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Does anyone still use Sonar?
Old 28th August 2017
  #31
Here for the gear
 

Overall happy user here.

Sonar does almost everything I want it to do (time stretching / audio flexxing and score editing being the weakest fetures IMHO) and it has some great features that many other DAWs lack.
Is it buggy? Yep. Is it buggiER than any other similar software? Nope.
Yes I wish they'd make it look more modern and lose the WIN 95 underlying flavour and that it had stuff like retrospective recording and a better score editing workflow
But, man, what a great piece of software. And I own Cubase, S1, Samplitude, DP, Bitwig 1, PT
Old 28th August 2017
  #32
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jih64 View Post
No, switched to Studio One 3 long ago, it is imo infinitely superior to the flakey, bug ridden, gazzillion workarounds required for things to function piece of crap called SONAR. Not that I had any real issues with Platinum, but then I had been a user since Pro Audio 9, so I knew which 'buttons' not to push. I knew the workarounds for the many various issues for things that didn't work as they should, if at all, I just grew tired of it all, and the direction of Platinum and the monthly updates, but most of all I found something else which to me is far superior. It becomes like second nature, the long time user how has learnt through the years no longer sees a lot of the issues that face new users, and therefore to them SONAR has no issues, but they are looking through tinted lenses. Look at the list of long standing serious bugs, look at how every month something that has worked previously is broken, often times not being fixed and as such joining and expanding the long list of bugs that will never be fixed. I was amazed to read a comment from Anderton which basically said that if an issue (read BUG) had a workaround, that the likelihood of it being fixed diminished considerably Just think about that, no wonder the list of long standing bugs is so long, SONAR is chock full of workarounds, which according to Anderton pretty much equates to bugs/issues that wont be fixed.

I also agree with the statements made here with regards to the Cakewalk/SONAR forums, it's the truth, I have seen it many times, people being beaten down because they dare to speak out, they dare to not lavish praise on SONAR, the fanbois just pile on until the poor user is beaten into submission, I am sure you have all seen it, if you say you haven't then you are just lying, pure and simple. It is a sickening place at times, and not for just that but all the back slapping, the arse kissing that goes on, it's like a mutual admiration society, the level of fanboiism is like nothing I have ever seen before. As for Anderton being a benefit, well I guess that depends on whether you are one of the arse kissers or not (A few of whom I see here in this thread), he has driven a number of users away with his attitude, SusanG for one, she even stated as much in a reply to Anderton. He just rattles on and on in defensive mode, often ending up leaving the reader confused about what the issue is, he bends and twists the story, goes off onto tangents with no seeming relation to subjects at hand, and down right must have the last say, and is NEVER wrong. Just look at the latest in the thread about whether or not Pro Channel module are still being actively developed, he just wont let go, he must be right, and he must have the last word. Read some of the comments in that thread by long time users, which basically agree with what I am saying here. No sorry, if he would just stick to tips and tricks and the technical side of things or whatever, but the way he carries on I don't see him as a plus, it's enough to make you sick reading some of his one sided blather, his excuses for SONAR's shortcomings.

There is a reason why SONAR is more often than not completely left out of the DAW conversation, why it is more often than not not listed in the "Test with" or comparability lists for many products. There is a reason that SONAR has the reputation it has (and it's not a good one) there is a reason why SONAR is not seen as a 'Professional DAW' there is a reason why SONAR's popularity is so low, the only people that can't see it are the ones on the inside, that are blinded by the facts, either they are hanging on because of the time and money invested, I believe some are only hanging on because of the forums, and the social aspect, at least I believe it plays a big part, they are insulated in a little bubble, safe from the outside , some feel some strange sense of loyalty to Cakewalk the company, as if it is somehow different than other companies, let me assure you it is not, if you think it is let me again assure you, you need to get out more, because it's not, and there are plenty of far far better options when it come to a DAW than SONAR, SONAR is old, built on old code, and that is part of the problem you see now, they just keep slapping stuff on without fixing the old code which is full of longstanding bugs. Look at how Staff view/Notation is going backwards, even Jerry has become increasingly vocal about it, it continues to go down hill with every update (not that it can go to much further down hill . . . lol) what little useful and WORKING features it has are oddly disappearing.

