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Anyone recording in PT Native on 128 buffer or less?
Old 5th October 2019
  #1
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Anyone recording in PT Native on 128 buffer or less?

Just bought a new top of the line computer, all other DAWs are running perfectly on as low as buffer size 32. But for some reason pro tools gives clicks and pops periodically even on 256 buffer.

This is on Windows 10, with an RME Babyface. Everything is top of line and as I said, running smoothly in every other DAW. I’ve done the Avid recommended Windows optimizations, to no avail. Any ideas?
Old 6th October 2019
  #2
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RME UFX and UFXII, 32 samples with ProTools|Ultimate 19.6 working great! (MacPro 2013 6 core)
Old 6th October 2019
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattrixx View Post
RME UFX and UFXII, 32 samples with ProTools|Ultimate 19.6 working great! (MacPro 2013 6 core)
Congratulations! Did you do any specific optimizations? Seems weird performance issues are very common: Protools 12.XX performance optimization script and important tips!

Before the monster PC I'm on now I was working on a maxed out Macbook Pro 2016, I could barely ever get under 256 buffer size on that one either, even when recording on a single channel.
Old 6th October 2019
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Negomo View Post
Just bought a new top of the line computer, all other DAWs are running perfectly on as low as buffer size 32. But for some reason pro tools gives clicks and pops periodically even on 256 buffer.

This is on Windows 10, with an RME Babyface. Everything is top of line and as I said, running smoothly in every other DAW. I’ve done the Avid recommended Windows optimizations, to no avail. Any ideas?
After i sold my PT TDM rig, i went with a PT HD Native. As i track lots of live instruments and being a drummer myself, reliable low latency performance was a must.

I've been using my native rig with a nMP 12 cores and 64 buffer for the past 8 years without any problems. I don't track through plug-ins though.

No special optimisation, simple plug and play.
Old 6th October 2019
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badaboom View Post
After i sold my PT TDM rig, i went with a PT HD Native. As i track lots of live instruments and being a drummer myself, reliable low latency performance was a must.

I've been using my native rig with a nMP 12 cores and 64 buffer for the past 8 years without any problems. I don't track through plug-ins though.

No special optimisation, simple plug and play.
Oh man, that's the dream! I really wish Avid would sort it out so it's not a gamble whether your system will run smothly or not. Whenever I do a session in the programs I'm less fluent in (Logic X, Ableton Live, Cubase) everything runs so smoothly on virtually any system at 64 Buffer Size with the RME drivers. Dang.
Old 6th October 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Negomo View Post
Oh man, that's the dream! I really wish Avid would sort it out so it's not a gamble whether your system will run smothly or not. Whenever I do a session in the programs I'm less fluent in (Logic X, Ableton Live, Cubase) everything runs so smoothly on virtually any system at 64 Buffer Size with the RME drivers. Dang.
I've been using PT since the early TDM days, i guess over 15 years now and to be honest, i've never had any problems.

I've used both Mac and PC over the years, again smooth sailing with both. I always buy the recommended hardware and it's basically plug and play.
Old 6th October 2019
  #7
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dcwave's Avatar
 

PC - i5 quad core 3.6ghz 16gb ram.
Win10
Latest version of PT native
128 buffer all the time - RME PCIe RayDat.
No optimizations at all

No issues tracking drums- 8 to 12 tracks, while having guitarist play a scratch track live through an Eleven Rack.
Old 6th October 2019
  #8
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s.d.finley's Avatar
Yes, Mac Pro 6.1 trash can OSX 10.13.6 with 2 UA Apollo 16s no problem @ 96khz with 64 buffer. CPU meter might go crazy but no buffer errors stopping the system. Minimal plug ins.
Old 6th October 2019
  #9
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2011 Mac mini, osx9 Mavericks, i7, 8g ram, ssd, PT10, RME FF800.

128 samples.
Old 7th October 2019
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badaboom View Post
I've been using PT since the early TDM days, i guess over 15 years now and to be honest, i've never had any problems.

I've used both Mac and PC over the years, again smooth sailing with both. I always buy the recommended hardware and it's basically plug and play.
I would buy the recommended hardware if Pro Tools was all i needed, but I work in the media sector with video etc too, so I had a company build me a setup that would excel in all areas. And it does! Apart from when it comes to Pro Tools. How come pro tools is the only DAW that's so peculiar when it comes to hardware? Seems like bad coding...
Old 7th October 2019
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry123 View Post
2011 Mac mini, osx9 Mavericks, i7, 8g ram, ssd, PT10, RME FF800.

