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New Pro Tools Pricing July 1 2019
Old 19th June 2019
  #61
Gear Nut
 
ianblack8's Avatar
Yep, I'm afraid I'm out, too. Last year I was lucky to buy the update renewal plan box for 60$ from a reseller, which was reasonable, but after such great news those deals will never happen again. Having to pay 99$ until July 1st or 199$ later? Forget it...
Old 19th June 2019
  #62
Quote:
Originally Posted by superwack View Post
It took them 6 months to release ONE update in 2019 (that added Mojave support a scant seven and a half months after it was released!!!!) and they have the... um... 'business sense' to jack up their already high prices in a competitive market where budgets get smaller by the project?

I love PT and I'm not going to switch DAWS but I'm perfectly comfortable running with 2019.6 until it stops working (NOTE: I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that their crack dev team can get one more update out before 2020! )
Wonder if they'll fix that 6101 error...
Old 19th June 2019
  #63
Gear Maniac
 
Hammer v2's Avatar
We all use Protools because it's what we learnt on. The Digi 001,2,3/mbox were all accessible, cheap and gave us a starting point. We got the hang of it and stick with protools.

How are the future generations going to learn Protools now when its priced like this?

Seems incredibly short sighted.
Old 19th June 2019
  #64
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer v2 View Post
We all use Protools because it's what we learnt on. The Digi 001,2,3/mbox were all accessible, cheap and gave us a starting point. We got the hang of it and stick with protools.

How are the future generations going to learn Protools now when its priced like this?

Seems incredibly short sighted.
Exactly. Avid is doing the opposite of what they need to be doing. They should be focused on market share. They’re better off making $300 off of 10 million customers instead of making $3000 off of 30,000 customers.

I’m so comfortable with Pro Tools it’s hard to switch, but for someone just starting out engineering or producing I can’t think of any reason they would choose Pro Tools as their DAW with the prices and functionality they are offering now.

There should be just one version of Pro Tools—Ultimate—and sell the perpetual license for $300. Most everybody in music would own a license.
Old 19th June 2019
  #65
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Sleazy_Rider's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer v2 View Post
We all use Protools because it's what we learnt on. The Digi 001,2,3/mbox were all accessible, cheap and gave us a starting point. We got the hang of it and stick with protools.

How are the future generations going to learn Protools now when its priced like this?

Seems incredibly short sighted.
The kids are using Reaper for $60

Or Bandlab for free

https://www.bandlab.com/products/cakewalk

I see protools as a legacy software...

Times are changing

Old 19th June 2019
  #66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer v2 View Post
We all use Protools because it's what we learnt on. The Digi 001,2,3/mbox were all accessible, cheap and gave us a starting point. We got the hang of it and stick with protools.

How are the future generations going to learn Protools now when its priced like this?

Seems incredibly short sighted.
Indeed.

It makes me wonder about my future interns. The prohibitive cost of entry for pro tools will preclude your average 19 year old’s accessibility. In the long term, that could mean fewer-still useful young people in professional music studios that make their way as engineers (and there are already so very few), and eventually, a phasing out of pt altogether.

I intend to start polling my current interns to find out what DAWs they and their peers use, with an eye towards switching away from exclusive pt use at my commercial room in the near future.
Old 19th June 2019
  #67
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Sleazy_Rider's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
Indeed.

It makes me wonder about my future interns. The prohibitive cost of entry for pro tools will preclude your average 19 year old’s accessibility. In the long term, that could mean fewer-still useful young people in professional music studios that make their way as engineers (and there are already so very few), and eventually, a phasing out of pt altogether.

I intend to start polling my current interns to find out what DAWs they and their peers use, with an eye towards switching away from exclusive pt use at my commercial room in the near future.
Subscription models work when the pricing is right...Netflix etc...amazon prime...

People on average have 3 subscription video streaming services on the go at the same time all as they see value in choice....and 5.99 per month is cheap so people see value in having a few...