But as long as people are safe in their little "Cakewalk Forums Bubble" and don't stray away to far, they wont have to hear all the negative stuff people outside that bubble have to say, they wont be confronted by the reality of the situation.

Sure SONAR can run fine and do what is needed, it may take the long road to get there, and require knowledge of all it's issues and workarounds through years of use to 'seem' like it is stable, but for the new comer it isn't like that, they are confronted with situation after situation where things don't work as described, as expected, where things don't work as the documentation says it should, because the documentation itself is out of date (BUGGED) That's the reality.
Here here!
Recently I complained in the Sonar Forum about the idea of subscriptions.
My issue with this model is I felt Cakewalk started releasing stuff each month to compensate for the subscription business model even if those releases added no value to the software.

I felt they were ignoring the real needs and issues users like me were facing.
For example: Sonar still crashes after all these years.

Come one, I have a QUAD CORE, and a Whopping 64GB RAM, running on a Samsung EVO Pro SSD, with NVidia T6060i.

I was yelled at and bullied just because I complained.

Thinking about switching to Studio 1.
Old 2nd September 2017
  #33
AudioFreq, I've been a long time Sonar user and I hate it when "Crashes" happen, I also considered changing to another DAW, although the only other was Pro Tools HD, I tried "Studio One 3" Demo version for 30 days and I will tell you "STUDIO ONE ALSO CRASHES" it was installed correctly, adjusted midi etc. I felt it wasn't as effective as Sonar! Possibly because I know Sonar so well Inside and Out, that Studio One seem a bit boring? and to Relearn another DAW to get the same results?

Because I know Sonar so well, It's "Extremely Rare" that I get crashes! There was one time recently during the Windows 10 "Developers" Update where I had to go into the "RegEdit" to enable/disable things because Microsoft wanted (soliciting) to profile the end user.

and "YES" there are a number of "Sonar Forum" Helpers and technical specialist that are a bit "Protective of SALES", so tend to Blame Forum participants as not being knowledgeable, or to "Discredit". I still like Sonar but tread lightly in the Sonar Forum?
Old 2nd September 2017
  #34
Gear Head
I have been with sonar since cakewalk6. After about a decade of 8.5.3 i moved a few months ago to x3e. So much new interface stuff to learn but the occasional flakyness i was getting running 8.5.3 on win8.1 is now all gone with x3 and its 100% reliable. The track comping system on x3 sure seems to suck vs 8.5.3, but after a decade of the same software anything new is going to be a nightmare to adjust to.
Old 3rd September 2017
  #35
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ionian View Post
Seriously though, even if you have some morbid curiosity, go peek at some threads on the Sonar forum. You'll see for yourself real fast what the attitude of that forum is.
I also recommend peeking at some threads in the SONAR so you can judge the forum's attitude for yourself. To wit: If people have questions or issues and display even a modicum of courtesy, they are treated in kind. If someone posts about a bug and the community can reproduce it, the thread usually ends with someone saying they've filed a bug report, perhaps with a suggested workaround in there somewhere.

The forum is a useful source of support from people who know the program. Even people who come in and rant are often talked off the ledge, and their problem solved.

What does upset the community is to waste time on someone who starts a thread saying "SONAR SUCKS!! CRAPFUL OF BUGS!!! DEVELOPERS ARE MORONS!!!!" and then you find out around post #20 that the user hasn't updated his interface drivers in 4 years (or isn't even using ASIO), running a system with 4 Gigs of RAM, is the proud owner of a wireless gaming mouse that spits out 40 billion interrupts per second, or has an HD Audio driver enabled that freezes audio streaming from time to time (which kills low latency) so it can service the graphics and give better frame rates for people playing Doom.

A forum is like a bar. If people are sitting around drinking and having a spirited discussion, all is well. But if someone comes in, barfs on the floor, insults the bartender, and then yells that the bar down the street is soooo much better, he won't be favorably received Unfortunately, it's an issue that all forums face.
Old 3rd September 2017
  #36
Gear Addict
 
Wolf LeProducer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PES View Post
It's been my daw for many years. Got the lifetime subscription, and see no reason to move to another similar program, especially as I use it in quite basic ways (=I see no shortcomings, if there are any).

