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Longtime Reaper user tried Ableton for a month …
Old 12th December 2018
  #1
Lives for gear
Longtime Reaper user tried Ableton for a month …

… and I wasn't impressed. It was so dumbed down compared to Reaper, but I did like Drum Racks. And the GUI was super-stylish and cozy.

The workflow was really fun, but not very intuitive and detailed. The mixer was almost non-existent. It's a toy.

I did buy a TouchPad and will use it with PlayTime in Reaper.
Old 1st February 2019
  #2
Gear Addict
 
elginchris's Avatar
 

"totally not impressed but I loved everything about it"
Old 1st February 2019
  #3
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by elginchris View Post
"totally not impressed but I loved everything about it"
I listed why it didn't work for me. It's a great, stylish toy … but doesn't have nowhere near the detailed control/editing as Reaper.
Old 1st February 2019
  #4
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jimmydeluxe's Avatar
yeah I don't think anyone coming from a mixing DAW would like Live. But, it's not called "Ableton Mix"

I use it and bitwig (which is more daw-like) for production and studio one for proper mix/master tasks

I'll have to check out reaper again–last I did on mac it was buggy...I envy it's lauded cpu handling
Old 16th February 2019
  #5
Gear Maniac
The real question is, could you do everything you needed to?
Old 16th February 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
The real question is, could you do everything you needed to?
Every DAW can do the basics, even Audacity and Garageband if you're crazy enough I suppose.
Old 16th February 2019
  #7
Gear Maniac
 

It's not dumbed down, it just has a different feature set and they both have strengths and weaknesses. For example, I can't do a looped live show with reaper.
Old 17th February 2019
  #8
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundationsAudio View Post
It's not dumbed down, it just has a different feature set and they both have strengths and weaknesses. For example, I can't do a looped live show with reaper.
That's the only feature it excels at. However, with PlayTime, you can now do something similar.
Old 28th March 2019
  #9
Gear Nut
 
Fred vom Jupiter's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by goom View Post
That's the only feature it excels at.
For what job did you use Live?
Without explaining that, it's like ppl judging a hammer for its ability to work as screwdriver.

Ofcourse there are better suited DAWs for recording and mixing.

But besides live performances, Live is a tool optimized for the creative process of composing and sound design. Tweaking notes and harmonies and testing variations against other variations is pure joy.

That may not be important for everyone, but it is very important for me:
If it is awkward to try in the third bar the 2nd inversion on the plucky chord with the 1st inversion of the pad against a certain variation of the chorus melody, then chances are higher I will not try it and be satsified with what I have got.

When I started to use Live many years ago, my arrangements went from nice and catchy to harmonic perfection.

What is even better is the fact, that the great workflow for composing is organically complemented by the equally great workflow Live offers for sounddesign and soundtweaking.

I find it very helpful and inspiring, if already during composition and arrangement phase things sound really good.
Old 28th March 2019
  #10
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred vom Jupiter View Post
When I started to use Live many years ago, my arrangements went from nice and catchy to harmonic perfection.
Elaborate, please.
Old 29th March 2019
  #11
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Fred vom Jupiter's Avatar
 

I did.
Old 4th April 2019
  #12
I struggle in Live but I like the sampler.
Old 10th April 2019
  #13
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by goom View Post
… and I wasn't impressed. It was so dumbed down compared to Reaper,
The thing with reaper is that the layout basically expects you to already know everything you need to mix good music. Others feel like they have permanent training wheels. Nothing there but raw and beautiful tools. For my first real mixer after garage band (lol) I really enjoyed learning the intricacies of audio recording and mixing without anything telling me what to do. Now after about 2 years of using Reaper 64, I’m the audio engineer for my school’s music program.
Old 26th April 2019
  #14
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Oscar Myer's Avatar
Firstly let me say that I'm not a professional recording engineer who is making a living in a professional recording studio. I'm just a hobbyist who is having fun recording for nobody to listen to, except maybe close family.

I have been strictly a Cakewalk/Sonar/Cakewalk by Bandlab user for many years. (started out on Cakewalk version 3) Lately I have been having problems with it doing things that are unexplained. The latest example is... I've been working on a strictly midi project for 2 or 3 hours. Only one fx being used. Suddenly one or two tracks seem to drop out sounding somewhat like an old scratchy vinyl record. I have to shut the program down and then reopen it over and over again. This is the only way to fix the problem - until it does it again.

I finally decided to give Reaper a chance. It took me a while to start getting somewhat comfortable with it's different ways of doing things and it's different terminology compared to Cakewalk. But instead of giving up on Reaper after a half hour, this time I stuck with it. And now there's no looking back. It is simple, straight forward and has been solid as a rock. I've yet to have it crash.

