder to work with.

I've read that it can be bad to solder crimped connections (can make the wire more brittle and crack?) so I didn't bother. The only few I soldered were bad crimps I had to 'melt' into the wire on DB25s (the cheap crimpers/pins are a little more difficult to work with). I'm honestly surprised how much stress crimps can take - mostly on the DB25s trying to get the strain relief on puts massive stress on some of the crimps, but in both cases I can give quite a massive tug on the crimps and have no issues. I guess we'll see how long my setup lasts

And after doing about 1000 channels of cabling, I only had about 3 bad connections, which mostly showed up as a -6db or so drop (either hot or cold missing in balanced connection, only once shorted to ground). Luckily, they were all on Db25 crimps, not the ELCOs. Easier than I thought
Old 21st September 2016
  #10
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Redrawn Whirlwind ELCO/EDAC pinouts

As posted some time ago, I also have an Edac job in front of me - only just getting around to it though...

Although there are a number of pinouts around, I decided to go for the Whirlwind schema as published here: Downloads - Support - Whirlwind

Although different to some UK pinouts (eg Canford's, which is possibly BBC-based), the 56-pin pinout also corresponds to that published by German company Sommer cable, so there's some transatlanticity (neologism alert!).

Finding the Whirlwind drawings too visually cluttered (esp P38 & P120), I redrew/modified them. They're now colour-coded (red+, blue-, green/gnd), with the pin and other outlines greyed more into the background.

A couple of errors were also corrected (11+ appeared twice in P90 and P120).

Attached .zip contains the original, and redrawn PDFs, and also multi-layered Inkscape (.svg) files which can be easily re-coloured if required.

Hope someone will find them useful,
some_turnips

PS, mods: If Whirlwind objects (eg copyright grounds), I'll remove them; if Whirlwind likes them they're welcome to republish.
Attached Files
File Type: zip EDAC-ELCO_pinouts_Redrawn.zip (877.6 KB, 65 views)
Old 21st September 2016
  #11
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Thats the 56w pinout I would use given a choice (theres some really strange 56w pinouts I've had to use in the past.)
Old 22nd September 2016
  #12
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(theres some really strange 56w pinouts I've had to use in the past.)

Ain't that the truth !! I am just trying to sort out the Pin out convention for wiring up my Soundcraft Sapphyre & it's like piecing together a jigsaw puzzle.
Luckily I have the manual but there's 38way / 56 way & 90 way Edacs to deal with..
Funtimes ahead
Old 22nd September 2016
  #13
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I wasnt going to name names but ... um ... yes ... Soundcraft
Old 9th October 2016
  #14
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Hmm, cable stiffness troubles

I've done a bunch of 8-way (to 36-pin EDACs), using individually-jacketed pairs, with no problems - the cable is supple, as are the pairs.

Foil-screened multicore is turning out to be a much trickier beast though.

I've started with a 24-pair, onto EDAC 90, taking a while to figure out the lengths, and translation from helical IEC pair numbering to linear/row-wise EDAC. (Per attached, work in progress re lengths.)

My problem is the cable's stiffness. It's got a bending radius of about a furlong! The weakness of the EDACs' 2-screw 'strain relief' is evident: with a little manipulation the cable starts working its way out, unless clamped to death.

32-pair into EDAC 120 will be worse. Even if it would fit into the connector, I can't source individually-jacketed 24-, or 32-way (seems discontinued). At least I got the foil-screened stuff at clearance price...

I'm going to try applying heavy-duty glue-lined heatshrink and clamp onto that, and will have to work out a way of supporting the cable in use, but I'm not over-confident, long-term.

Any suggestions?
Old 9th October 2016
  #15
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Johnny,

Actually that 56-way pin-out does make sense of a sort - it reflects spiral numbering within the cable itself. Slavishly following physical pair placement within cable is fine if you have a round connector (Tourline, Socapex, etc) but even then only works if male-female.

I just posted my approach - which abandons "panel pair number=cable pair number" dogmatism to minimise crossings in male-male cables' shells, which is more appropriate for EDAC - at least in my case.

Still a work in progress, though...