But, I recently started using Renoise, so Sonar is not the only program anymore. I suspect Renoise will be the main program for on-the-grid music from now on ("programming" music via QWERTY keyboard vs the hugely painful pianoroll-and-mouse interface most DAWs use).
I've been using Renoise since 08/09. I have old licenses to Sonar, Reaper, Cubase AI..

I'm considering upgrading my Cubase license - but I do everything in Renoise. I simply use Renoise.

I'm considering upgrading Reaper but... do everything in Renoise.

Sonar I would not upgrade. Not even considering it. Mainly because I had licenses to Rapture, and Z3ta and those two synths are no longer in my account. I'm not going to bother to call support over it. I just thinks that is plain rude. Gibson is poorly run to say the least.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anderton View Post
A forum is like a bar. If people are sitting around drinking and having a spirited discussion, all is well. But if someone comes in, barfs on the floor, insults the bartender, and then yells that the bar down the street is soooo much better, he won't be favorably received Unfortunately, it's an issue that all forums face.

Your video on Sonar X1 is still available to download from my account. Too bad Rapture isn't in my account. Rapture was one of my favorite synths.

Also, I used to be able to download those Galbanum Wavetables - Andy's product.. and they did not require a Rapture install. Now they do.

Whoever made these changes and decisions over there at Cakewalk and Gibson can loose me as a customer frankly.

I run a pretty big business nowadays. My own company that has some descent revenue. I know what I am talking about, and fyi I know how to set up a computer + audio card.

Last edited by Wolf LeProducer; 3rd September 2017 at 05:30 PM.. Reason: this little piggy went to St. Tropez, this little piggy went to Ibiza... This little piggy went to see Motley Crue
Old 18th September 2017
  #37
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedarkproject View Post
Sonar's lifetime updates are called that because it seems like you have to wait a lifetime for things to get fixed.

I bailed on Sonar after years of struggling with bugs that they just didn't have the resources to address (track templates breaking drum maps, undo/redo being unreliable, slip edit messing up when used with snap offsets, MIDI editing moving events into arbitrary nearby clips, etc etc etc etc), and getting tired of enduring 'improvements' that basically trashed my workflow, like the awful Take Lanes that neutered the previous Layer system, or the increasing reliance on the ProChannel when I want to work in Track View rather than Console View, etc.

Some of the bugs I was told wouldn't be fixed, because they were waiting for the much-vaunted Ripple Editing feature to come along. That took about a year to appear, so I'm glad I didn't pay for another year's membership waiting for that.
MIDI Ripple Editing Improvements added july 2017
Cakewalk - SONAR - Rolling Updates
Old 18th September 2017
  #38
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedarkproject View Post
Sonar's lifetime updates are called that because it seems like you have to wait a lifetime for things to get fixed.

I bailed on Sonar after years of struggling with bugs that they just didn't have the resources to address (track templates breaking drum maps, undo/redo being unreliable, slip edit messing up when used with snap offsets, MIDI editing moving events into arbitrary nearby clips, etc etc etc etc), and getting tired of enduring 'improvements' that basically trashed my workflow, like the awful Take Lanes that neutered the previous Layer system, or the increasing reliance on the ProChannel when I want to work in Track View rather than Console View, etc.

Some of the bugs I was told wouldn't be fixed, because they were waiting for the much-vaunted Ripple Editing feature to come along. That took about a year to appear, so I'm glad I didn't pay for another year's membership waiting for that.
Ripple added May 2017
MIDI Ripple Editing Improvements added july 2017
Cakewalk - SONAR - Rolling Updates
Old 20th September 2017
  #39
Lives for gear
 

Started with Sonar 3 Producer in 2004, went to S6 PE, currently with X2 PE. I've produced and recorded several albums for various indie artists with Sonar, it's a good workflow for me.
Old 20th September 2017
  #40
Lives for gear
SONAR Platinum is a fantastic product. Not perfect, but I really like how it runs currently.
Old 20th September 2017
  #41
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anderton View Post