128 samples.
Now that's just ridiculous, considering what I've paid for this new, top of the line setup and it not being to handle that. Jesus.
Old 7th October 2019
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Negomo View Post
I would buy the recommended hardware if Pro Tools was all i needed, but I work in the media sector with video etc too, so I had a company build me a setup that would excel in all areas. And it does! Apart from when it comes to Pro Tools. How come pro tools is the only DAW that's so peculiar when it comes to hardware? Seems like bad coding...
We do lots of video also, we are a small post facility with 4 nMP and 2 PC. All machines run PT native, Cubase 10, Ableton Live, Adobe CC suite, and Davinci Resolve with AJA Kona 4 and Black magic 4K video card. On two of the nMP we also have the Avid S6 console, Logic Pro x and FCPX on top of all the softwares/hardwares mentioned.

The whole facility runs on Dante so audio can be sent to/from any workstations mentioned above.

Again, pretty much plug and play using off the shelf Macs and HP Z-workstations listed on Avid's website. The only time time we ran into problems was due to plug-ins incompatibility.
Old 7th October 2019
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badaboom View Post
We do lots of video also, we are a small post facility with 4 nMP and 2 PC. All machines run PT native, Cubase 10, Ableton Live, Adobe CC suite, and Davinci Resolve with AJA Kona 4 and Black magic 4K video card. On two of the nMP we also have the Avid S6 console, Logic Pro x and FCPX on top of all the softwares/hardwares mentioned.

The whole facility runs on Dante so audio can be sent to/from any workstations mentioned above.

Again, pretty much plug and play using off the shelf Macs and HP Z-workstations listed on Avid's website. The only time time we ran into problems was due to plug-ins incompatibility.
Maybe I did buy a bad setup for Pro Tools then, I just don't understand why it matters so much with only Pro Tools and no other systems. I additionally do screen capturing/streaming of games etc in my work too so I wanted a rig that runs quietly and has the latest GPU:s for gaming etc. I also had it configured with capture cards etc.

For clarity, my system is:

Intel(R) Core(TM) i9-9980XE CPU @ 3.00GHz, 3000 Mhz, 18 Cores
128GB RAM
Windows 10.0.18362 Build 18362
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2080 Ti
RME Babyface Pro

It blows my mind I can't record one (1) audio track with 64 buffer without audibly hearing pops and clicks. It's ridiculous.

Anyway, thanks for sharing your functional setups hehe. Into the Avid support chains I go...
Old 11th October 2019
  #14
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nukmusic's Avatar
 

2010 12core MacPro 24gb ram, Samsung Evo SSDs with no problems running Protools at 64buffer.

What brand is your top of the line system? Or did you build it yourself? There are lots of little things that could affect any computer setup. What harddrives do you have installed? What software is running in the background when Protools is open? Have you tried a USB 3 interface?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Negomo View Post
Maybe I did buy a bad setup for Pro Tools then, I just don't understand why it matters so much with only Pro Tools and no other systems. I additionally do screen capturing/streaming of games etc in my work too so I wanted a rig that runs quietly and has the latest GPU:s for gaming etc. I also had it configured with capture cards etc.

For clarity, my system is:

Intel(R) Core(TM) i9-9980XE CPU @ 3.00GHz, 3000 Mhz, 18 Cores
128GB RAM
Windows 10.0.18362 Build 18362
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2080 Ti
RME Babyface Pro

It blows my mind I can't record one (1) audio track with 64 buffer without audibly hearing pops and clicks. It's ridiculous.

Anyway, thanks for sharing your functional setups hehe. Into the Avid support chains I go...
Old 13th October 2019
  #15
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I had 3XS systems (https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs) build the computer after my specifications. They build a lot of pro audio computers and did an extensive burn in and compability checks before delivering. And again, every other DAW is running smoothly, I just don't understand why Pro Tools is having such a hard time.

Intel 18 Core i9 9980XE Unlocked Extreme Edition Skylake-X Refresh CPU/Processor
128GB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2080 Ti 11GB

I run 5 hard drives, with separation between system, projects, audio samples, video scratch drive & video game drive. Drives:
CORSAIR MP510 960GB PCIe M.2 NVMe Performance SSD/Solid State Drive
2x CORSAIR MP510 1.9TB PCIe NVMe Performance M.2 SSD
2x Adata Ultimate SU650 960GB 2.5" SATA III SSD







Quote:
Originally Posted by nukmusic View Post
2010 12core MacPro 24gb ram, Samsung Evo SSDs with no problems running Protools at 64buffer.

What brand is your top of the line system? Or did you build it yourself? There are lots of little things that could affect any computer setup. What harddrives do you have installed? What software is running in the background when Protools is open? Have you tried a USB 3 interface?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Negomo View Post
Maybe I did buy a bad setup for Pro Tools then, I just don't understand why it matters so much with only Pro Tools and no other systems. I additionally do screen capturing/streaming of games etc in my work too so I wanted a rig that runs quietly and has the latest GPU:s for gaming etc. I also had it configured with capture cards etc.