S_T
Old 10th October 2016
  #16
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Mogami 2934 is your friend here, that range is about the easiest to work multicore out there. The flexibility means that you can use sensible pinouts (ie. you dont need to check against a pinout diagram to wire em!)
Old 10th October 2016
  #17
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Hi.
From these experiences, please give a vote of appreciation to the (probably girls) who wire these things day in day out at cable manufacturing places who get probably 'minimum wage' for their labours.
The desks built for the BBC in the 1980's used mostly 56 pin EDAC but there were at least 4 'variants' into the way they were wired. Mic input, Line input, and I think a couple for 'odds and ends' like remotes.
They also used the hex pins at the end to prevent plugging the wrong cable in.
Matt S
Old 10th October 2016
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumbergh View Post
Mogami 2934 is your friend here
Hmm, I'm sure it's great cable - if only the price were friendly! UK stockists have the 32-way (p/n 2938) at £36.46 per metre(!!!!!). That's out of the question unfortunately (compared to £2.75/m clearance from Canford for the 32-way).

I think I can work around this though, keeping what I have for the long-ish stage/FOH length (~25m), terminating on a fixed wall box with an EDAC 120 behind FOH (and losing one 90deg cable bend). I might need say 3-4m of flexible cable to get from there to round behind the desk, but could probably absorb that if it's the only practical solution, so thank you for the tip/recommendation - perhaps I'll be lucky and find an offcut somewhere!

At my little venue, I have to pack everything away after each (weekly) gig, and the whole point of all this is to minimise setup/packdown time plugging all my inputs, drive/outboard rack connections/returns etc.

Cheers, and thanks again,
S_T
Old 10th October 2016
  #19
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shhh dont tell everyone about Canford's clearance deals! £2.75 for 32pr is a deal.


If you have to use foil screen pairs like that rubber sleeves really help. An H20 isolates the screen, keeps the foil from unwrapping, and if the screen unfolds when bended you can gently retwist it back into shape (you cant really rework the screen if its held in place with HS.)
Old 2nd November 2016
  #20
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tdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Syson View Post
Hi.
From these experiences, please give a vote of appreciation to the (probably girls) who wire these things day in day out at cable manufacturing places who get probably 'minimum wage' for their labours.
The desks built for the BBC in the 1980's used mostly 56 pin EDAC but there were at least 4 'variants' into the way they were wired. Mic input, Line input, and I think a couple for 'odds and ends' like remotes.
They also used the hex pins at the end to prevent plugging the wrong cable in.
Matt S
Yep. From the experience, paying an extra $20 or $40 per connector or a few dollars more per meter of cable seems irrelevant to the time these things actually take to assemble.

If you're making $50 an hour at your studio, the time it takes you to assemble is probably the same (or more) as the cost of the materials their self, if you look at it that way, which is why I fully understand paying someone like Redco to build them for you. If it's actually taking away from billable hours it's most likely cheaper.
Old 19th November 2016
  #21
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Just starting a small 90P Edac project. I need to machine some panels and I don't have the connectors yet. Can't seem to find the dimensions of the cut-out for the panel-mounted 90P female anywhere.

Anyone have a source for that drawing?

Thanks.

D.
Old 19th November 2016
  #22
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http://sg.rs-online.com/web/p/genera...ctors/0779914/

i was just watching Nowhere Man a couple days ago and thought of you.
Old 19th November 2016
  #23
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Oh, funny! Hadn't thought of that in a while. Bruce Greenwood: what an awesome human being.

That drawing doesn't really show the dims of the cut-out. I will just have to be patient and wait until the blocks get here and measure. I was told that patience is a virtue but I was in too big a hurry to listen.

D.

Edit: I guess it does show it but the mounting scheme looks weird, like the connector doesn't drop into the cut out completely, so I will still be patient.

D.

Last edited by tourtelot; 19th November 2016 at 08:33 PM..
Old 22nd May 2018
  #24
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Nice guide! Going to attempt making my own EDAC to 3x Sub-D cable soon... It'll probably be frustrating (but educative) as ****
Old 2nd October 2018
  #25
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I'm looking at some deals on Reverb and found a Neutrik MA96-1D Bandam Patchbay wired to (4) Edac 90-Pin Female Connectors. I would use the patchbay to connect my various Protools HD I/O's that are connected to my HD Native Pcie Card. I have the following I/O's with the majority of them being Dsub except the Omni Inputs:

Avid Omni - 4 In/8 Out - 1 Dsub for Output
Digidesign 192 I/O - 16 in/8 out - 3 DSub
Digidesign 192 I/O - 8 in/8 out - 2 DSub
Apogee AD-16x - 16 In - 2 DSub
Apogee DA-16x - 16 Out - 2 DSub

I have the option to build 4 Edac 90 Pin Male to 2 Dsub. I've looked to see if there is an option to buy the connector already built, but not much luck.