A forum is like a bar. If people are sitting around drinking and having a spirited discussion, all is well. But if someone comes in, barfs on the floor, insults the bartender, and then yells that the bar down the street is soooo much better, he won't be favorably received Unfortunately, it's an issue that all forums face.
While I love SONAR, the forum is full of . . . I can't find a better word and don't want to be derogatory . . . amateurs and people who aren't very tech literate. If you have a basic question you'll be okay but for anything advanced good luck you won't find help.
Old 24th October 2017
  #42
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by omsk View Post
Sound on Sound magazine still has a monthly technique column for Sonar alongside ones for Logic, Ableton, PT etc.

But does anyone still use Sonar? I can not recall anyone here ever mentioning it.
Still in use here. Began with Sonar XL 2. Have used several versions since and am now on X3 Producer.
Old 21st November 2017
  #43
Lives for gear
 
Oldone's Avatar
They just announced that Cakewalk is closed. Gibson did exactly what everyone predicted, killed the company. No more development or updates. Glad I left their platform years ago before the demise.
Old 21st November 2017
  #44
Lives for gear
 
norfolk martin's Avatar
 

yup

November 17, 2017
GIBSON BRANDS ANNOUCEMENT REGARDING CAKEWALK, INC.
Gibson Brands announced today that it is ceasing active development and production of Cakewalk branded products. The decision was made to better align with the company’s acquisition strategy that is heavily focused on growth in the global consumer electronics audio business under the Philips brand.

Cakewalk has been an industry leader in music software for over 25 years by fusing cutting-edge technology with creative approaches to tools that create, edit, mix, and publish music for professional and amateur musicians. Gibson Brands acquired Cakewalk in 2013.

Gibson Brands, a growing company in the music and sound industries, was founded in 1894 and is headquartered in Nashville, Tennessee. Gibson Brands is a global leader in musical instruments, consumer electronics, and professional audio, and is dedicated to bringing the finest experiences to consumers by offering exceptional products with world- recognized brands.


Is there anything that Henry Juszkiewicz has ever touched that has not withered?
Old 21st November 2017
  #45
Lives for gear
I have no idea how many people use it but it's a great app.

The forum is a wasteland full of ******s and fanbois, but the product was wonderful. This is a shame.
Old 22nd November 2017
  #46
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolk martin View Post
yup

November 17, 2017
GIBSON BRANDS ANNOUCEMENT REGARDING CAKEWALK, INC.
Gibson Brands announced today that it is ceasing active development and production of Cakewalk branded products. The decision was made to better align with the company’s acquisition strategy that is heavily focused on growth in the global consumer electronics audio business under the Philips brand.

Cakewalk has been an industry leader in music software for over 25 years by fusing cutting-edge technology with creative approaches to tools that create, edit, mix, and publish music for professional and amateur musicians. Gibson Brands acquired Cakewalk in 2013.

Gibson Brands, a growing company in the music and sound industries, was founded in 1894 and is headquartered in Nashville, Tennessee. Gibson Brands is a global leader in musical instruments, consumer electronics, and professional audio, and is dedicated to bringing the finest experiences to consumers by offering exceptional products with world- recognized brands. ..snip
My two cents? Yeah? Then why even say that... if you're going to kill it?
Why not for example- 'Well, yeah we bought it, but turned out to be dog so...'

Old 22nd November 2017
  #47
PES
Lives for gear
 
PES's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldone View Post
They just announced that Cakewalk is closed. Gibson did exactly what everyone predicted, killed the company. No more development or updates. Glad I left their platform years ago before the demise.
Bells rang with the constant offers on their news(spam?)letter the past years, and culiminated with the lifetime update thing.

Not that it prevented me from buying into it.