I still think Steve Slates model at 14.99 is priced too high

5 years sub $900

Id rather have the fun of the sales and buy a plugin alliance plug I actually wanted and use for $29 and be done with it....
Old 19th June 2019
  #68
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy_Rider View Post
For anyone thinking of leaving Pro Tools...Studio one is where its at for ease of workflow IMO.

Their are some really cool features and I reckon if you emailed presonus direct and wanted to crossgrade they could do you deal.

There was an offer on not long ago where if you registered a S1 licence by a date you would get the CTC-1 Console shaper for free..I got an email.

I had already registered a couple of weeks before so was not eligible for the deal. A quick email to Presonus asking if they would honour the CTC-1 even though I registered before the deal and no questions asked within seconds the software was in my account and email saying sure thing have a nice day!

PT is built on old code but S1 is slick, loads fast and has seen big gains in V 4.5 (and update I got free)
I checked their website yesterday and they have a crossgrade offer of 25 percent discount. Full price is £350 approx...i think.
https://shop.presonus.com/Studio-One-4-Crossgrade
Old 19th June 2019
  #69
Gear Addict
 
juiseman's Avatar
 

This doesn't sound like a good idea; what are they thinking?
Why do this now when almost all other DAW's can do the same
or better? with better pricing?
Old 19th June 2019
  #70
Gear Addict
 
Guitarist9891's Avatar
I really hope Avid gets a new CEO that actually has a brain. They can still turn things around. It seems to be working for Gibson. Avid needs to drop their draconian policies and make people want to stay with them, not force them to.
Old 19th June 2019
  #71
Here for the gear
 

Avid will no longer be getting my money. The industry is trying to force subscription models on their users then they're saying that's what everyone wants. Bull****.
Old 19th June 2019
  #72
Here for the gear
 

Avid is most likely losing market share on protools, the newer generation coming in has no interest in it. Avid figures the best way to make this up is to take advantage of their existing customers.
Old 19th June 2019
  #73
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weezul's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrotto View Post
Indeed.

It makes me wonder about my future interns. The prohibitive cost of entry for pro tools will preclude your average 19 year old’s accessibility. In the long term, that could mean fewer-still useful young people in professional music studios that make their way as engineers (and there are already so very few), and eventually, a phasing out of pt altogether.

I intend to start polling my current interns to find out what DAWs they and their peers use, with an eye towards switching away from exclusive pt use at my commercial room in the near future.
I work with 3 or 4 new interns a year at one of the studios I engineer for. Not one of them in the past 4 years has any real pro tools experience. I couldn't leave them alone tracking even a solo vocal, or have them route anything or perform even simple edits. It's already happening, none of them own a license, and some are mid20s when they're here. But as another poster in another thread said, no it's the studio's fault for not teaching them it, it's just not 'pro' enough..... Because you can't be a 'proper' studio without HDX... The owners are cubase/uad lovers from a dance background and the interns do all their work for them in it. I bring my own iLok to run PT (infact I installed my own boot drive to the machine, so i can mirror my home set up and plugins!) but they do have a copy of 11 for anyone else who comes in. I bought my first copy of LE 7.4 and MBox2 Mini at 18... those were the days! Then it was PT M-Powered with ProFire2626... and etc etc.
Younger generation have no interest in pro tools at all. Why would they? It's buggy as ****, expensive, and badly optimised. And more and more music creation is moving away from needing PT. Everyone uses logic it seems. Any artists that come in, never want to take PT session away if it's not an end-to-end delivery. They want stems for logic....
Old 19th June 2019
  #74
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Interesting parallel to the new mac pro thread--vendor apparently concentrating their value equation on full time heavy users rather than hobbyists--seems odd to me to walk away from sales opportunities, but not my problem. I had some interest in pro tools a couple of years ago, but avoided due to the dominance of the subscription model--whatever you want to call the machinations of software companies who are seeking continuous and never ending revenue streams from products rather than initial sale and subsequent upgrade sales. Good for them to try it, my choice not to spend my money on it. I already stopped using waves due to heavy-handed moves designed to push money charging upgrades of products that work perfectly well without upgrades.

