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Issues Combining Multiple Tracks in Reaper?
Old 19th April 2019
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Issues Combining Multiple Tracks in Reaper?

Hey all,

This is my first post! I'm a total newbie to audio recording and I've been appreciating all the contributions, advice, and info on the gearslutz forums so far. Thank you!

I'm trying to combine multiple tracks on Reaper. I have a Master Track and four duplicates of that track. The timing is lined up for all of them. On each of the four duplicates, different frequencies have been isolated using ReaXComp and this tutorial: YouTube. The Master Track has been left undisturbed.

On one of the duplicates, I have tweaked a small range with a fade. When I hit "Play" and listen to all of the duplicates at the same time, with the Master Track muted, it sounds good. I got the result I wanted. Now I want to mash all these tracks back together and hear them all on one track.

Most of the posts I see about merging tracks talk about dragging and dropping into one track, or enabling free-item positioning. However, when I try either of these things and then solo the track I just dumped everything on, the sound is completely different. Some tracks are being favoured over others.

I did not change the volume of the individual racks, aside from the small fade, and again, when I "Play" them together as separate tracks, it sounds great. I want it to sound the same when I layer/merge/group/glue/[insert correct term here] the tracks.

The reason I need them to be one track is because I'll then need to take the little region I did my tweaking in, and replace that section of the Master Track with it - but that should be as simple as "cut selection and leave space" on the Master Track + "copy selection" on the complete merged edited track.

Could I be perhaps overlooking a setting that allows you to..."layer" multiple tracks and have them all come out cleanly at the same time?
Old 20th April 2019
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qhrisetgo View Post

Most of the posts I see about merging tracks talk about dragging and dropping into one track, or enabling free-item positioning. However, when I try either of these things and then solo the track I just dumped everything on, the sound is completely different. Some tracks are being favoured over others.
you should post an example of what constitutes (completely different).
granted, something doesn't have to be a lot different to be different.

I'm noticing some difference when I use multichannel instruments within nested folders. I'm not sure what that might be as yet. it could be a combination of phase inversion and some volume difference / change. it may be to do with different quality settings for plugins or summing being encountered when certain routing assumptions are being met.

if you have one pair of outputs and 4 tracks all accessing those outputs at the same level, you would expect the software to making some kinds of assumptions about summing. personally I'm not quite sure myself yet.
Old 21st April 2019
  #3
Add another track. Don't duplicate. You can name it something like "Sum".

There are multiple ways to do this but one way is to now click the routing button on each original track (not the new one you made). De-select "Master". Now click the "Add new send..." dropdown, and select the "Sum" track you just created. Also, make sure Sum is the only send entry in that dialog. In addition, make sure there are no receives on the track as well. Now do the same thing for the other three tracks. Now you have a dedicated summed track for those four other tracks.
Old 21st April 2019
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aural Endeavors View Post
Add another track. Don't duplicate. You can name it something like "Sum".

There are multiple ways to do this but one way is to now click the routing button on each original track (not the new one you made). De-select "Master". Now click the "Add new send..." dropdown, and select the "Sum" track you just created. Also, make sure Sum is the only send entry in that dialog. In addition, make sure there are no receives on the track as well. Now do the same thing for the other three tracks. Now you have a dedicated summed track for those four other tracks.
I guess it may be useful if one of the youtube guys can be asked to produce a video of the kinds of problems which can be encountered with certain settings as opposed to others for these cases. including any ways it might generally apply to multichannel instruments in certain instances and combinations.

clusters of these breakdown cases can be useful to have all in one post, and a video is probably the most efficient way to demonstrate them, I'd suspect. in my case I'm not so sure these are the issues, but you are right to point out that those are the places to first be looking. if I look again and find it was these issues, I'll post an update. there's an opportunity to start encountering various places where a phase inversion can be instantiated for example.
Old 21st April 2019
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
I guess it may be useful if one of the youtube guys can be asked to produce a video of the kinds of problems which can be encountered with certain settings as opposed to others for these cases. including any ways it might generally apply to multichannel instruments in certain instances and combinations.

clusters of these breakdown cases can be useful to have all in one post, and a video is probably the most efficient way to demonstrate them, I'd suspect. in my case I'm not so sure these are the issues, but you are right to point out that those are the places to first be looking. if I look again and find it was these issues, I'll post an update. there's an opportunity to start encountering various places where a phase inversion can be instantiated for example.
Yeah, videos can be very helpful. I was answering the OP, but in your case, there are more opportunities for unknown routings to happen when utilizing nested folders. You get the convenience of grouping/collapsing, etc, but at the expense of audio possibly being routed in parallel somewhere without realizing it. That's happened to me a few times and is why I usually don't use folders. The downside is that I end up with a ton of visible tracks, which can become unweidly. There are many ways to skin a cat in Reaper, though.
Old 21st April 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aural Endeavors View Post
Yeah, videos can be very helpful. I was answering the OP, but in your case, there are more opportunities for unknown routings to happen when utilizing nested folders. You get the convenience of grouping/collapsing, etc, but at the expense of audio possibly being routed in parallel somewhere without realizing it. That's happened to me a few times and is why I usually don't use folders. The downside is that I end up with a ton of visible tracks, which can become unweidly. There are many ways to skin a cat in Reaper, though.
I've been trying to figure out what is going on in my case, as I go along. the issue seems to be appearing in two different cases now. it is within nested folders and a multi channel output instrument. nothing complicated, just three separate stereo outs for a shaker kick and snare. I got an odd one where I included an FX channel just for the snare to get reverb and I eventually relaized the dry snare source signal seemed to not be there when I brought up the Dry snare in the reverb impulse player. until I inverted the phase of the send that is.

so my hunch was, given there are opportunities to invert phase at many levels, if something bugs out and inverts any of the phases,then things will start phase cancelling. but this isn't the only phenomena I've come across so far, and you seem to be aware of some potential issues which remain as yet unclear throughout the Reaper user community. it's probably a good idea for them to really start to try to flesh these issues out. it may result in uncovering of bugs or operational uses which could do with clarifying.

I doubt the OP would be encountering these issues btw. not at least until your advise is checked and followed through.
Old 24th April 2019
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aural Endeavors View Post
Add another track. Don't duplicate. You can name it something like "Sum".

There are multiple ways to do this but one way is to now click the routing button on each original track (not the new one you made). De-select "Master". Now click the "Add new send..." dropdown, and select the "Sum" track you just created. Also, make sure Sum is the only send entry in that dialog. In addition, make sure there are no receives on the track as well. Now do the same thing for the other three tracks. Now you have a dedicated summed track for those four other tracks.
Thank you!! Extremely helpful!
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