If this is happening, I got my money’s worth sooner than expected.
Old 22nd November 2017
  #48
Very bad news, I just felt that there was something like this to come, that's what kept me away of switching back to Sonar on a Windows machine.
But I think that there will be some kind of investor saving Cakewalk...I mean, we're talking about a piece of history in DAW here. Just remembering my first steps
with Cakewalk (Pro Audio).
Old 22nd November 2017
  #49
Lives for gear
 
ionian's Avatar
No big shock. I've been saying this from the day Gibson bought them. I know not long ago Craig Anderton was here spewing his BS. That should have been a sign things were bad when Cake sends its chief spin master to other forums.
Old 30th November 2017
  #50
Lives for gear
 
batsbrew's Avatar
i don't think anderton worked directly for sonar.......
Old 16th December 2017
  #51
Gear Addict
 
sharke's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon View Post
While I love SONAR, the forum is full of . . . I can't find a better word and don't want to be derogatory . . . amateurs and people who aren't very tech literate. If you have a basic question you'll be okay but for anything advanced good luck you won't find help.
Actually I find many of the folks on the Cakewalk forum to be very tech literate and knowledgeable. You do find, however, a lot of people saying things like "I just loaded up my SPLAT...." I mean who describes a piece of software as "my x....."

I think you see this with the Sonar community because there are a lot of old geezers there. What I often find with the 50/60+ age group is that unless they've worked in tech in some form, they can have a very shaky grasp of basic computing and terminology compared to the younger generation. As an example, there was a guy in the Sonar Facebook group the other day asking if it was OK to use a 3rd party plugin in Sonar that he'd been using in another DAW, the worry being that it might "corrupt" Sonar somehow.
Old 16th December 2017
  #52
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharke View Post
I think you see this with the Sonar community because there are a lot of old geezers there. What I often find with the 50/60+ age group is that unless they've worked in tech in some form, they can have a very shaky grasp of basic computing and terminology compared to the younger generation.
Phew! Glad I am in my seventies - or does that lump me in with all those old geezers in the 60+ part? I dumped Sonar (although I kept it up to date right till the lifetime upgrades announcement - knell of passing doom!) and moved to Reaper. A great community and still growing like crazy. As is the program.
And that shaky grasp on technology - can I then assume that all you kids have a shaky grasp on the underlying principles of recording, since you werent there for the days of hardware?

And remember YOU will be old one day, when all of a sudden you will be saying things like " I am old, not dead".
Old 16th December 2017
  #53
Gear Addict
 
sharke's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Phew! Glad I am in my seventies - or does that lump me in with all those old geezers in the 60+ part? I dumped Sonar (although I kept it up to date right till the lifetime upgrades announcement - knell of passing doom!) and moved to Reaper. A great community and still growing like crazy. As is the program.
And that shaky grasp on technology - can I then assume that all you kids have a shaky grasp on the underlying principles of recording, since you werent there for the days of hardware?

And remember YOU will be old one day, when all of a sudden you will be saying things like " I am old, not dead".
lol I knew someone would take that the wrong way. Not that there's any need to - it was just a simple matter of fact observation after all. There's nothing wrong with being old, and indeed at 45 I've been called "old and out of touch" on an EDM forum. Its true what I said about the over 50's being less technically minded than the younger generation when it comes to computing technology, especially as that technology stands today. Many of that age group didn't grow up with computers, and managed to avoid them until they were in their 30's and 40's - contrast this with kids today who have used computers from infanthood. Stark difference. This is just a generalization of course, there are inevitably exceptions on both sides.

And yes, kiddiwinks today are generally more ignorant of traditional recording techniques than the oldiwonks! They have a pretty shady grasp of how tracks were recorded before the age of DAW's. They're generally blown away by the idea, for example, that hardware constraints meant you couldn't just throw your 1176 on every track simultaneously, and they have trouble understanding how such great mixes were achievable without the ability to sidechain everything to everything else and without being able to throw an instance of Pro-Q on every track.
Old 16th December 2017
  #54
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharke View Post
Many of that age group didn't grow up with computers, and managed to avoid them until they were in their 30's and 40's - contrast this with kids today who have used computers from infanthood. Stark difference. This is just a generalization of course, there are inevitably exceptions on both sides.
When I was in my late sixties I used to teach old people to use computers (in the local public libraries) and my oldest pupils were in their nineties!!! I started on computers in the days of DEC minis. Used one of the pre-release versions of Protools harware/software in the mid eighties, so I had experience in both camps. Made my first released record in the 1960s on a full track mono machine with 2 mic inputs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharke View Post
And yes, kiddiwinks today are generally more ignorant of traditional recording techniques than the oldiwonks! They have a pretty shady grasp of how tracks were recorded before the age of DAW's. They're generally blown away by the idea, for example, that hardware constraints meant you couldn't just throw your 1176 on every track simultaneously, and they have trouble understanding how such great mixes were achievable without the ability to sidechain everything to everything else and without being able to throw an instance of Pro-Q on every track.
I remember back in the day being blown away watching this guy edit individual tracks of 2" tape - with a razor blade! Also the legendary Otto at Rockfield, field-repairing AKG C12s in mid-session!
Old 17th December 2017
  #55
Gear Addict
 