That being said, I am definitely not a keyboard player. Virtually all of my midi input is done in the "C" position. Cakewalk allows me to change keys to whichever I want and still be able to play that new key in the "C" position. As far as I can tell, I can't do this in Reaper. I can transpose to another key but in doing so I have to play that new key in it's position on the keyboard. And so the work around is to compose the whole song in C and then transpose it after I'm finished. It's a different way of doing it but in the end it seems to be working for me.

/OM
Old 26th April 2019
  #15
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melillo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscar Myer View Post
That being said, I am definitely not a keyboard player. Virtually all of my midi input is done in the "C" position. Cakewalk allows me to change keys to whichever I want and still be able to play that new key in the "C" position. As far as I can tell, I can't do this in Reaper. I can transpose to another key but in doing so I have to play that new key in it's position on the keyboard. And so the work around is to compose the whole song in C and then transpose it after I'm finished. It's a different way of doing it but in the end it seems to be working for me.

/OM
I'm not 100% sure, as I'm not currently in my studio, but you can transpose during recording: insert ReaControlMidi plugin as an input fx chain on your track. You can do that by either clicking the "in FX" button on the track control panel, or by right-clicking the record enable button on your track and selecting "Track input fx chain..." in the popup menu. Then, you can enter the number of semitones you want to transpose.

Hope that helps,
Marc
Old 26th April 2019
  #16
Gear Head
 
Oscar Myer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by melillo View Post
I'm not 100% sure, as I'm not currently in my studio, but you can transpose during recording: insert ReaControlMidi plugin as an input fx chain on your track. You can do that by either clicking the "in FX" button on the track control panel, or by right-clicking the record enable button on your track and selecting "Track input fx chain..." in the popup menu. Then, you can enter the number of semitones you want to transpose.

Hope that helps,
Marc
It indeed helped, Marc. I don't think I would have ever found this on my own. I was ready to accept the fact that this couldn't be done in Reaper and that I would have to use my workaround for it.

Thanks so much!!!

/OM
Old 26th April 2019
  #17
Gear Head
 
melillo's Avatar
 

Glad it helped! Generaly speaking, when I think that something cannot be done in Reaper, if find sooner or later that I was wrong!
Have fun!

Marc
Old 30th July 2019
  #18
Gear Nut
I'm a long time ableton user, that learned Reaper recently.

I must say the "toy" comment is clearly made out of ignorance.

I miss the grouping, fx chains and racks. So much easier to do parallel fx chains and multi instruments. I am really used to it. Reaper's routing, and pin approach, is flexible, but far more long winded. It takes ages to do what ableton does in a few clicks.

Reasamplomatic is an abomination to look at and use. Ableton destroys Reaper with it's samplers, drum racks, and slice to midi function.

However I wanted to remove a layer of abstraction, and up my audio editing game, and Reaper certainly excels there with it's takes and fx rendering.

Ableton is more intuitive, tidy, and integrated with it's shallow learning curve. The fixed, uniform workflow is what makes it great. It has everything ready to go (at a price).

Kind of the antithesis of Reaper with text boxes all over the place, and various inconsistencies.

I did a lot of tweaking to reaper, and I just about got it to mimic Abletons functions where i need it. It's cool having the Reaper flexibility on top.

I enjoy both for different reasons!



btw I found this to be the best skin:

https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/2320/F...ection%20frame
Old 30th July 2019
  #19
Lives for gear
 

OP, were you using the demo or did you purchase? Is the demo fully featured?

As a PT user I found one major difference when I used Ableton for a bit.

I find that with Ableton, I did more writing 'in' the software. I utilize the clip workflow and tools in Ableton to work ideas around and create pieces within the software.

Using PT, I do most of my writing outside of the software and the DAW is just there for recording and mixing instead of composition. Besides recording a bassline and trying ideas over it, most of my creativity happens outside of the computer.

Ableton really works well in letting you create building blocks to manipulate and build from. The same can be done in any DAW depending on your creative style, I just found that to be the biggest difference between its form factor and working on a timeline like in PT, Cubase or Logic.

The way I work currently, I've settled into 3 types of sessions, writing without the DAW, tracking into the DAW and then mixing on a different day with fresh ears.

I found Ableton was good for my style when I was doing all 3 processes at the same time. No better or worse, just a different workflow.
Old 22nd August 2019
  #20
Lives for gear
After getting Clyphx and J74iso, I think Ableton has become a lot better. Mixing on it is still painful compared to Reaper, so I'll just print stems and mix on Reaper … but Drum Rack, Simpler, and experimenting with compositions is what it's good for.
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