I already have a Switchcraf 6425 TT/Bantam Patchba that has Dsub I/O on the back and I made all the Dsub snakes for it. I do a lot of Hardware Inserts.

What are my alternatives to this, if any?

Any insight would be appreciated......
Old 5th October 2018
  #26
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tdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
I'm looking at some deals on Reverb and found a Neutrik MA96-1D Bandam Patchbay wired to (4) Edac 90-Pin Female Connectors. I would use the patchbay to connect my various Protools HD I/O's that are connected to my HD Native Pcie Card. I have the following I/O's with the majority of them being Dsub except the Omni Inputs:

Avid Omni - 4 In/8 Out - 1 Dsub for Output
Digidesign 192 I/O - 16 in/8 out - 3 DSub
Digidesign 192 I/O - 8 in/8 out - 2 DSub
Apogee AD-16x - 16 In - 2 DSub
Apogee DA-16x - 16 Out - 2 DSub

I have the option to build 4 Edac 90 Pin Male to 2 Dsub. I've looked to see if there is an option to buy the connector already built, but not much luck.

I already have a Switchcraf 6425 TT/Bantam Patchba that has Dsub I/O on the back and I made all the Dsub snakes for it. I do a lot of Hardware Inserts.

What are my alternatives to this, if any?

Any insight would be appreciated......
So, you CAN buy the connectors already built - custom made. Redco Audio is a really great supplier and will also custom build cables - I assume you mean something like this:

Redco Audio - Audio/Video Supplies and Accessories, Custom Cables and Panels, and more

The only reason I decided to do them by hand, was it would be about half the cost, which was at least few thousand at the end of the day, as I needed 16 ...

But, if you already have a Switchcraft TT/DSub, why not just keep it consistent and get more? Is it the cost? The cost savings of cheap mass produced d-sub to d-sub may end up being nearly the same price as getting a cheap used patchbay and going EDAC, if most of your I/O is d-sub. But of course, you can decide that
Old 5th October 2018
  #27
Lives for gear
 
barryjohns's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdot View Post
So, you CAN buy the connectors already built - custom made. Redco Audio is a really great supplier and will also custom build cables - I assume you mean something like this:

Redco Audio - Audio/Video Supplies and Accessories, Custom Cables and Panels, and more

The only reason I decided to do them by hand, was it would be about half the cost, which was at least few thousand at the end of the day, as I needed 16 ...

But, if you already have a Switchcraft TT/DSub, why not just keep it consistent and get more? Is it the cost? The cost savings of cheap mass produced d-sub to d-sub may end up being nearly the same price as getting a cheap used patchbay and going EDAC, if most of your I/O is d-sub. But of course, you can decide that
Good advice, thanks!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #28
Lives for gear
 
myles's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
Good advice, thanks!
Bringing this thread back from the (slightly) dead, I'm thinking about the same decision. I use two MH boxes, which are all Dsub outs. I have one 96pt TT bay, but could use another, so which way to go? Although I like the mechanical robustness of EDAC's, it probably doesn't make sense to go through all the work it would require to change formats.

One point that hasn't been covered in all this - if you keep your eye on ebay and reverb, you can often find used Dsub and EDAC snake cables for pretty decent prices. But that requires a non-urgent time frame, so doesn't work for all situations.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #29
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by myles View Post
Bringing this thread back from the (slightly) dead, I'm thinking about the same decision. I use two MH boxes, which are all Dsub outs. I have one 96pt TT bay, but could use another, so which way to go? Although I like the mechanical robustness of EDAC's, it probably doesn't make sense to go through all the work it would require to change formats.

One point that hasn't been covered in all this - if you keep your eye on ebay and reverb, you can often find used Dsub and EDAC snake cables for pretty decent prices. But that requires a non-urgent time frame, so doesn't work for all situations.
Hey Myles! I have a bunch of Elco-Elco interconnects and Elco on the rear of TT patch bays that I need to clear out of storage. Most all of it is Mogami. Shoot me a PM if interested! Cheers, bp

Oh, and as to your connundrum - Elco. The only thing I've got DSubs on now is the AVID interfaces. Everything else is Elco's or XLR's.
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