For clarity, my system is:

Intel(R) Core(TM) i9-9980XE CPU @ 3.00GHz, 3000 Mhz, 18 Cores
128GB RAM
Windows 10.0.18362 Build 18362
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2080 Ti
RME Babyface Pro

It blows my mind I can't record one (1) audio track with 64 buffer without audibly hearing pops and clicks. It's ridiculous.

Anyway, thanks for sharing your functional setups hehe. Into the Avid support chains I go...
Old 13th October 2019
  #16
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Hi OP

I run 24/96kHz at 64 bit buffer for recording. This is typically 16 audio and 3 heavy VIs (Abbey Road Drums, Kontakt, Omnisphere). I am on a 8700K system Win 10 with a MOTU 1248 interface.

The "trick" for me is to use a command line launch that sets the processor affinity so that 1 core is dedicated to the operating system (not Protools). I don't think this can be done easily on a Mac.

Details here:

I have reposted this from the Avid Forums to assist others on Windows Systems with low latency...

The Processor Affinity topic comes up every once in a while. I thought I might summarize my efforts for stable low latency performance for people following this thread. So taken from a few earlier posts...

Recent attempts at achieving lower latency while recording a band in PT 2019.6 / Win 10 using a mix of VIs and 12 x 24/96 kHz audio channels. We monitor midi drums (TD6V, Abbey Road Modern Kit), Various Kontakt Keys (2 players), acoustic guitar, and 4 x Vox live through PT during recording. See below for system build details.

With a MOTU 1248 (latest drivers and up-to-date Win 10) I can record without clicks or pops at 24/96 kHz with a 64 sample audio buffer and 64 sample PT output buffer (MOTU allows these to be set separately) for at least 3 hours continuous without issue. Some things that have helped:

1) Use a CPU affinity of ‘FC’ when launching PT ('FFC' for 8700K processors) – this frees up one core for background audio processing on an i7 CPU. This is required on my system to achieve click/pop free operation at low latency – otherwise I get random CPU spikes which will halt recording. At higher buffers (e.g. 256) it is not needed.

This can be achieved on Win 10 with the command line for my install:

cmd. exe /c start "ProTools" /affinity FFC "C:\Program Files\Avid\Pro Tools\Protools. exe"

(note remove space before exe to use these command lines - spaces required to post in forum)

> there are lots of tutorials on setting affinity - for example CPU Affinity Shortcut for a Program - Create in Windows Tutorial | Windows 8 Help Forums

2) Minimize the use of serial processing - recently someone on GS was discussing optimizing your DAW setup to minimize serial processing of audio signals – the more parallel the signal path, the easier it is for the program to schedule across all cores (makes sense). So I route all signals straight to Master Output channels for monitoring. I have one send setup for Vox slapback (HDelay) echo during recording for monitoring.


I overclock to 5.0 GHz. Overclocking is trivial (see YouTube e.g. YouTube) and completely stable on my system. Actually, I find overclocking gives better stability/performance for DAW work. I disable all clock and power switching in the BIOS. I setup a custom fan profile in the BIOS for quieter operation. Airflow is important for overclocking. With the Noctu cooler I reverse the normal case airflow to draw in from the back directly onto the Noctu Radiator, and exhaust out the front. This gets the coolest air over the Radiator for cooling. The CPU never goes above 70C when using ProTools on a busy project.

I did not delid my CPU; it should not be necessary for 5 GHz. Get the thermal paste right and make sure you have the coolest air possible moving over the radiators. I just used the asus overclock profile for 5 GHz on the Asus Z370 Prime A motherboard and adjusted the XMP for my memory. Once it was working, I lowered the CPU voltage from the overclock default until my system wasn't stable in a stress test then upped the CPU voltage back a few mV. Done stable and cool.

Also note, there is a big difference in CPU load (temperatures) between running a DAW with a busy project and running a Prime stress test. On a stress test the CPU temp cycles from 60 to 85 C, but with a full DAW load it only goes up to 70 C max.

Happy Camper, Hope this helps someone.

____________________________________________
Asus Prime A Z370 MB, 8770K CPU O/C @ 5 GHz, 32 GB RAM, 512 GB SSD, 2 TB Data drive, Gigabyte 950 video card running HDMI 2.0 @ 4K resolution, all USB peripherals plugged into USB3 ports EXCEPT Motu 1248 which is plugged into rear USB2 port, Turbo Mode Off in BIOS, C-states Off in BIOS, On-board sound Off in BIOS, HPET Off in BIOS. Command 8, Roland TD6, Edirol PCR M80, Korg SP250. Windows 10 (all standard DAW optimizations), Pro Tools 2019.6, Waves Gold Bundle, Waves HEQ, Native Instruments Komplete.
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