I am a hobbyist and had PT 7 back in the day, but moved on to cubase.
Old 19th June 2019
  #75
Lives for gear
Do they have any option? When you no longer can add new features that people are willing to pay for you need to get the money elsewhere. Avid have had lot of people that stayed on old releases. The offerings are not good enough. ProTools is very much what the standard, and people send their projects to a mixer or master or what ever. So they need part of the value chain to update so everyone else also need to update. Subscription is a very clever way to get the ecosystem to move forward. And currently there seems not to be any alternative...
Old 19th June 2019
  #76
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
I like the part about it being characterized as a quest for giving the customer what they want--some nice orwellian double-speak. And of course "The whole industry is going that way..."

I was thinking about this.

What other daw is going subscription?

Plugin guys are doing it, but like Slate, you can just get it for one month. Where's the protools equivalent? Make it available for $10 or $20 a month, with no signup, or penalties?
Old 19th June 2019
  #77
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bace View Post
Do they have any option? When you no longer can add new features that people are willing to pay for you need to get the money elsewhere. Avid have had lot of people that stayed on old releases. The offerings are not good enough. ProTools is very much what the standard, and people send their projects to a mixer or master or what ever. So they need part of the value chain to update so everyone else also need to update. Subscription is a very clever way to get the ecosystem to move forward. And currently there seems not to be any alternative...
Yes, they have another option. Sell perpetual licenses at a compelling price like literally every other DAW company. Focus development on stability and basic functionality instead of bells and whistles that almost nobody really cares about.
Old 19th June 2019
  #78
Gear Addict
 
juiseman's Avatar
 

Yea, that would be a great idea. For those who need to use it on a case by case basis.
Old 19th June 2019
  #79
Gear Addict
 
Guitarist9891's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
Yes, they have another option. Sell perpetual licenses at a compelling price like literally every other DAW company. Focus development on stability and basic functionality instead of bells and whistles that almost nobody really cares about.
Exactly. How much R&D did they waste on cloud collaboration? There was an overwhelming opinion on the DUC forum that no one was interested in cloud collaboration. They simply chose to not listen to their customers. Instead there were bugs to fix and requested features that were ignored.

It seems to me that they are aiming at pleasing corporate suits and investors and doing features that look good on paper and look fancy on meeting agendas. Instead of listening to their customers.
Old 19th June 2019
  #80
Gear Addict
 

I just read that if you let your updates plan expire, from 1st July you will no longer be allowed a reinstatement option. Instead, renting will be the only way to receive updates again. This is unacceptable. I’m truly in shock if this is true. My subscription is due in November and I’m so pissed by Avid forcing my hand to renew it now that seriously I’m giving up on PT right now.
Old 19th June 2019
  #81
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelpv View Post
I just read that if you let your updates plan expire, from 1st July you will no longer be allowed a reinstatement option. Instead, renting will be the only way to receive updates again. This is unacceptable. I’m truly in shock if this is true. My subscription is due in November and I’m so pissed by Avid forcing my hand to renew it now that seriously I’m giving up on PT right now.
Where did you read that at? Can you link the source please?
Old 19th June 2019
  #82
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gnjlee View Post
Where did you read that at? Can you link the source please?
In the article in PT Expert. Everyone is confused. One guy says he’s spoken to a representative and he said pricing for Ultimate reinstatements would remain at 999 but Avid’s article doesn’t mention it on their pricing table, nor the Vanila reinstatement plan. Even Mike, the editor of PT Expert, seems unsure at this point, but it IS a possibility, especially as Avid asked the site to modify their article, changing a crucial answer to “evaluating“ when asked about the current upgrade plans for perpetual licenses. I hope I’m wrong.
Old 19th June 2019
  #83
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelpv View Post
In the article in PT Expert. Everyone is confused. One guy says he’s spoken to a representative and he said pricing for Ultimate reinstatements would remain at 999 but Avid’s article doesn’t mention it on their pricing table, nor the Vanila reinstatement plan. Even Mike, the editor of PT Expert, seems unsure at this point, but it IS a possibility, especially as Avid asked the site to modify their article, changing a crucial answer to “evaluating“ when asked about the current upgrade plans for perpetual licenses. I hope I’m wrong.
No offense, but I hope you are wrong too! LOL. Thank you. I also read that article. I usually lurk on GS, but this particular issue has me really pissed off.
Old 19th June 2019
  #84
Gear Addict
 