sharke's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post

I remember back in the day being blown away watching this guy edit individual tracks of 2" tape - with a razor blade! Also the legendary Otto at Rockfield, field-repairing AKG C12s in mid-session!
Yeah the tape cutting thing blows me away too. I was always stunned by what Zappa did in that field. And when you consider the other stuff he did - the compositions, the arrangements, producing and mixing his own records, releasing them himself, organizing tours etc....all that kind of stuff makes me wonder how there's even enough hours in the day.
Old 6th March 2018
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Lance Lawson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by omsk View Post
Sound on Sound magazine still has a monthly technique column for Sonar alongside ones for Logic, Ableton, PT etc.

But does anyone still use Sonar? I can not recall anyone here ever mentioning it.
I've used SONAR since SONAR 4 came out and I've been running SONAR 6 since it was released. I am however considering switching away from SONAR since my SONAR 6 Producer's Edition has been getting unstable as windows makes more updates. I run Windows 7 and I wonder how much longer the SONAR 6 will be stable enough to trust. I've already had a number of files corrupted.
Old 5th April 2018
  #57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Lawson View Post
I've used SONAR since SONAR 4 came out and I've been running SONAR 6 since it was released. I am however considering switching away from SONAR since my SONAR 6 Producer's Edition has been getting unstable as windows makes more updates. I run Windows 7 and I wonder how much longer the SONAR 6 will be stable enough to trust. I've already had a number of files corrupted.
You might want to do some diagnostics on your hard drive(s). Of course, different combinations of hardware and software can act very differently, but I've never had recurring file corruption issues with CW/Sonar. Though, of course, I certainly HAVE had such problems when a drive was headed toward the cliff.

Because of the intensive nature of audio production disk use, it can put an extra strain on drive hardware. If a drive is starting to get sketchy, the extra stress can result in unexpected errors. It might be time for some thorough disk checking diagnostics.
Old 5th April 2018
  #58
Old 18th February 2019
  #59
Here for the gear
 

Staff view editon in Sonar

It's so sad having to use another program just to edit in staff view.
I always liked Cakewalk in several aspects, but this sonar Platinum is a bit too complicated and makes me feel stupid.
Where are the buttons to select the note duration?
Do I have to go up and select under the draw tool the duration in a drop down menu every time I want notes with different durations? It's so uncomfortable
Am I forgetting to show any menu?

Is there a more human menu to edit in the Staff view in Cakewalk Sonar Platinum?

What DAW (with all those daw functions) would you recomend that's also good for Staff editing?

Thanks in advance
Old 18th February 2019
  #60
Quote:
Originally Posted by androclave View Post
It's so sad having to use another program just to edit in staff view.
I always liked Cakewalk in several aspects, but this sonar Platinum is a bit too complicated and makes me feel stupid.
Where are the buttons to select the note duration?
Do I have to go up and select under the draw tool the duration in a drop down menu every time I want notes with different durations? It's so uncomfortable
Am I forgetting to show any menu?

Is there a more human menu to edit in the Staff view in Cakewalk Sonar Platinum?

What DAW (with all those daw functions) would you recomend that's also good for Staff editing?

Thanks in advance
Hello, androclave!

I take you are NOT seeing something like this (screen grab from latest free Bandlab/Cakewalk version of what we used to call Sonar...)

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