stixstudios's Avatar
After the "Fury" subsides (which it will) a concession will be made.

The price will drop in order to "lure" the unwary.

Be Aware!!!
Old 19th June 2019
  #85
Gear Addict
 
stixstudios's Avatar
The "classic" marketing ploy is to make a "change" seem really unpalatable, then back off a bit.

Governments do it all the time. A new thing is introduced, everyone freaks out - they back off a bit, then everyone will sigh a relief and be glad that the "worst" didn't happen, but all the while the sinister scheme (what they really want) is passed into law. Or in this case, the new software regime is implemented and everyone is now happy.

Basic psychology 101. Think about it.

Don't let it happen!!!!!!!!!
Old 19th June 2019
  #86
Lives for gear
 
Crazy4Jazz's Avatar
 

It feels like borderline fraud wherein you purchase a perpetual license but due to changes in the underlying OS or their new subscription you didn't really get what you purchased. Perpetual license means perpetual license. Rendering it unusable unless you agree to forfeit that which you purchased is the fraud. I suspect a lawsuit might be necessary.

The problem is who has the time or money to invest in correcting this charade? Class actions suits are very difficult and expensive and there may not be enough money involved to justify it. Maybe Avid is well aware that this is borderline illegal and they are counting on the fact that it is more effort than its worth to challenge such an obviously underhanded scheme.
Old 19th June 2019
  #87
Gear Nut
 

http://duc.avid.com/attachment.php?a...8&d=1560853825

If that's not viewable:
https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/hom...-upgrade-plans

I interpret "reinstatement to annual subscription 2-year commit" to mean giving up the perpetual license. As it is now, if you let your PT Standard upgrade plan expire, it's $299 to reinstate, with just 1 year of updates. Reinstatement while holding onto the perpetual license for $198/2 years would be a bargain compared to the current scheme.

So I think they're saying that if you let your perpetual license upgrade plan expire, your only options for updates down the road will be to buy a new perpetual license (at full price) or rent. Not just because of the above math, but also because of Avid's tearful acquiescence to the industry's overwhelming push towards subscriptions [cue violins].

I hope I'm wrong, but I don't see any other reasonable way to interpret it.
Old 19th June 2019
  #88
Gear Addict
 
stixstudios's Avatar
Refer to post #91 .
Old 19th June 2019
  #89
Lives for gear
 
Crazy4Jazz's Avatar
 

Quote:
Because you can't be a 'proper' studio without HDX
Interesting that you wrote this. A few days ago in a discussion about interfaces, someone commented that he would not hire a commercial studio that did not have HDX.

Maybe with the growth of other DAWs that are as good if not better than PT, Avid regrets every unlocking PT from its hardware and would be happy to shake off the people that don't want to or can't spend 10k every 3, 4, 5, 6 or whatever years to update their PT systems.

I let my update expire and now I'm at the mercy of what happens when I get a new computer in a few years. I could be stuck with a subscription I don't want. Looks like I won't be updating my computer like - ever!
Old 20th June 2019
  #90
Lives for gear
 
weezul's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy4Jazz View Post
Interesting that you wrote this. A few days ago in a discussion about interfaces, someone commented that he would not hire a commercial studio that did not have HDX.
I have no energy left from the epic 'new mac pro' and 'why is pro tools industry standard' threads to fight my corner.

All I can say is dealing in absolutes never seems to be a good idea
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